Who needs go up and who down survey ?

[Mostadio]

hmm. I thought the best counter to a perk alpha is evades? funny how that works eh?

But seeing as we can't get enough evades to dodge anything... why even bring it up? Personally, I don't even IP evades. I had them when I was still using bow for pvp but dropped them when I switched to pistol. My survivability didn't decrease. At all.

So, figure out how to use DVP to avoid a perk alpha, and have "metric tonnes" more HP than you need to deal with the 3 normals your opponent will get in before he croaks of pert proc nukes to the eye.

There is no way to use DVP to avoid a perk alpha because that'd require you to know exactly when your opponent is pressing his perk keys.. which you can't. Nevermind the simple fact that a single hud item renders the one tool you're basing this setup on 60% ineffective.

Just about every pvp engineer runs around in an identical setup. There may be one or two components missing and a few perks different, but in general, the equip tabs look the same. If there were some uber evade setup out there, I'm sure someone would have found it by now. The fact is, there isn't one so nobody bothers. There is one mantra that is universal amongst all pvp engineers. Perks are what kill us, so get enough AS to cap recharge and stack on HP and hope you kill the other guy before he kills you. There is no other way.

[McKnuckleSamwich]

I can't be bothered to argue more over this, but, to me, this whole things sounds ridiculous, like, engies don't like using DVP because it breaks too easily seems to be the major frsutration... but, seriously, not one engi inhere has said that they have actively used it, ever.

Considering the effect: - 1210 AAO this is an absolute atrocity to say that it's useless, or that engies don't have the support to effectively use it.

Most, just here you've said you reset evades. Of course it won't work for you now, but, come on, i've shown, and even that other engi showed that it was possible, and probably likely to have 2300ish evades and AAD.

1210+2300= 3500. thats more evades than my MA has with limber up, so, seriously, you can't stop shooting for a half second and press pet follow to debuff the piss out of EVERYONE around you???

To me, this sounds like:

Devs': here you go, this single nano is the most OP'd nano in game, but, you have to stop fighting for one second to use it.

Engi: *fighting... what? sorry, I'm too busy fighting. I didn't hear what you said.

Engi: *keeps fighting

1 year later.

Engi: my only defences are HP and blockers and coon.

Dev's: yes. you forgot to upload that nano I gave you last year.

Engi: I don't remember.

Dev's: no, you were too busy fighting.

moral of the story is that you don't always have to fight.

[Mountaingoat]

It doesn't matter if we stop fighting. If they don't stop fighting too the blind will break since we have reflect and damage shields.

[Adva]

And even if the engi somehow magically comes up with enough evades for this rediculous scenario to work, most pvpers are smart enough to tab to bots since they have next to no evades/aad and are pretty much always buffed with reflects.

[McKnuckleSamwich]

It doesn't matter if we stop fighting. If they don't stop fighting too the blind will break since we have reflect and damage shields.

And even if the engi somehow magically comes up with enough evades for this rediculous scenario to work, most pvpers are smart enough to tab to bots since they have next to no evades/aad and are pretty much always buffed with reflects.

I've never seen any evidence of this. I'll test it on my engi though. will have lots of time in the next couple weeks.

Adva: it's not magic, it's called IP, control symbs and modifiers, and btw, everyones got em.

[Mostadio]

I can't be bothered to argue more over this, but, to me, this whole things sounds ridiculous, like, engies don't like using DVP because it breaks too easily seems to be the major frsutration... but, seriously, not one engi inhere has said that they have actively used it, ever.

I tried it when I still had evades IP'd. I'd spam it and spam it and it never bothered anybody. There. Now it's been said. Can we move on to a topic that hasn't been beaten to death in the engi forums several times and lol'd at by engineers with actual pvp experience? Kthx.

[Adva]

The moment you find out what every pvp engi in AO's lifetime has apparently been doing wrong, I'd really love to know exactly what it is. Until then, anything you spit out about engi pvp is nonsense based on paper pvp scenarios and setups.

And even with that, you've already proven you fail at paper pvp. The second you claimed DVP had a 0% check pretty much summed that up.

[Galaad]

up.

1. Crats
2. Keepers
3. Mas

down.

2. Ranged advies



oh wait .. Lets assume klod is right...

Up.

1. Klod


down.

1. Brofist

qft

[erozc]

It doesn't matter if we stop fighting. If they don't stop fighting too the blind will break since we have reflect and damage shields.

I've never seen any evidence of this. I'll test it on my engi though. will have lots of time in the next couple weeks.

Adva: it's not magic, it's called IP, control symbs and modifiers, and btw, everyones got em.

There was once this obscure TL5 PvP engie who went for a DVP setup... The idea being no reflect, no damage shield (also means no coon), pretty much no pets. Shoot out damage in an alpha and then blind again. At least that's what someone claimed me he'd done.

Mind you, at TL5 you don't have the blind resist items and pets are crap. Then again you're giving up a lot of your defense (coon + reflect), and a some of your offense (pets, though I can't recall why he didn't bother with 'em), definitely the snare aura.

At TL7, any profession with nukes will dispatch you very swiftly as well without reflects, coon, bio rejuv and bio regrowth, and if you have reflects + coon they won't be blinded for any time at all. Others will still hit you thru the blind, and you can count on some having blind resist, plus people attacking from range. And any time you do damage you're opening yourself up to an alpha. Lower than 100% checking perks will do away with you as well.

Realistic usage of such a setup? Not really viable at all, much less than a NR8 soldier or ranged MA. Maybe more like a remod MP, or probably less...

So, DVP usefulness. If you, on an evade setup engi, with all the usual defensive stuff such as reflects, were to apply it to its maximum, you'd be able to pop it just as someone tries to alpha you, causing them to waste perks (which would be on a lower lockout due to not landing). That's it. Otherwise, you could count on it being active on a target for a few seconds between pet snare auras ticking and the enemy missing a few hits. Sounds really useful and worth giving up most your HP for.

Why not making a post about Vaccine being OP since it gives drain resist. That's a much more useful tool in PvP, and it's not really all that useful.

[-Klod-]

DVP is useful only against other pets.

[Mazzarin]

Down:
NT - Even their supposed nemisis, MP, cannot do anything against a NT, since their nano skill or damage debuffs don't land often enough to make any difference

[Shrubberyman]

Down:
NT - Even their supposed nemisis, MP, cannot do anything against a NT, since their nano skill or damage debuffs don't land often enough to make any difference

Omg, less AS, more nanoskills.

[-Klod-]

Omg, less AS, more nanoskills.

Been there, done that, then NT NBS'd.

[Saetos]

I must say that the 'quadruple AS Klodinator' is an awesome name.

Sounds like a name Dr. Doofenschmirtz would give to a giant crossbow.

[Makihran]

uninformed whining about DVP.

You. Can't. Be. Serious.

Attack skillsMatter metamorphosis 35 %
Time and space 35 %
Psychological modifications 30 %

vs.

Defense skillsNano resist 100 %

In case you are wondering, my AR for this nano (including nano research device just to make a point of how ridiculous this really is) is 1808. I'll go ahead and guess you've got a bit more NR than that.

[McKnuckleSamwich]

You. Can't. Be. Serious.

Attack skillsMatter metamorphosis 35 %
Time and space 35 %
Psychological modifications 30 %

vs.

Defense skillsNano resist 100 %

In case you are wondering, my AR for this nano (including nano research device just to make a point of how ridiculous this really is) is 1808. I'll go ahead and guess you've got a bit more NR than that.

lolwhut.

so you don't think it would land? Man, try using slowdown on enfo, unless an MA is NR1, or has just used uwos, it lands in 2 tries.

enfs have like 1500 AR in that one vs 100% resist.

[crattey]

Seriously guys, still discussing the evades engi? Really?

[Esssch]

We all know evades keepers are where it's at.

[RedWatr]

Down:
NT - Even their supposed nemisis, MP, cannot do anything against a NT, since their nano skill or damage debuffs don't land often enough to make any difference

yeah that's why when NSD lands first try, I go running around in circles capable of doing nothing BUT run around, and when it wears off, I got an unremovable debuff running forever in my ncu, and it costs me a crapload of my lil 10k pool to cast a damn thing, while the MP gets a 1/4 CH every tick of the heal pet. lalala. what a fun way to play

an MP that knows his tools, is brutal force to deal with.

learn your prof! u freakin whiners. i feel no pitty on MP's at all. in fact I feel no pitty for any pet prof. grab some tissues and head for the corner, whaaa!!

you got all in one nukes that debuff and do NT like dmg, and soon crats will too! WHERE'S MY NT PETS~? huh ? huh? that's what i thought..


SHUDDDAPPPP!!!!


...that felt good.

[Esssch]

learn your prof! u freakin whiners. i feel no pitty on MP's at all. in fact I feel no pitty for any pet prof. grab some tissues and head for the corner, whaaa!!

you got all in one nukes that debuff and do NT like dmg, and soon crats will too! WHERE'S MY NT PETS~? huh ? huh? that's what i thought..

Coming from someone who doesn't have a pet prof...


Damage 1095-2254(1281-2637) That's top MP nuke atm. If NTs don't get better than that, I would definitely complain about it if I were you