What makes Enforcers OP in your opinion?

[Gatester]

I see it a lot, and I laugh a lot about it but I would like to hear direct reasons for why people view enforcers as OP. Is it the offense or the defense? Too much survival or are particular comboes too effective? Try to be more specific than "Rage is OP because it gives enfs NR". If you think there is a problem with the enforcer toolset you have to say why that is in fact a problem.

I will try to argue against opinions I disagree with, but for my personally disclaimer I believe everyone's opinion is equally valid and even if I disagree it does not mean I am right, I just act like I am So let us try to be civil and hopefully dismiss some of these claims.



BTW I have a 220 shade that is currently pvping frequently, and I eat most enforcers for lunch so I will not be arguing from just an enfs point of view, but someone who kills them

[mr_road]

they are a pain because a fair few start running at 90% hp.

[Saetos]

I feel Enforcers are powered for these reasons:

Title Level 2
1) Perfectly capable of OD'ing a 49 Martial Artist with Mortiig Beater, Howlet, Cleavers, and Panther. And we're supposed to OD these guys?
2) Access to second Rage for extreme RunSpeed, NanoResist, and Inits.
3) Access to second Mongo for 106-point HOT.
4) Access to absorb nanos, Foremans tank, Bio Cocoon.
5) Access to the longest duration fear.
6) Capable of reaching 5000 HP, 6000 HP with Albtraum Wen-Wen.

Title Level 7
1) APF Rage gives them WAY too much RS/NR.
2) Access to iMongo for 510-point HOT.
3) Access to 2 sets of perks (1hb/1he), plus SneakAttack.
4) Can get way too much AAD.


The problem I find with enforcers is that while they have a strong defensive toolset (and they definitely should, as a tank class) their PVP offense is way too strong. They should be like a weapon-bound doctor: taking the hits while wearing their opponent down, instead of smacking them into last Tuesday then running away.

[Jekonam]

too much AAD.

[Martialmad]

I agree, enfos should have 0 healing and close to 0 def.
Ask for more HP/absorb/AC if you want, but enfos being able to heal and evade is just wrong.

[heartless888]

I agree, enfos should have 0 healing and close to 0 def.
Ask for more HP/absorb/AC if you want, but enfos being able to heal and evade is just wrong.

yeah being able to heal evade, coon and get root imunity while able to backstab is a bit much

oh wait thats advy.

if you think enf is OP then what are ranged advies? NTs? traders?

[Perskules]

yeah being able to heal evade, coon and get root imunity while able to backstab is a bit much

oh wait thats advy.

if you think enf is OP then what are ranged advies? NTs? traders?

they are gods

[Martialmad]

yeah being able to heal evade, coon and get root imunity while able to backstab is a bit much

oh wait thats advy.

if you think enf is OP then what are ranged advies? NTs? traders?

I never said enfos were OP.
I just said they shouldn't have heals and evades.

[navycut]

Enf's defense is fine, they should be able to take a lot of punishment however it's the offense thats way over the top.

I mean really... that alpha is the craziest thing ever, I'll say it's more efficient than a shade's alpha because shades need MR and stuff to actually perk evaders.

[rapp3d]

lol at trader complain about enf

[iolanda]

Enf's defense is fine, they should be able to take a lot of punishment however it's the offense thats way over the top.

I mean really... that alpha is the craziest thing ever, I'll say it's more efficient than a shade's alpha because shades need MR and stuff to actually perk evaders.

Its not about MR , the only resson at this curent stage the game , the Enf alpha power is better then shade one is mostly because they got more stun perks .

[Moonbolt]

enfs need MR to perk evaders except for 2 perks in the 1hb line.
enfs need to have a strong alpha cause theres no way we could kill anyone w/o it.
we dont have the regular dmg or a fast recharging heavy hittign special like FA / AS.

the reason enfs run is cause we got basically 0 survivability if we dont get the hell outa there if the alpha fails.
the only professions an enf can tank well if a alpha fails is other enfs or keepers cause none of them have the regular dmg output to actually brng down an enf before the enfs alpha has recharged.
all other classes with AS / FA / hard hitting crits (MAs) / perk chains that can actually alpha an enf (shades) / or hard hitting pets (engies) will kill an enf in most cases before the enfs alpha has recharged if the enf doesnt successfully kite him.

sure people here seems to think that regulars will be worth more in pvp from now on.
to do that they need to nerf everyones heals / healdelta / HoTs down to a lvl where PvM would be impossible.
and frankly i cant see FC changing so much in the game during this balance patch that tehy actually can make regulars valuable again against classes with any kind of healing capabilities.

people that think enfs def is OP....
seriusly?
i can mention fixers, agents, docs, soldiers, advs, MAs, MPs, NTs, Traders that manage to survive better then any enf by standing still infront of their target then an enf can.

enfs have 3 kool stuffs that we are working with atm.
1 a strong alpha - it lets us get alot of fast kills in pvp against people that arent equipped enough to handle the alpha. most endgame players tho can handle the alpha.
2 rage - lets us choose on vich terms we wanna fight. if we know we gonna get killed we have the possibility to get out of harms way.
3 the fear nano - probably my favourite nano in pvp. can give us some breathing room to ease the dmg a little while in a fight, or it can stop peopel from kiting u, or it can hinder people from gettign away from u, or it can give u the time u need to rage and run as hell if ur in trouble.

other then those 3 things theres not much to an enf.

[navycut]

the reason enfs run is cause we got basically 0 survivability if we dont get the hell outa there if the alpha fails.

That's a lie and one of the most stupid things I've heard in a while. 0 survivability? Wow lol your enf's in a med suit or something?

Enfs take a LOT of punishment before they go down.

[MassDebater]

just thier ability to escape me without fail, unless i have a snare mine ready on bs.


JUST RS.

[Klod9003]

Way too much NR and defensive tools.

[Moonbolt]

That's a lie and one of the most stupid things I've heard in a while. 0 survivability? Wow lol your enf's in a med suit or something?

Enfs take a LOT of punishment before they go down.

ill let some other enfs answer that statement if they have the energy to still look thru the balance forums.

[Cryfreman]

people that think enfs def is OP....
seriusly?
i can mention fixers, agents, docs, soldiers, advs, MAs, MPs, NTs, Traders that manage to survive better then any enf by standing still infront of their target then an enf can.

lol wut?

ok a few of them are very strong....but I am guessing you mean shield mp there in that list, even then, do you actually die to one?

[schloops]

I don't find enfos op. They are one of the strong classes, true, but op means more than that.

[Armus]

That stun, whatever it is is OP when you have a number of enfs keeping an entire group stunned. I have no idea what it's called or how it works but imo it shouldn't be possible to chain it on the same target(s).

Other than that I feel that some 220 enfs have perhaps a little TOO good def. Some enfs I do really crappy FA's on very often and my soldier isn't gimp in that sense.

But.. I'm not asking for enf def to be changed. Enf is the only melee class that is truly competetive imo. Enfs dont need a nerf. Only that perk.

[navycut]

ill let some other enfs answer that statement if they have the energy to still look thru the balance forums.

I don't really need an enf's opinion on the matter, I see with my own eyes their survivability.