Summary of Profession Rebalancing: Round 1

[McKnuckleSamwich]

Docs wastly oped? Against who? Docs are prolly the easiest kill in the entire game.


And have you seen much docs with lots of solokills lately? Talking tl7 now. Tl7 docs have the lowest average solokills of all professions. 99% of the time in pvp docs are in nanorecharge. And most of that time they are healing themselfes.

"Docs are prolly the easiest kill in the entire game" I don't even know how to argue this, because, it's clear to me that you've missed the boat. I will tell you the answer, and you can work towards it in your spare time: no.

Docs need a huge improvement. like ams+coon and still be able to heal. We still be killed before anyone else in mass pvp. But then we might be able to throw away few heals before dying.

hahahahahahah. You want coon, CH and AMS? why not roll an advy?
Docs are not "killed" before anyone else in mass pvp. They are CALLED before anyone else in PVP. When you start PVPing, you will understand the difference.

Tl5 docs are wastly superior to tl7. I know since ive played one for quite some time. Why?

No gth
Docs can still heal decent with drains running.
No decent alphas from anyone.
No hhab and fairlylow nr on most pvpers.
Very few can kill a doc in just a ch recharge
aimed shot

And so on...

At TL7, you can definitly STILL heal decently with drains running. tried perks lately? or, first aid stims? how about doctors book?, try CH. Remember that old nano from like TL3? Yep, it STILL works. Agents use it in fact. Quite regularly, as I recall.
Yes, no GTH. But, I've never heard of a doc running out of nano. If you run out of nano, you're doing it wrong. If you need to get a heal off, use a stim and pop it.
No decent alphas from anyone? dude, clearly you need to figure out a setup that works, because, there are very few people that can full alpha a doc from start to finish. Don't docs have like 25-27k HP?
No HHAB? srsly... ? If HHAB is what you think your problem is, you've got bigger fish to fry...

AS: I think that speaks for itself. If you can't get AS at TL7, you need to try this website.

Now, if you LIKE TL5 more than TL7, thats totally fine. I do too. But, don't try to make out that docs are all hard done by at TL7. Saying that doesn't make you look too smart.

[Mikenche]

Docs wastly oped? Against who? Docs are prolly the easiest kill in the entire game.

And which prof has the most soloing ability in PvM? I don't think even advys can solo Vortexx and Mitaar. Docs can (it just takes a while).

As for PvP, I don't agree. From my experience as an NT, fixers and soljas are by far the easiest. Been a while since the last time I was at BS, but I think docs were way up there with enfs and advys.

[epolass]

TL7 Docs are vastly OP'd right now and need a nerf. If you didn't want to stand and heal and buff, why roll a doc? People who like to fight should roll a shade or MA or something

Shade are not very powerful nor useful in TL7 pvp unless you're trox, but that's antoher topic.
Why roll a Doc ? to heal AND harm (see profession forum). Doc vastly OP'd ? Right, sure, see all those docs in BS. It's full of docs ! And they all have 2000+ kills !

Also, what do you mean by Docs are better at TL5?
Tl5 docs have LGE, and CH, both of which can be used at level 90..
TL5 docs have only a couple of decent weapon choices, none of which are effective in PVP and PVM, so, how do you mean: TL5 docs are "better"? What kind of criteria are you using?

TL5 docs have much higher solo kills than TL7 docs. I took TL5 as an example just because BS runs mostly for 210+ and for 150-174.
That means they do better in pvp (since they have higher pvp titles).

And which prof has the most soloing ability in PvM? I don't think even advys can solo Vortexx and Mitaar. Docs can (it just takes a while).

And it's pointless. It is useless to be able to solo those encounters. Such as it is useless to be able to solo Beast over 4 days. Soloing = making money. And it's faster to simply team with someone and sell mitaar/vortexx loot. And for most of the "credit soloing stuff" out there, other profs are way faster (more cred/hour if you prefer).
Soloing ability in a MMO? Seriously, who cares?

As for PvP, I don't agree. From my experience as an NT, fixers and soljas are by far the easiest. Been a while since the last time I was at BS, but I think docs were way up there with enfs and advys.

I didn't say docs were the easiest to kill. We got fair survivability, even if it's far from the best. But we're stuck on healing ourselves, and that's all. We (too) often see your kill stolen by another alpha prof while we were actually taking.

And each prof has "easier" targets depending on their toolset.

[Mikenche]

And it's pointless. It is useless to be able to solo those encounters. Such as it is useless to be able to solo Beast over 4 days. Soloing = making money. And it's faster to simply team with someone and sell mitaar/vortexx loot. And for most of the "credit soloing stuff" out there, other profs are way faster (more cred/hour if you prefer).
Soloing ability in a MMO? Seriously, who cares?

Just wanted to point out that PvP is not all that matters, and docs are rather overpowered in PvM. In addition to superb soloing ability, they're one of the most wanted professions in raids, quite possibly even the most wanted prof.

I didn't say docs were the easiest to kill.

You didn't. DrLithvium did.

[Mekh]

Just wanted to point out that PvP is not all that matters, and docs are rather overpowered in PvM. In addition to superb soloing ability, they're one of the most wanted professions in raids, quite possibly even the most wanted prof.


You didn't. DrLithvium did.

That must be why I have made a shade for soloing, because they can do the same a doc can (of what matters) in a fraction of the time a Doc must spend.


yup, definately....

[Autofil]

That must be why I have made a shade for soloing, because they can do the same a doc can (of what matters) in a fraction of the time a Doc must spend.


yup, definately....

Well surely your shade is as viable at healing others as your doc is at doing damage?
Shades solo well, but the randomness of a mob suddenly hitting you 7 times in a row, id feel more comfortable on a doc trying to solo the hard stuff.

[Mekh]

Well surely your shade is as viable at healing others as your doc is at doing damage?
Shades solo well, but the randomness of a mob suddenly hitting you 7 times in a row, id feel more comfortable on a doc trying to solo the hard stuff.

I was specifically replying to the soloing comment.

Comfortable.... You may feel comfortable, but that get's very old, very fast when a shade or various other professions can do all what matters in PvM that a Doc can.

Should you even happen to die now and then because of evade randomness, adds or whatever, you would still have saved enough time to compensate for that.

Same thing goes for quite a few other professions these days actually...

Supreme soloing ability is not only the ability to survive, but also the ability to kill as many mobs as possible as fast as possible... Given the object of soloing is to make credits or get whatever the mobs drops.

Taking the last part into consideration a Doc is no longer, and have not for a long time been the best option for soloing.

[crattey]

Doc damage, when wielding dual pistols, is hardly bad these days, though... It's not like you're still holding a chalice spamming DoTs.

Then again, anything worthwhile to solo, I solo on my crat nonetheless... While LoTV and left/right hands are still risky at times, most other stuff I can solo whilst watching t.v. and making diner at the same time. And it's faster than on a doc I've also solo'd all of Albtraum, including all bosses, with ease, something most docs won't be able to do, and would take them ages if they did.

Soloing LoTV with nothing but DoTs and chirops brings back memories best forgetting.. I'd literally rather watch paint dry.

[DrLithvium]

"Docs are prolly the easiest kill in the entire game" I don't even know how to argue this, because, it's clear to me that you've missed the boat. I will tell you the answer, and you can work towards it in your spare time: no.

hahahahahahah. You want coon, CH and AMS? why not roll an advy?
Docs are not "killed" before anyone else in mass pvp. They are CALLED before anyone else in PVP. When you start PVPing, you will understand the difference.


At TL7, you can definitly STILL heal decently with drains running. tried perks lately? or, first aid stims? how about doctors book?, try CH. Remember that old nano from like TL3? Yep, it STILL works. Agents use it in fact. Quite regularly, as I recall.
Yes, no GTH. But, I've never heard of a doc running out of nano. If you run out of nano, you're doing it wrong. If you need to get a heal off, use a stim and pop it.
No decent alphas from anyone? dude, clearly you need to figure out a setup that works, because, there are very few people that can full alpha a doc from start to finish. Don't docs have like 25-27k HP?
No HHAB? srsly... ? If HHAB is what you think your problem is, you've got bigger fish to fry...

AS: I think that speaks for itself. If you can't get AS at TL7, you need to try this website.

Now, if you LIKE TL5 more than TL7, thats totally fine. I do too. But, don't try to make out that docs are all hard done by at TL7. Saying that doesn't make you look too smart.

Perks have 10minute recharge, And that is quite along time for someone with no evades and no reflects and no cc tools. The doctors book heal 1k. I can assure the damage dealing is quite good on rk1 atleast and 1k isnt much.

First aid stims? We are talking tl7 pvp here. Not backyard leets.

CH works with drains yes. But drains isnt so much of a problem since we can remove em. When drained however our damagedealing is close to 0.

I have almost 30k hp. Clearly people on rk2 dont know a thing about pvp if they have trouble with a 25k doc.

Yes hhab. hhab gives something called nanoresist. Since you dont have a single clue about anything regarding pvp i tell you that docs use nanos for damagedealing in pvp.

And nanos check versus another players nanoresist.

Hugging as isnt really part of doc toolset. Its like youre asking a keeper to run aaround with a as rifle for damagedealing.

If you dont have a single clue about pvp or docs or nanoresist or peoples damagedealing theirs debuffs and so on please dont type in this forum missinforming other clueless people.

Just wanted to point out that PvP is not all that matters, and docs are rather overpowered in PvM. In addition to superb soloing ability, they're one of the most wanted professions in raids, quite possibly even the most wanted prof. .

Name one mob that the docs are best at soloing. there isnt one. Do you hear me back there in the year 2005? when docs were good at soloing?

Well surely your shade is as viable at healing others as your doc is at doing damage?
Shades solo well, but the randomness of a mob suddenly hitting you 7 times in a row, id feel more comfortable on a doc trying to solo the hard stuff.

Shades are used for soloing hard stuff and crats for soloing very hard stuff. And docs are used for soloing...um nothing. Becuse lots of professions can solo it better.

[crattey]

.. Becuse lots of professions can solo it better.

Well, if you take the logical goal of soloing: to kill a mob by yourself, then doctors are the all-round kings. While I can do some things on my crat a doctor couldn't do (can a doctor solo all of Albtraum, including keeper?), on the whole, a doctor simply -doesn't die- on some mobs, where my crat has a less than perfect succesrate.

If you take into effect that you're playing this game for fun, there' no clear winner, it's just a matter of personal preference. I love my crat and every profession since feels like an auto-attack profession. If I want to do a LoTV kill, I still take my crat, even though he still dies every so often.

I think the clearest way to put the difference is Inferno catacombs.. extremely hard to solo on a crat due to lack of charms. Still more fun that on a doc

[RedWatr]

Round 2 please.

[Eralius2]

So to fix fixers completely, it only needs less than a paragraph worth of writing, no i dont think so.

Please consider doing more to the prof, i mean a good chunk of 'balance' there was increasing our RS? What so we can run away faster?... real useful.
HoTs sounded nice - especially if the % based bit comes in.

[Kazeran]

Well, if you take the logical goal of soloing: to kill a mob by yourself, then doctors are the all-round kings. While I can do some things on my crat a doctor couldn't do (can a doctor solo all of Albtraum, including keeper?)

It has been done yes. I forget who did it, but i believe it was a pistol doc who spammed specials and used RK dots, took something like 4 hours. As far as whos better, the things that are worth soloing others can do faster though

[Mekh]

It has been done yes. I forget who did it, but i believe it was a pistol doc who spammed specials and used RK dots, took something like 4 hours. As far as whos better, the things that are worth soloing others can do faster though

I actually think you can phrase it like this instead:

As far as who's better, the things that a Doc can solo, others can solo faster

[Klod9003]

I actually think you can phrase it like this instead:

As far as who's better, the things that a Doc can solo, others can solo faster

And then, some can't. Neither solo, nor faster.

[Mekh]

And then, some can't. Neither solo, nor faster.

Never said otherwise....

[Klod9003]

Never said otherwise....

Don't mind me. Just saying. :\

[Caress]

Docs can solo almost anything. The problem is that they can't do it fast enough or efficient enough to make it worth while to do so.

It's all a matter of opinion in the end I guess what constitutes worth while...

We aren't the best soloers in the game. We are just the class least likely to die while doing so. When I attempt to solo reasonably tough stuff and people ask me how it's going (for which they have ample time) I usually reply "Well, I'm not dying yet. But %t doesn't seem to be dying very quickly as well!"

I'm not saying Docs are bad at soloing. I'm sure very well equipped/finished doctors are amazing but most 220/30/70 classes seem to be. I just want to state that if someone levelling a doctor to 220 for the reason of soloing stuff, especially if you plan to solo that stuff for credits, there's quite a number of classes that do a much better job at it than doctors do.

Sure, doctors can solo a lord of the void. Fantastic. Every doc that feels they reached a level of confidence needed to win that fight does it once to see if they can do it. Then do it again when they can't find a team or are bored to tears. It's fun to do....well, the first 5 to 10 minutes are sort of fun...but in the end it's a completely pointless and time wasting enterprise. Nothing more.

I'd trade that capacity in a second if it would make me capable of farming much lower and weaker (and more profitable) stuff without the constant urge to alt+tab and play a game of chess in the background.

[michaelpete]

first off u cant shorten the fixer snare/root duration because they dont land anyway u need to make higher lvl roots with less NR defense and the faster casting is great but it needs to be fast recharge aswell.

You should'nt be messing with summon lines at all they are useless just totally rem them from our nanokit.
We need more AR than anything.
RS fix does'nt seem too bad except that make sure it doesnt totally nerf us.

We could use some more defense perks because against high AR players we are useless and soldiers have massive AR not to mention the massive reflects and fixers have nothing but evades that dont do crap against alot of professions.

We could use some better LE nanos aswell because ours suck and maybe even an LE hot or root/snare that works better in pvp than ours do. we could use some SL roots too. We need a better short hot that isnt team based aswell.

Also if your going to do all these rebalances a full IP reset would be very useful after we get all these changes.

[darkwalkx]

zip .

Please, do take the time to read up what has been posted before. There has clearly ben stated that there's going to be a lot rebalanced, and that everything fits in the bigger picture. Beside, at the moment there's little known about what's gonne be done with the fixer.

Why would you want to remove the summon line totally? The fact that they are not useful now, doesn't mean they can't be fixed?

And i don't think fixers need much more defence perks, Aimed Shot is going to be changed, and as far as i know mongo rage as well. Same for the double/triple nukes. All of these seem nice changes for the fixer, as they bypass the fixer's main defensive tool: evades.

Same for the hot: there has already been stated they are looking in creating more/different hot's: an idea is % based hot's.

Regarding the ip reset; i've been playing somewhere since 2004 if im correct (i know, only recently created this forum account), and everytime a big change comes to ao, a full ip reset is given.