I think whats Obtena is trying to say is that traders will get be more desired in teams (thus, PvM "buff"). 15% crit chance for whole team and nano help when everyones costs go up are example of things for which I would like trader in my team.
As for soloing aspect... with bigger nanocost on heals, nerf to crat debuffs, more time between fixer HoT ticks, enforcer absorb line cooldown,... everyone is getting nerfed on that part
I would like to be realistic here: 15% crit buff will not make up for having a toon in team that can do something useful like DD or heal... the nano-over-time won't either as people will more likely get buffs from NT or MP instead of "wasting" a team spot on a prof that doesn't really do much DD or anything.Originally Posted by Vetusleet
This is my (and i think others') concern over these changes from a pvm perspective.
Proud Member of Paradise
*snip*
The last time we called Means out on his weasel words about level locks he just accused us of nitpicking so i really wouldnt bother.
The Rebalance Steamroller is running here, if you dont like the way FC wants it then i guess they feel you can leave the game or just be crushed underfoot...
Sad state of play imo
ALTS: Alienhunter, Moonglum, Quellist, Quellcrist, Jesharet
Trader PvE evolves around evading. I cannot say that i have a decent setup, but i know, i can, or could solo most inferno mobs. Before they are drained down, i have NO chance of evading them, not even mentioning outhealing.
The easiest way of seeing what this new trader toolset brings, would be to put it to a practical test.
Below, an 8 minute movie of the pen cata boss solo killed.
KurSolo
I am also aware that AO does not evolve around solo killing stuff, save yourself that speech. I simply picked it to set up some kind of milestone.
Keep in mind, that a lot of traders do NOT have access to full Xan symbs or combined sets.
If it is proven possible to survive this encounter with the proposed changes, then I'll shut up.(Youtube/filehost or it didn't happen).
Neophyte Nerf"Shareida"Batted First Order
Freshman Jefferey"Bailan2"Ginsberg - Retired
Shareidah - First Order
A Producer's point of view
Just in case the nanos get automatically created by parsing the document or someone implements it 1:1 without thinking about it:
I'm not sure if 'Target'/'Self' and 'User' are used correctly in all nanos. Bear in mind that all this pink really distracts me, but for some nanos we cast a teambuff (for example Lend Nano) that does in my teams ncu:
Self Modify Max Nano 1000
and in some nanos (for example Major Armour Distributor) we cast a teambuff that does in my teams ncu:
Target Modify Crit +15
Would be pretty bad for our ability to find teams if we unfortunatly end up buffing the NPCs that we are attacking... But as said, i'm not sure if I'm correct, i'm rusty, old and there's soo much pink that distracts me
Another thing i noticed:
One trader will be enough for each raid in the future to hand out wrangles for everyone, he will just have to refresh all teams every 3 minutes. Not sure if i should see this as PvM love as this will raise the value of one trader in each raid or as PvM-hate since it might get harder for a second trader to join a raid and changes our tasklist from debuffing mobs to buffing teams and making sure everyone has a +132 running...
Last edited by Syyceria; Jan 22nd, 2011 at 18:40:59.
Syy
Agents have the same issue: shine when they can cast all RK (AO-clasic) nanos, then it goes down hill in power..To me this graph proves a point i've been trying to make for years... if traders are so overpowered as everyone cries, why are we the least played profession? If we're so OP, how come we've never become a flavor-of-the-month? If it's such easymode and instawin, why aren't there double-digit percentages like the other "uber" classes (adv, enfo, sol, doc)?
You know why, because we AREN'T! We aren't overpowered (we're about right in our current state tbh#) and anyone who actually pvps on a 220 trader for a long term (ie, not just one fight against some green or one BS where your side was already dominating anyway) sees this.
Yes i know traders are OP at lower levels and that they count too and that changes were needed there. But as i posted earlier, there are better ways to handle that than the changes i see here, which seem very heavy-handed.
Traders shine up untill that point, where Agents are boring before, and a bit less boring after the shine.
I have tried to make a graf of my point:
X is QL, Y is powerfulness of nanoCode:. . .| . | . | . | . | . | . | . | QL 200
AO classic (pre QL200) has a lot of nanos, spread out on a line, when you hit the QL 200 mark, they get lvl locked rare and extremely powerful.. in other words: the next nano is a NEED to have, while pre QL 200 the next nano is NICE to have.. it will not -cripple- you not having it..
BUT as far as rumours go, that will change for Agents: the first lvls being fun also.. about the endgame.. I have yet to see it, but with the current(as in now, not rebalancing) trend of "mediocre Atrox need to be able to cast everything", the trader twinks will be able to shine and burn out too..
I do not have an endgame trader, my analyses of the nanos available to the profession told me to stop at 150..
Are the nano skill requirements obtainable? and are they worth it?
Are they castable without drains running?
To me it creates a joy to have those laddered drains, to be able to cast a higher nano.. if I can just self it, the thrill of having the drains going fades away.
Other professions can just* get the nanoskills and cast their combat nanos whenever they want.. always having them reddy.. boring..
Draining keeps you on the edge, and aware of "I do not have X drain running, then I must use heal Z instead of Y"
Other professions just have the same nanos to cast all the time..
at least that is the way for the low-mid lvl trader.. the endgame trader sadly hits the wall of "no new nanos to cast for you, just cast the same one again and again"?
That is what I get from looking at the -current- nanos.
What I see in the rebalancing act is to actually make a steady graph where we get more choice, by regaining "NICE to have" nanos, that are not NEEDED, but a weighing of spending that last IP in nanoskills or evades..
and actually having a choice..
*(some item swap to have both combat and nano abilities)
Attention devs:
a BIG part of this though, is INCREASING the breed/TL caps on IP in skills..
as hitting that cap is what makes the choice less of a choice.. you simply can not put in more IP..
If it was up to me: NO cap on how many IP you can put in.. no TL or breed caps..
the breed is only responsible for the colour(cost) of the various skills (nanopool, body dev etc.)
Leading to a totally skill based game..
Caps, as I see it are there to keep people from messing up..
Having more free(weekly full IPR?) IPR on top of those currently goten when lvling, will make up for that
You forgot that you need to cast the nano boost every 60 seconds..
If only it was an aura, then the team would benefit, and you would not have to cast the same nano every 60 second again and again..
The direction of the rebalance is: "it is boring having to re-buff every 30 min, buffs shall last 4 hours", yet a nano that needs to be cast every 60 sec is introduced?
On to the PVM buff for traders:
One thing that makes me glad is the AC drains.. I experimented and the conclusion was obvious: in the current game, they are not worth it..
Actually it gives less damage, as you sacrifice casting other nanos..
Good to see a re-vamp of that.
Humankind can not gain anything, without first giving something in return.
To obtain; something of equal value must be lost.
That is the 1st law of equivalent exchange
Rubi-Ka needs: a nickel statue of an astronaut pointing at the sky
With the description / plate saying:
When the stars burn out and I find I lack the strength to continue...one of YOU wil pick up the flag and carry it forward.
This really isn't a corporate product anymore...it belongs to all of us. Where it goes it up to us.
Time to strip my trader has come.
Tnx to funcom for the previous trader profession.
Break-down of the First-Draft Trader Nano Document Changes
Tl;dr version
• Increased amount of casting (opposite of what traders have asked for)
• Increased Nano cost across the board by 62% on average. Where it actually matters, it’s up by 200-300%
• Drains less effective when we’re fighting lesser opponents in PvP (I don’t see other profession debuffs scale like this)
• Little to no adjustments to our static defense. Actually, our only real defense (Nanobot Defense) had its duration (or usefulness) reduced by 1/3. The removal of the nano dot to justify this is merely a gimmick, as we had tools to compensate, and thus keep emergency casting under the influence of this anyway
• Roots next to useless
• Removed Corporate Protection/Industrial Sabotage/Shutdown skills. Compensated by nothing at all
• A few lines has had their A-B parts merged
• Initiative buff removed from our already measly damage buff
• YEEIYF made more situational. Healing and cool down cut in half
• Unknown at this time how long the 220 pets will last, but they do debuff more than their master if you can figure out that logic
• All the forum whining by non-traders paid off in the end. Catering to the masses is the new agenda
• The person in charge of trader balance knows better than all of the other PvP traders combined. In other words, we’re in good hands
Introduction
First off, let me start by saying I agree 100% with Syyceria and Wrangeline. I was not planning on going too deep into the details of this, but watching Funcom destroy a profession that houses 2,5% of the end-end-game population does not sit well with me.
For quite some time, at least the past two-three years, traders (and by “traders”, here and henceforth I refer to TL7 traders) have asked for less casting, more defense options, and more viability in a team (PvM) scenario. At a glance, the first draft of trader nano changes reveals the complete opposite in the two former cases, and a negligible boost in the latter.
By comparison, traders are the least played profession past level 201. Even more so at the end of the scale (220/30). Why? I can’t answer that, but I can certainly speculate. I don’t think I would be wrong in assuming that the majority of the people, who play this game, mainly do so for the PvM part, while they consider the PvP part a small extension. And thus, traders, while interesting to play to some, does not actually benefit most team scenarios in ways that doctors, enforcers, soldiers, or bureaucrats do. While we’re “nice to have”, we’re not “necessary” by any stretch of the word. The same can be said for a lot of other professions as well, but traders are more complex to play than most, and that, factored in with a game that has arguably one of the steepest learning curves of any MMO, leaves little to be desired in an end game trader.
Many view the trader as a “high risk vs. reward”-profession, and rightfully so. From patch 11.0, traders have always relied on crippling others to stand a fighting chance. “Reverse defense”, “attack is the best form of defense” or whatever analogy applies. As patches came and went, traders saw both boosts and nerfs. The shadowlands expansion was introduced in 2003, and traders were on a steady decline. Alien Invasion made its entry in 2004, and did not by itself contribute in a meaningful way in the adjustment of traders. 2006 saw the Lost Eden expansion come into play, and while a small step in the right direction, traders didn’t fare leaps and bounds better than anno 2003. It wasn’t until a few band aid fixes between 2006 and the release of Legacy of the Xan booster that traders really started taking shape, molding into something viable compared to the rest of the bunch (again, speaking strictly TL7 here, in case you already forgot). One of the best trader quotes explains this in a very short, concise and humorous way; “SL killed the PvP Trader, AI pissed on the grave, LE dug up the body and kicked it in the groin” –Uberstuff.
Where we go from here, I can only imagine, but by the looks of it we’ll find ourselves in a slippery slope going forward.
The actual tl;dr part of this document
Top area of effect root
Cast requirements – Stays the same
Nano cost – 609, previously 452 (increased by 35%)
Recharge – 1 second, previously 3,91 seconds (decreased by 75%)
Cool down – 30 seconds, duration 7 seconds (locked out 314% of the time, relative to duration and recharge)
Defensive skill – 100% Nano resist, previously 90% (increased by 10%)
Chance of break – 20%, previously 46% (improved by 57%) Comment: Not that it matters much with the short duration
Attack range – 20 meters (Stays the same)
Over all – Usefulness reduced
Top single target root
Cast requirements – Stays the same
Nano cost – 845, previously 667 (increased by 27%)
Recharge – 1 second, previously 4,52 seconds (decreased by 78%)
Cool down – 10 seconds, duration 7 seconds (locked out 29% of the time, relative to duration and recharge)
Defensive skill – 100% Nano resist, previously 90% (increased by 10%)
Chance of break – 20%, previously 26% (improved by 23%) Comment: Not that it matters much with the short duration
Attack range – 20 meters, previously 25m (decreased by 20%)
Over all – Usefulness reduced
Top calm/mezz
Cast requirements – Stays the same
Nano cost – 1368, previously 450 (increased by 204%)
Recharge – 1 second, previously 3,5 seconds (decreased by 250%)
Cool down – 3 seconds (No lockout relative to the duration and recharge)
Duration – 420 seconds, previously 4245 seconds (decreased by 90%)
Debuffs – -2100 initiatives, previously -233 (increased by 801%)
Over all – Usefulness reduced in PvM, negligible increased in PvP versus targets you’re not fighting (given they are not fighting a target which is fighting them, or their fighting target does not have reflect (break on attack is still 100%[/COLOR]), both scenarios are rare to non-existent)
Top team heal
Cast requirements – Stays the same
Nano cost – 777, previously 262 (increased by 197%)
Recharge – 2 seconds, previously 3,8 seconds (decreased by 47%)
Cool down – 3,5 seconds (locked out 43% of the time, relatively to recharge)
Over all – Now a one-hit-drain/heal, whereas before it was a one-hit-heal for a certain amount, and a dot on the trader, and no lock out on casting the lower heals. Proposed version will most likely lock out the rest of the nanos in this school (Drain Self Heal Team, 273)
Top health haggler
Cast requirements – Stays the same
Nano cost – 1650, previously 412 (increased by 300%)
Recharge – 2 seconds, previously 4,56 (decreased by 56%)
Cool down – 3,5 seconds (locked out 43% of the time, relatively to recharge)
Attack range – 30 meters, previously 20 meters (increased by 50%)
Over all – No longer able to cast on oneself. Virtually nullifies reliable self-healing. A major setback
Top health plunder
Cast requirements – 2730 BM/TS (increased by 273%)
Level requirement – 218
Nano cost – 2730, previously 300 (increased by 810%)
Attack delay – 4 seconds, previously 3,48 seconds (increased by 15%) Comment: Won’t really matter since it’ll be instant cast at full defense
Recharge – 2 seconds, previously 4,48 seconds (decreased by 55%)
Cool down – 4 seconds (locked out 50% of the time, relative to recharge) Comment: Actually a slight decrease from the original, but only by a mere 10%
Attack range – 30 meters, previously 20 meters (increased by 50%)
Defensive skill – 100% nano resist (Stays the same)
Self-heal – 2528 (increased by 379%)
Target drained – 5056 (increased by 835%) Comment: -50% PvP damage and either 13- or 30% reflect from graft or RRFE makes it 2200 or 1770
Over all – Replaces our haggler as our means of healing ourselves. Might turn out positively, but I wouldn’t mind lowering the defensive skill to 85% and the target drain to 1900/1400. Usefulness definitely increased, but relatively speaking, our self-healing is taking a tiny hit in terms of reliability.
Nano cast requirement (in a css setup with utils/huds focused on defense) is only obtained by having both divest, plunder, accumulated interest (proc), unforgiving debts (proc) and umbral wrangler running. Needless to say, this requirement needs to be lowered, considering it’s now our only viable source of healing
Your enemy’s enemy is your friend
Cast requirements – Stays the same
Nano cost – 1801, previously 470 (increased by 271%)
Recharge – 2 seconds, previously 1,5 seconds (increased by 25%)
Cool down – 60 seconds, previously 120 seconds (decreased by 50%) (locked out 287% of the time, relative to duration and recharge)
Self-heal – Total 7500 over 15 seconds, previously 15000 over 30 seconds (decreased by 50%)
Self-nano-heal – Total 7500 over 15 seconds, previously 7500 over 30 seconds ((increased 50%))
Over all – Reduced healing at the cost of increased nano regain and reduced cool down. An improvement in situational us. No info on the debuff part as of yet, but presuming it stays roughly the same as present day version
Top single hit nano steal
Cast requirements – Stays the same
Nano cost – 1121, previously 315 (increased by 256%)
Recharge – 1 second, previously 4 seconds (decreased by 75%)
Cool down – 4 seconds (locked out 66% of the time, relative to recharge)
Attack range – 30 meters, previously 20 meters (increased by 50%)
Nano steal – 5043, recovering 100%. Previously 2016, recovering 75% (233% increase with Accumulator 10 trained) Comment: With 55% Nano cost reduction, you would regain 4538 nano points
Over all – Obviously a major increase in our ability to steal nano from an opponent, but we would rather see an increase in survivability over extra nano regain. Under NBD, casting the 3rd best health plunder, granted we’re not out of nano, will still be more beneficial at keeping our health up, rather than casting the top single hit nano steal to gain more nano (due to the way the DtN conversion works)
Grand theft humidity
Cast requirements – Stays the same
Nano cost – 1099, previously 470 (increased by 134%)
Recharge – 1 second, previously 1,5 seconds (decreased by 33%)
Cool down – 60 seconds (Stays the same)
Debuff Duration – 15 seconds (Stays the same)
Self-nano-heal – +10% nano points every second for 15 seconds (Stays the same)
Target drained – -15% nano points on first hit, followed by 15 hits of -10% nano points for 15 seconds ([COLOR=“Lime”]Stays the same[/COLOR][/COLOR]). Comment: Target is completely drained after 10 seconds, and remains at 0% for the remaining 5 seconds
Victim nano replenishment – After the 15 seconds of nano drain has finished, a 20 second nano replenishment will be casted in their NCU. Replenishes 2% of their nano pool at a two second intervals throughout the duration (In other words, stays the same)
Over all – Stays the same. Would like to see a complete overhaul ála Isellthings’ suggestion.
Top nano heal-over-time
Cast requirements – Stays the same
Nano cost – 4980, previously 1200 (increased by 315%)
Attack delay – 1 second, previously 4,5 seconds (decreased by 78%)
Recharge – 1 second, previously 3,5 seconds (decreased by 71%)
Cool down – 59 seconds (No relative lock out)
Duration – 60 seconds
Nano healed – – 4980, previously 3108 (increased by 60%)
Over all – Heals team mates’ nano pool for more than the present day version, but does not heal the traders’ pool like it does today. Also, nano cost increased three times, which likely won’t present major problems in PvM
Top lend nano buff
Cast requirements – Stays the same
Nano cost – 544, previously 588 (decreased by 7%) Comment: I fail to see the logic behind this change
Duration – 4 hours, previously 15 minutes (increased by 1500%) Comment: Another gimmick
Over all – Now buffs the entire targets’ team, including the trader, if I’m not misinterpreting it entirely
Improved Quantum Uncertainty
Cast requirements – Stays the same
Nano cost – 1201, previously 756 (increased 59%)
Duration – 4 hours, previously 2 hours (increased 50%) Comment: Another gimmick
Over all – Seeing our drains did not get a boost in this department, I wouldn’t mind seeing an increase in the amount this nano buffs. Also, buffs other players with the regular QU, which is nice, but falls under the category “another gimmick”
Not going to go over tradeskill debuffs. The general change is marginally increased Nano cost, increased duration to 4 hours across the board, and increased attack range to 30 meters. Still no chemistry on our self-only composite specialist tradeskill buff .
Nanobot Defense
Cast requirements – Stays the same
Nano cost – 795, previously 536 (increased by 48%)
Recharge – 1 second, previously 2 seconds (decreased by 50%)
Cool down – 60 seconds (locked out for 80% of the time, previously 69%, relative to duration and Recharge)
Duration – 10 seconds, previously 15 seconds (decreased by 33%)
Shield variable – DamageToNano variable 60, previously 65 for solitus, opifex, atrox, and 70 for nanomage (decreased 8% for the aforementioned professions and 14% for the latter)
HP-to-nano conversion – 250%, meaning 1 hp of damage will drain 2,5 nano~ (Stays the same) Comment: A 4000 aimed shot would result in 1600 damage taken to hit points and 6000 nano points drained
Root/snare reduction – One hit of -100% to any root or snare, previously one tick every 3 second for the duration of the nano which practically nullified any root affecting the trader (decreased 80%)
Over all – A major blow to our only real defense measure. Coupled with the removal of Corporate Protection, as well as effectiveness of our drains on our fighting target(s), this needs to be reworked. Preferably removed completely and replaced with something more solid and longer-lasting
Borrow reflect
Cast requirements – Stays the same
Level – 100, previously 175
Nano cost – 800, previously 1100 (decreased by 27%)
Recharge – 1 second, previously 1,5 seconds (decreased by 33%)
Cool down – 120 seconds, previously 60 seconds (increased by 50%) (locked out 91% of the time, relative to duration and recharge)
Self-reflect buff – 35% if target has over 31% reflect (increased by 17%)
Duration on self-reflect buff – 10 seconds, previously 600 seconds (decreased by 98%)
Over all – Seeing this will most likely cancel any running form of reflect on the trader, and the duration of said replacement buff will last for 10 seconds, the risk will never be worth the reward
Updated decision by committee pets
Too early to tell. We don’t know the new duration, the AR, or if the procs will hit 100% of the time or not. Not likely to be viewed as an improvement. Entertainment value cannot be underestimated though
Top charm
Cast requirements – Stays the same
Nano cost – 824, previously 743 (increased by 11%)
Attack range – 30 meters, previously 20 meters (increased by 50%)
Over all – Looks like the stun is gone from all of our charm nanos. Improvement PvM-wise, but adds virtually nothing but entertainment value in PvP (top crat/engi/mp pets still have psychic over 449)
Grid gateways
Cast requirements – Stays the same
Nano cost – Increased across the board
Attack delay – Decreased across the board
Over all – Another gimmick, but in line with other professions’ changes
Top root reduction
Cast requirements – Stays the same
Nano cost – 640, previously 543 (increased by 18%)
Recharge – 1 second, previously 6 seconds (decreased by 83%)
Root-reduction – -100%, previously 233 seconds
Over all – Considering the present day roots last longer than the present day top self-root reducer is able to reduce roots, this is an improvement
Top team damage buff
Cast requirements – Stays the same
NCU cost – 23, previously 53 (decreased 56%, if I’m reading the document correctly)
Nano cost – 0, previously 1200 (decreased 100%) Comment: Most likely a typo
Duration – 4 hours, previously 2 hours (increased 50%) Comment: Yet another gimmick
Over all – Now buffs the team as well as the trader. Not sure what’s up with the three first damage types labeled as User, while the latter five are labeled Target. On a completely different note, this is a waste of NCU on the PvPing trader after it lost its range initiative buff
Top divest damage
Cast requirements – Stays the same
Nano cost – 1801, previously 500 (increased by 260%)
Recharge – 1 second, previously 4 seconds (decreased by 75%)
Cool down – 15 seconds, previously 120 seconds (decreased by 88%) (No lockout relative to the duration and recharge)
Duration – 20 seconds
Damage debuffed – -250 (Stays the same)
Damage buffed – 250, previously 0 (increased by 250%)
Over all – While this is certainly an improvement, it’s also another nano to cast (not in line with the traders’ wishes). Document stats it will remove blocker nanos.
Top nano resistance debuff
Cast requirements – 1800 PM/SI, previously 1715 PM/1711 SI (increased by 5%)
Nano cost – 2700, previously 2810 (decreased by 4%)
Attack delay – 8,5 seconds, previously 7,5 seconds (increased by 13%)
Capped Attack delay – 0 seconds, previously 2 seconds (decreased by 100%)
Recharge – 1 second, previously 3,5 seconds (decreased by 71%)
Cool down – 10 seconds (No lockout relative to the duration and recharge)
Duration – 15 seconds, previously 120 seconds (decreased by 88%)
Debuffs – -500 nano resistance, previously -250 (increased by 50%)
Over all – Losing our major nano resistance buff, but gaining a tad more on the PvP debuff. Would not mind if this was changed into a drain, or better yet, incorporated into the Divest line, seeing that it has its NR check increased.
Top AC debuff (line should be renamed to drain)
Cast requirements – Stays the same
Level – 217, previously 220
Nano cost – 1755, previously 2987 (decreased by 41%)
Capped Attack delay – 0 seconds, previously 2 seconds (decreased by 100%)
Recharge – 1 second, previously 3 seconds (decreased by 67%)
Cool down – 10 seconds (No lockout relative to the duration and recharge)
Duration – 20 seconds, previously 60 seconds (decreased by 67%)
Defense skill – 100% nano resistance, previously 105% (decreased 5%)
Debuffed AC – 10000, previously 25000 (decreased by 60%) Comment: Also debuffs critical chance by -30%
Buffed AC – 6250, previously 0 (increased 6250%) Comment: Also buffs critical chance by 30%
Over all – I take it we’re able to cast this in PvP now. Will help with increasing what our regular hits hit for, but at the same time, a stat was taken from our primary drains and molded into this one. Not in line with the traders’ wish to cast less. Relative to present day drains, critical chance debuff duration is decreased, while critical chance buffed, as well as duration is increased on the traders’ behalf, but not by much
Top team AC buff
Cast requirements – Stays the same
Nano cost – 579, previously 534 (increased by 4%)
Recharge – 1 second, previously 6,5 seconds (decreased by 85%)
Cool down – 175 seconds (No lockout relative to the duration and recharge)
Duration – 185 seconds, previously 180 seconds (increased by 3%)
Buffs team – 3600 in all ACs, 15% critical chance, previously 979 to all ACs and 0 critical chance (increased by 268%)
Debuffs trader – -3600 in all ACs, -15% critical chance, previously -2400 to all ACs and 0 critical chance (increased by 50%)
Over all – A nice boost to PvM. Not much else. Calling the trader the new be-all-end-all damage booster is pushing it.
Top skill drain (Divest)
Cast requirements – Stays the same
Level – 215, previously none
Nano cost – 1801, previously 600 (increased by 300%)
Recharge – 1 second, previously 4 seconds (decreased by 75%)
Cool down – 5 seconds, previously 0 seconds (No lockout relative to the duration and recharge on a single target. Locked out 75% of the time for other possible targets, relative to recharge and cool down)
Defensive skill – 100% nano resist, previously 90% (decreased by 11% )
Debuff Duration – 15 seconds, previously 210 seconds (decreased by 92% )
Buff Duration – 600 seconds, previously 210 seconds (increased by 187%)
Debuff amount – -138 to all weapon- and nano skills, previously -325 to all weapon- and nano skills as well as -150 aao and -12% critical chance (decreased by 71% )
Buff amount – 275 to all weapon- and nano skills, previously 275 to all weapon- and nano skills as well as 15% critical chance (critical increase moved to another line)
Attack range – Attack range – 30 meters, previously 25 meters (increased by 20%)
Over all – Trashed
Top skill drain (Plunder)
Cast requirements – Stays the same
Level – None (Stays the same)
Nano cost – 1801, previously 600 (increased by 300%)
Recharge – 1 second, previously 4 seconds (decreased by 75%)
Cool down – 5 seconds, previously 0 seconds (No lockout relative to the duration and recharge on a single target. Locked out 75% of the time for other possible targets, relative to recharge and cool down)
Defensive skill – 150% nano resist (Stays the same)
Debuff Duration – 15 seconds, previously 210 seconds (decreased by 92% )
Buff Duration – 600 seconds, previously 210 seconds (increased by 187%)
Debuff amount – -138 to all weapon- and nano skills, previously -325 to all weapon- and nano skills as well as -150 aao and -12% critical chance (decreased by 71% )
Buff amount – 275 to all weapon- and nano skills, previously 275 to all weapon- and nano skills as well as 15% critical chance (critical increase moved to another line)
Attack range – 30 meters (Stays the same)
Over all – Trashed
I have no idea why both A and B skill drain lines check for the same line (Skill Drain Line A - Level check). Unless it’s just me being super tired, I’m guessing traders can’t debuff a target with both, if one is already running (trader still receives positive part from both). Hopefully it’s just a typo.
Hoping we’re not limited to having either A or B on the target at the same time, our debuffing prowess is reduced from -950 AR with both drains running, to -276 (a 71% decrease), and 1600 Relative AR if we had Corporate Protection still (an 83% decrease).
If my theory of only one skill drain per target is indeed not just a type, we’re losing 85% debuffing prowess, or 91% had Corporate Protection still existed come the rebalance patch.
Top team wrangle
Cast requirements – Stays the same
Nano cost – 871, previously 464 (increased by 84%)
Attack delay – 1 second, previously 2,55 seconds (decreased by 61%)
Recharge – 1 second, previously 6,55 seconds (decreased by 85%)
Attack range – 30 meters, previously 15 meters (increased by 100%)
Over all – Does no longer debuff the trader
Top umbral wrangle
Cast requirements – Stays the same
Nano cost – 1100, previously 3500 (decreased by 69%)
Attack delay – 1 second, previously 20 seconds (decreased by 95%)
Recharge – 1 second, previously 3 (decreased by 67%)
Duration – Nano document states a change, but it’s still the same 4 hours
Over all – In line with other professions who’ve gained these “easy street”-methods of buffing lower level team mates, we can now cast our top umbral and team mates below level 205 will receive the appropriate version.
In closing
All this, with virtually no increase in survivability, other than a bump in our self-healing (now resistable), which does not negate the fact that our debuffing tools are spread out like never before (completely ignoring trader feedback all together).
Over all our drains last light years on ourselves compared to how long they used to last, at the expense of debuffing prowess both in terms of amount debuffed and duration. Nano point drains improved a bit, while self-healing was reduced in relative terms (it’s not a reliable source of healing due to its possibility to be resisted). Skill drains have had some of their stats moved to other drains, again, increasing workload and reducing effectiveness). Nano cost increased across the board, the effect of which is too early to tell at this point. The only “panic button” (Nanobot Defense) has had its effectiveness reduced by 33%. No real increase in defense.
Casting has increased tenfold, and as such, so should the risk-vs-reward. In my eyes, a trader should be a devastating force to be reckoned with on the battle field, not a measly pea-shooter with debuffs that glance off like raindrops on a raincoat.
“SL killed the PvP Trader, AI pissed on the grave, LE dug up the body and kicked it in the groin, Rebalance…”
Last edited by gunner7; Jan 22nd, 2011 at 20:26:00.
Same here. The worst part is that PVM lovechilds keep their advantages (there are pretty much no changes for enfs, shades, mas so far except a bit higher nano cost so maybe some of them will even put a single ip into nano pool or use -15% cost on their belts *shock*) or get even more (docs and crats - way more dd from nukes) while for professions that did suck anyway and required a lot to be half decent entire toolset is going to be destroyed. I have a 150 trader myself, pumped billions into him and he does like 1/3 DD of MA in med suit and now this nerf ... Same goes with engi, they want to take away the best part of his toolset and offer nothing in exchange.
Asasello, Sottcapo, Ciex, Rychu, Ciek, Zomowiec, Ciekafsky, Rysiek, Chinaski, Libertarian, Propertarian.
Gunner7, fantastic job, bud. You mind if I add some of your information to one of the placeholder posts?
[[ RYUAHN | 220/21 Opifex Trader
== Proud Member of Core ==
[[ ALASTROPHE | 220/15 Solitus Martial-Artist
The buff effect of BR has a Self Modify Reflect All Damage Types 35
mod (30 for non soldiers) and the nanoline lists New Line: Reflect Emergency Buff
so it will add to whatever regular reflects. Duration is only 10s though.
Deadly Whisper - RK1
too many alts for to little space
Sad but true, this is funcom point on traders. I have a 150 trader too, i did trox for doing s10, full CSS with 1 CS, i did the best for having 1.1k ts/pm without full CS, using dkp + FSS, and i got odded by soldj and ma who spent half of how did i spent, at one point i gived up and i went BSing, and now this...
I hope fc will give to traders the possibility to change profession (and eventually remove the profession from the game, since now it has no meaning...)
I wonder what did they smoke while rebalancing traders... now trader are worst as they was before LE.
Last edited by Drakeep; Jan 22nd, 2011 at 20:49:16.
strup asked me to post it for him, but sure.. i dont think he minds
Oh, that was Strupstad? Wow.
We've got some good peeps here, I'm impressed.
I'll send him a PM then.
[[ RYUAHN | 220/21 Opifex Trader
== Proud Member of Core ==
[[ ALASTROPHE | 220/15 Solitus Martial-Artist
I started playing an Advy a month ago. My GF plays Keep. We're having a blast.
See it from the economic side. People will tip more for wrangles.
Neophyte Nerf"Shareida"Batted First Order
Freshman Jefferey"Bailan2"Ginsberg - Retired
Shareidah - First Order
A Producer's point of view
Looking at how FC is proceeding to rebalance, u did well starting an advy, since there will be proly no nerf on em...I started playing an Advy a month ago. My GF plays Keep. We're having a blast.
See it from the economic side. People will tip more for wrangles.
Btw 2billions for wrangle looks like a good start.
Lets start a wranglers strike!
Traders have gained a permanent (or as close to it) 250 damage buff in pvm. Your self crit chance has increased by 6% and you also gained a 5000 damage nuke which will land practically everytime, but a trader may have to cast a lower one so lets just say 4500 extra nano damage very 4 seconds.
In a team, you increase 5 player's critical chance by 15%, and combined with the increased weapon skill from umbral and -10000 AC's on a single target, the actually damage you increase profession DPM by is substantial. For my DD setup shade, for instance, that should be around a 42000 DPM increase. Pretty much you give everyone in the team an extra 150 AR and attach a ql300 Viral Targeting Subunit to the team.
Even if the increase in DPM was only 25000 for 5 members in the team at a 25000 DPM loss for yourself, the damage of your trader combined with the increase makes your DPM contribution about 270000, that is with a trader predicted to do 170000 DPM on a single target over time and is more than reasonable as a DD setup trader can hit numbers well over 200000 DPM. I'd be interested in knowing how much MORE DD a DD trader could do with these changes actually.
Your attempt to be realistic, unfortunately, lacks the facts of reality.
Do we want professions to be able to solo things like that in the future is the main question. I'm gonna give it a shot myself on my 220's to see the difficulty personally, but if FC wants professions to solo less in the future I would expect nerfs like this to everyone "eventually" and maybe no one would need to complain but rather team up.Below, an 8 minute movie of the pen cata boss solo killed.
KurSolo
If it is proven possible to survive this encounter with the proposed changes, then I'll shut up.
As a profession with access to the highest crit damage weapons, shotguns, and even the option of going MA for pvm, how exactly is +15% crit increase not an incredibly awesome change for you? I'm going to ignore the rest of what you said as I have actually analyzed the documents and thus know better.
Last edited by Gatester; Jan 22nd, 2011 at 22:04:42.
So lets say, for rebalancing shades, u propose to remove, dof+limber, and Piercing mastery perkline, and u'll be ok with a 250 damage buff , 15% extra crit buff for ur teammates and.... a shotgun?
Ok seems fair, u won it!
Regarding umbr, afraid u aren't a trader!
Regarding MA, u forgot that they got dof+limber + heals. For not mentioning ma attacks, stuns.
Last edited by Drakeep; Jan 22nd, 2011 at 22:18:06.
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