Group Perk Prof Delineation

[McKnuckleSamwich]

It has just become obvious to me, that if we QQ over acrobat, and it's nerfed, yes, it accomplishes the aim of nerfing advies, but, it also screws up relatively balanced or already slightly nerfed profs like fixers.

So, my suggestion is for Profession adjusted Group perks.

Sorry to heap work on your shoulders genele, but, this is possibly the only way to achieve balance on the age old problem of NERF ADVIES without messing up any of the related profs.

1. If acrobat is nerfed to nerf advies, MA, fixer shade gets nerfed worse.
2. If coon gets nerfed, enf and engy get nerfed worse.

How to Fix:

Advies need the "Jack of all Trades" Acrobat, and the "Jack of all Trades" Cocoon.

Make JoaT acrobat give 75% of current bonuses, 75% static, and 75% buff on limber 200-->150, and DoF 800-->600

Make JoaT Coccoon give 50% of current bonus, all absorbs cut in half.

That way, True evade profs don't get the beat stick, and the profs that actually need coccoon, engy+enf (and keepers who perk it instead of evades), don't get nerfed as a result of REAL needs in advy nerfment.

[Hacre]

Or you could just rectify the ages old Gaute mistake that was giving Advies Acrobat in the first place.

Which means, taking it off their group tab. Problem solved. People that should have Acrobat have it, Advies don't.

You don't get to be the only rival to doc heals, while bouncing around with 1000 stackable evade buffs, along with nicking bio cocoon from Keepers, Enforcers and Engineers. You just don't. Especially when these days Enforcers are barely justifying access to Bio cocoon.

Try and imagine this. Advies never had Acro, but had everything else that they had, good heals, access to Bio Shielding, root immunity, 2 weapon lines, one of which is ranged with 80% def checks.

Now imagine the response if in a perk change document, it was proposed Advies get Acrobat. You'd all go nuts and rightly so.

Says it all, really.

[Kopecz]

C'mon. Pick a nerf and stick to it. Is it gonna be 80% perk checks or remove acro or coon? The numerous advy hate threads popping up everyday are kinda getting a little ridiculous.

[Hacre]

C'mon. Pick a nerf and stick to it. Is it gonna be 80% perk checks or remove acro or coon? The numerous advy hate threads popping up everyday are kinda getting a little ridiculous.

They all kinda make a point though. With the rebalancing, something has to give. I'd be happy for Advies to keep 80% checks if Acrobat or Cocoon goes.

All three being available though is ridiculously stupid.

[Kinkstaah]

Or:

1) You could remove people from perking both
2) You could make advys only perk Bio Shielding 9, and Acrobat 3 maximum.
3) People would just stop whining about it

[Xenotric]

Im all for the removal of acrobat from adventurers, as i've stated numerous times, there was next to no reason for them to have it to begin with, they have no background in being an evade dependent profession and no support for evades in their toolset.

Only real reason I can fathom for them ever having access to the line is for the multi weapon skill it gives, which is not terribly needed for adventurers seeing as they get tons of support for that already (yes perhaps they might have to spend a bit of more IP then they otherwise would but it'd be about time ¬_¬)

I have no qualms with them having bio shielding as they have a background in using shields and absorbs, nor with them having 80% defense check perks (although having higher attack multiplier would be better)

[Racatti]

Advs are fine, l2p nubs!

[tweeeek]

Advs are fine, l2p nubs!

more then fine infact

[erozc]

Change post topic so that it actually reflects "Nerf advies" instead of it actually seeming like something exciting about group perks in general.

[Kopecz]

they have no background in being an evade dependent profession and no support for evades in their toolset.

Wut? Do you even play and advy? You do know that wolf morphs and auras and bird morphs all add evades so how the hell can you sit there and say it's not supported in our toolset?

I have no qualms with them having bio shielding as they have a background in using shields and absorbs

First true thing you've said about advys so far. In summary, learn the tools before you start posting about what is and isnt' part of our toolset kthx.

[Xenotric]

last time I checked wolf gave AAD not evades, reet is "evade support" the same way a yalmaha stilletto is a dodge range buffing item, yes it gives the stat but since you can't do anything but move in it its not really "support"

The only nearly valid skill you stated would be the wolf aura, but that in itself is not so much as an evade buff but an all around team buff, and is only a 3 nano line hardly what I'd call support.

but sure if you want to call that a full evade support toolset then surely NT's, metaphysicists, traders, keepers and soldiers should have access to acrobat as they all have nano's that buff evades (some even more then fixers) so therefore have evades as a supported toolset.

[Theonora]

last time I checked wolf gave AAD not evades, reet is "evade support" the same way a yalmaha stilletto is a dodge range buffing item, yes it gives the stat but since you can't do anything but move in it its not really "support"

The only nearly valid skill you stated would be the wolf aura, but that in itself is not so much as an evade buff but an all around team buff, and is only a 3 nano line (2 nanos when acrobat was given) hardly what I'd call support.

but sure if you want to call that a full evade support toolset then surely NT's, metaphysicists, traders, keepers and soldiers should have access to acrobat as they all have nano's that buff evades (some even more then fixers) so therefore have evades as a supported toolset.

Adventurer evade or AAD buffs, endgame ones only because I can't be bothered to list all of them

Calia's Figure: Wolf
Mother Wolf
Improved Stare of Cerberus
Dance of the Dervish
Calia's Form: Parrot
Shadowstalker or Lightstalker
The Call

I wouldn't necessarily call it a "full evade support toolset." But we've had little bits and pieces of evades tucked into various nanos for a while. Although, I wouldn't necessarily say that perking either acrobat or bioshielding is a bad idea or choice, either, quite honestly.

[Xenotric]

The thing is MOST professions tend to have evades tucked into the odd buff here and there, and saying that is support enough to have access to what has become one of the major defensive tools for those professions that do rely on evades (some almost exclusively so) just doesnt seem right, more so if those professions already have defense support in a way they have more history and support in to begin with.

Specially as you could take almost any of the "competitive" stats and say adventurers have support for them as they have them tucked into a couple of nanos and perks... Heck a fair amount of the evade buffing for adventurers only came up after or with the introduction of acrobat. Before that adventurers had very meagre amounts of evades on one or two lines meant for buffing other stats.

And AAD does not count as Evade support as its not evades, its just defense rating, but even then that was only introduced to the shadowlands 200+ wolf lines

[Theonora]

The thing is MOST professions tend to have evades tucked into the odd buff here and there, and saying that is support enough to have access to what has become one of the major defensive tools for those professions that do rely on evades (some almost exclusively so).

Specially as you could take almost any of the "competitive" stats and say adventurers have support for them as they have them tucked into a couple of nanos and perks... Heck a fair amount of the evade buffing for adventurers only came up after or with the introduction of acrobat. Before that adventurers had very meagre amounts of evades on one or two lines meant for buffing other stats.

And AAD does not count as Evade support as its not evades, its just defense rating, but even then that was only introduced to the shadowlands 200+ wolf lines

I suppose that would depend on how significant you find 165 AAD and 179 evades + a 201 pulsing evade nano buff. (That's without acrobat, I didn't calculate it in.) Its obviously not enough to count adventurers as a top tier evade profession, I imagine, but a total of 545 points is significant enough to me that evades is something I work on in setup, obviously. I've never bothered to do the same sort of calculation for any other profession, so I couldn't tell you how exactly it falls into anyone else's amounts exactly. And yes, I'm aware that its Acrobat that launches that number into the "higher numbers of" categories, so as I said, I wouldn't kick to hard if we had to make a choice between that or bioshielding. I'm feeling agreeable today.

[Xenotric]

Yes at best it should be a choice between the two, but I would still argue that evades aren't the primary or core defense of the adventurer as much as absorbs and healing are and thus could probably drop the perk entirely (im not opposed to it being replaced with a different perkline to further enhance adventurers main defense, although most adventurers tend to be towards the powerful side of the scale without such modifications)

[agentwolve]

balance is not intended for 1v1 duels

[McKnuckleSamwich]

balance is intended

fixed

[sultryvoltron]

Adventurer evade or AAD buffs, endgame ones only because I can't be bothered to list all of them

Calia's Figure: Wolf
Mother Wolf
Improved Stare of Cerberus
Dance of the Dervish
Calia's Form: Parrot
Shadowstalker or Lightstalker
The Call

I wouldn't necessarily call it a "full evade support toolset." But we've had little bits and pieces of evades tucked into various nanos for a while. Although, I wouldn't necessarily say that perking either acrobat or bioshielding is a bad idea or choice, either, quite honestly.

I hate Advys >.<

[McKnuckleSamwich]

I hate Advys >.<

QFT.

Remove Acrobat from advy. they got better evades than enforcer or keeper without acrobat, better heals than enforcer, keeper, and MA and shade, and have awesome escape tactics.

(melee profs listed)

I think they are balanced without acrobat.

[erozc]

Removing is so boring... How about a trade it, maybe for Corporate Protection and Industrial Sabotage?