IP reset

[___________JagdTyger]

Neutrals wont be missing anything as is they dont get boards or tokens heh, so why should they get Iprs too...... Im just being sarcastic, but wasnt the idea to have neutrals so that new players could get in game as one then choose which side they wanted down the line? Neutrals are unappealing for lack of having a board to make you want to choose a side, and to make a career out of being neutral is a personal choice that you accept knowing you wont get these. So whats the difference if they benefit or not, mayhaps FC has plans for Newts down the line that will finally give those that choose to be that some love. But on the other hand, you can be neutral and go omni or clan, or clan and go omni, or omni and go clan, but you cant be omni or clan and go newt. There is a reason for this...

Jagdtyger

[______________Yazule]

It would take me 7 reset points if for some reason in the future my weapon setup was screwed over. Like how they changed the skills on crossbows in 14.6.

ok lets do some math

title level 1, 1 ipr, 2, 2 ipr, 3, 3ipr, 4, 4ipr, 5, 5irp, 6, 6ipr

1+2+3+4+5+6= 21 ipr

HMMMMMMMM.

that means you can change weapons 3 times IF IT USES 7 SKILLS.

I am 141, I dont level really anymore, BS missions just too boring, I could be 200, but what do I learn in those last 59 levels except boredom?

Never used my full reset, never used any IPR, on my third weapon choice and am I gimped? NO...

I have title capped all my "important" nano skills, all my attack skills, body dev, nano pool. Yeah, I am a little short on evades, but I can drop my weapon and cream leets with my 400 MA roflol

edit- also title capped treatment, race capped int, melee init is title capped as well

gimme a break, they gave everyone an out (full IPR) and then (by the above math) 3-5 more outs (not many people use 7 skills for a weapon). If someone chose to use (or should I say waste) their IPR on the flavor of the month, or whatever, then too damn bad for them.

Again, no matter HOW MUCH SENSE I MAKE, I will not win this argument. People got a taste of IPR's and that is where funcom made their mistake. They did make so many mistakes before that one that the IP Reset is reasonable, but now they dont have a leg to stand on as far as trying to deny them again.

So people will whine, and complain and in the end they WILL give a full IPR and tokens for ipr rules, cause they have to, cause people will keep askin, cause they still want to make money.



twalk amungst yoselves

[Blackwing]

Originally posted by Neuromncer
What I don't seem to understand is what 'major' change in the game is coming with this patch? A buff is becoming self only... a scope is slowing inits? These are 'major' changes? Hah! Then by this reasoning MA crits becoming self only is a major change, BBI's changing from melee to ranged init is a major change... hell, give me 2 total IPR's for those! Even though it may seem like a 'major' change to some of you, losing out on a high end buff is not a major change, nor is inits being lowered by an item. I could see if you are level 200 and don't have any IP left to spend, but otherwise it will mean that (heaven forbid) you have to spend IP to use something well, instead of being lazy and getting buffs to make up for a deficit in your Toon. *shrugs* Did it ever make much sense to anyone that a scope was raising crits on melee attacks?

And now about the idea of IPR for tokens.... aren't the neutrals gimped enough as it is? Why make it so that they can't IPR now? Extra EXP sounds good, tokens do not.

if i remember correctly the crit buffs became self only at the time of the total ipr.

around that time the shotgun whatever profession population got drastically reduced.

point being: it was a drastic change in the way the game played and there was an ipr.

[Peisinoe]

Originally posted by Yazule
I am 141, I dont level really anymore, BS missions just too boring, I could be 200, but what do I learn in those last 59 levels except boredom?

Typical statement of one who doesn't know what he's talking about. I find that most who use this excuse really mean that they're lazy and don't feel like putting in the effort.

I'll tell you that at no point in leveling up was my character not improving. But I find there are many players who think it is easier to cry out, 'I don't gain anything if I level up to 200!' then actually doing it. (At no point between 1-198 was I not raising something essential.)

Oh yes. When you have green weapon skills, it is much clearer to see what type of weapon to use. It gets nerfed a little, but guess what...it is a green skill. Do you have any idea what type of IP it took me to use the weapons I use now? Probably more then you'll ever see at level 141. When you're all dark blue, then you just pick one. If it gets nerfed, then you reset and pick another one. Weapons change every damn patch. The flipside is nanos. Funny, I bet if they changed every patch, you'd be crying your little ass off.

Now, if this was a truly balanced game, we wouldn't all have to rely on weapons. Those of us who have ALL dark blue weapon skills could actually rely on our green nano skills for instance. This game, however, does not work like this. We are all pseudo soldiers/agents. A few of us are gimped to hell MA wannabes.

No, IPR shouldn't be given to anyone except a level 200. Once that character is there, it is stuck. It can't level anymore. And while it may be just fine and dandy for some players to oh..use a queenblade for months and months and be an utter gimp, therefor making it very easy to self righteously say that IPR is for the 'casual gamer' while playing up the holy martyr role, some of us actually like to have fun and be effective at what we do, and not spend months bearing the heavy weight of martyrdom on our shoulders.

But I suppose someone who looks at the game more seriously then me is beyond such things. *snicker*

[Dyna18]

The last time I checked AO was still a game.

And a game is for people to have fun, which means everyone should play it the way they find entertaining.

So I say more IPR to those who want it.
I imagine there is nothing more boring then being ql200 and not being able to change anything anymore to your character.

[______________Yazule]

Originally posted by Peisinoe


Typical statement of one who doesn't know what he's talking about. I find that most who use this excuse really mean that they're lazy and don't feel like putting in the effort.

I'll tell you that at no point in leveling up was my character not improving. But I find there are many players who think it is easier to cry out, 'I don't gain anything if I level up to 200!' then actually doing it. (At no point between 1-198 was I not raising something essential.)

Oh yes. When you have green weapon skills, it is much clearer to see what type of weapon to use. It gets nerfed a little, but guess what...it is a green skill. Do you have any idea what type of IP it took me to use the weapons I use now? Probably more then you'll ever see at level 141. When you're all dark blue, then you just pick one. If it gets nerfed, then you reset and pick another one. Weapons change every damn patch. The flipside is nanos. Funny, I bet if they changed every patch, you'd be crying your little ass off.

Now, if this was a truly balanced game, we wouldn't all have to rely on weapons. Those of us who have ALL dark blue weapon skills could actually rely on our green nano skills for instance. This game, however, does not work like this. We are all pseudo soldiers/agents. A few of us are gimped to hell MA wannabes.

No, IPR shouldn't be given to anyone except a level 200. Once that character is there, it is stuck. It can't level anymore. And while it may be just fine and dandy for some players to oh..use a queenblade for months and months and be an utter gimp, therefor making it very easy to self righteously say that IPR is for the 'casual gamer' while playing up the holy martyr role, some of us actually like to have fun and be effective at what we do, and not spend months bearing the heavy weight of martyrdom on our shoulders.

But I suppose someone who looks at the game more seriously then me is beyond such things. *snicker*

*edit* It is the people who have no argument that decide to attack a person instead of posting actual constructive arguments

Based on your post to me and its tone I decided to post my arguments and give as good as I get... enjoy

/edit

1) are you really that dense? I have been around since beta, played all but one class (fixer). What I "dont know what I am talking about" is the boredom of 200. OOOH, you did 934875934857349587 bs missions, I am really impressed pfft.

What big upgrades did you get between 150 and 200? hmm, the numbers got bigger in your stats/skills area, you got the SAME nano only higher quality ... oooohhhh! color me impressed. Those hours upon hours of running through the same mission killing the same mobs taught you so much

good sheep, good sheep *scratches behind her ears*

/prostrate

2) who chose your weapon... oh yeah, you did, sounds to me like you learned a LOT about managing those IP's ... hmmm...

Yeah, I have green skills for combat, guess what, I have only 3 requirements on my weapon, yet I have raised all of my skills at some point or another in that list and yet still dont seem to need a reset... HELL I WAS PEIRCING when i was born and now am 2hb.

And guess what, they are not changing the skills needed for weapons, just the weapons that you want. The only changes to weapons I have seen are all good, fixing bugs (with VERY few exceptions) like init bugs etc. They have changed a number of my nano's over the past almost two years... find one post that has me screaming for an IP reset. Mongo, my bread and butter has changed a number of times, Rage, my jelly, has changed a number of times. CHallenger is about to be changed as well, another of my biggie nano's

yeah, your a real genious it seems

3) your 200 and your stuck, and you were foolish enough to use your 21 IP RESETS along with your FULL IP RESET... and you still feel stuck.

boy you learned a lot in those extra 59 levels didnt you? how many upgrades to your dunce cap did you get?

4) tell you what, lets just let everyone start the game and just give them commands

/set level x
/set skill x max
/clear skill x
/set damage x
/set profession x

w00t that was fun!

lets play again

I dont take this particular game seriously at all... it is the people whining that their game needs to give them everything that are taking it soo seriously.

I never say anything against anyone until they decide to judge me.

I guess all I can say to you is

1) seek help, now
2) you are an idiot

kthxbye

[___________JagdTyger]

Hmmm thought this was constructive....

if someone does something to you, and you do that same in kind to them, that makes you no better then the one who started it....

damn kids...

Jagdtyger

[______________Yazule]

I give what I get, if that makes me a 32 year old child then so be it. People that are nice to me get 10 fold of the generosity, people who decide to be "not so nice" to me get 10 fold of that as well.

I am a life amplifier, I amplify the energy directed at me.

and I made very constructive arguments. The fact that I 'salted' them with my opinion is of no consequence.

[Elektro]

Whoever mentioned this idea.... too lazy to scroll back ..heh
I think it is a great idea. The problem would be implementing it though. Possibly another item like the token board to load your tokens to, kind of like the bag used for tags turned into Brock.

Once you get the bag full of 250 tokens, you can trade it to a machine/person for 1 ip reset point.

Reason why this is a great idea? People wouldn't be so scared to try new things with their character, and you might actually see level 200 peeps running missions again. From what I hear, lvl 200 = boring.

The number of tokens could be increased if people thought it is too easy to aquire these tokens. The only drawback to introducing a "bag" type system would make the tokens currently above 1k on the token boards useless, but all newly aquired ones could be put in "bag".

[Blackwing]

unless neutral really get tokens?

[locomdenom]

I believe they get them under the current system, but can't "use" them so they just delete them.

If you loaded them into a bag, then neut's would just load tokens they got into the bag, rather than using them for the board.

Hell, it'd give neuts an advantage; all those tokens we have to put into token boards, they'd put into IPR points.

[___________JagdTyger]

Its been so long since I was a newt that I cant remember if I got tokens when I did missions, I dont think I did tho. But as I said before I believe newts are the way they are for a reason, to make you want to choose a side, newt kinda being the intro side you can choose as a newbie. Tho in the long run I am not against newts getting something that would give them a board like everyone else. I did see a newt that had both pads on, if im correct they can do both the omni and clan quest as is. In any conflict like the one we have in this game, Clan vs Omni, there is always a group that can play off both sides.

Jagdtyger

[Dunsany]

Originally posted by JagdTyger
Its been so long since I was a newt that I cant remember if I got tokens when I did missions, I dont think I did tho. But as I said before I believe newts are the way they are for a reason, to make you want to choose a side, newt kinda being the intro side you can choose as a newbie. Tho in the long run I am not against newts getting something that would give them a board like everyone else. I did see a newt that had both pads on, if im correct they can do both the omni and clan quest as is. In any conflict like the one we have in this game, Clan vs Omni, there is always a group that can play off both sides.

Jagdtyger

Currently, I'm a level 140 Neutral and I've never earned a token even if I 100% complete a mission. I do have half a bank full of tokens I've looted off bodies in missions, just in case I find a use for them sometime in the future.

I've completed the first two parts of both the Alvin and Dodga quests and can wear both Clan and Omni shoulder pads because the side requirements are Not Omni and Not Clan.

Personally, I think it would be interesting to make the token boards Not Omni and Not Clan, perhaps with some mix of advantages and disadvantages for the Neutrals that choose to wear them. And I think the ICC should design some useful neck slot items that anyone can wear but are more specialized than the Clan and Omni token boards. Superior Tradeskills Bow Tie, Superior Self Defense Bow Tie, etc.

[geal]

hehe yazule...i dont disagree with your comments..but the fact taht you played so long..you know what to do and waht not to do. many people who started playing ao made lots of stupid mistakes (put skills into swimming and adventuring)..including me. i have used many ip resets before the lvl 30..i even used my full ipr at lvl 25 just because i had no idea what i was doing. 120 lvls later, i used up many ip skills(i put lots of ip in mechanical engineering because i liked making rings :/, then i figured out i was losing money hehe) and resets as well. right now i dont really need it..i guess i'll have faith in fc and stick with pistols, but the whole point of it is so that it adds a bit of high lvl experimenting. right now everyone is basically following the same path because they know it works, they are hesitant to spend their ips in other ways. i guess my only other option is to make another alt and get it up to lvl 140 (i really was considering making an alt of the same prof as my main)..sigh.

[______________Yazule]

Originally posted by geal
hehe yazule...i dont disagree with your comments..but the fact taht you played so long..you know what to do and waht not to do. many people who started playing ao made lots of stupid mistakes (put skills into swimming and adventuring)..including me. i have used many ip resets before the lvl 30..i even used my full ipr at lvl 25 just because i had no idea what i was doing. 120 lvls later, i used up many ip skills(i put lots of ip in mechanical engineering because i liked making rings :/, then i figured out i was losing money hehe) and resets as well. right now i dont really need it..i guess i'll have faith in fc and stick with pistols, but the whole point of it is so that it adds a bit of high lvl experimenting. right now everyone is basically following the same path because they know it works, they are hesitant to spend their ips in other ways. i guess my only other option is to make another alt and get it up to lvl 140 (i really was considering making an alt of the same prof as my main)..sigh.

yes you are right, playing before live did give me an advantage.

think on this though, when you ding 200 you get 6 IPR, so if you have any "final mistakes" to fix then you got them

thank you for the post, it made more sense than any other I have heard.

Just to let you know though, I "threw away" 4 toons on RK1 when I moved, then on RK2 D is my second toon (though I didnt mess up my NT "main" funcom did nerf range and had buggy nano's, so I stopped playing him... oh and nanomage ). Every one has their rerolls. This is my 3rd MMORPG in the past 7ish years and I know that there is always the "n00bie" phase, chars you love but dont use because you messed them up. Then you reroll and make your "uber" template.

Bein a n00b is the most fun in the game imho. When everything is fresh and new. After that you have friends and "tweeking/twinking" to keep you happy (oh and pvp ;p)

[Silver]

IP reset points are a good thing and keep the game interesting (and after all this is a game and games must be fun and interesting or there would be no players).

Personally the though of reaching lvl 200 and not being able to change my character and try new weapons and different skills would make me stop right now and play something else. I want my characters to be fun and interesting.

I don’t have the time to reroll and I wouldn’t want to if I did. I like the character I have now.

I am not bothered about full IPR, I just want to be able to “change” my character as the game moves in different directions.

IPR points should be obtainable in game (not easily) but we should still have that opportunity.

Silver

[______________Zindel]

I did the full IPR when it was available, not because I felt anything had been mistakenly raised, but just to gain back the extra skill gained from ability trickle down. In fact, I only saved a grand total of 20k IP. Now at level 200 I have 15 IPR points remaining, and very close to 1mil IP banked. I also have 2 skills (1hb for torturing tool, piercing for claw) that I may never use again. Do I think I deserve more IPR after the upcoming changes.….absolutely!

The 15 tokens I have remaining are a title level bonus from 1-200, which gives me the ability to experiment with things such as the torturing tool and claw. If a new and better weapon comes along in a patch that requires 1HE or 2HB I do NOT expect to have extra IP to change to the new weapons, as long as they work in the same fashion as they did in the original investment of IP (or with very little change). If I were short IP from equipping the new weapons, I would expect to use 2 of my title level tokens to recover the unwanted skills. However, if Funcom were to make some major fundamental change, which heavily impacted my character by rendering skills useless through an item nerf or whatever, I feel that warrants extra IPR tokens.

From an MA perspective on the upcoming changes; the nerf to Reet-tech bows should include sufficient IPR tokens to recover all the skills required to equip the weapon. The low light scope changes should include sufficient IPR tokens to reset the required trade skills. This is potential wasted IP and should be recoverable, NOT by using IPR tokens from title levels. We shouldn't be forced to use tokens earned through title levels every time Funcom decides to nerf something, its not fair to every class. I've been lucky, advanced my character very conservatively, some professions have gone or will go through very heavy changes, forcing them to waste a lot of tokens which gives them much less room to experiment with new content. I feel very sorry for the engineers and doctors who have pursued the MA route. They are losing attack rating through ffok nerf, their critical chances will be the lowest in the game as the scope nerf will probably limit them to MOP, TTS and GOC only. If they are forced to use their title level IPR, this will give them less chances to experiment with future content.

The request for a full IPR doesn't seem necessary at this time. Funcom just needs to evaluate what changes deserve extra IP and return that to the players. As time goes on those title level tokens may be fully spent experimenting with new content. Funcom really needs to create a more dynamic system for earning extra tokens to make that content accessible. Players will get bored if they are stuck with old gear and deserve to try new content to keep the game interesting. One suggestion I think would be great (similar to UO and AC2) is to allow the player to lower a skill progressively and add back the IP to their pool. I do sort of dislike the sort of instant mind erasing of IPR. Would be nice to unlearn something over time and build something else at the same rate. Lastly, for those who argue, "well then we'll just have cookie cutter characters and I like being unique!!"...IPR won't keep you from being unique. If everyone goes to one type of weapon or gear...be "unique" and change.

[____________Farraday]

*grins evily*

Yazule, he may be big, ugly and full of opinion, but he's ours =P

As for the full IP Reset? Blah.. we don't need an IP Reset.

There was an IP reset, NOT because MA Crit buffs were changed to self only, but because 1) of the OE Changes, and damn near EVERYONE had built their characters around the fact that you could use the biggest and best equipment possible, without any penalties. and 2) Because of the numerous changes that were made to skills before hand.

Once they pack on another 10 months of changes to skills (if they do) then I'll be right there asking for a full IP Reset.

As it is now, I agree with Yazule - they gave it to us once, so now the players are going to get upset and *demand* it every other patch to fix their gimped characters which really aren't all that gimped.

[Yakuza]

Dna...#1 you get a total of 15 IPR points at TL6

#2 Why do you want to FORCE people to be different?

#3 Getting more IPRs would actually get people to be different anyway...Ex:
An Engi wants to reset MA or Shotgun and try out grenade launchers...But he's afraid they will suck so he's going to reset to something 'safer' that he knows will be a decent weapon i.e. a cookie-cutter one...If he had more IPRs then he could try it out and reset again if he didn't like it.

[______________Yazule]

Originally posted by Kaiousama
Dna...#1 you get a total of 15 IPR points at TL6

#2 Why do you want to FORCE people to be different?

#3 Getting more IPRs would actually get people to be different anyway...Ex:
An Engi wants to reset MA or Shotgun and try out grenade launchers...But he's afraid they will suck so he's going to reset to something 'safer' that he knows will be a decent weapon i.e. a cookie-cutter one...If he had more IPRs then he could try it out and reset again if he didn't like it.

1) really? I am not 150 yet and have *would have to look but pretty sure* 10 IPR, so you saying you get no IPR at 200 and 5 at 150... again I will have to look when I get home and then come back and edit if I am wrong (dont pay much attention cause I dont use them)

2) I dont force people to make decisions on what they want to be. In the early days this may have been an argument, but we didnt have IPR then . Now all you gotta do is

a) look around you
b) go to the boards

and if you want to be UBER you can follow the templates

3) getting IPR's gives people the ability to change to the flavor of the month, MOST players will pick the imbalanced weapons/skills. These of course are the things to get nerfed cause they are imbalancing. Then they go to the next best thing, which becomes the newest flavor of the month/imbalanced thing.

What you get is the Uber d00d brigade, and yes I honestly beleive that 90% of the people that will USE the IPR's regularly are these people.

If you want to be unique you will probably stick with what you have unless it becomes "UBER" in which case you will gimp yourself because others are copying you. Either that or you become an "old school MA engineer" (just an example, not saying ma engi is uber).

*edit* I should just add this to every post...

I am NOT going to win this argument... guess I am a glutton for punnishment, but I feel my opinions are still VERY VALID...