Thread: MP Nano Document Discussion Thread

  1. #541
    Quote Originally Posted by Kintaii View Post
    He didn't mention pistol and neither did I. :P Is pistol going to be supported through MP nanos? No. Not right now, and the odds are that isn't going to change. I never said, however, that pistols wouldn't be something that MPs could use and use effectively; the only thing I have said in regards to pistols is that if you want to get buffed for pistol use, you're going to need to track down someone to buff you up - Nothing that's too different from how things are now.

    As an MP, your official, nano-supported weaponry choices are as follows: 1hB, 2hB, and Bow. Pistol will remain an option, but you're not getting nano buffs for it - This doesn't say anything about perk support, items, etc. etc. If you really WANT to use a pistol then go for it - But to make it work, *you're* going to have to work, and you're going to have to twink and buff and get your stuff right.
    Clearly someone completely ignored what we said?

    And maybe I wanna add that there are 2hes and melee energy for MPs. Also, to repeat everybody else, Pistol is our less hard weapons skill to improve

    To say that pistol will be not in MP core anymore is..... odd.
    Lainbr - 220/30/70 Meta-Physicist Nanomage - E / Spirals - 220/30/70 Enforcer Solitus - E / Kokusho - 201/22/55 Fixer Nanomage - Equip Soon ;o
    Traderbr - 180/0/0 Trader Nanomage - / Kaoru - 60/0/0 Meta-Physicist Nanomage - totw semitwink
    Proud veteran of Spartans

    To devs: You failed redesigning MPs as NTs with pets. I want my debuffer back.
    Dreamer: Basically - I wish THIS much effort was put in to ALL profs rebalance docs.

    Kintaii: Genele is more hardcore than you, your guildmates, and anyone else you've ever played with
    Anarrina: Trust me, I'm not that scary in real life.

  2. #542
    Fair enough, and thanks for the clarification that we're moving from 4 to 3 official weapon choices. Four supported weapon choices is more than most professions get I suppose, and having 3 adequately supported weapon choices may be better for the profession as a whole than 4 poorly supported choices.

    This should give Pistol MPs time to plan either a new setup or a new profession. On the other hand, so long as we don't lose the Pistol support we have now (best weapon from an IP perspective, symb and group perkline support) there is no reason Pistol MPs should be more gimp after than the re-balance than they are today. Got to feel for them though - like most MPs, they had to be hoping for improvement in the re-balance.

    On the other hand, you could consider letting Pistol MPs have sufficient support to cast the top pet (even if they had to swap a bit to do so). Using a weapon without nano-support isn't such a big deal (particularly when it IP caps 160 higher than 1hb and bow, 320 higher than 2hb), but I fear for a lot of Pistol MPs not being able to cast the top pet (and while I may be mis-interpreting that seems to be what is being suggested) will be a deal breaker.

  3. #543
    So are we still going to get perked by every profession, bar doc's after the re-balance?

    You guys messed things up really bad with the pistol perks/As pistol that you can maybe understand some people are not looking forward to items etc being redone.

    FC 'fixed' self proccing, thus loosing us 350 evades at the touch of a button, perhaps take 350 evades off every prof and see how they feel??
    FC alter pistol perks so now even a decent engi/crat can face roll a bow mp with them pistol perks, nice thinking.
    FC hand out the new prof stars, grats on handing out 60 ar to Enf for example but no def on our's.
    FC gives us 'the best AS gun in game' Shame we need a scope to be decent with it while other profs get to click between def hud/ar, lowering our def to ar ratio again.

    Guessing its things like this that have affected mp's badly are making some people worried.
    Still here

  4. #544
    Quote Originally Posted by Cryfreman View Post
    So are we still going to get perked by every profession, bar doc's after the re-balance?

    You guys messed things up really bad with the pistol perks/As pistol that you can maybe understand some people are not looking forward to items etc being redone.

    FC 'fixed' self proccing, thus loosing us 350 evades at the touch of a button, perhaps take 350 evades off every prof and see how they feel??
    FC alter pistol perks so now even a decent engi/crat can face roll a bow mp with them pistol perks, nice thinking.
    FC hand out the new prof stars, grats on handing out 60 ar to Enf for example but no def on our's.
    FC gives us 'the best AS gun in game' Shame we need a scope to be decent with it while other profs get to click between def hud/ar, lowering our def to ar ratio again.

    Guessing its things like this that have affected mp's badly are making some people worried.
    And now they take our SS 250AAD that we maintain 100% of pvp time and divert everybody attention to the *shinning* new evade buffs, saying we got more defense. Pff...

    If AR profs dont get an AR nerf or if we dont get massive AAD/Evades in itemalization... WE ARE DOMMED
    Lainbr - 220/30/70 Meta-Physicist Nanomage - E / Spirals - 220/30/70 Enforcer Solitus - E / Kokusho - 201/22/55 Fixer Nanomage - Equip Soon ;o
    Traderbr - 180/0/0 Trader Nanomage - / Kaoru - 60/0/0 Meta-Physicist Nanomage - totw semitwink
    Proud veteran of Spartans

    To devs: You failed redesigning MPs as NTs with pets. I want my debuffer back.
    Dreamer: Basically - I wish THIS much effort was put in to ALL profs rebalance docs.

    Kintaii: Genele is more hardcore than you, your guildmates, and anyone else you've ever played with
    Anarrina: Trust me, I'm not that scary in real life.

  5. #545
    Yes. Clearly there is not enough domming going on these days. =)
    Towerblock, 220/30/70 Engineer
    President of Steadfast

    And way too many alts...

  6. #546
    Changing to bow is not interesting, so no coming back either.

    This people should watch more sci-fi movies and less disney channel.

  7. #547
    Love the changes going to be introduced to MPs, but have some concerns:

    1. Debuffs
    Current debuffs may work good for PVP, or maybe not – have to test em, but for sure they are close to nothing at PVM. The biggest MP problem – team desirability may be solved if we got some changes in debuffs like –
    - PVM version of NSD capable to shutdown some abilities on nowadays bosses 100% of time
    - PVM version of damage debuff, with maybe smaller value of debuffing, but with possibility to keep it on mob 100% of the time.


    2. Pets
    Another way to give MPs some use in team is nano healing.
    Give us the ability to switch Heal Pet for nano healing, and it will may make the real difference on how MPs can work in team.

    Attack pet
    219 Pet with 2500 nanoskills is not something we have to twink hard for.
    2500 TS/MC is the usuall value on my trox MP in nano setup with current gear. Everyone will cast new pet with some huds swapping.
    Give us one more 220 pet, let it be something like 2700 TS/MC and it will be the real challenge for twinking, so we can have two real choices on pet twinking.


    3. Creation weapons
    As we are supposed to be nanoskills oriented prof, creation weapons AR template should be 100%TS+25%weap, not vice versa. Let us use nano based perks instead of weapon perks.
    Our creation weapons should hit for 1/1 and do 200-300 damage (as NTs one), to allow us to land some procs.
    With the current proposed AR template we still have much lower AR compared to AR other profs have. Not sure the new weapon bufs will change much.

    4. And pls we need some kind of alpha protection with SS gone.
    Last edited by gaia3; Apr 7th, 2011 at 20:01:16.

  8. #548
    Agreeing with gaia3.
    2500TS/MC is something that is reachable with easy-to-medium effort at endgame, and with medium effort if you are a weapon focused MP.
    I'd love a 2500TS/MC pet lvl 219 and a 220 pet 2700TS/MC reqs for those going full nanoskill setup.

    Regarding weapons, Tigress should have AMEP AR template. 100% bow + 25% TS or MC.
    Creation weapons should have 100% MC or TS and 25% weapon (not allowing us to use relative perks) or 70% weapon 55% TS or MC, 1.5/1.5 speed max and scaled dmg according to the "high" speed.
    I don't know how well will DtP work coupled with new healing from healpet, but I'd love to remind that we used to evades few things, and lately we don't really evade much.
    If devs want to turn us into engi evade type, then boost our chance to stand an alpha by a fair amount.

    Pistol support being left out of nano programs avaiable to MPs is something that will make a lot of MP drift into other weapon choices, I fear. By the way 2500TS/MC pet is doable with less than 4 swaps in a pistol MP like in my setup (changed ofab body for CS)
    220/30 Lordlawrence
    200/2x Pampero
    Ever wondered what's like making an OP toon? 30/3 Forum
    25/3 Killergoa

  9. #549
    Quote Originally Posted by -LL- View Post
    Regarding weapons, Tigress should have AMEP AR template. 100% bow + 25% TS or MC.
    Tigress should be destroyed and not survive the rebalancing.
    Ebondevil - Omni Level 220 Agent on Atlantean, Feel free to contact me any time if you have questions, in game or out.
    Varinox - Omni Level 220 Meta-Physicist on Atlantean
    Yamarra - Omni Level 150 Shade on Atlantean

    Feel free to send me any tell in game or a Private Message if you require anything.

  10. #550
    1. Disney is good, mkey?!!!

    I dont get it why ppl whine about pistols. They are not so great dd. Around the time when le came out i had to move from pistols coz they were too low dmg. Best i found was 1hb! Using Kyr'ozch was damn good for inf mishes. Maybe only shens has more dmg than that. Using FS or Burst on pistol costs a lot IP, not to mention multi ranged. And recharge on those would stay slow, and you hardly hit anybody with them in pvp. Using AS would also cost ip, and twinking 2250 pistol skills..
    Both for pvm and pvp there are better choices. And pistols are used by many other profs, we mps always said "we are uniqie, different" so why u wanna use a wep type that many others in ao using also? Being unique we said didnt we?

    Personally i had to change wep type many times. I was 2he, 2hb, pistol, 1hb, pistol again (if i remember well), and now bow. And if i have to change wep type again, fine. Its also part of being mp Its AO, you change wep when time (new patch) comes. Tradition wep? Yea, we can say that. Same as enfs with 2he and? If FC would force us to leave pets behind that would be something but this?

    Tho Kintaii didnt say they will nerf pistol mps. But, you can ask devs to give us moderate pistol support (as an old tradition wep). Its clear if you dont use creation weps you wont get access to full toolset, same goes if u keep using tigress, shens, or howlet, cdr, s7 weps (at lower lvls).

    I always loved to change, a new chellenge, a new playstyle. Maybe i would say if an mp havent changed wep type at least 3 times then not a real mp.

    Only thing FC must focus on the most is: to keep 1hb/2hb/bow in same strength, so mps could REALY choose what they want. Right now weapon choosing is same as being most effective/not to be worse than others. If FC could create a real balance between these 3 types, i would say thats awesome.

  11. #551
    Also, i guess few ppl didnt realy get what we will get. You will have same evade as keeping up SS all the time (with new evade buff), you get 50% reflect with rrfe (which is a bit less than having zset), you get 2-3x healing from pet. Those you lose 5 spec blocker. But now you get full access to your toolset and you wont be locked out for 10-30 secs coz you used CoC or SS. Tho ill miss CoC, was a realy annoying nano (at least for docs/advs xD )

    If we could be static unperkable (that we wasnt be), then with new heal/reflect we would be as hard to kill as a shield mp now.

    As i see FC want mp to be enf-like. I mean, take some dmg (enf has absorb, mp will have DtP) and heal up with pet. Did you see the pet heal desciption? 1017,5 HP/sec from full buffed healpet!!! That means u get back 60k hp/min!!! That means if u get 20k hp mob/player can alpha you 3 times in 6 min to 1 hp and you still survive and get healed. As i see now it will be damn OP and im afraid it will be nerfed, but i realy realy hope it wont. So why you wanna be unperkable? If you are smart, in duel you put hpet on wait. And after u got in few hits let it heal 1st. Anyway having 4,5 (!!!) healing time on pet, can u image it? 4-5k hp / 4,5 secs. Better than spamming BoL all the time!!! How is that, having a personal adv and spamming BoL on you as exchange for your crappy old healball?

  12. #552
    Quote Originally Posted by Ebondevil View Post
    Tigress should be destroyed and not survive the rebalancing.
    this without taking into account that AS is becoming a 3s cast special, and that agents are getting another special on top of that. So jealousy about Tigress should not survive rebalancing aswell.
    220/30 Lordlawrence
    200/2x Pampero
    Ever wondered what's like making an OP toon? 30/3 Forum
    25/3 Killergoa

  13. #553
    Tigress moaning was all bs anyways, an MP's AS is not even in the same ballpark as an agents.

    Agents getting another special as well.. cant wait to see how 'adv like' agents will become.
    Still here

  14. #554
    Quote Originally Posted by Cryfreman
    Tigress moaning was all bs anyways, an MP's AS is not even in the same ballpark as an agents.
    Nor should it be. And despite what you may think Traders isn't either. This isn't exactly something new...

  15. #555
    Quote Originally Posted by Cryfreman View Post
    Tigress moaning was all bs anyways, an MP's AS is not even in the same ballpark as an agents.

    Agents getting another special as well.. cant wait to see how 'adv like' agents will become.
    But if an Agent could have used the Tigress, they would have done better with it than with the Cobra MK6. Hell, Agents would do better with the Tigress than with Angst of the Xan. That's the point of the Tigress moaning, to point out how sucky rifles are.

    Also, I don't expect the proposed AS changes to go through like they currently are.
    The Fine Arts:
    Mime | Surgery | Zen
    The Traitor


    Xirayne: I couldn't care less about who is clueless or what the exact definition "real" pvp is in ao, I want "fun" pvp!

  16. #556
    Quote Originally Posted by SultryVoltron View Post
    But if an Agent could have used the Tigress, they would have done better with it than with the Cobra MK6. Hell, Agents would do better with the Tigress than with Angst of the Xan. That's the point of the Tigress moaning, to point out how sucky rifles are.
    Well, Tiger is not much worse then Tigress so...

    Quote Originally Posted by Kintaii View Post
    As an MP, your official, nano-supported weaponry choices are as follows: 1hB, 2hB, and Bow. Pistol will remain an option, but you're not getting nano buffs for it - This doesn't say anything about perk support, items, etc. etc. If you really WANT to use a pistol then go for it - But to make it work, *you're* going to have to work, and you're going to have to twink and buff and get your stuff right.
    What you are trying to say is, we are finally getting true 1hb/2hb/bow support on our symbiants?
    Renowned jester of the double AS Tigress

    MP in sneak eNSDed me and did about 20k damage in 10-12 seconds

  17. #557
    Quote Originally Posted by -LL- View Post
    this without taking into account that AS is becoming a 3s cast special, and that agents are getting another special on top of that. So jealousy about Tigress should not survive rebalancing aswell.
    I just absolutely love how everyone ignores the 220 MP I have listed in my sig, and then act like I don't have a clue about how the Tigress performs. People can and do play and enjoy more than one profession and I enjoy playing on my MP. I still despise the Tigress.

    This has nothing to do with jealousy, though keep believing that if it makes you feel better.
    Ebondevil - Omni Level 220 Agent on Atlantean, Feel free to contact me any time if you have questions, in game or out.
    Varinox - Omni Level 220 Meta-Physicist on Atlantean
    Yamarra - Omni Level 150 Shade on Atlantean

    Feel free to send me any tell in game or a Private Message if you require anything.

  18. #558
    Quote Originally Posted by Chrys
    What you are trying to say is, we are finally getting true 1hb/2hb/bow support on our symbiants?
    Quote Originally Posted by Kintaii
    As an MP, your official, nano-supported weaponry choices are as follows: 1hB, 2hB, and Bow.
    Think it's pretty clear what he said.

  19. #559
    Quote Originally Posted by -Klod- View Post
    Well, Tiger is not much worse then Tigress so...



    What you are trying to say is, we are finally getting true 1hb/2hb/bow support on our symbiants?
    I guess yes

    Quote Originally Posted by Ebondevil View Post
    I just absolutely love how everyone ignores the 220 MP I have listed in my sig, and then act like I don't have a clue about how the Tigress performs. People can and do play and enjoy more than one profession and I enjoy playing on my MP. I still despise the Tigress.

    This has nothing to do with jealousy, though keep believing that if it makes you feel better.
    :3 Like I despise Zset. But at least Tigress make us do something in pvp.
    Lainbr - 220/30/70 Meta-Physicist Nanomage - E / Spirals - 220/30/70 Enforcer Solitus - E / Kokusho - 201/22/55 Fixer Nanomage - Equip Soon ;o
    Traderbr - 180/0/0 Trader Nanomage - / Kaoru - 60/0/0 Meta-Physicist Nanomage - totw semitwink
    Proud veteran of Spartans

    To devs: You failed redesigning MPs as NTs with pets. I want my debuffer back.
    Dreamer: Basically - I wish THIS much effort was put in to ALL profs rebalance docs.

    Kintaii: Genele is more hardcore than you, your guildmates, and anyone else you've ever played with
    Anarrina: Trust me, I'm not that scary in real life.

  20. #560
    No BlackCradle... I think Klod meant more specifically items and equipment buffs - not the nano buffs.

    And I think Kintaii already said this when he said:

    Quote Originally Posted by Kintaii

    The itemization thing comes in in that your armour, your symbiants, your general equipment *may carry more support for these non-creation weapons in the future*.
    X
    Xtremtech: MetaPhysicist currently resident on Test. (209 + 21 AI Levels).

    Various other test MPs of differing levels and builds available.

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