Dr. Nano Doc

[Traderjill]

Not that I entirely disagree but that "chatter" is the sole reason they are posting those balance drafts - Drafts... because that's what they are - for feedback. Obviously some whining and ranting isn't going to help but from what I understand constructive feedback it wanted and required. It'll be a long time until any of these changes appear first on the test server so any talking about it both from fan as from FCs side is purely theoretical for now.

I understand that.. I do believe input is needed.. I didn't mean my statement to come off harsh in any way. I read through what you posted, for instance, and it seems like good information/feedback. I just feel that the back and forth over things like "who is OP" and "why docs are blamed for this that and the other" is a waste of space... and my comment was specifically directed towards the individual I quoted.

I've also heard people in-game and on the forums getting really upset over these changes and I guess my post was also my way of saying 'chill out' a bit.. we can overcome whatever is thrown our way and Kintaii has made it clear that the balancing will be on ongoing work in progress and adjustments will be made even once the changes hit Live.

[XenonDe]

Btw, will the complete heals still have the massive SL agg? Because if they lose that then I think that will be a massive boost for leveling doctors and something I would have appreciated while leveling on hecklers lol.

I've grown fond of the CH taunt tbh served me well at tl4-6 range. The boose for leveling doctors isn't that big though with the new heals and the longer cooldown on CH. The new best RK heal alone + UBT will be enough for any pre tl7 leveling without relying on extra perks / stims / CH support. (A pity.. really. That level range was where docs learned to use their full toolset)

[XenonDe]

I understand that.. I do believe input is needed.. I didn't mean my statement to come off harsh in any way. I read through what you posted, for instance, and it seems like good information/feedback. I just feel that the back and forth over things like "who is OP" and "why docs are blamed for this that and the other" is a waste of space... and my comment was specifically directed towards the individual I quoted.

I've also heard people in-game and on the forums getting really upset over these changes and I guess my post was also my way of saying 'chill out' a bit.. we can overcome whatever is thrown our way and Kintaii has made it clear that the balancing will be on ongoing work in progress and adjustments will be made even once the changes hit Live.

Wise words. These balance documents always seem to boil the blood. No.. Not the nano.
I suppose it just shows how much we all love our toons and the game.

[Binarybits]

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Sorry had a huge wall of text that was really just a rant about me viewing the changes as turning a doc into a turn-based healing profession ( think keeper as a team oriented no DD profession) instead of the quick multi-tasker I loved.

[XenonDe]

I made myself a quick overview of the Nanocosts and combined nanocosts to get a better feel of the drain. I'll just drop it here as raw data. May it be useful to someone... O.o

						Base (no NCR)					50% NCR		
				Recharge	Nanocost 	Nano/sec	Nano/2sec	Nanocost 	Nano/sec	Nano/2sec
Debuffs							
UBT				60		862		14,37		28,73		431		7,18		14,37
Wrack and Ruin			10		1142		114,2		228,4		571		57,1		114,2
							
Nukes / Dots							
Conta. Prot. Kappa (Nuke)	4		3065		766,25		1532,5		1532,5		383,13		766,25
Scything Blight (Dot A)		30		1337		44,57		89,13		668,5		22,28		44,57
Bone Eater (Dot B)		30		1362		45,4		90,8		681		22,7		45,4
Dr Blazes M. C. (Dot C)		10		3832		383,2		766,4		1916		191,6		383,2
Nanite Plague (Nemesis)		120		800		6,67		13,33		400		3,33		6,67
							
Healing							
Improved CH			20		1436		71,8		143,6		718		35,9		71,8
Bodily Invigoration		4		2051		512,75		1025,5		1025,5		256,38		512,75
Superior Team Health Plan	6		3231		538,5		1077		1615,5		269,25		538,5
Viral Rejuvination (Hot)	25		609		24,36		48,72		304,5		12,18		24,36
Life Expansion (Temp HP)	60		1362		22,7		45,4		681		11,35		22,7
							
							
Combined UBT+Dots+Base Nuke					1253,78		2507,57				626,89		1253,78
Combined BI+Hot+Temp HP						559,81		1119,62				279,91		559,81

[Teyla0]

Just to put in some basic info about me playing as a doc:
I'm playing doc for over 5 years and doc only (say whatever you want, other chars (to me) are freaking boring). A year ago I switched from 220 doc (too boring to keep playing a high lvl doc) to 150 for s10 and some pvp fun. And I'm 95% pvm solo based.

All right... let's see...

****CH 20 cooldown... Might cause troubles? Revitalizing Salve a solution for me? Could be. But!
4s cast time? (ok irrelevant). 2s recharge? Good. 4s cooldown? Another trouble?
A question here... Does the cooldown means I have to use different single heal or I can't use any single heal during the cooldown time?
Anyway, it's still faster than LE recharge time. Improvement? Umm... could be, but! Nano cost! Yes, it's the nano cost. LE 200% ? Revitalizing Salve 400% compared to LE? (forget the % nano cost or % heal mod for now, as it's irrelevant). Old LE 4.9 HP for 1 nano, new LE 3.3 HP for 1 nano, Revitalizing Salve 2.86 HP for 1 nano.
That makes 150% nano cost for new LE, and 171% for the Revitalizing Salve heal compared to old LE.
Before I started reading the forum I told myself that I could live with higher nano cost, even 200% for better heals (I mean really improved). As I usually don't drop less than 50% of my nano pool, whatever am I doing.
That means I've got what I wanted for a price I'm satisfied with.

I love it.

****Team heals... umm... higher average heal. Good idea! Nano cost? You've got to be kidding me... Seriously, the amount there is just wrong. 1331 for THP is wrong. Make it 750 top, which makes like 175% of the average nano/hp of the old THP. Just under 200%, this is crossing the line!

****HOTs... I use them... sometimes. I don't really have to, but I like being healed over time and care less about my (or team members) HP. But... now 25s duration? FC seriously? Slap yourself. It's not only stupid, it's also pathetic. Not shorter, but longer. That's the way to do it. Make it cost incredible amount of nano, but make it last longer. 4k nano for 10 mins on the tops HOT? Fair enough. I'd rather use some tactics than being HOT spamming monkey.

****HP buffs Long: Nothing to say here, I see improvement.
Short: 60s? Bad idea. 180s min please. This just doesn't make any sense...

****Init debuffs... 60s... well... make it 120, pvp 45 (it doesn't land every time and sometimes you can't "afford" to recast it, so it's fair enough). And I can live with that.

****Emergency nano regain? Thumbs up!

****New Dot's and nukes? Well, can't wait to play with these new toys!

All right, that's my opinion.

[Ayria]

A question here... Does the cooldown means I have to use different single heal or I can't use any single heal during the cooldown time?

Cooldown is like perk recharge, it doesn't block other things.

Currently nanos are like 1/2 to say 1 sec cast time and 2 recharge.

After balance it will be more like 1/1/2 for 1 cast, 1 recharge, 2 cooldown. With recharge being quicker it lets us start casting another nano quicker, just not that specific one we just cast because it has a 2 second cooldown.

ICH works like that currently. With a 4 second recharge, opening us to cast BI etc, but a 20 second cooldown so we can't ICH again for 20 seconds even though we can cast other nanos before ICHs cooldown is done.

[blingoutyourdead]

Cooldown is like perk recharge, it doesn't block other things.

Currently nanos are like 1/2 to say 1 sec cast time and 2 recharge.

After balance it will be more like 1/1/2 for 1 cast, 1 recharge, 2 cooldown. With recharge being quicker it lets us start casting another nano quicker, just not that specific one we just cast because it has a 2 second cooldown.

ICH works like that currently. With a 4 second recharge, opening us to cast BI etc, but a 20 second cooldown so we can't ICH again for 20 seconds even though we can cast other nanos before ICHs cooldown is done.

I think this is not quite right. The cooldown is per line, not per nano. So you take 1 second to cast, then 1 second to recharge, then between 4 and 60 seconds, depending on the line, of cooldown. During that cooldown you can cast anything in any line that is not in cooldown, but you can't cast another nano in any line that is currently in cooldown. So you can cast a single heal, team heal, DOT, init debuff, and complete heal all in a row, with just cast and recharge in between. But you can't cast another nano in the CH line (includes CH, iCH, and A&O), until cooldown from the first CH is completed.

[Keex]

Thanks for reading any of the thread or putting forth anything valuable in the discussion.

If your going to say something like that try adding some details so we know where you are coming from and why you are saying what you are. Right now it looks like yet another troll post.

PVE healing in AO right now: unlimited ressources mean spamming every heal you want, anytime you want. there is absolutely no difficulty in keeping people alive unless they get oneshot. the healing part of the doctor profession (and seriously, that's what the job of this profession is) is completely boring because you don't need to have an eye on anything. 99% of the time it's even enough to just cast team life channeler.
the obvious thing to do was now to require thinking from healers as well. that means you have to focus on getting the healing job done, coordinate with other healers in some cases (anyone remember CH chains?^^) etc, to make sure you don't run out of nano and have heals not on cooldown for upcoming events. the nano changes accomodate this task in some parts by adding higher nanocosts, recharges etc. (how it turns out to be in the end...i don't know, neither does anyone else).
this leads in my opinion to a much higher difficulty in playing a doc in PVE, which i can only applaud!

and to the question where i'm coming from...have played ao for like 7-8 years, doing (also with a doc) every encounter in the game...i know what i'm talking about when judging the current healing-model in AO...

[Cyberleet]

My horrible opi doctor will be so much more horrible now with the cost-nerf. Giev Tarasque plz!

What they should do is give access to more ql 300 stimulants with these changes.

Enlarge now buffs strength for 20 but has lost its scale modifier

LOL, wtf?

[Shareida]

Does anyone remember The time where more as one doc were needed in a Merc raid, using text macros to indicate that they are in CH recharge? That was at least challenging. Seems it boils down to that again, that docs have to communicate in large scale raids to be efficient.

ow wow, didn't even read your post

the obvious thing to do was now to require thinking from healers as well. that means you have to focus on getting the healing job done, coordinate with other healers in some cases (anyone remember CH chains?^^) etc, to make sure you d

That.

[Binarybits]

Does anyone remember The time where more as one doc were needed in a Merc raid, using text macros to indicate that they are in CH recharge? That was at least challenging. Seems it boils down to that again, that docs have to communicate in large scale raids to be efficient.

Yea and remember when you needed to have a team to do things other than just 1/2 of the endgame encounters?

I'm all for making it more difficult to keep the team healthy... if FC nerfs enough of the solo professions in the MMO, to make them NEED a doc again.

[blingoutyourdead]

I'm all for making it more difficult to keep the team healthy... if FC nerfs enough of the solo professions in the MMO, to make them NEED a doc again.

Gimping toons so that they can't do any particular thing in the game is NOT going to make people team to do that thing. S42 is impossible without a huge raid force. That doesn't mean we have huge raid forces. It just means it never happens, or when it does happen, it fails.

People who now are soloing without dual logging a doc toon for a healpet, and who NEED a doc after rebalance, will just pony up for another account and roll one. People who have a heal pet doc that breaks after this because it can't keep up with casting, will just pony up for another account and roll a trader/MP/NT to pocket nano boost their pocket doc.

The people who farm "solo" now have been dual-logging and quad-logging and six-logging for years, and this isn't going to stop them, or even slow them down. At most it will just generate more paid accounts for FC, which, to be honest, is probably one of the primary goals here. They've obviously given up on actually growing the player base, and are now just determined to gouge whoever is left for as much as possible until it all runs out (e.g., ITEMSHOP). Meanwhile people who can only afford one account will be left with gimped toons that can do even less than they can today when playing alone or in small groups, and they will still be left sitting on LFT for hours, feeling even more useless.

As someone posted above about Everquest, when the player population got so low there that teaming became impossible, they just gave people NPCs for hire that could play the primary tank/healer/DPS roles. So instead of six-logging you could just fill your team with some moderately intelligent bots and go to town. FC would rather gimp professions and make you multilog, since that means more revenue in a game where they have no other way to maintain or grow it.

[Kazeran]

and to the question where i'm coming from...have played ao for like 7-8 years, doing (also with a doc) every encounter in the game...i know what i'm talking about when judging the current healing-model in AO...

don't moan about being required to care for your nano. that's the whole point. healing was completely dumb before. if that puts a bullet into 2 manning pande or things like that, i can only applaud the changes.

Because when I told you to add details and a explanation to your post to know where your coming from it was meant in a way to know what you mean and why you said it. I really don't care how long anyone has played a doctor so long as they have experience in both pvp and pvm to a degree, and they don't even have to have that its just a preference. Everyones input matters.


Also I've already added a cooldown explanation right under general info on the 2nd post so everyone has an example.

[Blakshadow]

Finishing my 220 soli doc with all alphas and phats was a big accomplishment for me. Maybe I don't know something, but in 220 pvp, I still die alot due to stuns, so I don't feel very invincable. But I agree with the idea that if FC thinks docs are OP'd in pvp, then direct the nerfs to pvp only... I don't feel that nano-managment will be fun at all in pvm.

Also, will dots from multiple docs stack on a mob? I was never entirely clear on how this works even now (as in, do last doc to land a dot get the credit?), But with nukes now going to be dependant on dots (both to work and for +dmg), maybe this is an important issue now?

[blingoutyourdead]

Also, will dots from multiple docs stack on a mob? I was never entirely clear on how this works even now (as in, do last doc to land a dot get the credit?), But with nukes now going to be dependant on dots (both to work and for +dmg), maybe this is an important issue now?

Nope. They refresh already running DOTs, but do not stack. That doesn't appear like it will change in rebalance, or likely ever. Especially when a team has to burn more slots for additional docs, this is a pretty big stealth nerf to DD overall, since it's not a liability shared by toons doing direct DD or nukers. Multiple nukes ought to "stack" though . . . assuming you can get them off before DOTs run out.

[Kazeran]

Also, will dots from multiple docs stack on a mob? I was never entirely clear on how this works even now (as in, do last doc to land a dot get the credit?), But with nukes now going to be dependant on dots (both to work and for +dmg), maybe this is an important issue now?

Been talked about, will likely never happen, thats why the gave us nukes

[XenonDe]

Been talked about, will likely never happen, thats why the gave us nukes

-.-
Then they should make it a base nuke not some spend nano here nuke.

[blingoutyourdead]

Then they should make it a base nuke not some spend nano here nuke.

Hey, they named it base nuke. Man, you people will just cry about ANYTHING.

[XenonDe]

Sounds like politics imo.