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Thread: MP Nano Document Discussion Thread

  1. #81
    Hmm only thing I'm seeing here, is if something like an enf or whatever comes up to you and facerolls all his perks, the DD debuff isn't really gonna help.

    Or will the nanodamage debuff work on perks?

  2. #82
    It is a 10m AoE too... that's a small range even for a mez. I think it's about right.

    X
    Xtremtech: MetaPhysicist currently resident on Test. (209 + 21 AI Levels).

    Various other test MPs of differing levels and builds available.

  3. #83
    Quote Originally Posted by -LL- View Post
    Glad to see this doc, finally!
    The positive thing is that it seems MP will be a medium hard prof to play, expecially in pvp.
    Goodbye lovely pistol setup
    It seems to me that your pistol setup would do better after these changes than it does now? 20% DtP and the better evade buffs should largely make up for the loss of SS, a lot better healing, better attack pet (even if you need to do some swapping to get it out), vastly better nuke damage?If there is something in these changes that is killing pistol setups, I'd appreciate if you could explain it so it can be brought to the Devs' attention.

  4. #84
    I think it might just be that there's a ranged creation set-up and so he can get the creation benefits (construct nanos) with a comparable AR to pistol, keep Fling as a special and still be ranged.

    What you don't get though is the faster speed of hit with pistols... which may be important for proccing. Right now, we don't know what's going to happen with the procs do we? Haven't seen an LE perk document as yet.

    X
    Xtremtech: MetaPhysicist currently resident on Test. (209 + 21 AI Levels).

    Various other test MPs of differing levels and builds available.

  5. #85
    Also, he's using Troa'Ler. It may not survive itemization, but for now that's a pretty decent AS, which is probably the biggest loss from his setup to the creation bows, closely followed by attacks/minute.

  6. #86
    Well the good thing of the pistol setup is that it allows some freedom in armor/hud slots, since you need less skills to cap AS. That results is slightly better nanoskills/def setup, compared to bow, and a slightly less AR (which is anyway far from good).
    I've said goodbye pistol because with the AS changes + increased AR of creation weapons (and the buffs that come with those weaps) should bring new and more effective setups using creation weapons rather than normal weapons. Anyway I am beginning to think that, despite the coolness of a pistol setup, bow performs little better in pvp anyway (not in pvm). I believe AS won't be a reliable special to use after rebalance, as MP.. would be probably better to find new solutions instead of normal weapons.
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  7. #87
    Ok, cool... that's pretty much what FC has been going for in the MP portion of rebalancing. Traditional weapons will still be a reasonable choice, and MPs with traditional weapon setups will be better off then than they are now, but creation weapons should be a very attractive alternative.

  8. #88
    Quote Originally Posted by XtremTech View Post
    It is a 10m AoE too... that's a small range even for a mez. I think it's about right.
    Indeed.

    It's merely useful as some kind of a SL bosses fight helper tool (to deal with calmable adds that hang around). Also, I wonder what resistance it checks in PvP usage, calm or root/snare ones?
    Renowned jester of the double AS Tigress

    MP in sneak eNSDed me and did about 20k damage in 10-12 seconds

  9. #89
    I'll hold on to most of my comments regarding the nano doc until the next version is rolled out, but I will say that I'm rather disappointed at the NSD nerf and the letdown on the creation weapons attack/recharge (especially the bow).
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  10. #90
    I'd like throw in that the mez pets of today won't mez unless the target they are mezzing stops in melee range, making it useless on constantly moving targets. I hope this would be addressed with the new ones.

    Also, to reiterate a point made by another, 100% weapon skill + 25% ts means we are losing massive AR compared to the 80% ts + 20% weapon skill of creation weapons today. My current Zset MP can't even break 1k 2hb without custom imps or weapon skill AI armor. We have no perk, buff, or symb support for 2hb and its a blue skill for us.

  11. #91

    Funcom employee

    Just as a note, make sure to keep checking the third post in the thread - As the Profs gather feedback and questions from you guys, they'll be answering what they can there; I'll also be tossing in bits of information as well, so definitely a good idea to keep up-to-date with the changes there. =)

    Also! When you guys see obvious errors or stuff that just doesn't 'look right' (like the Spec 4 reqs on some of the nuke lines), *PLEASE* point them out to us. Mistakes and typos happen, and its good to get this sorta thing cleaned up as early as possible. =)
    Brad L. McAtee / Kintaii
    Former Senior AO Designer & Jack of All Trades
    (2007 - 2012)
    ~~ Twitter :: Facebook :: Norse Noir ~~

  12. #92

    Funcom employee

    no klod the lack of a double as creation bow does not count as an error i am sorry =(
    Brad L. McAtee / Kintaii
    Former Senior AO Designer & Jack of All Trades
    (2007 - 2012)
    ~~ Twitter :: Facebook :: Norse Noir ~~

  13. #93
    Quote Originally Posted by Kintaii View Post
    no klod the lack of a double as creation bow does not count as an error i am sorry =(
    What about fling shot on creation? Its double fling shot? ;p
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    Dreamer: Basically - I wish THIS much effort was put in to ALL profs rebalance docs.

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  14. #94
    My biggest concerns currently are:

    1) Creation bow. To be honest, there's really no benefit to using this over a shield. At 100% bow/25% TS, I'm honestly wondering how many of people screaming "Oh that really helps with AR" actually play an endgame MP in PVP. Currently my MP uses a fairly typical CSS/def setup and I have 1784 Bow, 2454 TS, and very little AAO. Combine it with the fact that it's set at 3/3 speed with only fling as a special, who are we honestly going to hit? Docs, engis, and soldiers? The same people we hit now if we're lucky? There's a reason people don't use the upgraded Beast bow for PVP currently. Adding 25% TS on its attack skill wouldn't change that. Slowing the weapon to 3/3 is the last nail in its coffin. Finally, as a ranged prof with no meaningful special and low damage mitigation (See #3), we'll still be kiting so the bow will be even more useless.

    2) The hoped for "Mezz Pet" alternative effects. Yes I know it's in the works, but we still lack a means to do much about our opponent's NR unless I'm missing something.

    3) Explosive damage is going to destroy us. The new defense buff is welcomed, as is the DtP. However, as previously mentioned in this thread, that DtP is about the same (actually less useful) than currently asking a soldier for RRFE.

    Combine it with the fact that currently MP's SS themselves to gain that additional AAD which post-these docs we'll actually have less static defense than we have currently with AoR + SS. For those of you that play an endgame MP, you're well aware that the current defense with AoR + SS + 5 blockers (which will be removed) doesn't stop many professions from destroying us with explosive damage. The additional healpet heal will do very little if we can't live long enough to get 2 ticks of the heal.

    There may be some progress in possible perk actions to give us an "Oh Sh*t" button, but currently a slow ticking heal that can be disabled, a DtP with less damage mitigation than current reflects, and a higher static but lower maximum defense rating is not going to help us against many people.

    4) I really hope the immunity nonsense will replace any type of remover or immunity from the ND perkline or virus scanners. If not you may as well delete NSD altogether.
    Last edited by Johnnykay; Mar 23rd, 2011 at 00:08:07.

  15. #95
    I find it somewhat odd that odin's other eye is (still i belive?) 8h as the only nano and that other nanos as 8h cm are now 4h, no real big deal, but what's the deal with that?
    And did it get boring to type in 4h in the docs so you started to type it out in seconds instead?
    Edit: the deal with that could be a type i guess, or someone is just very inconsistent
    Last edited by nanoforcer; Mar 22nd, 2011 at 23:58:06.
    Don't you just hate this kind of ppl
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  16. #96
    Quote Originally Posted by Kintaii View Post
    no klod the lack of a double as creation bow does not count as an error i am sorry =(
    Nice try. It's on the sheet #3.
    Renowned jester of the double AS Tigress

    MP in sneak eNSDed me and did about 20k damage in 10-12 seconds

  17. #97
    It is what I expected so that is bad news. Nuker with pets, the same evades, huge casting requisites, trying to force all MPs into creations, a sucky bow to tell rangers they can't complain, NSD killed in PvM (was already far from useful in PvP), bad damage mitigation, simple healing upgrade, no weapons solutions, no PvM role in teams...

    Why it took two years to write it down if it was what Corily told us that was coming back them? It even has more nerfs than expected. Have fun buffing nanoskills.

  18. #98
    As it stands, this will currently effect all pets - If you get hit, all three take a whack.
    Eek! Passing the damage through to all 3 pets is a bit nightmarish. Killing all three pets at once isn't a great idea at all. I'm not sure how many people would use it.

    Best I can suggest if this is the case, is that the DamageToPetMultiplier needs to be 33% then... not 100%. So that only 33% of the damage done gets passed through - but since it passes through to 3 pets, then you end up with 99%. Passing all of the damage done to the MP to all three pets is just over the top.

    Better still would be if it only affected the attack pet.

    And I suppose even better still might be if you could choose which pet it would affect.

    X
    Xtremtech: MetaPhysicist currently resident on Test. (209 + 21 AI Levels).

    Various other test MPs of differing levels and builds available.

  19. #99
    The current NSD is useless in most endgame PvM because the bosses resist it, or use nuke procs rather than actual nanos. With the current shorter duration/lockout mechanic for our debuff, it will no longer be necessary for bosses to have innate resistances to NSD and our other debuffs. So rather than crippling Hezak and being useless in most other raids, it will be useful on most raids but not decisive anywhere.
    You have to realize though that bosses don't constantly cast nano's, it doesn't work like damage. So this makes it very dependent on luck. And when the boss debuffs the raidforce during NSD immunity, you will get the blame. To be useful in pvm it should be able to be on much more often, at least 50% of the time.
    Another solution could be that the lockout is on the MP (at least when it lands), so that multiple MP's can keep NSD running on a target.

    And I'll end with a question: what about raids where it IS decisive? Will they be altered?
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  20. #100
    Quote Originally Posted by Edta View Post
    And I'll end with a question: what about raids where it IS decisive? Will they be altered?
    Very likely I'd say.


    Also, MPs are never happy are they?
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