MP Nano Document Discussion Thread

[Shesomaru]

Hehe.. medusa pet

I think dmg debuff will be fine. 10 sec debuff, 20 immun. It means u can run it 20sec / 1 min, so its up 1/3 of the time. 2k dmg means regulars mobs wont touch you. It wont be a "static" debuff, more like a big help for a little time, to get healed up and such. And i prefer this, not that "you debuff once and live forever" , but you need a little tactic when to use it.

Btw dunno who, but somebody didnt belive 2,5k MC is not much in AS setup. Till now my acc was closed but i checked the stats. All self.

14,7k HP
1984 AR
1767 AS
2100 RS
2200 TS
2377 MC
1080 AAD
1760 evade - 1660 dodge - 1610 duck

Difference between TS-MC comes from the AS implants, with symbs they would be nearly same. Perking conc would make me up near 2,5k, and with hud3 pet is easy to cast. And im using ofab/beast/css , gloves gives 32 MC thats all, so with more nanoskills from armors.. 2,7-2,8k nanoskills still easy.

[madmax]

DD debuff will be the same we got now. You got the numbers already. It won't be used as it is not worth the nano. It is not intended for "normal" mobs, nobody cares if normal mobs get debuffed or not they can't kill a player unless they are a lot (where single DD debuffs would be worthless anyway). This things work with hard or boss type mobs and they won't work, if you can survive without them for such a long inmunity time you don't need them.

NSD is dead, there is no way to know when it is going to be needed with mobs. It will only be usable in PvP in a few encounters as a temporal distraction or finishing like it is used now.

The total AAD we will have will be lower and we are loosing lots of NR, immunities, resistances that no professional talks about them (cause they don't understand enough the mechanics of the game and they don't play where they are needed)...

AS setups will be dead too. Bow will probably die also, it is used because of AS, without AS regular damage is the only important thing and bows are slow. To hit with AS in the future you will need Attack rating, how much AR will you have with your AS setup? and if you get AR equipment how high will be your AS or your nanoskills? You will have enough AR to even dent a normal player at your level with bow?

Post your "AS" setup please. enlighten us...and I will tell you where you are loosing defense and NR. And please tell us too where do you magically will get those 200-300 extra nanoskills easily...

It will be fantastic when only the few players that have absolute endgame setups will be able to cast the final pet to show up in Borealis. It is cool how professionals get the GM buffs, levels, research and equipment to do it easily in "test".

[Leduc69]

I first got this reaction too when i saw the nanodoc omg we are loosing blockers AS lots of aad, NR 80 root/snare resist ect but dw imo for now we can just debate aboutr what will or wont be the mp role or playstyle at rebalance, nobody even FC see the all picture and there's a lots of new toys inc with perks and itemisation for all profs.

Speaking about numbers is useless atm we just know FC designed a pet for pure casters mp.

and yes with my setup easy to swap 2 items to get the 2K5 MC/TS

[lainbr]

DD debuff will be the same we got now. You got the numbers already. It won't be used as it is not worth the nano. It is not intended for "normal" mobs, nobody cares if normal mobs get debuffed or not they can't kill a player unless they are a lot (where single DD debuffs would be worthless anyway). This things work with hard or boss type mobs and they won't work, if you can survive without them for such a long inmunity time you don't need them.

NSD is dead, there is no way to know when it is going to be needed with mobs. It will only be usable in PvP in a few encounters as a temporal distraction or finishing like it is used now.

The total AAD we will have will be lower and we are loosing lots of NR, immunities, resistances that no professional talks about them (cause they don't understand enough the mechanics of the game and they don't play where they are needed)...

We all know it. Our professionals knows it. Both of us are whinning and qq'ng in MP threads and Professional threads. Do devs cares? I dont know. They stole our AAD and NR and resistances but kept Soldiers massive AR. /figures

AS setups will be dead too. Bow will probably die also, it is used because of AS, without AS regular damage is the only important thing and bows are slow. To hit with AS in the future you will need Attack rating, how much AR will you have with your AS setup? and if you get AR equipment how high will be your AS or your nanoskills? You will have enough AR to even dent a normal player at your level with bow?

All AS setups are dead, not just ours. Unless you can build enough evades/defences to fire one w/o dieing or have CC good enough to keep target while firing it (Crats anyone? :P)
2.4k 2.5k AR is the max AR i could calc that a MP can afford. But its useless and suicide ^^

Post your "AS" setup please. enlighten us...and I will tell you where you are loosing defense and NR. And please tell us too where do you magically will get those 200-300 extra nanoskills easily...

Nanocontroler Unit + Infused Ancient Nano Enhancer + Research Attunement Device - Nano Technology Level Three + 60 from new Ancient Knowledge perk = 260

Less QQ against our professionals (which at least still play, are active in forums, are not doom keepers nor mastah trolls) and more QQ against devs

[madmax]

nobody even FC see the all picture and there's a lots of new toys inc with perks and itemisation for all profs.

We agree, they are just messing everything up instead of solving problems. They are even making many professions and setups umplayable

Speaking about numbers is useless atm we just know FC designed a pet for pure casters mp.

It is not. It is the moment to do it since we got the info and I doubt pets will buff nanoskills to change those numbers.

and yes with my setup easy to swap 2 items to get the 2K5 MC/TS

Great for a nanoskilled? profession that our professionals bragg about. My soldier does not need to swap items to get his endgame weapon on. Does not even need to reequip his weapon from time to time. He can even equip different endgame weapons depending on the situation and encounter he is managing.

All AS setups are dead, not just ours.

Not at all, only any setups that won't have enough AR to hit with it. Swapping to AS will be dissabled, that is good, but traders and agents will still have superior AR. AS setups from other classes like soldiers and advys will still have enough AR. Who gets out of the equation? Professions that use AS a secondary PvP damage finisher and MPs that used it as a main weapon and damage source.

Nanocontroler Unit + Infused Ancient Nano Enhancer + Research Attunement Device - Nano Technology Level Three + 60 from new Ancient Knowledge perk = 260

Do I have to post you defensive items that go in those slots? Or you as an uber nanoskill profession user with endgame equipment agree with swapping to cast what we are told is our main weapon?

Less QQ against our professionals (which at least still play, are active in forums, are not doom keepers nor mastah trolls) and more QQ against devs

Professionals agree with most of this changes, except for the debuffing nerf that they didn't expect. They are nukers that have dicussed here plenty against the rationalitation of our weapon skills. Any good idea that has been tossed here has been nulified by them so I just see them as gate keepers.

[lainbr]

Or you as an uber nanoskill profession user with endgame equipment agree with swapping to cast what we are told is our main weapon?

Yes, because I actually sacrificed nanoskills to get a reliable AS. I see no problem on it at all. But seems like you see all other profs can get almost everything w/o drawbacks and you feel its wrong. IT is wrong, other profs shouldnt get everything.

So sad they get better offense and defence while mps get crap useless stuff that dont add offense nor defence.

[madmax]

Yes, because I actually sacrificed nanoskills to get a reliable AS. I see no problem on it at all. But seems like you see all other profs can get almost everything w/o drawbacks and you feel its wrong. IT is wrong, other profs shouldnt get everything.

So sad they get better offense and defence while mps get crap useless stuff that dont add offense nor defence.

Defense, crap, I am talking about defense not your AS setup. You have to loose defense to get those nanoskills. And we already lost lots.

[lainbr]

Defense, crap, I am talking about defense not your AS setup. You have to loose defense to get those nanoskills. And we already lost lots.

So you are talking about "new creation bow setup"? http://auno.org/ao/equip.php?saveid=172041 <-- just ignore tigress. 2.8kMC 2.7k TS :3 Edit: Also add Trance on perks

[Mountaingoat]

Defense, crap, I am talking about defense not your AS setup. You have to loose defense to get those nanoskills. And we already lost lots.

You can get 2.5k nanoskills without losing anything off of a max practical def rating.

[madmax]

So you are talking about "new creation bow setup"? http://auno.org/ao/equip.php?saveid=172041 <-- just ignore tigress. 2.8kMC 2.7k TS :3 Edit: Also add Trance on perks

No, I don't care about creations, you are still close minded about ranged MPs weapons.

You are closeminded about equipment. Do you think we should need endgame equipment like that to cast the pet when they already took out nanos and there is a loose in defense? I am not talking for me here, I am talking for future MPs.

And you miss important defensive hud items where you use two nanoskill hud items.

You can get 2.5k nanoskills without losing anything off of a max practical def rating.

What is a practical defense rating for you? In NR and defense and inmunities

[lainbr]

No, I don't care about creations, you are still close minded about ranged MPs weapons.

You are closeminded about equipment. Do you think we should need endgame equipment like that to cast the pet when they already took out nanos and there is a loose in defense? I am not talking for me here, I am talking for future MPs.

And you miss important defensive hud items where you use two nanoskill hud items.

Offenses apart... If AS is doomed and assuming we dont need it, we can equip eye and rhand symbs. It alone gives you 144 in nanoskills (MC TS). Ancient Knowledge perkline will give more 60 nanoskills. The setup I posted above was endgame sure, with 2.8k MC 2.7kTS, it means normal ppl can get 2.5k on both(Infused Ancient Nano Enhancer instead of Nanocontroler Unit, DB Gloves and Boots instead of CS, anything cool instead of ACDC...). Devs said they gonna make sure average MP can cast last pet, and if current number is too high, they can drop it.

I also dont really see the superbig loss of defense from equipments, 50 maybe?

[Towerblock]

I also dont really see the superbig loss of defense from equipments, 50 maybe?

The loss of 50 defense can make even the toughest noobs cry. Its true. Ask anyone whos lost their shadowweb spinner in the middle of combat.

[lainbr]

The loss of 50 defense can make even the toughest noobs cry. Its true. Ask anyone whos lost their shadowweb spinner in the middle of combat.

Oh yeah, and we lost more 70 def from SS vanishment. SO! Nano skills isnt the problem (unless you stay as AS MP :x). The problem is: we dont have defense to counter stuff in pvp AND until current rebalance docs we are losing defence while all other profs are getting more AR(some got more def as well).

If we dont got helluva defense from perks/items and our att pet stay utelly and completely useless in pvp, the rebalance is crap and nothing will really change to MPs. If we dont get usefull debuffs and hwlluva nanoregen stuff, MPs will stay in the foreveralone in pvm.

Seriously Devs! Why nerf MPs?

[-Klod-]

Get ready to run in full spiritual or combined officer's armor. That Damage to Nano will rawk.

[Mountaingoat]

What is a practical defense rating for you? In NR and defense and inmunities

Well here's a setup with oodles of nanoskills (2730ish MC/TS) and a pretty high def rating http://auno.org/ao/equip.php?saveid=163811. To make it a max practical def rating setup I would do the following:

--> swap the ancient technical bracer for a masterpiece ancient (-20 nanoskills/+20 def rating)
--> swap infused nano hud for infused defender hud (-50 nanoskills/+50 def rating)
--> drop the nano controller unit to move the nanodeck to that spot and add a non infused vision or defender (-75 MC & TS/+25 def rating)

That totals to -145 MC/TS (2730-145=2585) and +95 def rating which leaves room to spare on nanoskills in what I would consider a max practical def rating setup. You've still got room nanoskill wise to drop more Scouts in favor of HP gear if your so inclined. Additionally, new perklines can give us up to 160 more nanoskills.

The combined scouts is only necessary for pvp'ers. If your under equipped, leveling, and/or a pvm'er you can reach 2.5k nanoskills with cheaper gear that doesn't add to evades or just use more nanoskill huds instead of def rating ones. And in my mind its just the same as pvp'er combat/weapon based profs "needing" CC/CSS (scouts is 1/3rd the price of the aforementioned btw).

If your weapon setup and playstyle is so important to you and you don't want to swap, then use a lower pet. You have more personal damage to make up the difference with which was, I think, FC's reasoning to begin with on these reqs. Let's face it, MP's aren't a weapon prof so why should those who go against the grain outperform purists without facing more work?

I'm not happy about a lot of the MP doc stuff either, but the 2.5k pet is something I think they got right.

[madmax]

Discussing this is getting nowhere.

As opposed to gatekeepers I might seem like a doomsayer. But doomsayers in the MP forums have been right all the time in the prediction of what the documents and rebalance would end like up to date. Some things have been worst, some not so much but it was a deception to many MPs.

I am against this Mountaingoat because I see the global picture of the weapons MP. It is not that it will be easy or hard to be a weapons MP, FC is trying to kill the setup, Shield MPs want other MPs to be nerfed. Envy? Purists? You know MPs have been using normal weapons from the start of the game. Some of them have been given weapon support and that was when MP shinned and that didn't meant they where overpowered when the dot bug was corrected.

More than half the actual left MPs wont play the future MP, I am not even talking about the many that have left the forums (game?) or are banned (I know many MP players that do not have access to this forum). That is something to think about.

[Shesomaru]

I dont get it.. swapping: on my adv i have to swap 4-5 items to cast best buffs (fully endgame, just pure pvp setup), engis have to swap half of their gear, on shade i use phulaks to cast best nanos. So WHAT is ur prob? swapping 1-2 items / every 2h to cast pet is acceptable imo, anyway u cant recast pet for a min or so and hud3 is easy to swap.

Speaking about stuffs and you complain about the "whole picture".. like you had any idea more than guessing. Whole game changing..

NSD: yes, will be nerfed. Other question: we will need it anyway? Because if we will be enough powerful without it.. i wont cry for it.

SS: i always hated SS. You are blocked from your tools for 30 secs!!!!!

As you know (just forgetting it) in the new system nearly all nanos will have very short cooldown, which means you can spam them (not like SS.. bleh).

Most of you cry only about losing defense... you know what? With current doc we wont need def. RRfe + DTP + nanomage DTN = 30 + 20 + 10% reflect (20% to pet, 10% to nanopool) = 60% static reflect. Also to mention healpet's 60k / min healing power (yes, question how easly hpet will be blocked, but thats other story). So if we will get such huge "reflect like" stuffs (even if they nerfed a bit) and we get healpet (nerfed down to 45k hp /min healing) that means it can heal us up to max from 0 hp twice every min.

Also not to forget every perks and specials (AS for sure, others im not sure) will have attakc time, the dmg we get will be spread in time, it wont be a huge gank dmg, more like a static dmg during 20-30 secs. So in that time we have time to debuff, use absorb util, get healed by pet.

And if we were unperkable, who could kill us? Who could kill shield mps? We will have nearly same reflect as shield mps now, more healing power, MUCH MUCH BETTER nukes... so ?

Yes, playstyle will change. Weapon will be much less important (thanks god, btw that was the old MP playstyle if somebody forget, 4-5 years ago MPs used wep as a 3rd dmg for a little extra). Btw weps are useless right now anyway, only bow AS useful in pvp but u must sacrifice a lot to get it. We will get 3 nuke lines, and 1 nuke will be 4-8k dmg / 4 sec... AS is 1 lucky hit / 11 sec, so? We get nukes for the crappy weps we got.

Madmax: lets say i accept that lots of MPs left. But will take less than 6 months to get used the new nanodoc well and ppl will whine again how strongs are the MPs and all those MPs who left will try it again.

[madmax]

I told you I was not discussing this anymore. Have fun with your MP, I might come for some forum fun here if you cry because of changes after rebalance, that is when it will be almost impossible to make but small tweaks since FC is not going to make major changes them.

Btw, 4-5 years ago weapons where the main damage source for MPs. Pistol and 1hb normal weapons where used by most MPs instead of creations and AS (rifle and bow) was the main weapon for lvl 150+ MP PvPers while red shield+1hb alien and some melee normal weapons for lower level ones. I hardly nuked in PvM because it lowered my damage.I PvPed with a 220 MP back them. To tell you the truth, I once saw a roleplaying lvl 50 MP with a 2hb creation rod back them.

No MP is against better nukes, no one is against better pets, many will live without NSD, no one is against debuffs. nukers and weapon user playstyles could work perfectly. Why our professionals and some of the shield MPs have worked so hard to nerf weapon MPs? envy? jeaously? Some people likes to expend their free time traveling with horses, others with choppers, some others with cars. Do you think a car and motor lover will be happy if it is forced to raid on horses? He might like both, he might not, but if he is paying for cars he will not be happy if given a horse instead.

[Camar]

I dont get it.. swapping: on my adv i have to swap 4-5 items to cast best buffs (fully endgame, just pure pvp setup), engis have to swap half of their gear, on shade i use phulaks to cast best nanos. So WHAT is ur prob? swapping 1-2 items / every 2h to cast pet is acceptable imo, anyway u cant recast pet for a min or so and hud3 is easy to swap.

Well, we are a nano prof, not a weapon prof. I don't see NTs having to hotswap to use their tools. I don't see Soldiers having to hotswap to equip their weapons. So why should we?

Most of you cry only about losing defense... you know what? With current doc we wont need def. RRfe + DTP + nanomage DTN = 30 + 20 + 10% reflect (20% to pet, 10% to nanopool) = 60% static reflect.

That is simply not true. First of all, not everyone is a nanomage. And second of all, you can't just add those percentages. Even in the best case they are multiplicative. And 0.7*0.8*0.9=0.504 (0.56 without being a nanomage). So in the best case that these all just stack (it really depends on the way these are handled btw, before or after PvP caps e.g., noone knows how DtP will actually work!), it will be a bit less than 50% "reflect", with the additional fun of having all three pets taking damage and yourself also taking nano damage. So it's nowhere near SoZ defense, not by far. That's ok btw, having SoZ defense and full offense would be quite OP...

And you can't count on the heal pet, period. In a PvP situation, it will be lagging behind, be drained/rooted/snared, whatever. The pet pathing alone will see to that, not to mention all the hostile nanos the pet so far has a snowball's chance in hell of resisting. Unless they pretty much make it immune to hostile nanos, it will not heal you a big chunk of the time...

[madmax]

Thanx Camar, you got my point and I sometimes find it hard for people to understand me. I guess that wherever you are shield or bow you actually play and see the global pic.

Sorry if anyone felt insulted in the thread. Calling you closeminded, Lain, was not intended as an insult but as saying you have a narrow view of the situation.

What I want is good weapon support, for the four weapons used by MPs at least, and decent debuffs. Nothing more complicated, nothing that some of us wouldn't care if we had to sacrifice the "higher" pet and some nukes instead. But we don't have the pet, the nukes, neither the weapon support.

Kintaii might think that we should be generous to all the hard work they are making but I am not paying them for it, I want my clock to give me the time and that is why I bought it. If it does not give me the time as intended I don't care if the customer support tells me instead that sometime it will give me a weather forecast.