make RRFE self only

[heartless888]

yup, heres an idea, how can the devs balance 14 classes while factoring in rrfe? if the devs really want to balance the classes they should make rrfe self only since last time i checked, the diference between a doc with or without rrfe is worlds apart, the diference between a shield MP with or without rrfe is worlds apart aswell, the difference between a decked out enf with or without rrfe is worlds apart, i think its only fair that if they want to truly balance the classes and make them have the right tools, rrfe shouldnt be a factor and right now, it is, devs might not think about rrfe when they fix stuff but lets face it, in pvp, everyone has that 30% shield and i think its wrong

i do support agents still having rrfe from TP etc

that is all. what do you guys think?

[Graftmage]

They need to make team auras better then (update faster, etc.).

[Pomidor]

...last time i checked, the diference between a doc with or without rrfe is worlds apart,...

I know this since years

[Mikenche]

You only mention RRFE, but I think there are other buffs as well that are overpowered in PvP. My biggest beef is with Behe and iLC; they easily triple (or even more) a TL 2-3 character's HP, which is completely ridiculous. GSF is problematic as well; if you don't have a way of holding your target still, you can't catch him. There are probably others that I don't remember right now.

On the other hand, all of these are highly useful in PvM. As a nearly pure PvM player, I cannot support making these buffs universally self-only. One way I've suggested is to clear all outside buffs from NCU as soon as you enter 25% or lower gas. The existing PvP mechanics will take care of preventing hugely overpowered buffs from being recast.

[Sonikeep]

I better add "cant have reflect programs in ncu" flag to MP shield )

[Wrangeline]

RRFE and some other things mostly just function as an added chaos-factor in AO. I personally don't mind RRFE being self only.

It's one of those arbitrary things that AO has to offer. One of those things that has very few, if any, positive aspects while having many more negative aspects tied to it. Many will whine, kick and scream if someone tries to take a serious look at these things, because they don't want AO to "turn into WoW" or whatever other half-baked nonsense stuff they cook up in their heads.

[Wrangeline]

On the other hand, all of these are highly useful in PvM. As a nearly pure PvM player, I cannot support making these buffs universally self-only.

I don't think RRFE applies to this though. If you are teaming with a soldier, you get reflect aura. If you are not teaming with a soldier then you should try to get by without it. If it's impossible to get specific stuff done without rrfe then FC could address those specific areas individually. RRFE being self only wouldn't really cause problems for PvM.

[Mikenche]

I don't think RRFE applies to this though. If you are teaming with a soldier, you get reflect aura. If you are not teaming with a soldier then you should try to get by without it. If it's impossible to get specific stuff done without rrfe then FC could address those specific areas individually. RRFE being self only wouldn't really cause problems for PvM.

That's a good point. I do tend to solo self-buffed, or with whatever buffs I have left over from the last raid, and the reflect aura indeed supplant RRFE for raids. So yeah, making RRFE self-only wouldn't affect me too much.

[Mastablasta]

Froobs would lose out on reflects then, and basic game would be fubared :|

[Kinkstaah]

Or remove rrfe from the game entirely, and reduce all damage by 30%

[heartless888]

You only mention RRFE, but I think there are other buffs as well that are overpowered in PvP. My biggest beef is with Behe and iLC; they easily triple (or even more) a TL 2-3 character's HP, which is completely ridiculous. GSF is problematic as well; if you don't have a way of holding your target still, you can't catch him. There are probably others that I don't remember right now.

On the other hand, all of these are highly useful in PvM. As a nearly pure PvM player, I cannot support making these buffs universally self-only. One way I've suggested is to clear all outside buffs from NCU as soon as you enter 25% or lower gas. The existing PvP mechanics will take care of preventing hugely overpowered buffs from being recast.

AO is broken enough as it it lets try to think about 220, or at best TL5 too, im all for making every single buff ingame self though, that way people who want auras gotta team and stuff but then it creates more zerglings etc, im just saying, rrfe ruins it alot, and as a soldier you cant begind to understand just how annoying it is for us to have a hard time killing someone because of a buff casted by my own class, a buff which lets face it other than froobs, is not used at all by us, ever. it is just there to help others being a pain in the ass for us to kill, how can they fix balance when once they think things are fair, someone can get rrfe and be 3 times harder to kill just from that? as for gsf, i wouldnt mind either but they are about to change the run speed mechanics so lets see what that does

[heartless888]

Or remove rrfe from the game entirely, and reduce all damage by 30%

so soldiers will also take 30% less than before?



i didnt think so.

[Kinkstaah]

i didnt think so.

And thats fine, because everyone having RRFE doesn't come close to breaking the game, and you know it.

[cbus97]

Debump. Even as a soldier I can't complain. I love using my Augmented Hellfury to pop RRFE off people in BS. Sure they can just grab it again from teammates, but if timed right it can be a nasty surprise, especially to docs who are in the middle of tanking 3 people.

[Xenotric]

Removing RRFE would kind of screw over those that dont have shadowlands and thus cannot use the aura...

Not to mention theres nothing that wrong with RRFE, sure its 30% damage reduction if people have it but if they have it then good on them for not doing mass combat self buffed only, everyone else can do the same and can even bring in people to counteract the shield if its really that much of an issue.

Only time it could be said to be completely overpowered is if it was 1v1 duels but since outside buffs dont count in them only soldiers would have access to it anyway...

[heartless888]

And thats fine, because everyone having RRFE doesn't come close to breaking the game, and you know it.

you are missing my point though, sure now people dont think its a big deal, since we all got used to it, im saying if they are doing major work about balancing the classes and the game, it would help not to have to factor in that people will have rrfe and thus might throw the balance completely off, example, advies got more than they need to live, toss a rrfe on them, who are they going to die to short of swap alpha which wont be there next patch, and AS FA agent alpha, which also wont be ther next patch?


another example is vs a fixer, while when they got no rrfe, the few bullets i hit them with hurt and i can actually harm them somewhat, when they got rrfe, they can outheal ANY dmg i do to them (with an assault rifle)

we got used to it, yes, dosnt make it any less idiotic that -everyone- is so much harder to kill than they should be because of my own buff , gsf isnt even the same as plenty people got high RS and some even choose evade over gsf

[Xenotric]

On that principle ALL buffs that help in combat would have to be made self only for "balancing"

getting buffs from others is part of the game, some are more useful then others but they all have an effect.

[Wrangeline]

On that principle ALL buffs that help in combat would have to be made self only for "balancing"

getting buffs from others is part of the game, some are more useful then others but they all have an effect.

Yeah but the question is, do some buffs have such a big effect that things would/could actually be a lot better if they were made self only? RRFE being the most effective buff by far makes it the obvious one to look at (first) and to discuss if it's in fact too much and if the game, players and devs would benefit from it being made self only if it is. (The obvious disclaimer being that making rrfe self-only is only half the procedure. Tiny adjustments to other things as a result of rrfe being made self-only would be required as well).

[Kinkstaah]

we got used to it, yes, dosnt make it any less idiotic that -everyone- is so much harder to kill than they should be because of my own buff , gsf isnt even the same as plenty people got high RS and some even choose evade over gsf

Perhaps soldiers are OP vs targets without RRFE. In the real world, RRFE is and has been considered a must have, and if it is to be removed, it makes a lot more sense to simply provide it as some kind of passive buff for everyone (or change mechanics for the same effect), and remove the nano line for soldiers too.

If anything, classes should get the option to "Guard" others, where you simply take damage (or a percentage) instead of the person you are protecting. This would make AMS extremely useful for protecting *others* as well as yourself for the duration.

Then we can all enjoy RRFE enabled PVP, soldiers have a reflect and damage mitigation advantage, and can situationally really assist others with damage mitigation too.

[lostlife]

your thinking pvp, for certain things in pvm, osbs are required during the levels that they yeild the most advantage (like DR goddess, for a few profs).

also, if you give every one a passive 30% reflect and remove it from sold tool set, i want other buffs to be removed and every one gets insta benifit, like enfos essence, trader wrangle, or fixers hot.

for those who cant hear the sarcasm in my typing, what im saying is that buffs are given to particular profs for a reason, and there are buffs that can and can not be cast on other people for a reason, placing a min lv on buffs like fixer ncu buffs would fix the osb for pvp problem, but it would also inhibit there ability to twink, and twinking is to large of a part of AO to limit it to higher lvs.