Neutrality Application Forms - WHY NOT?

[______________Zaduda]

K K, if Cosmik reads this first, IM SORRY! k, i know i emailed feedback and bothered you, but i believe if sometihng is a good idea, push it

(Cosmik is now bored of reading Lev's posts and will probably make me save in Andromeda and take me to Belial Forest the next time he see's me online) lol



BUT.... the point.


Neutral's should have application forms. I know i know, that FC wants people to be in the conflict,... but i guarantee that 90% of people that would USE these apps would eventually take sides once more in the conflict....


I'll tell you a lil story which shows why we need them.. (a VERY short story)

I roleplay Lev, an assassin, not FROM RubiKa. OT asked him here to um..... *cough* kill clanners n people they generally dont like. And i did ((i actually did, i used Lev's money to twink alts and take out people other people didnt like or wanted killed)).
But then i met my wife, Purity, who doesnt want me to be a killer or assassin and asked me to stop.
Me, being the beloved husband i am, stopped..
But now , i am no longer a freelance assassin and i have no place within the corporation. But i dont *want* to be in a clan or part of the rebel cause.

I want to be what i was when i came to Rubika, a NEUTRAL

I dont want to restart a level 60 character just to make him neutral, roleplaying is a very big part of my life on RubiKa, and i've got in Lev my best character yet for stats and ip allocation n stuff. i LOVE my character,... he has a ql 100 blade and kicks ass

I dont wanna restart him, i dont wanna be clan but i no longer work for OmniTek.


Other people i've talked to are also in similar positions like this. We're willing to give up our merit boards, so why should we be stopped from being Neutral.


Please, make Neutral Application Forms, if not for just high level people, make the 20-30's who turn omni or clan, stick it out till 50 to be neutral once more, make em fight for it......


but at the least, make neutral app forms, its oppressive gameplay to force us ....... we want freedom of gameplay

[____________Ejeckted]

while i'd never change sides,
(bc of the way tokens/merit-boards work)
i agree this should be an option.

an Omni quitting his job
is not the same thing as
an Omni taking up arms against Omni-Tek
(making him 'clan')

i think this is the way it should always have worked.

if you join the enemy in your own city
the gaurds should (sometimes can) shoot you
for being a traitor.

if you go to the enemys city with the intention
of switching sides there, the gaurds dont know that,
you're still KoS.

you should just quit' your side
thereby becoming neutral by default
and then the neutrals can go whereever they like
and only a neutrals can apply for jobs/citizenship.

[Blade / Silke X]

YEAHH!!!I want t obe a neutral!

[___________Illuvatar]

Did you ever look up neutral in any dictionary, or have any clue what the terms really mean? In any natural conflict, becoming neutral after have chosen a side, would not be possible. It goes against the principle of being one, and thus, there should not be an option to change to neutral.

[____________Ejeckted]

that is a dumb arguement

we are not talking about neutral states
we are talking about neutral individuals
it is a different concept

example:

USA citizen Bob lives and works in America
Omni-Tek citizen Steve lives and works in Omni1

America goes to war with Vietnam
Omni-Tek goes to war with the Clans

American citizen Bob is called to fight
Omni-Tek citizen Steve is called to fight

American Bob says 'no' and moves to Canada
Omni-Tek Steve says 'no' and moves to Newland

This is not the same thing as Bob going to fight for the Viet Kong
This is not the same thing as Steve going to fight for the Clans

:P

an individual can become 'neutral' at any time
just by saying "screw you guys im leaving"

it is much more difficult for a state to get itself
out of a conflict and suddenly declare itself 'neutral'
but that is not what this thread is about.

it's about giving the players/individuals realistic RP options

like i said, i would never go neutral for game-mechanic reasons.
in an RP sense i'd prefer to be neutral but that is just too much
of a handicap in AO .. . but if people want to choose to handicap
themselves for RP, that option should be available to them.

[______________Zaduda]

"Did you ever look up neutral in any dictionary, or have any clue what the terms really mean? In any natural conflict, becoming neutral after have chosen a side, would not be possible. It goes against the principle of being one, and thus, there should not be an option to change to neutral."

Excuse me for saying, but what a load of crap.



And we're not talking nationality here either, everyone on RubiKa is of the same country/planet


its a political stance you affiliation is, not your race or country.

Im not OmniTek, i worked for them, i dont want to now. Im not clan, i dont want to help them at all. That makes me neutral. That IS its definition, to not be involved in either side, to be balanced.... buy a dictionary yourself.

Jeez, some people....

[Defiler]

I do not think there should be neutral aplication forms, Neutrals should be very small in number and not anyone can be neutral if they want to. You said you killed clanners and now u r saying sorry and becoming neutral... guess what? the clanners will not think ur neutral because u have not been punished for killing ppl and OT will think u r a traitor and joined clans; and neutrals dont want ppl who "changed their minds neutrals want pure neurals. Thus once u have taken a side you can never choose to be neutral. Just my 2 creds, not a flame

--Stimmed Out

[____________Ejeckted]

"guess what? the clanners will not think ur neutral because u have not been punished for killing ppl and OT will think u r a traitor and joined clans"


the above arguement is invalid again,
because clan will accept ex-omni and omni will accept ex-clan;
regardless of how many of their side they killed.

neutrals will always be small in number
because being neutral sucks

you are a target for both sides,
get no tokens/merit-board,
and have very few shops/save-terminals

but for the RPers
it just doesnt make sense that by quiting one
you automatically join up with the other

quitting your job is not the same thing as
bombing the office HQ!

[Malachii]

I currently work for Omni-tek, I'm contracted under their services for a set amount of time. I will work for Omni-tek loyally... but after the contract has ended... I too would like to go neutral, having no real sides.
This would mean I could be 'hired' as a free agent again.
And as Clans don't have nearly enough funding to hire myself or my associates... then becoming a Clan worker is pretty minimal.

What I can't seem to agree with here are the people who disagree about having the option to go neutral.

To roleplay my assassin properly I should be able to end my contract successfully... then move onto whomever arrives with my new contract. Thus ending my employment as an Omni-tek employee.

Perhaps devoted 'assassins' should have contract boards instead of merit boards. *laughs and laughs an...* oh okay then, so it wasn't funny

-Malachii, keeper of arcane reverie

[_____________Alexion]

Initially FC's plans for the neutrals where that they'd recieve an IP bonus at each lvl, above and beyond what omni's and clanners get. To reflect the difficulty of going out on your own and not gaining support from a side. Being able to switch to neutral would fubar this.

But since FC's done nothing at all in terms of neutrality advantages, in fact given the a rather large shaft IMHO, I don't see any reason why they shouldn't do this. Or give a neutral some advantage at least, such as being able to shop anywhere.

BTW, my first characters where all neutral, until I figured out that there was no reason/advantage to do it. No token boards, very little territory, strange pvp rules, no unique armor, no special guild advantages. I like RPing, but not at the cost of that much of a penalty.

[____________Yohansen]

Originally posted by Stimmed
and neutrals dont want ppl who "changed their minds neutrals want pure neurals.

Well, as a neut, I would be pleased to wellcome Mr. Rivers to our (non-)side.

[_______________Rypht]

Yes, as would I, as a neutral welcome any who don't want to embrace this war. But this is a perfect example of the neutral population, we're a bunch of individualists, you'll have those that have some corny concept of a pure neutral. You'll have others that are willing to open their arms to aid anyone. You'll have yet others that will be hateful of select others.

As for the "Did you ever look up neutral in a dictionary" arguement, perhaps you should aim that at Funcom, it seems being the ONLY oppressed faction *has yet to see clanners in any way be oppressed* (yes we are a faction) on rubi-ka is the believed meaning of neutrality.

[___________Shadowolf]

Originally posted by Stimmed
I do not think there should be neutral aplication forms, Neutrals should be very small in number and not anyone can be neutral if they want to. You said you killed clanners and now u r saying sorry and becoming neutral... guess what? the clanners will not think ur neutral because u have not been punished for killing ppl and OT will think u r a traitor and joined clans; and neutrals dont want ppl who "changed their minds neutrals want pure neurals. Thus once u have taken a side you can never choose to be neutral. Just my 2 creds, not a flame

--Stimmed Out

Not to flame, but to respond . First of all anyone can be Neutral if they want to, that's kind of a definition of a Neutral. hink about it, OT has Ross and his gang deciding who can and can't work for OT, theoretically, so you could argue that not all can be OT (even though right now with Amnesty and all everyone can). Cland have COT, they too decide weather or not you're worthy of being a rebel, theoretically, even though you can still be a rebel on your own and say screw COT (what most Clanners seem to do anyway). Who of the Neutrals has a power to decide weather or not an individual can become neutral? Exactly, thus if one want to become neutral no body can stop them, except for inabilety to do so in-game as of yet. As I see it right now, if you try to terminate your employment with OT they kill your soul (re-roll), same with Clans, you run away they hunt down and kill you (not like they actually care about citizens of Rubi-Ka that don't follow their ultimate regime). Does it make sense? No, but that's one of the reasons I decided to stay away from both of these cults.

Your arguments about killing Clanners before so not being able to become neutral is false, since I am Neutral, I killed Clanners, and guess what, I am still Neutral .

And as for us wanting pure neutral, look at my first argument, we have no power to decide who we want or not, being neutral is not like getting a citezenship, it's a state of mentality. Also, neutral means you are neutral to everyone, OT, Clans and other neutrals, so I care less if you are a "pure" neutral or your mother was OT and father was Clan.

Hmm, my response became longer than the post I was replying to . Oh well, got carried away. On the issue, I just want to say that I agree, let people fix their misstakes after seeing how friendly OT is and righteous Clans are. After all, we all make misstakes, choosing side is just one of them .

PS: Flame all you want, I'm just having fun. If any of you are too blunt to get sarcasm and such, well, that's one of the beauties of MMO"R"PGs .

[_______________Orb!t]

If you have even killed only 1 person of the opposing side you shouldn't be labeled neutral.. it doesn't work that way irl and it shouldn't work like that in-game.. you have clan-blood on your hands in the name of omni-tek so you can NEVER EVER be considered a neutral again.. you can give up killing all ya want, you stil have a history..

[_______________Orb!t]

and shadowwolf.. if you're a neut who killed a clanner or omni then it's a different matter.. some neutral countries (atleast 2 which i know of) during WW2 brought down allied and axis enemy fighers and captured allied and axis pilots.. they were still considered neutral because they were defending their airspace, not because they prefered one side over the other.. defending yourself as a neut is not the same as picking a side and killing in the name of..

[___________Shadowolf]

I agree with you on that Orbit, even though one of those killings was not a self-defense, but in the name of my contractor as I am a merc .

[_______________Orb!t]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Scumbug

an individual can become 'neutral' at any time
just by saying "screw you guys im leaving"

---

the person that quit for example omni might declare himself neutral but that doesn't mean a damn thing to the clanners that know you killed some of their own.. you can be neutral all u want then, you'll still be perceived as the enemy because you once were omni.. it's not all black and white, there's a lot of gray in between.. and u say it's diff with individuals? nope, you think that an axis soldier who said "screw it" halfway during the war would just be accepted as neut and left alone? maybe in a world with all senile ppl yeah, but not one where ppl have brains and can remember things.. english isn't my native language so kinda hard to explain my stance in full detail but i'm sure anyone who doesn't live in a fairy-tale world would agree with me.. u can be a neut all you want, you'll still be ex-omni to anyone who knew you..

[_______________Orb!t]

one more thing heeh.. scumbug, changing from clan to omni or vice versa is completely different and even more complicated..
but as some have said in this thread, a pure neut is someone who has NEVER ever chosen a side (hence a neut), not one who chose a side and then became neut again.. it's not u who decide your ultimate verdict of being neutral or not, it's other ppl that do that for you.. joining the neuts is a whole diff thing then being a neut..

[______________Zaduda]

Again, all the people knocking this argument seem to have no feet to stand on.....


"If you have even killed only 1 person of the opposing side you shouldn't be labeled neutral" - Orbit

Fine, ill go out and kill Omni-'s.....

Then i'll of killed clanners AND Omni's....... what does that make me then?????????


If i kill clanners and join the clans, how is that different from me killing clanners and joining the neuts? Its an AFFILIATION.

Im leaving one side and joining another. And your still confusing OT as a religion/way of life, than what it actually is. A company.

I will kill clanners in this amnesty, i will join the clans and kill omni-tek employee's in this amnesty. Heck, Aberic, save me a spot the next time you see Radimam, i wanna kill him, ABERIC was made neutral when he was sacked from OT!!!! (im quitting OT)
The difference is, i'd of *stayed* neutral.

Infact, perfect case in point. OT expelled Aberic, they didnt expel him to the clans, because they SACKED him from OT, so they knew he didnt like the clans, he was made neutral. incase he then wanted to JOIN the clans, but, instead he joined OT.


I will do anything with my character to be turned neutral again, neut forms will make it easier,




but in the end, it simply comes down to oppressive gameplay and non freedom of choice to not have neutral application forms.

Saying "no you cant be a neut, you have to choose a side" is like saying once you choose, Omni, you shouldnt become clan.

[_______________Orb!t]

actually, you don't have anything to stand on either.. no offense, but as always most (not all) of u americans see everything in black and white.. good or bad.. once more, in the end it's not how u declare yourself.. it's how ppl perceive you.. you would be more respected by joining from omni to clan then from omni to neut.. changing from omni to clan is changing sides.. changing from omni to neut is NOT.. if u tried i'm sure u could understand this..

but never mind though, it's just a game so change all u want..

and we're not knocking this argument.. we're just posting our views. try to be open to other views too and atleast try to understand them instead of discarding them from the start..

to solve this there should be another faction.. omni, rebel and outcast (rogue whatever).. i don't say neut cause that isn't a faction for me..