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Thread: Exploding Pets - or how to use pets as offensive weapons

  1. #1

    Exploding Pets - or how to use pets as offensive weapons

    Ok, your first thought here is: "Lol, lame". However, if you remember it, Lemmings was cool.

    Basic outline / justification:

    MP pets are supposed to be manifestations of our anger / emotions. Unlike Engy / Crat pets (who are robots, dogs and hired hands) our pets are pure notum manifestations. That's pretty unstable stuff!

    Non RP reasoning:

    1) MP pets are bottom of the pile at the moment. Attack pet - lowest AR. Heal pet - outmoded by today's standards. Mezz pet - ok, but of little use apart from in specific situations. They need some love - shoving more AR on them / just more upgraded buff lines is ZZZzzz. How's about a real change?

    2) Pet classes [As noted by Chrys] need some distinctive features, thus I feel MP pets should be the most "outlandish" ones. In the chain of pet users, MPs ironically are the weakest class, with the weakest pets.

    3) MPs want to be pet users first, mobile turtles / AS machines second. I've always felt this, pretty sure most do as well.

    4) I'm sure I've got an ancient RK nano loaded that did a DoT to my pet for a tiny amount of boost to its damage. I can't find it on Auno, but I remember using it on a level 45 pet and almost insta ganking it. So the precedent is there.

    5) It'd be insanely fun. Watching a floating meatball zooming off to attack a blob & blowing up would be crazy fun. It'd also require skill in pet use [timing is everything] to get the best effects.


    Way it works:

    1) Instead of pets being mobile /afk damage (essentially mobile, annoying DoTs) this would make them proactive focused weapons, under the caster's control.

    2) Each pet would have a different line of explosive buffs. e.g. Attack pet = damage nukes, mezz pet = AoE roots etc, Heal pet = AoE bonuses to friendlies. Pet QL would set ranges of numbers, nano QL would determine effect types. This would allow balancing across the MP level range, not just T7 love. e.g. Casting a nano on the attack pet that made it explode, the damage delt would be determined by the level of the pet. A variation here is that perhaps these nukes only work on meatball type pets - we'd need a couple of higher QL ones though (yes, I'm addicted to the idea of exploding meatballs).

    Some themes:

    1) World of GOO. Mezz pet on 10 second timer explodes into green goo, AoE slow effect
    2) World of Ink. Mezz pet on 10 second timer explodes into AoE blind effect.

    And so - I've a list here a couple pages long of ideas for them.

    3) The nanos would work on a timer. e.g. Nano cast -> 10 seconds to explosion. There'd be a slow burn line (like old versions) and fast PvP ones (5 / 10 second timers)

    4) SL pets would need their cast times tweaked.

    5) New meatballs please.

    6) All AoE effects should be inclusive. e.g. They effect everything, friendly or non-friendly inside the range. Chaos & disorder are fun


    Anyhow, as a MP, I'd love to see this. At the moment, I do most of the DD, my pet is a one-click throwaway which I buff every 10 mins.
    Last edited by Kaitlain; Jul 22nd, 2009 at 13:23:11.

  2. #2
    I've mentioned pet special abilities many times in the past (including AoE self-destructs), ever since I discovered the joy of controlling a pet class in Warhammer which allows you to blow up your squig (and also instacast a new one).

    Eg.
    http://forums.anarchy-online.com/sho...d.php?t=546852
    http://forums.anarchy-online.com/sho...d.php?t=549611

    Problem is that it's going to be hard work to code so we should stick to band-aids.
    bai2u!
    -::l2pvp!1::-
    Electronite: FFA also destroyed Clan hegemony when it comes to tower wars. Ironically the downfall was started by the most active pvpers. Another ironic thing is that the downfall happened due to pvm conflict. Silirrion: (We have pretty good anti-troll filters by now though) Means: Thong-wearing troxes will always be a part of this game and a point of AO pride. Keldros: Obviously reall trolls don't use conditioner Marlark: If this forum was Swedish in it's language .. id pawn you any day. 220 NT: tl7 is a joke most of the time. 90% of the people are double double dead. some are worth debuffing tho. Mastablasta: you guys are right and I'm wrong. Ebag: No. You alpha me'd due to the stat bug. More Ebag: I don't have any twinks currently, nor do I participate much in mass TL7 PvP (though I do go occasionally, usually just to watch). Questra: an MP in sneak eNSDed me and did about 20k damage in 10-12 seconds

  3. #3
    I'm in for any changes on pets, alot of varieties we could cast to let us adapt ourselves in almost every situation, or just for fun, like those exploding pets.
    ᖧ-Flynicist-ᖨ
    Grenade

    Rushing where angels fear to tread.

  4. #4
    Anything would be better than what we have now.

    You guys know those drones spawned by one of the LE mission bosses? Looks like a tiny Borg sphere, locks onto a target and then explodes in a very small AoE (2 m or so?) explosion. Could be used as a basis to build AoE explosion pets after.
    Prynxkjui 220 NM MP / Prynjunior 220 Soli Doc

  5. #5
    Well the other issue is engy pets had this kamikaze bot that was way OP for farming dd on big HP mobs like Tara and those got removed never to be seen in game again. So we'd be 'stealing' their toolset with exploding damage pets, though an exploding AoE snare/root/dd debuff mezz pet replacement would be terrific.
    bai2u!
    -::l2pvp!1::-
    Electronite: FFA also destroyed Clan hegemony when it comes to tower wars. Ironically the downfall was started by the most active pvpers. Another ironic thing is that the downfall happened due to pvm conflict. Silirrion: (We have pretty good anti-troll filters by now though) Means: Thong-wearing troxes will always be a part of this game and a point of AO pride. Keldros: Obviously reall trolls don't use conditioner Marlark: If this forum was Swedish in it's language .. id pawn you any day. 220 NT: tl7 is a joke most of the time. 90% of the people are double double dead. some are worth debuffing tho. Mastablasta: you guys are right and I'm wrong. Ebag: No. You alpha me'd due to the stat bug. More Ebag: I don't have any twinks currently, nor do I participate much in mass TL7 PvP (though I do go occasionally, usually just to watch). Questra: an MP in sneak eNSDed me and did about 20k damage in 10-12 seconds

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Chrys View Post
    Well the other issue is engy pets had this kamikaze bot that was way OP for farming dd on big HP mobs like Tara and those got removed never to be seen in game again. So we'd be 'stealing' their toolset with exploding damage pets, though an exploding AoE snare/root/dd debuff mezz pet replacement would be terrific.
    I've seen that in the DB.

    Any knowledge of when it was removed? Pre-SL?


    These days it might not be so OP.... if it wasn't used by engies.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaitlain View Post
    I've seen that in the DB.

    Any knowledge of when it was removed? Pre-SL?


    These days it might not be so OP.... if it wasn't used by engies.
    Problem was it did %HP damage instead of a fixed amount. So cool in PVP... against PVM mobs however, DDFARM :> Would be fixed with Target=Player or simply set to a fixed HP amount (say 15k, which would equal a capped hit in PVM or PVP).

    I think it didn't make it out of test server, I'm not sure tbh
    Last edited by Chrys; Jul 22nd, 2009 at 18:17:38.
    bai2u!
    -::l2pvp!1::-
    Electronite: FFA also destroyed Clan hegemony when it comes to tower wars. Ironically the downfall was started by the most active pvpers. Another ironic thing is that the downfall happened due to pvm conflict. Silirrion: (We have pretty good anti-troll filters by now though) Means: Thong-wearing troxes will always be a part of this game and a point of AO pride. Keldros: Obviously reall trolls don't use conditioner Marlark: If this forum was Swedish in it's language .. id pawn you any day. 220 NT: tl7 is a joke most of the time. 90% of the people are double double dead. some are worth debuffing tho. Mastablasta: you guys are right and I'm wrong. Ebag: No. You alpha me'd due to the stat bug. More Ebag: I don't have any twinks currently, nor do I participate much in mass TL7 PvP (though I do go occasionally, usually just to watch). Questra: an MP in sneak eNSDed me and did about 20k damage in 10-12 seconds

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Chrys View Post
    Well the other issue is engy pets had this kamikaze bot that was way OP for farming dd on big HP mobs like Tara and those got removed never to be seen in game again. So we'd be 'stealing' their toolset with exploding damage pets, though an exploding AoE snare/root/dd debuff mezz pet replacement would be terrific.
    Quote Originally Posted by Chrys View Post
    Problem was it did %HP damage instead of a fixed amount. So cool in PVP... against PVM mobs however, DDFARM :> Would be fixed with Target=Player or simply set to a fixed HP amount (say 15k, which would equal a capped hit in PVM or PVP).

    I think it didn't make it out of test server, I'm not sure tbh
    Actually, the main problem was that the kamakazi pets could kill GM's.

    They didn't do a % HP damage either, but instead did a set HP to damage. (IE: set HP to -1)


    Genele has a method for doing kamakazi pets....but I'm pretty sure Engie's get first dibs if it happens.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Ebag333 View Post
    Actually, the main problem was that the kamakazi pets could kill GM's.
    Yeah cos GMs are part and parcel of every day gameplay and you see them all the time everywhere.
    They didn't do a % HP damage either, but instead did a set HP to damage. (IE: set HP to -1)
    I didn't think kamikaze pets insta killed everything? That sounds like pretty dumb programming.
    bai2u!
    -::l2pvp!1::-
    Electronite: FFA also destroyed Clan hegemony when it comes to tower wars. Ironically the downfall was started by the most active pvpers. Another ironic thing is that the downfall happened due to pvm conflict. Silirrion: (We have pretty good anti-troll filters by now though) Means: Thong-wearing troxes will always be a part of this game and a point of AO pride. Keldros: Obviously reall trolls don't use conditioner Marlark: If this forum was Swedish in it's language .. id pawn you any day. 220 NT: tl7 is a joke most of the time. 90% of the people are double double dead. some are worth debuffing tho. Mastablasta: you guys are right and I'm wrong. Ebag: No. You alpha me'd due to the stat bug. More Ebag: I don't have any twinks currently, nor do I participate much in mass TL7 PvP (though I do go occasionally, usually just to watch). Questra: an MP in sneak eNSDed me and did about 20k damage in 10-12 seconds

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Chrys View Post
    Yeah cos GMs are part and parcel of every day gameplay and you see them all the time everywhere.
    Well they are part and parcel of every day gameplay....you just need to know where to look.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chrys View Post
    I didn't think kamikaze pets insta killed everything? That sounds like pretty dumb programming.
    Remember how many years ago this was. The game engine was hugely limited compared to todays world.

  11. #11
    I can't remember what the problems were... but I remember the long discussions about possible solutions and the eventual decision to give it up. I've also heard that Genele has a more recent solution for it... be interesting to see if it turns up at some point.

    There's been a bunch of stuff coming out recently where they've been finding new ways to do things. I noticed Means talking about a big effort they've made going back through legacy coding and finding out how it all actually works in connection with changing dbases and graphics engines.

    I'm thinking that there was a lot of stuff that FC haven't trusted themselves to touch since forever, because it was so badly documented and understood and the original coders were long gone. When they did touch old stuff, it very often went very wrong and had all sorts of nasty knock-on effects that were unexpected.

    But they've been forced to actually go through the code and really work it out now, which has opened up some doors and made some of the things that were seen as 'not reasonably possible' now more approachable.

    That's a good thing.

    X

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Ebag333 View Post
    Genele has a method for doing kamakazi pets....but I'm pretty sure Engie's get first dibs if it happens.

    honestly, if engies get it first, i'll be so f'n pissed off and insulted, i dont know what kind of bitching i'll direct at FC. we've had such ideas and wishes for several several years now. it was the idea that caused us to get that stupid SS nano as well.

    Level 1 to 300 in 8 Years! Pwn!
    - Join us on Discord! -
    AO WIKI!
    Arcanum!


  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by shadowgod View Post
    honestly, if engies get it first, i'll be so f'n pissed off and insulted, i dont know what kind of bitching i'll direct at FC. we've had such ideas and wishes for several several years now. it was the idea that caused us to get that stupid SS nano as well.
    Well Engies did have it first and had it taken away from them, long before it showed up in any of our wishlists.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Ebag333 View Post
    Well Engies did have it first and had it taken away from them, long before it showed up in any of our wishlists.
    i dont care if Gaute himself had it first (even tho its odd to have something that was impossible back then). MPs are required to have it to make up for SS.

    Level 1 to 300 in 8 Years! Pwn!
    - Join us on Discord! -
    AO WIKI!
    Arcanum!


  15. #15
    I really dig these ideas for our pets. It would certainly make them a lot more interesting and fun. While we're at it, can we has hot pink Rihwen pl0x?
    Hot Pie ~ Remedie, Maiaa, Squirt, and Remepie

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