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Thread: how do you solo hard mobs?

  1. #1

    how do you solo hard mobs?

    Hiya.

    I usually set my pets on wait, pull one mob, and when I go back to my pets I set my healpet on myself and start attacking. The mob usually attack me for a few hits until my pet kinda agro ... until all my perks hits the mob and he aggros me again. When im running low on HP I run away, if I can hide I sit down and let my heal delta heal me while my healpet is healing my attack pet.

    Uhm, and that's pretty much how I fight.


    I get a problem right away when the mob hits for more than my healpet heals. 30 sec cast time on attack pet usually kills me(unless I spawn cacademon and save myself that way)

    Does anyone have any good ideas? I just read trough xtremetechs guide and he havent mentioned alot regarding this. Of course, there's probably many things that effects how to do this. ranged/melee and so on. I am ranged now.


    How do you solo hard mobs? I am btw level 207 and I cant solo _any_ inferno mob, I think(not suure when/if its possible)

  2. #2
    At 207 you can try merlin dragons I think, not sure tho.
    Use damage debuffs, they are working like charm.
    Kuznechik, Board member of Disciples of Omni-Tek (and few dozens of alts)
    DoOT is recruiting
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  3. #3
    Debuffs, debuffs, debuffs, debuffs, debuffs.

    Keep all debuffs (that work on that mob, NSD on a non nuking mob = bad mkay) running as much as you can.

    Swap agg as much as you can between you and your demon (twink your aad/evades enough, and demon doesn't need to tank).

    Starfall perkline - Works wonders, the DD perks are nice, but the real show stopper is the -aao/-inits perk you get @ Starfall 1 (can't rem name). Anyways, at Starfall 10, it's like a mini UBT + NT blind on the mob.

    And if you have Sacrifical Shielding, and you have the mob debuffed, you can always toss that on too, the 250 aad after the dot wears off helps.

    Oh, before I forget! The 2 evade procs. While it's harder to keep them up 100%, assuming you have a decent weapon speed, they can mean the diff between phat lewt, and rezzing.
    General of Umojan Protectorate - Technical Department
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    Norbby, 220/20 Keeper - stabbing anything that moves

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    And all MPs should be forced to speak like that Architect guy from the Matrix when RP'ing....
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  4. #4
    Thanks for replies.

    I tried to kill a inferno mortiig, and they hurt like ****. Even with debuffs.


    I will read a bit more later today or tomorrow and see if I can figure somehting.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Mortiphomet View Post
    Would you find a weapon that does mostly dmg in specials like docs use be really really good for soloing? I mean if your gonna be spamming debuffs the whole time your not gonna have time to do barely any regular hits in... MBC comes to mind if your not gonna do the defensive shield bit...
    Actually, for soloing the best weapon choice is 1hb, so you can duel a hammer w/ the SoA (+210 aad).

    And anyways, it's fairly easy to time the debuffs, most have roughly a 2 second rehcarge, which times fairly well with weapon hits.

    And on a side note: when you look at our debuffs, really there's only one that needs to be chained: the SL dmg debuff line B. The rest of our debuffs last 45 seconds to 4 min.

    It can get confusing at times what debuffs the mobs are running, but keep soloing (I advise trying notum scourges, they make great learning subjects), and you eventually get a style and feel for it.

    And as for the topic of MBC, it just doesn't feel right to me for some reason on an MP. There's better options out there.
    General of Umojan Protectorate - Technical Department
    General of Haven - Technical Department
    Norbal, 220/19 MP - "Slightly" off-kilter NM - equip
    Norbby, 220/20 Keeper - stabbing anything that moves

    Quote Originally Posted by jorricane View Post
    And all MPs should be forced to speak like that Architect guy from the Matrix when RP'ing....
    I bump this daily, drop by and say hi?

  6. #6
    1hb ftw when soloing.
    Last shield gives 33% reflect to 3/5 of inferno mobs attacks... If it's not enough - it also adds AAD.
    Kuznechik, Board member of Disciples of Omni-Tek (and few dozens of alts)
    DoOT is recruiting
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    Well, as a well-known fact - I know nothing (especially about engineers).

  7. #7
    It really depends on the situation when 1hb would excell or fall behind.

    APF, you'd be better with pistol or bow

    City Aliens (and ship), gogo 1hb


    This is how I've seen it work out at least



    Oh, and regarding chain nuking:
    If you spend too much time nuking (and resetting your attack bar), you will loose dd. Simply beacuse your weapon will outdamage your nuke in TL 7 (or at least it should ).
    Hence why timing is so important for an MP. Our nuke can wait half a second for the attack to finish

    Altho, if you want specials, it's either 1hb, or pistol for you (I personally recommend pistol as the ranged specials = more dmg).
    General of Umojan Protectorate - Technical Department
    General of Haven - Technical Department
    Norbal, 220/19 MP - "Slightly" off-kilter NM - equip
    Norbby, 220/20 Keeper - stabbing anything that moves

    Quote Originally Posted by jorricane View Post
    And all MPs should be forced to speak like that Architect guy from the Matrix when RP'ing....
    I bump this daily, drop by and say hi?

  8. #8
    If you want DD and don't need to worry about being hit too much (aliens, missions, etc) - pistols are clear winner. (fast and RANGED specials)
    If you want survivability when soloing - 1hb. (for AAD/reflect)
    If you want pvp - bow. (for nasty AS)
    That's it.
    Kuznechik, Board member of Disciples of Omni-Tek (and few dozens of alts)
    DoOT is recruiting
    -------
    Well, as a well-known fact - I know nothing (especially about engineers).

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by kuznechik View Post
    If you want DD and don't need to worry about being hit too much (aliens, missions, etc) - pistols are clear winner. (fast and RANGED specials)
    If you want survivability when soloing - 1hb. (for AAD/reflect)
    If you want pvp - bow. (for nasty AS)
    That's it.

    you can verry well AS in PVM, kuznechik. Bow does as good as pistols in pvm with the right setup. Fling recharge /AS Recharge is v fast on tigress too (and glyphed sancrosanct weapons etc). And i dont see the point in being hit more with bow or 1hb? In the end, it preferences. if you use sancrosanct bow, AI bow, AI pistols or shield/1hb hammers, there is not much difference in survivability. our weapons dont save our behinds, our skill in using em in the right maner with our tools does.

    Vickie
    Sovieta, Seraph - Angel of the first order
    Ihsahna,my Twinkie

    " What on earth would our beloved, stinking, beautiful Europe have become without our dope fiends, drunkards, homosexuals, consumptives, madmen, syphilitics, bed-wetters, criminals, and epileptics? Our whole culture was created by invalids, lunatics, and felons."
    —Moment of Freedom- Jens Bjørneboe 1966

  10. #10
    Handy tools for soloing (Regardless of weapon choice):

    - Reflect graft
    Very handy for those nasty monsters. The best reflect graft offers 13% reflect.

    - Quark Containment Field
    perk obtained from training 3 levels in "Theoretical Research. Extremely handy for those times you need to recast your pet.

    - Soothing spirits
    Probably a must have no matter what, but mentioning it anyway. Both for the heal perk and the boost on pet healing.

    - Starfall
    A perk line. The part that helps the most for soloing, is the perk action called "Dazzle with lights". At it's best it offers a -800 inits and -300 aao to the hostile target. Can be quite helpful.

    - Freak strength
    A somewhat niche thing I think, since it doesn't work on bosses. But it worked nicely for me on things like notum scourges. The whole line offers a total of 3 stun perks. The stuns will also stun yourself, but don't forget that your pets are still in action. And it might just make the healpet able to heal you up that little bit you need sometimes.

    - Root grafts
    Handy for crowd control and pulling sometimes. Root adds and move on. Might also be used in some pet recasting situations.

    - Debuffs
    Use what you can (and need). Even the completely outdated wrath abatement makes a minimal difference. On 220, the SL debuffs are definately worth considering.

    - Evade procs
    If you have them, use them. At least on things you know might be a challenge. For everything else, there's nuke procs. The debuff procs are utterly useless.

    - Terrain
    Don't be afraid to use the terrain to your advantage. And no, you can't hide from aggro. But moving around, using the terrain to block line of sight, can sometimes make monsters waste lots of hits while your pet is pounding on it.

    - DoT ring (be it the Totw or IS one)
    Helps for pulling. DoT the target you want, and run until the adds are gone. Then start killing the DoTed target, which most likely still is after you.

    - Mezz pet
    Did you pull far away but still have that one add on you in addition to the desired target? Put your mezzpet on it.

    - Channel Rage
    The perk line itself gives 100aad, but the main reason I'm mentioning it is because the perk action seems to make the pet hold slightly more aggro. Might just be my imagination though.

    - First Aid
    First aid stims are very nice. Especially in SL. No need to max out the skill, but make sure you have enough to use decent ql stims. Trust me, it helps. Even more so with a little skill lock modifier from symbs.

    Eh...at least that's a start. Might post links for the stuff in the db if needed.

  11. #11
    Channel Rage is cool, if there's one easy mob, since it helps alot while killing the mob.

    When my pet aggro mobs the pet tends to die and I cant respawn it becuase I cant stand still for 30 seconds. <--- that's the problem. :P

    Edit: The theoretical research root rocks - if it lands.

  12. #12
    I can practically shoot non stop if I don't have to kite.

    All debuffs are insta-cast except NSD. You just have to time it right so that you cast during weapon recharge.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Vickie View Post
    you can verry well AS in PVM, kuznechik. Bow does as good as pistols in pvm with the right setup.
    Doubt it somehow... Bow does slightly higher regulars than pistols, but it's single wield, so pistols will be same DD from regulars.
    AS every 15-20 seconds and fling every 15 seconds from it will lose compared to fling each 6 seconds and burst every 10-12 seconds. Especially considering that you can't hit AS every time it ready and basicly limited to 1 as per room in mission. And do tell me you AS in pande...

    P.S.: I'm playing 217 tigress MP and 220 silverback engi, I'm aware of possibilities of AS in pvm :P
    P.P.S.: Pistols are way more team-friendly... No need to rush into room and pull AS on unaware mob then training team with few adds And MP isn't exactly defensive fortress like engi to survive results of 13k AS if he's in average team...
    Last edited by kuznechik; Jun 21st, 2007 at 11:12:44.
    Kuznechik, Board member of Disciples of Omni-Tek (and few dozens of alts)
    DoOT is recruiting
    -------
    Well, as a well-known fact - I know nothing (especially about engineers).

  14. #14
    many MPs have conceal nowadaze so rushing isnt needed for those with conceal.

    i know it does a tad better dd with pistol, but i dint understand that you said pistols is best at ai raids. well, mob dies faster, but u can get alot more defense with evade/aad sertup, than ranged, as it might take longer time to kill, but survivability will be much higher.

    Vickie
    Sovieta, Seraph - Angel of the first order
    Ihsahna,my Twinkie

    " What on earth would our beloved, stinking, beautiful Europe have become without our dope fiends, drunkards, homosexuals, consumptives, madmen, syphilitics, bed-wetters, criminals, and epileptics? Our whole culture was created by invalids, lunatics, and felons."
    —Moment of Freedom- Jens Bjørneboe 1966

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Vickie View Post
    many MPs have conceal nowadaze so rushing isnt needed for those with conceal.
    You might have a hard time AS-ing a dark red mob that has not turned back on you, even in team mish and even if it's far away, down the corridor.
    Proud member of Shadow Ops
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  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Vickie View Post
    many MPs have conceal nowadaze so rushing isnt needed for those with conceal.

    i know it does a tad better dd with pistol, but i dint understand that you said pistols is best at ai raids. well, mob dies faster, but u can get alot more defense with evade/aad sertup, than ranged, as it might take longer time to kill, but survivability will be much higher.
    Quote Originally Posted by Klod View Post
    You might have a hard time AS-ing a dark red mob that has not turned back on you, even in team mish and even if it's far away, down the corridor.
    Conceal is only going to work if you have a conceal buff most of the time (IE: leet, etc).

    And a good AS takes time to setup, anyone with AS who just spams it as fast as they can will take agro and die (which is usually why agents damage tends to be fairly poor in team missions, either they're not spamming AS, or their dead ).

    Pistols are better at large scale raids with (relatively) low HP mobs (such as APF) due to the faster recycling of specials. I know at least on RK2 even before LE the top DD's at APF were always crats (even without their pets/charms) because they have great pistol lines and lots of pistol perks, and uber fast recharge on specials.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Ebag333 View Post
    I know at least on RK2 even before LE the top DD's at APF were always crats (even without their pets/charms) because they have great pistol lines and lots of pistol perks, and uber fast recharge on specials.
    Not so much due to perks/pistol buffs or special recharge, but due to chain-nuking Rule of One. Crats only have generic AI perks for damage, and dark blue specials. Reason why we do well at APF is due to Rule of One doing quite a bit of damage on aliens when chained.
    Last edited by crattey; Jun 21st, 2007 at 19:17:20.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by crattey View Post
    Not so much due to perks/pistol buffs or special recharge, but due to chain-nuking Rule of One. Crats only have generic AI perks for damage, and dark blue specials. Reason why we do well at APF is due to Rule of One doing quite a bit of damage on aliens when chained.
    Does RoO hit for more than min damage on Aliumz? 'cause if not I see no reason why MP's shouldn't be in the top DD then, considering we could (pre-LE) get nearly the same pistols on and Mind Quake is actually slightly better damage per min (due to the significantly faster recharge).

    I've never seen an MP close to top DD in APF.

  19. #19
    Aye, it does for more than min. On low AC targets like aliens, RoO ODs mind quake slightly.

    As for pistol damage, MPs used to wear mostly chosen/scouts from what I've seen. DD crats wear CSS or even CC, which adds more AR and cuts down special recharge.
    Only thing we have over MPs, pistol wise, is a lot higher AR. We don't have any extra burst to help or something. We can train pistol mastery up to 8, meaning we only get those first two perks, which hit for 200 and 600 or so
    Soldiers, fixers, advies, etc should all be doing more damage than a crat with pistols/smg only. They have higher AR, more damage perk, more add. damage and an easier time capping specials.

    All depends on how hard you're willing to work on it. On my fixer, at 215, I was usually 1st or 2nd DD at apf, simply due to the fact I was setup entirely for DD at the time. Same for those crats you see in the top of DD at APF.

    Add pets though, and a DD crats' damage goes through the roof with the new pet buffs for CG. Not sure on Widow's damage, but both Carlo and CG are currently ODing the engi dog/widow.
    Last edited by crattey; Jun 21st, 2007 at 23:11:10.

  20. #20
    Soloing is fun. But its interesting how different people solo in different ways.

    My Attack pet is considered little more than a long running DoT.

    My Mezz pet is only good for distracting stuff every now and again. I honestly don't expect much out of it, but I figure one interrupted attack over the course of a battle or two is worth it. If the mobs is over ql 250 I don't bother. Completely worthless on spirits and such of almost any level.

    Heal pet is the most important part of the equation, first to summon and makes a good distraction if you need to get away (even better than mezz pet because it generates more aggro). It goes without saying Soothing Spirits is mandatory.

    Healing in general: Sprit of Blessing and Heal pet. If these are insufficient, then fire off healing stim.

    Channel rage is a necessity because of a) the AAD and b) if you fire the perk off whatever mob you are soloing switches back and forth between you and the pet for about 2 seconds basically losing an attack or two. Again its primary purpose is distraction, don't think it will help you kill significantly faster. Well technically it does...but not so much more you'd notice.

    Ken Fi: I use it because its a pet buff and you get it for a throwaway perk point. I can't attest to its usefulness but it refreshes more than Channel Rage. So put them near each other on your bar and get use to hitting them as a 1-2 combo for combat pet buffing.

    LE Procs: If its a new mob and you don't know if you can handle it. Fire off both evade procs. If you're experienced with it, swap in the damage procs. Either will be more useful than the debuff procs. If things seem to be going easy swap in the damage procs. If you get surprised and don't have the evade procs running swap them in mid battle.

    Hacked Boosted-Graft: Lesser Deflection Shield QL 200: mandatory. Even if you can handle the mob, do it because there are idiots who will wander in and train you trying to lose thier own aggro and realize too late that you aren't an enforcer with 50 bajillion hitpoints and a mongo.

    Debuffs (the Will line): Should be one of the first things fired off in the battle either just after or just before you hit 'q'.

    Debuffs (the Resolve line): Use only if you are the "hands off" type of mp that likes to let the pet do the work. Otherwise not as useful as just plain nuking unless you are getting your rear handed to you. This fits in the emergency usage just below stims.

    Debuffs (NSD): If you know the mob nukes/debuffs this should be the only thing fired off before the Will line. If you're not sure you can hold off. If you or your pet get hit with a debuff once during the battle keep him shutdown for the rest.

    Chaotic Assumption/Hostile Takeover: Its a 4-5k nuke with a debuff that occasionally does something useful. The only mobs in the game I haven't been able to fire this on are: The Night Heart (from pandemoneium), Jack the Legchopper and one other mob who I can't remember. They consistently resist this, everyone else I can hit...even those that resist other perks. The downside is like all our perks, its SLOW! So starting off the battle with this one after debuffs isn't a bad idea so you can the get most uses of it during a fight.

    Sacrifical Shielding: A very useful nano with a very painful drawback that can be easily nullified. If you are soloing multiple mobs all at once or in a group, then make sure to fire off this nano on your current target just BEFORE it dies. So you get the benefit of protection and the rest of your opponents don't. Soloing a big mob and using this can be really painful. That's why you absolutely positively do not fire off this nano on a mob until a second or so before you hit it with Dazzle with Lights perk. This will effectively nullify most of the bonus your target gets. SS is not a replacement for MQ, though it does do slightly more damage over the same time period. Once dazzle wears off, firing SS again could put you in jeapordy.

    Basically since Dazzle is kinda slow, you hit these three buttons in succession. Dazzle, SS, Combust. SS will hit first, Dazzle, second then Combust nukes them. If you have Thermal Detonation and Supernova then go for it, but Thermal Detonation is the most resisted of the bunch.

    Nukes: I like using Metaing's Improved Glacial Lance better than I ever liked using Mind Quake. The downside is yes it still only going to do min damage (I got it to do 1490-ish damage once in scheol once) and its a royal mega pain to get. Also if you use 1hb weapons you can't just chain nuke since it WILL interfere with your weapon attack which do more damage. Pistols, reportedly, it has so little affect on slowing you down its safe to chain nuke. For 1hb the best time to nuke is when both your hammers are in recharge or if you are doing 1hb/shield then you've got more leeway as to when to nuke.

    Roots: Only when your DoT dies or things get really dicey. QCF and bolt.

    Personally I have the stims out all the time, but I never use the RK ones (because that is a sign this battle is over and I lost). I remember the SL ones when things start to get dicey. For me they are a last resort kind of thing. I farm a few from the dungeons, the ones that hit twice are really nice.

    Prebattle notes:

    - Before any battle summon a Shield of Asmodian and leave it in inventory for quick swapping.

    - Use the Hacked graft on yourself.

    - Evade procs are set

    - Put healing stims are where I can find them without thinking.

    - A rarely used nano that should be cast more often for the 10% of the time that you really need it is One Mind, One Purpose (Nano Interrupt Reducer Line). If your heal or attack pet dies and QCF or roots aren't an option this will practically guarentee you can get your pet summoned while getting smacked around. It rarely used because most people try and get away rather than taking the hits.

    - Anticipation of Retaliation: Mandatory

    - It helps to make a hotbar specifically for soloing that way you can memorize the keys and hit things without looking or jumping bars.

    - Healing nano - it raises the heal delta on the mezz pet to a not glacial pace.

    - Find the point on the Agg/Def bar where you can still hit for 1/1 and not be full def. The bar stays there until things get dicey.

    During battle

    Keep your HP's up intelligently. When it first drops don't fire of stims or blessing until after you get the taletale jump that your heal pet has fired off a heal. NM's don't have much HP so a 1500 point hit looks like you've been bashed horribly. The instinct will be to hit in the supplemental healing immediately. Doing that as Mortificant is firing off a heal just locks your heaing ability for several seconds. And if you take a hit right after that you are SOL. I fire off blessing if my hp drops twice in a row or nears 50% , I'll stim after that.

    Don't be afraid to hot swap damage gear for evade gear mid-battle, it may slow up your attack but save your life later on.

    Don't fire off QCF just because you start taking a few hits. Run away and after a few steps swap your heal pet to your attack pet, the heal pet will generate more aggro that way. It also has more HP than your mezz pet and is more effective as a distraction.

    If your attack or Heal pet drops that is when you fire off QCF. 9 times out of 10 you should be able to outrun your attacker, if not, you need to raise runspeed or its a situation where you waited too long to leave and you are technically already dead. The client just hasn't figured it out yet.

    Perk nuke chains are SLOW, start them off early and often because they take forever to recharge and this is about the only time you can use the big guns.

    Fire off weapon special ASAP since they tend to recycle quickly.

    Terrain and breaking LOS are always good strategies,. Sometimes you can't really run away or break LOS, but you need to interrupt those attacks. That's when melee users take a walk. That's right WALK. While walking you are still attacking. Some mobs will stop attacking when you leave thier up close zone and take a few steps before swinging again. This works for areas like plains or dungeons where there isn't much cover and you can't go too far without ending up running into another mob. With a little effort it won't slow your attacks/debuffing down but every now and again it will make the mob you are fighting run to catch up with you because you stepped out of its comfort zone. The difference between running and walking is simple. While running you will get out of its comfort zone faster, but you also take yourself out of range for hitting. Note its comfort zone is smaller than its actually melee range and smaller than your melee range. SL monsters can still hit you but some will stop and chase you for some reason. It easist to notice this in dunegons. Start at one end of the hallway and smack'em around a bit then walk down the hallway. If you have aggro, the mob will hit you until you are out of its comfort zone (not out of its range) and it will chase you. It doesn't work all the time, because sometimes they will realize...yea I can still him and keep wacking away at a distance.

    Evades are king, but AC's are no slob. When soloing damage is good but don't sacrifice damage for evades unless you know you can handle it. Also remember the less damage you do the longer the battle goes, the greater the chance something goes wrong, so try and strike a nice balance.

    Also remember your weapons need to only be 1 point out of OE to be fully effective but your AR will suffer so you will have more misses. And if the mob debuffs weaponskills you're going to be OE no matter how much you've invested.

    Also for melee users in tight battles do NOT use flurry of blows until you are forced to go go further in defensive mode than you can still hit 1/1. If you do it while you can hit 1/1 you're not going to get much benefit and you leave yourself wide open. Not so tight battles...go nuts.

    With a good strategy and a few levels those mortigs won't be a problem.
    Last edited by Davias; Jun 22nd, 2007 at 17:06:36.
    Sometimes, you just have to charge in with both hands blazing and hope they drop before you do.

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