220 pvp tools

[Zeylenne]

Offence:

1. UBT. More or less getting useless because it does not affect alpha cycle. somewhat effective against nanoprofessions, to some degree advys, and can be annoying to a few else.

2. Dots. Pretty decent, the new pvp dot "Dr Blaze's Mutagenic Compound" does nice damage, and I often see at least 1-2 ticks before target is killed by someone else.

3. Weapon specials. - I see maybe 500-1500 dmg from my specials (Have to use doc pistols to gain the pvp dot) (And mind you, these are impossible to swap out for a doc once they are in due to the high multi ranged)

If I can be alone with a target, (assuming they dont run + root me) I can actually most often survive. I can also kill alot of the 210-219 people because they dont have so much hp. vs low hp the dot actually work pretty well.

I usually see myself performing like 3000-4000 hp damage on a specific target before it is either dead or disappeared or I am dead.

Defence:

I have 2 defences... Heals and high HP.

A doc is a hard target to kill for a single attacker, and very easy to kill for multiple attackers.

Then there are my "nemesis professions": Soldiers and Adventurers both have nanos that make my heals less effective. = 50% defence... a trader effectively removes my complete toolset and leaves me with perks, removing 95% of my offence and defence. Crats keeps me almost completely stunned, removing my entire toolset completely.

Then there is the DOC nemesis nano: I can debuff a crat, and make his nano tick away. Umm.. ofcourse, if im not stunned that is... and umm a crat does not need nano to stun me since he has proc stuns :s SO a bit useless...

Im asking for some tools to make pvp more fun. Make nanoresist actually matter...
make me able to kill - something that does damage at once, not more dots.

the fast paced play the BS has become does not suit a doc very well.

Oh, and you wonder - Should a doc not just heal? Sorry, I do heal in between, but assist macros doesnt work well and most people dont want to team because of the PVP titles. And - its alot more fun to actually kill someone.

[dockwagon]

I think it's a balance. With SL doctor healing became just to much. 220 doctor can do 3k hp healing pr second in average.

For people killing in BS, the doctors are an annoyance. Get one person to 10%, gets healed, repeat.

When the PvP was only Whompa/BY wars and Tower wars, doctors heal was countered.

The skill,pvp gear/experience and/or comunication by the people doing Whompa/by wars made flagged doctors alpha meat. This is based on observations, since I didn't do much Whompa/BY wars. PvP just to PvP isn't my thing.

In mass pvp the huge amount of people, lag, callers etc, also offset the doctors healing. When doctors was able to heal, it was quite breathtaking to watch how your side wasn't taking much casulties while the other side slowly died.

Now BS comes, and the idea is that the fighting should be fast and furious, but due to lower skill by the participants on average (compared to Whompa/BY wars) or smaller clashes (compared to old tower wars), doctors remove the fun if they are played correctly. I've once had the pleasure to heal in BS with some defensive position to fall back to (defended by turrets) and the figthing was in the front. Kept 5-6 people alive through the whole BS. It was fun for us, but for the other side who crashed into 6 advies/soldiers/keepers who was healed (imortal) couldn't be much fun.

I think doctor toolset in BS is too great if a doctor and other players plays smartly in BS.

But the toolset created to offset doctors heals are too disruptive to the doctor's enjoyment. Ie 2x50% reduction in heal and the total removal of the ability to heal. If they nurfed our healing other players by 2/3 in bs, it would remove the annoying impact of a good doctor on the other side but not render him/her useless to defend themselves.

GTH would be better if it had one -50k nanotick and that's it. Doctors doing DB the intended way will know how long it takes to get nano back from the nano remover debuff, after it, heals must be calculated to get some nano regained before going all out healing again.

Well, my 2 cents.

Edit: cleared up some spelling errors

[rsee]

I got in a team last night. Usually i am trying to move my title from freshman to rookie, but i had an orgmate who didn't do much pvp and we found another team of four and joined forces.

The team had a soldier, an agent an enforcer (someone im forgetting) and two docs. In that situation we are terribly overpowered. so long as the doctors stay behind the others and contributes as(or burst fling) and dot from afar, it was pretty tough to kill anyone on my team, for the reasons dockwagon said.

i don't know if there were simply no traders about or if the team made them quick alpha fodder, but i had no GTH sad tails to speak of in the three rounds i played before bedtime. nor did i notice any heal debuffs, but again that could be because the heal debuffers never got close enough to land em.

I understand completely that pvping alone without rrfe in a BS can make you go down quick...but i have to imagine even a keeper with all the buffs is gonna go down quick as he runs through the whompa to mid only to find four agents waiting to pop him.

I also undestand that we don't have much offense...but truth be told if you can land all three dots you would do a ton of damage. not that i ever stay alive long enough to do em.

[Hailzy]

A doctor sucks as offensive in BS. We can't kill much unless it's 1v1 alone for a long time.
We can only get on teams that spread out of range of your LoS, which makes it hard to keep them all alive.
So Many things in BS effect the LoS and it, for one, makes me angry that the back of the point can block your heals while you're healing capper.

A defensive doc in BS is a beautiful thing. When people know they have a doctor watching out for them, and they know to stay in your range whilst taking on the opponents, it brings a small tear to my eye.

In my opinion, You can be a good doc in BS. But to fufill the roll as a healer, others, besides the doc, have to play smart too.


//edit\\
PS. I hate people who cry for heals while everyone is killing you and they have some nubi attacking tham and they are just 80% hp. "Amg, halp. i r dai if nt cumz 2 trple me eeeeepz"

[rsee]

PS. I hate people who cry for heals while everyone is killing you and they have some nubi attacking tham and they are just 80% hp. "Amg, halp. i r dai if nt cumz 2 trple me eeeeepz"

omg so true. or the soldiers who refuse to give out rrfe/fixers who don't give out gsf. i generally heal them anyways, but asking for it 7 times and not getting it makes me want to not heal them....

[Hailzy]

omg so true. or the soldiers who refuse to give out rrfe/fixers who don't give out gsf. i generally heal them anyways, but asking for it 7 times and not getting it makes me want to not heal them....

Me > them imo. If I'm gonna die, and they aren't, well screeeeeeeeeeeew them.
I told the guy off for sending me please heal me tells.

[Docci]

Yep, unless it's 1on1 duel somewhere faaaar away, doc pvp is dead. FC don't want us to pvp anymore. Just tank the adds maybe.

Doc pvp died long ago.

[Zeylenne]

Suggestions for a fix:

Increased attackrating for our dots/ubt....
Increase a doc's nanoresist by far, and make it actually work...

Give us 1 sec cast/recharge on the pvp dots. And add A and B pvp dots too with similar cast time and even higher damage. After all it cant hit same target for more damage that it already does, we can only refresh.

[Dac---]

For the few times I manage to get onto BS in the little time I have atm, I generally am around core, defended by some turrets and healing the rest. As said, there generally is no time to plunge all 3 DoTs on someone in there, and my guess is I can barely contribute 5% of the damage on a toon before the rest of our side makes the kill. The few times I got in a 1v1 on BS I mostly just got smacked/rooted/stunned after which that other person ran off, not even bothering in trying to kill me

All in all I don't mind not killing people, I'm there for the VPs and like this support role as well. Though at times it can be hard to target/assist in there due to no teamage in BS. Then again, haven't had complaints from people for not healing when I failed to target them in time.

If docs are intended to function on BS just as on PVM teams, I think the current toolset we have could suffice. From level 1 a doc's told his team does the damage while docs are to stick to healing, perhaps this 'mechanism' is to hold for PVP as well? Though I must admit I wouldn't mind holding a trox-sized blaster and AS/FA/Bu/Fl the crap out of someone ^^

[Graftmage]

Well, an NT is a 100% frag for a doc Basically docs are pretty unkillable.

[Leyanne]

Basically docs are pretty unkillable.

Basically meaning 1vs1?

All it takes is one stunner and one well equiipped DD to take down a doc in few secs. Most of the time it's a stun + 2 or more people though. Doc is often quite a survivor, but we are also often targeted first and there is a helluva lot of debuffs out there that hurt us bad and we take capped damage all the time every hit and perk landing.

And in the end docs, although may survive, can't really kill much on their own. Unless in some corner, 1vs1, with root grafts and blind ring charged, against greenie or pvm player

[Doctorhyde]

Something I think would be interesting would be scalable DoTs.

Instead of doing 1K per tick on ANYONE, have it scale up with their HP and reflects. It should be around 10% per tick for Dr. Blaze, 9% per tick for the one below Dr. Blaze, etc. Reflects should only be 50% effective on DoTs.

Remember, Dr. Blaze only ticks 5 times, so you're talking about a 50% total reduction per cast, not 100%.

Make the A and B lines have a 2.5% per tick scaled DoT too. Those tick more times but cast much slower. If I have time to get all 3 DoTs on you consistently, then I deserve to be doing 15% of your HP every 2 seconds, especially since I'm spending my time doing that instead of healing.

Compare that to the alpha of any other profession and you'll easily see its still paltry and in no way an alpha. In fact its the opposite of an alpha (slow to take effect, stacks at the end). But if you haven't managed to alpha me after 15 seconds, I deserve the ability to have a mild shot at killing you or making you run away.

[srompu]

*Edited for probably being sarcasting and troll-like*

That said, I'd bump doc damage if it could be given at the cost of significantly reducing their healing ability.

[Leyanne]

I'd bump doc damage if it could be given at the cost of significantly reducing their healing ability.

This has been suggested before, by docs. Personally, I just would like to see some, or even one, of these things to be implemented somehow:

- ability to effectively go full def, like everyone else
- new ubt
- new Epsilon Purge

[enilias]

I'm not sure that going full def is a viable option for docs the way it's now. Being full def implies being able to start evading, that combined with the insane amount of healing docs get at the endgame it would probably make them virtually immune to everything except stunning.

An improved ubt sounds nice, but the -1452 really should not be improved in my opinion, it would just be too much. That leaves an improved EP, which I think just is not likely to happen. This because as it is now it removes things like cocoon too as far as I know, it renders the primary defence of other professions useless. (Although this could be fixed with giving the nano formulas that are removed a minimum ncu-amount too.)

What I would like to see very much is not an increse in damage or other kinds of offence in pvp. Rather I would like to see minor tools that makes healing large groups of people that are not teamed with the doc easier. Assist-healing at the BS still is difficult for me. I would value an aoe-HoT for example much more then a slightly improved version of EP or the ability of going full def.

That said, I almost only do pvm and when I do pvp I'm reminded almost right away at how bad I am at it, so this is mostly theoretical to me. I could be completely wrong. ^_^

[dockwagon]

We wont evade much full deff, but it will help us with resisting with nanoresist.

Ie, better chance of countering gth, blinds, roots, snares, nukes, debuffs...

[Leyanne]

We wont evade much full deff, but it will help us with resisting with nanoresist.

Ie, better chance of countering gth, blinds, roots, snares, nukes, debuffs...

Yeah, with current attack ratings even evaders don't evade much. Nanoresist, which is one of doc's strong skills (hell, we have buffs and symbiant support for it) would get usefull. I don't think it's too much to ask to be able to use our tools.

[Vits]

omg so true. or the soldiers who refuse to give out rrfe/fixers who don't give out gsf. i generally heal them anyways, but asking for it 7 times and not getting it makes me want to not heal them....

Bump for that (and more doc offense please)

[srompu]

You got a new ubt with the LE debuff procs. I think your offensive power is too small, but your defensive power is equally great.
If you got even reasonable evades or could regularly resist hostile nanos, you'd be unbelieveable uber with your current healing.

[Nanofox1]

Got my pistols on yesterday, tried out some BS today using the unique DoT.

I think its great, so much more fun than AS, killed quite a lot of people with it too, fixers, MAs, Advs (har har, tis true), engies, MPs, and not just gimp ones either, some proper PVPers. I run both init debuff procs, help a lot. I'd add NTs to the list only I'm in Full PR almost still from doing symbs, so my mc/bm kinda sucky and didn't land much before they rooted and ran.

The constant getting zerged before everyone else does get tiresome though. Nerf crat stuns, was tanking an adv and keeper for ages today and was fine, until a crat showed...