Tanks/Docs read this.. calm order Pen/Inf mish

[Pajeron]

Since I can't be bothered to repeat this thread on Doc forums and then every profession forums that call/pull it's best placed here in the hope that other professions come here to look into what a Crat can and can't do...

Background: Penumbra mission, level 207 hard rolled...
No Enforcer in team so I knew I had my work cut out right from the start

So what happened?

Doc died twice and here's why... first time wrong mob out of three was called (a 250 El-Moro) leaving a 240 Cur-Afat and a 252 Kuir-Aman as adds, the Cur-Afat calmed first attempt (as always) the Kuir-Aman countered my SL calm 3 times before mezzing and it then took (and this is not an exaggeration) somewhere in the region of 20 attempts to land contemplation.... Doc's verdict = my fault

2nd time Doc died was much the same scenario... this time 2 mobs pulled both 250+ Kuirs :/ again repeated counters on the calm resulting in dead Doc. Doc's verdict = once again my fault!

So what point am I trying to make?

To make Pen/Inf hards as "safe" as possible (especially with no Enf) the calm order should read as follows

uncalmable = Familiar and Boss (speaks for itself)
hardest to land calms on = Kuir-Mare the Custodian (insanely high NR)
next hardest to calm = any of the rest of the Kuir family (insanely high NR)
next hardest = El-Moro and El-Doro (hardly ever counter me these days)
lastly, easiest to calm = any other mob in the mission
I haven't mentioned chaos mobs purely because they're a breeze to calm period.

Me? Nanomage... PS and SI maxed ql200 De'Valos sleeves (extra nanoskills) Always ALWAYS gets Comp Mochams for missions.. nano init maxed along with ql300 Viral compiler and ql200 NF deck range increaser equipped.

My point? well, I guess this is more of a rant than anything else... I just wish other professions understood our profession's capabilities/limitations before being so quick to partition blame when they are visiting reclaim..

Hopefully some other professions will read this and take note..

incidentally it should be noted that the Doc admitted on more than one occasion to breaking calms due to not using /assist, I guess THAT was my fault too?

[Willnotfix]

NERF CRATS

[MrKrosis]

Good information. I wish half of the people I teamed with knew this. Also would like to add that while the familiar is not calmable, he is rootable depending on the layout of final room, it might be practical to root the familiar on the other side of the room and kill the add if there is one. I also noticed that besides those mobs, all of the others are not always equal when it comes to NR (blitzing a few dozen inferno hard missions on a crat for looting spindles made me aware of that) but I can't seem to remember which classes it was offhand. You've definitly listed the hardest ones though. I'm curious from a clan players perspective, what is their take on nano resist of sided mobs?

[Lunaspell]

Unredeemed is pretty much named the same, or atleast follow the same concept

Familiar of * = boss mob
* The custodian = insane NR dont think I have ever calmed one
* - Kuir = very high NR, on some it never lands, other might take 3-5 trys
Calan-Cur = high NR, some times u can land on first others take 2-5
Caleth, Rawa, Craig-or = average NR normally lands on first try, there can be an odd exception but then they are level "much higher than you" or atleast 252

theese are my experiances leveling from 205-210 in inferno missions, also I have maxed nanoskills and always atleast a CI running

and landing Contemplation after seems to be a random roll, if it lands quick or never

[Malaxia]

First of all, i've never calmed a custodian. It says "blahblah was unaffected blahblah" all the time, in missions and dungeons.

For kuirs and moro, after 217 i land sl calms on first try almost all the time (that was handy in hellroom in inf missions with 3 kuirs at the same time)

And rooting the familiar is nice but you can usually calm the add and kill familiar first (then kill the add while the xp perk is running)

[Stillian]

Oh well, going to post this on Doctor forums for you then =) Good points, well done.

[dualShock]

crat calming

Attacked by Demon of Shadow!
Executing Nano Program: Empowered Introspective Engagement.
Attacked by Demon of Shadow!
Nano program executed successfully.
Executing Nano Program: Contemplation.
Your target countered the nano program.
Executing Nano Program: Contemplation.
Your target countered the nano program.
Executing Nano Program: Contemplation.
Your target countered the nano program.
Attacked by Demon of Shadow!
Executing Nano Program: Contemplation.
Your target countered the nano program.
Executing Nano Program: Contemplation.
Your target countered the nano program.
Wait for current nano program execution to finish.
Unable to execute nano program. You can't execute this nano on the target.
Executing Nano Program: Contemplation.
Nano program executed successfully.
Attacked by Demon of Shadow!

[Mathmatikus]

crat calming

Attacked by Demon of Shadow!
Executing Nano Program: Empowered Introspective Engagement.
Attacked by Demon of Shadow!
Nano program executed successfully.
Executing Nano Program: Contemplation.
Your target countered the nano program.
Executing Nano Program: Contemplation.
Your target countered the nano program.
Executing Nano Program: Contemplation.
Your target countered the nano program.
Attacked by Demon of Shadow!
Executing Nano Program: Contemplation.
Your target countered the nano program.
Executing Nano Program: Contemplation.
Your target countered the nano program.
Wait for current nano program execution to finish.
Unable to execute nano program. You can't execute this nano on the target.
Executing Nano Program: Contemplation.
Nano program executed successfully.
Attacked by Demon of Shadow!

BUMP wtb the title of "Masters of crowd control" and getting some calms that wipe hate list like traders and NTs got and crats didnt for some reason >: (

[Malaxia]

Good crat calming:

Attacked by Fiendish mortiig!
Executing Nano Program: Contemplation.
Nano program executed successfully.


And btw, the "Attack by" after the contemplation doesnt not mean aggro hasnt been wiped.

[Mathmatikus]

Good crat calming:

Attacked by Fiendish mortiig!
Executing Nano Program: Contemplation.
Nano program executed successfully.


And btw, the "Attack by" after the contemplation doesnt not mean aggro hasnt been wiped.

Yeah I get that on my 211 crat a few times during a run, most of the time it takes between 2-5 casts, but theres always 2 or 5 mobs that counter EVERY SINGLE CAST. Crats are suppose to be the masters of crowd control so why are secondary calming proffessions blessed with far better sl calms than us (trader and nt).

And btw, dont try to insult me by questioning my knowledge of calms. I posted about wanting a (ok here we go for narrow minded people) *SL* calm that wipes the hate list so we wont be second to proffessions that wern't suppose to be better at calming than us the first place.

[Malaxia]

And btw, dont try to insult me by questioning my knowledge of calms. I posted about wanting a (ok here we go for narrow minded people) *SL* calm that wipes the hate list so we wont be second to proffessions that wern't suppose to be better at calming than us the first place.

I wasnt even trying to insult. I just wanted to make things clear. RK calms almost always wipe aggro. SL calms can wipe aggro on a few occasions. I just dont want that someone who read the thread might thinks that crats calms are gimpier than they are. You are damn right with the fact that there will always be one mob on which calms will never land. But most of the time, RK calm lands perfectly. I did a few missions with NTs and i was calming kuirs and el moro much better than the NT. And i'm not even mentionning AoE calm...

[Mathmatikus]

I wasnt even trying to insult. I just wanted to make things clear. RK calms almost always wipe aggro. SL calms can wipe aggro on a few occasions. I just dont want that someone who read the thread might thinks that crats calms are gimpier than they are. You are damn right with the fact that there will always be one mob on which calms will never land. But most of the time, RK calm lands perfectly. I did a few missions with NTs and i was calming kuirs and el moro much better than the NT. And i'm not even mentionning AoE calm...

True that our SL calm can wipe hate list (with some rediculous unreliable chance to wipe it), and yes RK calm does land fine sometimes on SL mobs but theres always, ALWAYS, going to be some that resist nearly every cast of Contemplation, 3-5 counters on mobs which feels sometimes be average : p, is tiresome and also effects the team, compared to a Trader or NT that only need to land their SL calm once and wipe hate list.

In a way its a slap in the face that we have sometimes have to struggle to wipe the hate list. I by no means think crat calming abilities are poor, far from it, but when it comes right down to it, why do we have to work so much harder to wipe the hate list than secondary calming professions, Trader and NTs.

[Lunaspell]

I wasnt even trying to insult. I just wanted to make things clear. RK calms almost always wipe aggro. SL calms can wipe aggro on a few occasions. I just dont want that someone who read the thread might thinks that crats calms are gimpier than they are. You are damn right with the fact that there will always be one mob on which calms will never land. But most of the time, RK calm lands perfectly. I did a few missions with NTs and i was calming kuirs and el moro much better than the NT. And i'm not even mentionning AoE calm...

At 211 with 1622 PM/SI (including CM) it isnt my experiance that the RK calm lands perfectly on anything that is more than yellow to me, I even have grey spirits in adonis counter it more than once.

Whats the idea anyway with a calm that lasts 1:40 and doesnt wipe hate list, its more like a stun than a calm

[Breaks]

<3 Paji

[Dudududu]

awesome info... but I'll like to add just one thing

Is it possible that crats knw that
a.) when u charm... u HAVE to be able to handle ur charm effectively.. i.e. NEVA sleep when the timer on ur charm runs out and kills ur whole team (penumbra mish vortex comes to mind). and
b.) If u cant handle the charm properly... DONT charm and let the team just kill everything

Reason 4 this is .. there seems to be crats that dont realise that top of the hate list for charmed mobs are themselves and docs.. hence.. the 2 classes in team that are key to team survival will get wiped if the charm is set loose to wreck havoc.

[Sawbones2]

Great post Pajeron, 3 suggestions although I gather from your post that you're not in the mood to take suggestions from a Doc at the moment

* Please repost in the Doc forum
* Please repost in all DD forums
* Add the same type info for Ado, Ely, Scheol level mobs and Aliens

I've been in many a team (as a now lvl 177 Doc) where sooner or later the anguished cry rang out: who attacked the calmed add!? Many a Crat and Trader and NT are pre-maturely grey from seeing their good work undone by a careless DD toon.

The information on the calmability of various mobs is priceless and should be required reading, no...next to the PC cheat sheet material, for all Pullers and callers.

Your post has all the makings of a great little guide. Care to turn it into one?

Cheers

[Hot]

To me, it seems like what they should have done is made our empowered SL calms 'area calms'. Now if they where an area calm, I can see it not wiping hate lists and having to RK calm over it. That would make alot of sense, and having us being able to take care of crowds like we are suppose too. We would just have to RK mez all the adds afterwards.

[glitch]

Lol paj I remember that mission...doc was also a bit miffed you're nano regain perk was that gimpy 50% one

[nerfman]

bump for a sticky!

[arkador]

WTB Teams that listen when i say "Don't attack my pet when i release it, untill i say so. I need to wipe it's hate list or it will kill me"