My opinions on weapons

[RedWobe]

Reading “Definitive Research on Best PvM Doc Weapons Thread,” posted by Biochemyst, I realized that while it provided significant information about damage predictions – which are for the most part pretty accurate- it didn’t address how different weapon types would affect the rest of your setup – from armor, to HUD/Utils, to imps/symbs. This, in my opinion, leaves this guide decidedly not “definitive.” My goal is not to provide the definitive guide, but rather to augment Biochemyst’s fantastic guide with a look at how different weapon setups will fare for different setups. I will examine most of the weapons that he has done DD analysis of and provide pros and cons for each – as I see them. Obviously – this is subjective. I make no claims to either having tried all the different options or to having played a character all the way to 220.

We will start with the favorites:

Shotgun: (Maw, Ith and Kyr) The major advantage to the maw is that boosting the skills for the maw will also allow you to equip a Snakemaster for PvP – if you PvP the Maw is probably the most solid PvM choice for you available today. A high QL alien shotgun with a large crit scope could do better because of its lower attack cycle time and the horid crit bonus of the maw, but the Maw would definitely be a solid choice on RK, where its high max damage would actually come into play. Up against most other weapon lines, shotgun is very IP friendly – only requiring 3 skills (4 if you swap for AS). Also, assuming that you triple implant everything possible, shotgun conflicts with only one nanoskill – the faded BM in the waist. Strangely, fling shot conflicts twice with shotgun, leaving the cluster usage of the maw to 4, despite the fact that it can be equipped quite early in the game. Shotgun is also compatible with high end doc armor – getting small bonuses (read: tiny bonuses) from both Chosen and Azure armor. The downside of shotgun is, to me at least, that it cannot compete at high levels or in high crit setups. In Biochemyst’s PvM weapons guide – in the 210 high crits setup, the maw sits at about 1/3 the damage of Kyr Hammers, the MBC or Kyr Pistols, and far less than half the damage of Gelids. Furthermore, the viable PvM shotguns are fugly.

1he: Ahhh gelids, the age-old favorite of the soloing doc. Cold damage rapes a variety of high AC mobs which resist all but the minimum damage of other weapon choices, a huge nuke proc and relative IP and cluster friendliness. The naturally low attack time of the gelids, combined with their relative lack of crit bonus, leaves the gelid IP friendly – you have to train up 1he, FA and MM up to max if you want to twink them on at 170 (proven possible), but very little IP needs to go into Melee Init. Cold damage cannot be implanted, but it can be augmented with a Penumbra Tuac or a variety of other damage enhancing choices. The Gelids are also cluster friendly, taking up a lot of useless cluster slots (shining left hand for example) and not using up any important cluster slots (I assume nobody will keep the MM eye in after equipping =P) for nano-skills or nano delta. For soloing in levels 175-210, it looks to me like Gelids are far away the best choice. The lack of crit reliance for damage leaves the HUD3 slot open for the Eremite Macro Sensor (providing an extra 1% crit decrease) and the huge damage potential and IP/Cluster friendliness makes it obvious why for so many docs – its Gelids ftw. Kyr axes do better than gelids in BC’s DD sim, but I question our ability to reliably sneak attack, or whether the extra damage is worth the extra IP cost of raising the other specials, especially given how crappy they are. They may lose a little against high end kyr weapons or the MBC in the last 10 levels, but they’ll always hold their own, and you wont have to fund the e-bay monsters to get them, and get them on. (yes I know there are other ways to get high QL alien armor, but you have to admit, its not available to everyone). For this, the gelids win the “everyman award.”

Heavy Weapons (The MBC): Widely considered to be the most uber doc PvM weapon out there, a 220 MBC does damage that can only be described as, in the words of Donald Trump- “Uge.” It gets better because a good percentage of that damage comes from special attacks, meaning that the damage is not interrupted by the long cast times of high end SL DoTs. Many a thread has been posted about the insane damage output of the MBC. This weapon is probably the best PvM weapon for those docs with more money than they know what to do with, because it is, in my opinion, only the best IF you have a lot of %AddRadDam in your setup. Because of the way burst works, and the quick special recharge of the MBC, the number of bullets fired out of an MBC vastly exceeds that of anything other than a full-auto weapon in the hands of a soldier. The effect is a great magnification of the effectiveness of every point of added damage. If you have a Dchest, RBP, Rad. Damage Arul Sabas and rings of power, the MBC is gonna be the way to go. For docs with a full set of SS or Mercs armor however, but not the Dchest/RBP set, I would think that the higher QLs of Alien Hammers, Alien SMGs or Alien Pistols that you could equip could be better. Also, there are no viable heavy weapons alternatives up to that point, so unless you want to be running around Penumbra missions with a Chalice, you’re gonna be using up one of those precious IPRs. Seems the most popular choice for pre-MBC is the JAME: powerful when you can get it on, but severely gimpy if you look at BC’s DD sim.

Melee Energy (SoD/KO Hammer): Popular for the nanomage crowd because of the int. trickledown to Melee energy, it seems to me like this combo doesn’t cut it because (among other things) of the totally crappy placement of shining ME clusters. Furthermore, the other clusters completely prevent any add damage clusters to be added in. Additionally, this is, along with the regular Kyr Hammers, which totally own this combo in terms of damage (at least on paper), the most IP expensive weapon choice today for docs: ME, FA, Brawl and MM all need to be raised, along with Melee Init- assuming you want a crit scope. The only plus side, as I see it, is the mods from the SoD- +4 nano delta (not exactly amazing, but helpful), 32 int (getting better) and –4% nanocost (pretty freakin’ sweet). Honestly, if you’re not a NM, there’s no reason to go this route, and if you are, there’s still something that does more damage than this combo, if you can stand to give up the light saber effect.

1hb (Kyr Hammers): The winner of the pure damage output contest in BC’s damage output contest- the only reasons I could see not going with Kyr Hammers is if you MUST PvP, you can’t stand Melee, have enough +damage mods and wads of cash to make the MBC worth it, or want to train up more than two of your base abilities besides your weapon skills. Seriously, despite relatively good cluster usage (other than the bright right arm for brawling against nanodelta), the Kyr Hammers are gonna set you back some SERIOUS IP. In addition to two large specials, they must be dualweilded, and the multimelee reqs on kyr weapons are utterly ‘tarded. However, if you gotta do big damage, gotta look sharp (my favorite stylistically) and don’t have the big bucks for the uber Tara gear – Hammers are probably your best bet. The thing that, in my mind makes the hammers better than the MBC, if you can stand to be melee (I know a lot of people can’t- I prefer it tho), is that if/when you get your high QL mercs armor- you can equip a QL of hammers far above 220 – where the hammers already OD the MBC in the damage sim. Putting on a QL260 MBC just means you paid less for your MBC, but didn’t put it on till 220 and had a lot of Supple/SS armor to help out.

Pistol (Dual Kyr’Ozch Pistols)- Pistols are another popular doc option, given that the pistol skill takes less IP to train, and it is a proven fact that you can get a QL300 type 4 pistol on (if you can find Puxx and have a whole set of SS armor). Seems like the higher possible AR rating with pistols would lead to more hits, possibly making the pistols the tops in terms of damage. Even with the cheaper pistol skill however, the top damage dealing setup with pistols will kill a lot of IP, and even maxed, wont throw out specials quite as fast as the MBC (can a doc cap the burst? AODB says you need 1550 burst to get it to 8 seconds). The main problem with pistols however is, like the Melee energy setup, the clusters suck: shining pistol interferes with shining nanodelta. Some of this can be made up with perks, unlike any other weapon choice other than ranged energy, but I would think that the the difference in AR once you take out a QL250 shining cluster would be significant. Pistol takes the award for best “cradle to the grave” weapon – CDR and buffing weapons will last you a LONG time as a doc, and the kyr pistols are certainly a viable endgame weapon choice, if not the best choice for all you ranged folks.

Assault Rifle (JAME) – Amazing at low levels, when you can first get it on, the JAME tends to loose strength over the levels, and is usually thought of as a precursor to MBC use. It’s probably best to leave it at that, since our ability to tote around a high QL Kyr AR is pretty limited.

[RedWobe]

Abnormal Choices

MA - Equipped with a "Blades of Boltar" setup, docs can do impressive damage. Some have argued that it rivals the SMG setup, and it certainly looks cool. This being said, MA lacks power until BoB have been equipped (and they are not easy to get). The style, the use of combined commando and the uber damage make this one a new fad, much to the dismay of MAs who have been pointfarming for their own BoB.

2he (Kyr Sword or FBR) – I know from experience that this is possible. It will certainly never do the kind of damage that the hammers or MBC does, but for style, nothing beats charging into battle with a big freakin’ sword. There are a variety of options, the cheapest, in terms of IP, being the FBR. Its two blue skills, keep ‘em maxed (2he and Melee init). The FBR is certainly slow, and I highly disagree with its high ranking on Biochemysts DD sim, seeing as he didn’t factor in the init debuff, but if you’ve maxed Melee Init, it should swing fast enough to do some pretty serious damage. It gets you some of the perks of gelid use, namely the ability to use an Eremite Macro Sensor and cold damage, and is easier to twink on, since you don’t have to worry about Fast Attack or MultiMelee. Of course, you don’t get them either once it is on, but you can pick and choose for yourself. Once you outgrow the FBR, use the highest QL sword you can possibly buff yourself into and a +15% crit scope (if you’ve been using the FBR for 10 levels, you’ve prolly got your inits high enough to handle it. The Kyr weapons have very good crit damage, and are generally fast, but need high levels of skill in the specials and multimelee, which makes them hard for docs to equip. By getting rid of the type 112 on a kyr weapon, you can equip a much higher QL weapon, and with a crit scope and MoP crit 25% of the time. It uses up only one pertinent nanoskill cluster to go with the FBR/unupgraded Kyr sword (faded waist) and the extra IP from not training up brawl, dimach, riposte etc. Not the tops in terms of damage, but high points for style, low IP usage.

2hb (Maul) – It’s really only worth going this route if you’re a trox doc, but how cool would it be? Lets face it, the Maul pwns in terms of style and minimum damage. It’ll take A LOT of work to get your inits up to handling the slow speeds of the big hammer, but when you do, get ready to bash some skulls as only an atrox can do. I highly doubt you can ever equip a Kyr hammer in high enough of a QL to either outdo the Maul if you’re a trox, or make it worth it if your not. The 2hb road will kill your nanoskills however, if you’re thinking of putting in that support chest. But its not like you rolled a trox doc to avoid CI anyways now is it?

MG/SMG – Was really a very good option pre-SL, but the low minimum damage on all the SMGs that aren’t fixer specific (or fixer/soldier specific) kills a variety of awesome looking options. When is funcom gonna realize that this game would be 20x as cool if you could still use all those pre-SL weapons? What I wouldn’t give to get a high min damage on a Sol Chironis. You could have a lot of fun on RK equipping and trying out different QL200 SMGs in TL6 before you hit 200 and have to start SL though. In the 215-220 range, if you look at the Type 4 and 5 Submachine gun however, the weapon line seriously perks back up. With some sharpshooter’s armor, I’m willing to bet that a very high QL submachine gun OD’s an MBC, and costs a whole pile less. Of course, this won’t be true at the minimum level for equipping an MBC, but at the endgame, MG/SMG looks like it could be a new FTW option. Sucks that SMG uses a chest cluster, but hey, by the level that its really important, Mochams last longer than you’ll probably be alive each go’round. Additionally, you get to use those Electrofloridae gloves that you looted because there wasn’t a Soldier around for a PILE of extra added damage.

Piercing – Piercing is a great option to balance HP with damage, as the prime setup is utilizes combined command, possibly the soul mark of pieces (500 in the sleeve slot) and 2x QL300 Aleksanders Blooded Punchknife. Piercing also uses abilities which are possessed in great quantities by the Opifex doc, which seem to be en vogue.

Bow – Bow is another option that I would only recommend to those who PvP as well. The ability to AS is basically a requisite to PvPing as a doctor, and there are three AS weapon lines: shotgun, rifle and bow. Bow is pretty slow relative to the other Kyr weapons, but our symbs give us Physical Inits, which are basically only good for bow and martial arts. Before you get to Kyr weapons, you can also use the sided bows apparently, upgraded with the grey glyphs. Bows get high points for style too, IMO.

Rifle – Like the bow, only if you want to PvP. Or if you want to look like a total badass. My doc has a QL9 rifle that she wears around for that. Rifles have abnormal, but not horrible cluster slots, and like I said, if you’re gonna PvP, you’ll be able to swap out. Not much more to say about rifles, until Funcom ups the min damage on the old RK weapons or nerfs SL Mob AC. Neither is likely to happen any time soon.

Ranged Energy – This is a tough one, the cluster spots are atrocious, but we get good perks for it. There’s also the Amplified Shock Cannon if you just don’t want to put that much IP into weapons, and want to use a full symb setup (more on this later). You could theoretically PvP with it too, since the Energy Carbine weapons can be equipped with AS. Like Melee Energy, the Int trickle down is certainly nice for NM. Unfortunately, the perks are level-locked, whereas implants are not, and a 210 from perks requires a bunch of alien perks, as well as regular perks. It is therefor not really an option at lower levels where the forced cluster usage, or non-usage would gimp either weapons or heals.

[RedWobe]

So what weapon should you use? Its totally up to you really, there are a variety of good choices out there. You should decide based on what makes you happy to see your guy wielding, rather that which beats which by how much in a damage dumper simulation. That being said, IMO certain weapons will perform, situationally, much better than others. He’s how they rank situationally – to me at least. (disclaimer: this is totally subjective. Read the post title.)

In an Uber Damage Setup (read: Dchest and RBP).
1. SMG
2. MBC
3. Pistol
4. 1hb
5. 1he

In full alien armor and a defensive back piece (HNTA, Spirit Shroud, Burden)
1. SMG
2. 1hb
3. MA
4. MBC
5. Pistol

In full Alien Armor, but damn I can’t stand Melee
1. Pistol
2. SMG
3. MBC
4. Ranged Energy
5. Shotgun

BUT I WANT TO PVP AS WELLLLLL…. (Note that other than shotgun and MBC, they are ranked primarily in terms of their PvM ability, as long as they have AS. MBC beats any non-AS weapon in PvP, because most high level PvPers have the uber gear, from what I’ve seen)
1. Shotgun
2. Ranged Energy
3. Bow
4. Rifle
5. MBC

A note about clusters… Not all weapons are made equal in the eyes of the cluster gods, and some nasty sacrifices must be made to equip top QL weapons with lots of specials (remember, special damage > regular damage). So here’s how they rank for all you symb-clutching docs.
1. Ranged Energy (assuming that you don't actually use any clusters, just perks)
2. Shotgun
3. 1he
4. Bow
5. Rifle

A note about IPRs… IPRs are precious, use them sparingly. Certain weapons win a “cradle to the grave” award for being viable all throughout the game, from Noob Island through Biodome raids and LoTV soloing attempts. Here’s the ranking for “cradle to the grave” for those who don’t want to IPR into their endgame weapon
1. Pistol
2. 1he
3. 1hb
4. Shotgun
5. 2he

There are of course, other factors to consider: some weapon choices make an obnoxious amount of noise, look stupid, or don’t work well with other gear that you just don’t want to be without. A perfect example of this the fact that Gelids will probably be tops for anybody who REALLY REALLY likes having that Eremite Macro Sensor in for the -%crit chance. Other people prefer to stay at a certain level and twink, for a variety of reasons- different weapons will work the best at different stages of the game - nanodelta does very little good at level 60 for example, making dual CDRs probably the best temple-twinking weapon. One huge thing to consider is the amount of time you spend in SL compared to RK. If you just love the old school RK and are content to stay out of shadowlands, a whole world of new options opens up to you. When I have more time, I may add onto this post or make a new post about my opinions on the best froob weapons in the game, or which weapons seem to me to be best at different twinking points. Finally, it is important to consider that Funcom just seems to like certain profs to use certain weapons, and so its worth considering that the strange but workable weapon line you love so much now might get totally nerfed in the next expansion or patch. IPRs are precious.

Happy hunting, and happy healing,
RedKross

[Aiiane]

Lot of info and thinking there. Thanks for sharing.

[Lunaspell]

impressive post, thx alot

[Sheffy]

Added this to the Doc sticky.

[Cheapthrill]

Great post.

I would add the Amplified sleek cannon into the ranged mix as it seems to perform pretty good as well.

Also you dont have to choose between pvm/pvp when it comes to AS. Once you have enough shotgun/rifle skill to equip your weapon you only need to worry about raising AS skill as its pretty much the only determining factor of your AS dmg when it comes to people like us who see no great noticeable difference in dmg past 1k AR.

Although i dont speak from experience in the above situation, i have seen a number of docs who do this with zasataba/ithaca.

Any input on ip expenditure from people who have done this would be interesting.

[misssverige]

Awesome this was just the kind of post i was looking for thx alot =)

btw how good is the smg with AS in pvp i mean towards the ithica/zastaba?

/misssverige

[Portulis]

Well done! Really nothing for me to argue about in there, most balanced weapon discussion i've seen in a while.

[sauran]

omg, that was a sweet post, heh - just the kind of post i've been looking for ;D thanks man

[RedWobe]

I would add the Amplified sleek cannon into the ranged mix as it seems to perform pretty good as well.

Also you dont have to choose between pvm/pvp when it comes to AS. Once you have enough shotgun/rifle skill to equip your weapon you only need to worry about raising AS skill as its pretty much the only determining factor of your AS dmg when it comes to people like us who see no great noticeable difference in dmg past 1k AR.

I included the ASC in my considerations actually, especially when considering its high rating in my "symb clutcher" comparison. The ASC really cannot compete with the other "high end" weapon choices, except in very short battles. There have been a couple posts on this. The real upside to the ASC is the fact that you can get it on and get about 1k AR without using up any symb slots. Given that a huge percentage of weapons steal the right arm slot, which is also a particularly sweet symb, this makes the ASC a good "all around doc" weapon, to be hotswapped with a type 3 RE carbine for PvP, as opposed to the MBC or dual hammers, which are "all out damage" weapons for soloing docs.

Honestly, I don't know that much about PvP. I don't do a terrible amount of it, but I do know that all over the forums I have seen "NERF AS" and "AS FTW" posts in large quantities. I know that the Ithica is probably our best bet in PvP, and the rest of the PvP rankings I pretty much just ranked the AS weapons in terms of PvM ability and threw in MBC at the end there.

[Cheapthrill]

Cool i have to confess i jus went bakc and read thru all your skill based weapon choices and saw the ASC sorry i missed that first time.


Someone like Dokalicious could prob give some info on the pvp im sure i have seen him using mbc in SL and ithaca around TG

[Towerblock]

No one considered a Grenade doc? =) twisted, but might be fun. Would be kinda interesting to see a doc luging around the hand mortar of bcam-xum. *evil evil thoughts*

[Regidoc]

Actually, there's a doc in my org that uses a Hand Mortar

[Siorai2]

I'm just going to quickly add my experiences of MBC/SMG here, simply because I rant occasioanally without explaining why

I put a QL220 MBC on around level 208 I seem to recall, and I must say the step up from JAME was amazing. As so well described, the capped Burst time makes an enormous difference, the gun looks great, the noise is fantastic and I was over the moon.

When I hit 214 (a level on which I have now become seemingly stuck) I needed to raise funds for some new kit, and having looked into SMG I decided that was the way to go. It took some twinking, but I managed to get a QL225 type 5 SMG on, even if I am only a few points above being OE.

So, having tested both setups against the same mobs for some time, let me give you my conclusions.

First, the SMG has a higher min damage than the MBC, and therefore as I'm sure you can guess, does more damage, although not vastly more from that one element certainly.

Second, your specials recharge is exactly the same (at least mine is) which means I'm not losing anything from slower Burst/Fling times.

Third, and in my opinion most important. Your AR is higher with SMG than it is with MBC. Now this might be a trox thing as SMG trickles down from stren/agil/stam for 90% which obviously benefits us big fatties, but my AR is significantly higher, and I mean more than 200. Add +30 from Glory and that's quite a boost. It means you land more 3 bullet bursts, and of course adds marginally to damage overall.

Fourth, Energy damage is very buffable. Not only all the usual gubbinz, but the nice blue aliumz gloves become an option not open to non-energy users, and thus I'd say a full damage enrgy setup will always outdo a full damage non-energy setup simply due to this item being available to one and not the other.

Fifth, it's a HELL of a lot cheaper.

Now, the downsides. SMG only starts to compare to MBC at QL220 and above. I needed towers, supple, all sorts of bits and bobs to get mine on, so it's in no way as easy as the MBC to throw on. Obviously SMG implants in chest which is a huge no no, so although I used a chest imp for equipping, I use a normal symb day to day. You could argue that I got to put my eye symb in which I lost from MBC, but that's swings and roundabouts really. It doesn't look as good as the MBC, it doesn't make any amazing noises, and people will genuinely believe you're not as good as an MBC doc damage wise as the SMG hasn't really been well documented enough, unlike the huge publicity the MBC has had.

It's only at QL225 and above you'll start noticing an SMG setup move ahead of the MBC, and by now we're into the land of 1501 SMG skill to equip, which really is a bitch if you're trying to do it early.

I have no idea what QL I could twink on at 220, I'll see when I get there, but in my opinion SMG should at least begin to be recognised as a direct and viable competitor to the MBC.

[BigBubba]

Nice Post ..... Im still doing a Damage Dumper test some day ... Sill nice work here. Though I personaly disagree with your output on the MBC I think its a total waste of time to either buy or camp it. Its the most over rated weapon ever in my eyes. Might of been the way in SL but its title for best PVM weapon is over. More then one weapon out there with better PVM damage now.


Eunucha
Inner Circle
Since 2001

[Fiorin]

I decided to try alien smg type5. It is pretty nice with all energy damage buffs in game. Even if you dont have towers the damage will be a lot better than mbc can every do. With my current setup i have 1280 min damage and 3860 bursts (i have both +add. energy towers). It could be even higher if you go full +damge setup.

The smg clusters arent very nice, lot of conflicts:
* Faded is chest with confilicts with one of the good symbiants we have. Dont think anyway wants to give up chest symbiant.
*Shiny smg and burst share same locations. Also cant use r-arm symbiant, so you loose either alldef or nano delta(alldef most likely).
*bright conflicts with mc. Fortunately the dot requirement can be still meet pretty easy w/o that cluster.

MBC has also 2 good sides:
* It has good modifiers, +hp+def+psymod.
* It can be self equipped at later in game.

Other than that smg outdamages mbc quiet a lot, not to mention higher AR (less misses).

[Deathstalker]

hm, no MA observation?
specially in PvM with dual BoBs you get a lot of dmg in.
triple attack to max ur dmg during the roughly 15s you not spend casting DoTs compared to double like dual 1hb/1he/pistol or single from 2handed weaps.

And i would like to point out, that SMG/5 does od MBC pretty fast (ql 220+) in PvM as soon as you reach higher skills in specials.
(you have to invest more IPs in Burst/Fling tho to cap (300 more fling/burst ea to cap needed))

[appolonia]

Actually I'd say MBC is the route to go in the late ttl6, when you can equip it with some ease, to 215ish, when you can equip an SMG with enough skills to cap specials and equal MBC.

The only problem here is the droprate/price of MBC, but this weapon wil still do very well in endgame, will be selfable, will keep it's nice buffs, and will still look/sound good (though I'm fed up with perennium's noise)... So to me, docing wise, MBC remains the best.

On the other hand, most people keep forgetting that CLA line gives 2 very nice perks to add to the overall SMG dmg, making it the obvious best choice for an endgame randed weapon damagewise (with all those nice add energy items), except for troxes maybe since we need CNC badly (if we don't wanna beg for a CM too much). And, of course, SMG is almost FREE.

I'd like to avoid all those incoming and obvious sounding threads about SMG (we already got zillions of them about the MBC kthxbye), just by saying that the price and perf of the MBC can't just make it the ultimate weapon, apart form personnal matters of taste. It's been proved many times that MA/Melee setups just blow the MBC out, so maybe it's time to give the MBC it's right place, and here I just hope the next patch will really bring us a questable nodrop MBC.

Plus, and quite important, think about all those docs that won't reach 220 just because they can't or don't want - many docs around are test toons, were made to solo, or to heal org raids, and 220 is not necessary for those. Then MBC is THE way to go for them.

And please, stop talking about towers or org contracts when it's about PVM weapons, you keep spitting on Eunucha when he's talking about a dmg test cuz not everybody can aford his setup but you forget not everybody is in a top pvp org with 200+ sites where as a leader you can plant before your mates can.

[Deathstalker]

And please, stop talking about towers or org contracts when it's about PVM weapons, you keep spitting on Eunucha when he's talking about a dmg test cuz not everybody can aford his setup but you forget not everybody is in a top pvp org with 200+ sites where as a leader you can plant before your mates can.

um, no offense but where is anybody attacking Eunucha here ?
or you menat that generally speaking?
Even then, his setup is nothing big (just some camping for the 2*BoB) and prolly most oldtimers (or pwrlvlrs) could get it pretty easy.
puttting CM/CC, dchest, electro, rpb on my doc would take me like 2mins (yeh im bragging, sue me) but do i want to spent 4 IPRS (HW, Burst, Fling, RI) to gain roughly +15% in PvM dmg?
personally i can live with my gimpy self MBC/HP setup and 260 Symbs/300 imps.