Neutrals beware, the CoT is coming for you

[Dabblez]

Just to be clear, what really needs to be defined is in essence:

1. What concessions do the Clan require from Omni-Tek to agree to a permanent cease fire?

2. What concession do Omni-Tek require from the Clans to agree to a permanent cease fire.

I don't expect this to be easy. I do expect this will require a lot of negotiations and a lot of compromise. And maybe to start with both sides will make unreasonable demands. But if you start with the point that neither side has actually suceeded in over 200 years to bring this to an end militarily, it's got to be time to try something different, no?

Savoy

[____________SideSlip]

Originally posted by Savoy
Just to be clear, what really needs to be defined is in essence:

1. What concessions do the Clan require from Omni-Tek to agree to a permanent cease fire?

2. What concession do Omni-Tek require from the Clans to agree to a permanent cease fire.

I don't expect this to be easy. I do expect this will require a lot of negotiations and a lot of compromise. And maybe to start with both sides will make unreasonable demands. But if you start with the point that neither side has actually suceeded in over 200 years to bring this to an end militarily, it's got to be time to try something different, no?

Savoy

One thing that is really important is an esptablished border, and allocation of proper Notum Mining towers to better designated areas. Of course this would apply to both sides, including Neutral Providances.

[Kithraks]

Originally posted by Uwen
Why is the concept of speaking with Houston, as opposed to shooting at him, so difficult to accept as a possibility?

*The administrator couldn't help but grin.*

Back to the topic at hand.

In response to the claims that I do not represent all of Omni-Tek they are correct. I do not represent Omni-Tek. That won't stop me from working to build popular support for an alternative to war between Omni-Tek and the Clans.

The official Clan line is fighting for freedom and democracy gainst Omni-Tek.

That is fine and all. But I fight against the millitant Clanner mentality that Omni-Tek and Neutrals must be destroyed for that to happen.

I do accept the offer to sit and talk. The one-way(at a time) nature of the gridforums are not conductive to the case and arguements that I wish to make. Lets just meet in a public setting, start disscussing and see how it goes.

Is the Council of Truth building accessible to all during the off hours?

[UwensBack]

The building is open, or was a week ago, during the off hours.

And I think its rather general to say there is an "official" clan line, don't you? But that's nitpicking I suppose.

[____________SideSlip]

Originally posted by Kithrak


*The administrator couldn't help but grin.*

Back to the topic at hand.

In response to the claims that I do not represent all of Omni-Tek they are correct. I do not represent Omni-Tek. That won't stop me from working to build popular support for an alternative to war between Omni-Tek and the Clans.

The official Clan line is fighting for freedom and democracy gainst Omni-Tek.

That is fine and all. But I fight against the millitant Clanner mentality that Omni-Tek and Neutrals must be destroyed for that to happen.

I do accept the offer to sit and talk. The one-way(at a time) nature of the gridforums are not conductive to the case and arguements that I wish to make. Lets just meet in a public setting, start disscussing and see how it goes.

Is the Council of Truth building accessible to all during the off hours?

Agreeable Mr. Houston. I to do not represent the majority of the Clans, but I do have to say, I am a little more level headed than some of them. I accept that idea you have so proposed, and I would like to know a general time that this meeting would take place. Maybe we can more prominant members to come and attend.

[____________Zumzolin]

Originally posted by Savoy
You know Mr Zumzolin,

I don't know what Clan schools teach you guys these days, but it's normally considered good form when debating to provide some reasons and facts to back your statements.

A bold, blanket statement such as:

"Crying out to Administrator Houston for peace, however, is futile."

or

"Peace can be achieved but not round a table."

...kind of requires you provide your reasons if its to been taken seriously, Why it's futile to talk to Kithrak about peace? Who said peace cannot be achieve around the negotiations table? Where are the fact to support these views? Where is the substance to these claims?

Frankly presenting a case as though it were a self-evident truth smacks more of fanatism than logic.

Savoy

Your making an assumption that I need to justify myself Kaba. There's is no debate for me here because I cannot be swayed.

There are no shades of grey. The clans and Omni-Tek are polarised. There is no middle ground and so no compromise.

The fanatic label that you've given me might or might not be true. Why should I care. If my conviction makes me a fanatic then so be it. I'm not an appologist, my thinking is not clouded by a confusing array of opinions. I am focused and willing to do what must be done.

[Tussa]

Is the Council of Truth building accessible to all during the off hours?

I sincerely hope this doesn't mean you intend to hold your little pow wow in the Tir tower. If you want to do peacetalks, by all means, do them. But don't be surprised if numerous people the clans dislike it if these talks are held in the tower that serves as a symbol of what we are, deep inside our capitol.

[____________SideSlip]

Originally posted by Zumzolin


Your making an assumption that I need to justify myself Kaba. There's is no debate for me here because I cannot be swayed.

There are no shades of grey. The clans and Omni-Tek are polarised. There is no middle ground and so no compromise.

The fanatic label that you've given me might or might not be true. Why should I care. If my conviction makes me a fanatic then so be it. I'm not an appologist, my thinking is not clouded by a confusing array of opinions. I am focused and willing to do what must be done.

Nothing wrong with being a fanatic. They have their heart set on one thing, thats admirable. Just not the killing of a lot of innocent people, thats not admirable.

[Kithraks]

Originally posted by Zumzolin
The fanatic label that you've given me might or might not be true. Why should I care. If my conviction makes me a fanatic then so be it. I'm not an appologist, my thinking is not clouded by a confusing array of opinions. I am focused and willing to do what must be done.

And this guy called me an Omni drone because I had my heart set on finding a peaceful resolution? This is why I am saying that the Clans have no claim to say killing an Omni-Employee is 'good' and that whatever the corporation does is 'evil'. Murder is murder by any name. You can attatch a decorative lable to it called 'freedom fighting' but it is murder just the same.

In fighting oppression, you end up oppressing those that you fight.

Re Tussa: If there is to be no compromise between Omni-Tek and the Clans as some of your members so ardently proclaimed(showing what the Assembly stand for) should a compromise be reached regarding using the Council of Truth building to select a different site?

Or....should we do what any 'good freedom fighter' would do and accept no compromise? Think about that the next time the Assembly or some other millitant Clan thinks its righteous to kill all Omni and Neutral citizens. *smiles*

Regards,
Administrator Houston
Omni-Admin

[____________SideSlip]

I recommend that a resolution is reached by scheduling a meeting in a pre-designated area and a good set time for any delegates that want to attend, Clan, Omni and Neutral.

So, any suggestions?

[Tussa]

Good luck, Mr. Houston. It will be a pleasure to see how the clans react to your blatant mockery if you do a meeting in the tower.

[Marisha]

Can you define why the tower is there, President Godfray? Is this not an appropiate use of the seat of Clan government, the opening moves in an effort to bring a cease fire to the current conflict? Or has the symbol become more important than the intent?

[Kithraks]

Originally posted by Tussa
Good luck, Mr. Houston. It will be a pleasure to see how the clans react to your blatant mockery if you do a meeting in the tower.

The point I am making is that the same 'no compromise' brick headed stance of your Clan's members show a glaring inability to cope with changes(or to make them). Such people have no interest in the future of Rubi-Ka and run counter to the democracy and freedom ideas they claim to be fighting for.

[____________SideSlip]

I have done no such thing to counter the hopes of peace and I am a Clanner. I will talk even if my comrades shun me, the ones I die for, I would still do it, so they will not have to die in the end.

[Kithraks]

Wouldn't working on a way to reduce hostilities end up saving more lives than going out to kill people?

Our goals are not all that different. Only difference is that I'm not only trying to save people from my side. Faction has no bearing.

[____________Zumzolin]

Originally posted by Kithrak
Wouldn't working on a way to reduce hostilities end up saving more lives than going out to kill people?

Our goals are not all that different. Only difference is that I'm not only trying to save people from my side. Faction has no bearing.

No Houston. More talking will result, eventully, in more bloodshed. Talking delays the inevitable.

If you think that are goals are similar then you need to get to know your enemy. That's one of the most ridiculous things I've ever heard.

And there lies the problem. Making compromises leads to resentment when both sides realise they've backed down from what they believe in. Then comes more violence.

You fear death Houston because you're gutless and without conviction. You seek to hang onto your meaningless, borgoiuse lifestyle as long as possible without any kind of discomfort in your mundane existance.

Your concern for my brothers and sisters in the clans is bogus. Like everything else that Omni-Tek mutter it's without substance and cheap.

[Tussa]

Originally posted by Marisha
Can you define why the tower is there, President Godfray? Is this not an appropiate use of the seat of Clan government, the opening moves in an effort to bring a cease fire to the current conflict? Or has the symbol become more important than the intent?

That's exactly right. It's for the clans. Not for any peacesmoking ritual of an Omni-Tek administrator. Should the clans want to make diplomatic moves to get in bed with Omni-Tek, so be it, but that's for the clans to decide, in the clan city, in the clan tower. It's not your choice to make, and it's not a place wherein you people can try and make our choices for us.

Mr. Houston, you're tossing stones in a bottomless pond. Call names, and play the heartbroken one all you want. I don't care to discuss with you, one of the most false people that walks this planet. If you were so concerned with peace, you wouldn't be part of the department you are part of, no matter what kind of "saboteurs did it" excuse you flag. Your words are pretty and painted with innocence, but they hold no bearing to many of us. If you truly want peacetalks, why don't you send your boss, Mr. Ross, to settle a deal? Maybe he's not agreeing with you, and you want to go behind his back?

[Marisha]

Originally posted by Tussa
Should the clans want to make diplomatic moves to get in bed with Omni-Tek, so be it, but that's for the clans to decide, in the clan city, in the clan tower.

So, if a clanner had suggested meeting there, everything would have been fine? I ask because a clanner did sugest the meeting, Kithrak just suggested a location. Or is the holy of holies so sacred that non-believers cannot enter, even in the interest of peace?

Originally posted by Tussa
If you truly want peacetalks, why don't you send your boss, Mr. Ross, to settle a deal?

I’ve said this before, but I’ll re-iterate. If you look at the last cease-fire, CEO Ross met with Speaker Radiman in Omni-One. This was due to the security concern from Mr. Ross’ staff. This was after Radiman had sat on the council as speaker for eight years, demonstrating the stability of his leadership at the time. Your reformed Council has been around for less than three months.

Also, these meetings only came after an unconditional amnesty on behalf of the Omni-Tek Corporation. This only happened after a cease fire had been signed, a treaty was negotiated by the ICC, assurances given from the clans that they would be able to curtail the efforts of the rogue clans who refused membership in the council, and four years of fragile peace had passed. Then, and only then, did Radiman and Ross meet in an effort to resolve the issues between the clans and the Corporation.

To demand the CEO immediately is jumping the gun.

Accept a small delegation that hopes to establish a framework, or you can try to recreate Radiman's five-year path. It’s your decision, ultimately. Were making an effort towards peace. Are you?

[Astera]

"Were making an effort towards peace. Are you?", says the War Dominatrix.

*laughs*

I have read these arguments over and over and this one is about to come to a full circle. Word twisting and shifting negative attention were almost lost arts but lately i've seen quite a bit of it.

*applauds*

[Dabblez]

Originally posted by Astera
"Were making an effort towards peace. Are you?", says the War Dominatrix.

*laughs*

I don't see what the contradiction is. Surely the people who stand to gain the most from peace are the very same soldiers who would otherwise have to fight them.

Savoy