A Way to Find Loot outside Missions; Outdoors Hunting; Dyna-camp Ideas etc

[_____________Venekar]

Bump.

[______________Tedric]

I agree with the original poster.

While missions are fine and good, and team missions are a lot of fun, there's simply not much incentive to hunt anymore. Which in turn leads to problems finding a group, and loss of communality since everyone is "inside" doing a mission instead of outside in the (beautiful) main game world.

So add one more vote for making hunting and general "outside" stuff competitive with missions. I for one love hunting with a team, but lately it's been hard finding groups (especially since I'm both neutral and on RK2 .

FC, please consider having the new "boss mob only " loot also drop from random normal mobs, even if rarely. Also, please increase the number of good hunting spots if at all possible...

[______________Pangur]

I started with AO because of the beautyful landscape and not ugly looking closed rooms. Give me a reason to continue my way up to 200 and create hunting grounds for players 130+

- Pangur

[Kuro]

How about this for a suggestion:

Leave the "special items" spawning in missions as they are...

But make the same items tradeskill creations with some unique components and have those drop from outdoor spawned mobs? That way, a person or group that hunted outside could, over time, collect the parts to build those same items (or have them built).

Later on, some customizing on the loot tables could be done so certain types of parts dropped from specific mob types (ie: mechanical parts from droids, organic parts from animals, more refined parts from humanoid mobs).

The problem with having the special items drop from mobs as a complete item would be farming from powerlevellers/power guilds. At level 25, wiping out the Rhinoman village in Newland Desert was an impossibility solo and a huge challenge for anything but a extremely well integrated team. At level 120 or so, it's a /pet hunt away.

But by making them tradeskill items, the loot can be customized to discourage people with the "farm mentality". Obviously parts off a level 40 mob would be similiar in QL and ultimately yield a similiarly QL item. If you can't get all the parts in 1 place, then it means visiting various spots or plain dumb luck. And then there's the matter of finding someone that can put it together for you (which can be tweaked somewhat by having higher requirements for the unique parts).

[RVWinkle]

A while back I read a report from this guy who is generally recognized as the creator of the first mud, hence the father of MMORPGs. In it he described the various player types that need to be catered to in order for a game of this style to be successful. Based on what I've seen in this game, it appears that the designers read this article and then had it tattooed on the forehead of every Funcom employee involved in this game.

Some of the player types include:

Killer - aka pvp twinks
Socializer - the ones that have all of the different social outfits
Improvement - what the missions were designed to cater
Explorers - why we have a massive world
etc.

Granted that these player types aren’t mutually exclusive but to excel at one gameplay wise you can’t simultaneously include aspects of others. What this means to me is that a person can do missions for cash so they can get their new implants then go out and have an adventure, afterwards you go to the bar and tell people about the one that got away.

Now it seems there's an imbalance in the number of Improvement players and Explorers and people playing as Improvers when they really should be playing as Explorers. Perhaps some people think that Improvement is the only way that this game was meant to be played.

A true explorer doesn't hunt for xp, isn't worried about the best loot. An explorer wants to find weird places and mobs far away from civilization. They want to have stories of how they defeated Nokken in a team below lvl 70 or how they survived a bad pull of 5 quake lizards.

If people really want to explore outside they should seriously consider getting off the xp treadmill and enjoy the game for something other than improvement. I fear if Funcom addresses the concerns in this thread it will only act to further homogenize the game and ultimately reduce the versatility.

This thread tells me that people want their cake and to eat it too. Based on how Funcom has been working hard stop people from complaining, I suppose they're going to get it.

Just for the record I’ve tried to play quite a few of the different types but I refuse to sit in dungeons all the time just because I don’t have that ql 200 nano. When I meet a lvl 150 player who hasn’t seen a Primal Chirrop I feel sad that they’re not taking full advantage of the game but hey, it’s their choice as long as they’re happy.

[Cadwin]

bump

[Bionitrous]

The world in not THAT big. Believe me. Even if I just started playing today, I would easily have seen everything in the game by September.

What the Explorers want are the Treasure Maps out of UO adapted to the AO theme. God, I miss them level 5 treasure hunts.

What the Explorers want are the spawned Points of Interest that SW:G is going to have. Basically you are flying in the longest road and crest a ridge to see a mining shipment being attacked by Scorpiods. YOU decide how the vignette plays out.

What the Explorers want are random Mutations of indigenous Fauna to catalogue. A "Freakishly Smart Braindog of Shrinkage" might only be seen once in the entire history of the game. He could grab his screenshot of the midget monster with the glowing head and then call his Killer buddies who want nothing better than to kill it and keep the head as a trophy. The fact that it uses lvl160 nanos from both the Doctor and Trader lines makes the victory even better.

What the Explorers want is not 1, but 100 Marvin-like and Moog-like NPC's that actually do something more than offer an amusing dialogue.

The Explorers want a reason to hang out in 10-3 with the poor guy. As it stands, I have no reason to ever go back their.

The world ain't that big. The fact that once you've seen it once there's not reason ever to go back makes it even smaller.

[______________Rielle]

It's funny, I actually came back to AO after 8 months BECAUSE of missions, primarily.

In all the other MMORPG's out there it's the same old 'at this level, run to this spot and kill this creature' rinse and repeat nonsense. At least with missions I have a certain task I can choose to do in a place I choose to be for a reward I choose is worth the risk.

Now I'm only level 29, so obviously 171 levels from now I'll probably have a very different view of them especially if that's all I did to get that high.

So I agree they need to make the outdoors equally attractive to those that aren't keen on missions.

-R

[RVWinkle]

I couldn't agree with you more Bionitrous. I'm glad to see other people interested in improving the explorer content.

I think your post is a little off topic though, I took this thread as improvers wanting to have content in explorer areas not that there's a lack of explorer content. I may be wrong though, it wouldn't be the first time.

Originally posted by Bionitrous
The world in not THAT big. Believe me. Even if I just started playing today, I would easily have seen everything in the game by September.

What the Explorers want are the Treasure Maps out of UO adapted to the AO theme. God, I miss them level 5 treasure hunts.

What the Explorers want are the spawned Points of Interest that SW:G is going to have. Basically you are flying in the longest road and crest a ridge to see a mining shipment being attacked by Scorpiods. YOU decide how the vignette plays out.

What the Explorers want are random Mutations of indigenous Fauna to catalogue. A "Freakishly Smart Braindog of Shrinkage" might only be seen once in the entire history of the game. He could grab his screenshot of the midget monster with the glowing head and then call his Killer buddies who want nothing better than to kill it and keep the head as a trophy. The fact that it uses lvl160 nanos from both the Doctor and Trader lines makes the victory even better.

What the Explorers want is not 1, but 100 Marvin-like and Moog-like NPC's that actually do something more than offer an amusing dialogue.

The Explorers want a reason to hang out in 10-3 with the poor guy. As it stands, I have no reason to ever go back their.

The world ain't that big. The fact that once you've seen it once there's not reason ever to go back makes it even smaller.

[_____________Cranium]

Don't worry people, dyna-camps are coming to get you! They're being done by the man responsible for Lush Fields/Pleasant Meadows/Omni-Trade/WD-database expert & whatnot. Our very own Viljar "The Wizard" Sommerbakk! OK, PR mode off, we're VERY aware of this problem in the World Design department and want to do what we can to combat it. Though resources are short and the road long we're marching across Rubi-Ka looking for trouble. I'll try and get you guys a snapshot of our 10 foot "Terraformed Rubi-Ka" map that we just smacked on the wall, to help us plan things (the source code for the AO Special Edition futuristic paper map, so to speak). I'm thinking I'll set me a quest to get me a Yalmaha and map all the red-spots along RK's borders as well.

Some VERY cool ideas people, we'll make this world yours yet!

Currently working on a proposal for "Modular Hallways", a long-needed enema for the GODAG (Gaute's Online Dungeon Auto-Generator!). Don't know if it will fly, AO's eating coder-time like you wouldn't believe. AndreJ & KenC claim the current system only needs minor tweaks to become a lot more structured though, so the WD department is building it, alongside the "outdoor attention" (ooh!).

I'll bring this up personally next expansion meeting I'm seated at, got some new solutions in mind! ;P

brb

Hey Cosmik, how you finding Oslo?

[Feetus]

Originally posted by Cranium
I'll bring this up personally next expansion meeting I'm seated at, got some new solutions in mind!

Awww man - so we gotta wait for an expansion pack and pay some decent money to finally get a fun game to play?

I remember way back when - before FC nerfed the spawn rate - when there was hunting a plenty...Patch after patch this has apparently been for the most part destroyed in an effort to make missions the way of life (or so it seems). You guys have built some awesome out door areas - that totally blow for xp or loot. We really need much better spawn rates with mobs of similar level well spread out. Hunting grounds at higher levels should not all be in 25% or 0% zones because being ganked always blows and would still just lead high levels to just run missions in doors. If you make good hunting grounds at high levels all in 25% or 0% zones - this will only make awesome grief spots. Makes it easy to grief people when you know where they're going to be and they are there often (ex: OT ace camp - w00t clan Storm!).

Cluster mobs with aggro a plenty also sucks. You cannt have any kind of decent hunting with lots of aggro around. Perhaps monsters could drop normal stuff like armor/weapons/nanos that are a little above the level of the monster to make it so that hunting them is a reasonable way to level. This would make it so that you dont need so much money to keep buying better items so that you can continue to be a valuable teammate to hunt with because hunting is obviously not going to be a good way to make money. Dont make monsters drop rare loot - make that mission only. This will stop peopel from camping good hunting grounds with higher level alts for their n00b alt. Just let low level teams hunt for xp and the items they will need to continue leveling decently.

Hunting used to be so much fun - and now it just blows. With lots of money from my higher level characters I can have fun hunting from level 1 to about 70. The problem is - if I didnt have money - I would have to go do missions still for the money so I could be able to hunt worth a crap.

Get the idea? Normal loot of higher levels for hunting - rare loot off of missions - as mission rewards not boss only items...we need to be able to get the stuff - but will be enough of a challenge anyways to drag people into a mission for you when they're out there getting good xp and having fun hunting.

[_________Deaddreamer]

<Blatant troll, I retract my statement and apologize>

[_____________Kodiene]

FC really needs to jump on this.

Have ya'll seen all the kick ass looking MOBs out in RK??? These bastards won't fit in missions and look hella cool.

If you spent the time to model and animate these "hunting" mobs, DEAR GOD make it worth while for us to kill em.

/me hates missions
/me hates rooms
/me hates grey walls

[_____________Hextorr]

Originally posted by Noreth
I take it your one of those puinish anyone that doesnt want to play like me types. Some days, I truely wish your type would stick stand-alones. Your idea is heavily flawed by its very ill thought out approach. You see, With mission one can finaly avoid the biggest thing to ever hurt a MOG; "griefers." Your approach would force those of us that are just slap happy to finaly be clear of them right back at them. I can see just fine putting the same possible items on overland spawn. I cannot see putting it on it only.

Let me paint you folks a scene: Picture the rare spawn zone, you're so happy as you can finaly fight these mobs. You load up for bear as it where and head for it. Something is odd when you arrive though, there's some person 70 levels above you there and, they are slaughting everything at record speed. You say ok but, I should be able to get at least one or two. After some time and utter failure to compette you get set to leave, at this point that "fine soul" offers to sell you for a outrageous cost what you should have been able to get for free.

Not only will this happen if you turn anything worth having into overland only but, the well "I'm just hunting for my alt" crowd will swarm as well. I see nothing in basic wrong with making overland hunting worth while. I see a huge problem with your approach to it. I'd think simply "cloning" the same items at random (Yes at random, if not I would bet my god forsaken soul on my scene being daily fact.) overland drops. There should be options beyond missions well and good. But let's not punish those that don't want to hunt overland.

You say you feel overlands been punished. Well just remember that as a adult you learn that attacking the area you feel hasn't, doesn't make any sense iether.

Sorry to point it out to you but you are the one wanting to make everyone play like you want, you clearly didnt grasp/read the meaning and the words. So without making it sound like a flame it realy is not, let me try and make it clear to you what i want to accomplish here.

I do not want to change the way missions work, if you want to do them fine, the game is here to satisfy everyone. But I dont want to be forced into missions, so i want ways to get loot and experince outside the missions, see none is trying to punish you if you dont want to play like us...

Secondly noone talked about a unique mob with unique loot, we are talking about giving the world and its Mob families a history, a meaning and some specific loot. This does not mean that they drop always the same thing, it only means that some mobs have a tendency to drop a certain spectrum of loot while other a tendency to drop more of another kind of looot. Like someone added Ex: Cyborgs drop more weapons and armor while the Medusas could drop more gems and Nano crystals. But this is still random loot, just with a bit more meaning.

We also want to make the Experience on the Mobs outside greater, hunting outside is much more risky so it should be more rewarding also.

Another idea is to make dungeons a living part of exping and loot gathering, right now the mobs on dungeons have too much HP and too litle Exp, if you make dungeons with specific loot big enough they will not get over camped.

This is an idea in the works with everyone trying to contribute, no one said it is perfect right off the bat, but we are trying to have here constructive ideas so we dont have to be puinished if we dont want to play like you

[_____________Hextorr]

Originally posted by Cosmik
Got some good news on this. Just finding out more details and wanted to post here now to just say I've read it. Be back soon with more information.

Woot!

[_____________Hextorr]

Originally posted by Zenforth
Funny Hextorr how you would like to hunt outside. It seems to me you like to hunt more than mobs outside. I would agree with you, because I too would like to hunt outside. But unfortunately most of the good outdoor hunting spots are 25% gas zones. And of course the only time I did, your lame ass had to come and ruin it. Hunting outside? No thanks, I'll just stick to missions inside where I don't have to deal with the likes of people like you.

Milan "Zenforth" Laurence
100 Doc
Omni-Pol RK 1

I hope you quit sooner than later.

Zenforth, what you are refering to, is your team hunting in the ACE camp, a 25% zone, i showed up and sprayed a few bullets at everyone, kinda to ****e up your day, i switched targets before i killed anyone, i didnt get a single reward message so i know i succeeded in not killing anyone, everyone got to the house that was just a few steps away, with only some minor bruises and a good rush, you unfortunatly got mowned down by the mob you guys were fighting mainly because you didnt run for the door emediatly...

Now if they made good outside hunting both in 75% 25% and 0% zones you could choose to hunt in the 75% zones if you dont want to have these "encounters", and if you went to hunt in 25% and 0% zones, the reward for killing the mobs would be incresingly greater for so would the risk.

It is sad that there isnt any good outside hunting grounds, that is the problem. 25% and 0% zones are not a problem of themselves if everything is implemented correctly.

[_____________Hextorr]

Originally posted by Cranium
Don't worry people, dyna-camps are coming to get you! They're being done by the man responsible for Lush Fields/Pleasant Meadows/Omni-Trade/WD-database expert & whatnot. Our very own Viljar "The Wizard" Sommerbakk! OK, PR mode off, we're VERY aware of this problem in the World Design department and want to do what we can to combat it. Though resources are short and the road long we're marching across Rubi-Ka looking for trouble. I'll try and get you guys a snapshot of our 10 foot "Terraformed Rubi-Ka" map that we just smacked on the wall, to help us plan things (the source code for the AO Special Edition futuristic paper map, so to speak). I'm thinking I'll set me a quest to get me a Yalmaha and map all the red-spots along RK's borders as well.

Some VERY cool ideas people, we'll make this world yours yet!

Currently working on a proposal for "Modular Hallways", a long-needed enema for the GODAG (Gaute's Online Dungeon Auto-Generator!). Don't know if it will fly, AO's eating coder-time like you wouldn't believe. AndreJ & KenC claim the current system only needs minor tweaks to become a lot more structured though, so the WD department is building it, alongside the "outdoor attention" (ooh!).

I'll bring this up personally next expansion meeting I'm seated at, got some new solutions in mind! ;P

brb

Hey Cosmik, how you finding Oslo?

That's good news

Now.. dyna-camps... can this be camps that disapeer and spwan somewhere else in the zone once they are wiped out? this sounds very interesting, both from variety and anti camping point of view

[_____________Calenth]

Originally posted by Cranium
Don't worry people, dyna-camps are coming to get you! They're being done by the man responsible for Lush Fields/Pleasant Meadows/Omni-Trade/WD-database expert & whatnot. Our very own Viljar "The Wizard" Sommerbakk! OK, PR mode off, we're VERY aware of this problem in the World Design department and want to do what we can to combat it. Though resources are short and the road long we're marching across Rubi-Ka looking for trouble. I'll try and get you guys a snapshot of our 10 foot "Terraformed Rubi-Ka" map that we just smacked on the wall, to help us plan things (the source code for the AO Special Edition futuristic paper map, so to speak). I'm thinking I'll set me a quest to get me a Yalmaha and map all the red-spots along RK's borders as well.

Some VERY cool ideas people, we'll make this world yours yet!

Currently working on a proposal for "Modular Hallways", a long-needed enema for the GODAG (Gaute's Online Dungeon Auto-Generator!). Don't know if it will fly, AO's eating coder-time like you wouldn't believe. AndreJ & KenC claim the current system only needs minor tweaks to become a lot more structured though, so the WD department is building it, alongside the "outdoor attention" (ooh!).

I'll bring this up personally next expansion meeting I'm seated at, got some new solutions in mind! ;P

brb

Hey Cosmik, how you finding Oslo?

I have no idea what any of that meant, but it sounded really cool.

[_Tekkor_]

lol, i thought I was the only one. I followed about 50% of what he said but he lost me on a few things.

I to agree with all of you on the increasing outisde hunting desires. In fact this has happen before in mmorpgs. Any of you remember when EQ did hte same thing but the other way around?

They had a problem where nobody was doing the static dungeons. Or at least some of them. So what they did is the increased the exp gained in those zones/dungeons. Very easy soloution.

They should make PvP zones gain +25% for exp and then all other outside zones say 15%. Then add a bit more loot to the outside mobs as well.

I also agree they need to refine a few areas better for high level players. Tell your world designers or whoever to make more areas modeled after the NW Mutie camp area in Lush Fields. Good concentration of same leveled monsters, landmark to group at (cave), close by scanners and shop (lush outpost) and things like occasional LB to ****e things up.

NW mutie camp is one of the best outside grouping places in the game. Make a note of that Funcom. This is a change you guys should be abl to make fast..dont drag feet on this one...people want it.

[_____________Rolller]

Back in the day when I was a wee little soldier I used to do missions strickly for loot. Experiance was best gained with a team hunting outdoors (lush). Nowadays both are only had in missions. Not that I haven't tried. I and some friends have tried to break the mold. We have so far have failed to find anything outdoors worth the time.

All the adjustments made to mission mobs where most deffinitaly not applied to outdoor mobs. Anything in a decent range for a group to hunt outdoors(post 70 really) will either give too few exp points or have too many HP's or hit insanely hard. Often you get all three (which is fun until you figure out that you and your party are dead and will have to spend another 15 mins to get back out to the spot you where just at ).

Anyways ... back to my point. You don't need to have outdoor mobs drop fancy pants loot. Just make them a viable alternative for gaining exp and you will see an explosion of outdoor hunters. I for one would like this to happen sooner rather than later. For me an expansion pack will not cut it. If all additions to the base game are done and everything else will end up in the expansion pack a lot of bored people will get only more bored.


You have proven you can do it with Lush Fields. That is one of the best zones in the game (kudos to thoose who created that zone). It's so good that clanners would come down and hunt there (before the guards started shooting). You need to do that kind of work again a couple more times.

All the work put into this game and all a good majority of the player base see's is the missions. We aren't all there cause we love them. A majority of us are there cause there is NOTHING else in the game.

What I guess I am saying is that I think this should be given a high priority at FC. As a paying customer I place my voting dollars on out door hunting.