Why Peace?

[_______________Snarf]

Ok, I don't get it.

I've always wondered WHY people in clans and OT care about peace. So there's fighting. People die. But they instantly resurrect. So what's the big deal?

Who cares if people kill one another if the biggest problem is that they've got to find some change to get a bus home from the reclaim terminal?

Snarf

[_______________Snarf]

Oh, and if anyone has one of these "perma-death guns" that are spoken of as if they can be summoned up by a gimped fixer, be sure to give me a /tell. I'd like to try it out on Cptfallout.

Snarf

[___________Chagidiel]

Well, I hardly think I really should have to remind you of all those civilians not in such an economical position that they can buy those quite expensive insurances...

[_______________Snarf]

I think you're forgetting that such poor citizens get free insta-scans until level 5!

Snarf

[___________Chagidiel]

No, no, I am not talking about those that are active field agents as you and me, but those civilians we can see wandering about in the cities...

those that are afraid to leave thiere homes due to the unstable situation on Rubi-Ka.

[_______________Snarf]

But all citizens of rubi-ka get mystical free scans.

If they're not, then they're exploiting!

[____________Founding]

Sometimes its easy to see why Snarf chose an Atrox........

You really got to worry about some people.

[___________Shadowolf]

I must agree with Falcon on this. We can't just be killing people because it's fun! What do you think this is, some type of war game? People get shot, understand? May be they do get their lives back, but what about their happiness. First of all, in case you didn't know, it hurts to die. Yes you get restored, but that hurts too. Being taken apart by molecules is not a very pleasent process. Also some people want to be able to walk around in the woods enjoying sight seeings of Rubi-Ka without being afraid of having some youngster shoot at them and send them back to their home-town however many miles away as he it running to meet up with his friends so that they can run around and have some fun killing more innocents. And even for soldiers, would they rather get bullets and plasma stored in their flash or snjoy a walk in a park with their famalies? No human has a right to enforce anything upon other human and that includes death, permenant or not! People want to live safely and happy without havng to fear explosions in their backyards. If you like war, go somewhere to the Omega system, they're always blowing themselves up thier and everyone's happy about it. People fight for a goal, when that goal is simply to fight for the sake of fighting, they are no longer humans.

[______________Scorus]

Originally posted by Snarf
I've always wondered WHY people in clans and OT care about peace. So there's fighting. People die. But they instantly resurrect. So what's the big deal?

Who cares if people kill one another if the biggest problem is that they've got to find some change to get a bus home from the reclaim terminal?

Spoken by one who has never been in a war. What we are in now is not a war. In a war you don't go home to your warm apartment at night. Wars are spent in mud up to your knees or marshes up to your chest, with rats and snakes and leeches nipping at you constantly. More people die of disease and dysentery in a war than ever fall to hostile ammunition. These are slow, painful, debilitating deaths that damage the mind as much as the body. And the mind doesn't return to its scanned state, you keep the memories of all the horrors you experience in war.

Do you think that a child who has felt what it is like to be blown to smithereens a few dozen times doesn't take that trauma with him or her? Or a mother or father that has seen their child suffer from hunger and cold after their house was blown up and they were forced onto the road as refugees? I have seen many jackbooted military theorists or rear-echelon officers yearn for some kind of never-ending eternal war. I have never seen anyone that has been in a war do the same.

Cervantes
Clan Diplomat

[Brad, STL/MO]

All of which brings up the question ...

Like most of my clan characters, Pluggenplay hates the company, has no intention of ever working for the company, begrudges the profit on drinks she buys at Baboons, and will cut and run the second the Council makes the first gesture towards recognizing Omni-Tek's monopoly on notum.

On the other hand, she also has no intention of declaring war on her own, not with an official cease-fire on. Yes, there are no shortage of Omni-Tek saboteurs in the cellars under Tir; she's got an apartment full of Weird Looking Bombs to show for it. But if the cease-fire breaks down, it won't be at HER hand, not unless the company provokes it by doing something really, really outrageous. (Say, disabling the Clans' Insurance Terminal system. Or crippling the Suppression Gas dispensers and reclaim camping in downtown Tir. Or actually using the Permanent Killing Weapons we keep hearing about. Or maybe if one of these Weird Looking a-Bombs actually goes off.)

So what should she have done when, accidentally whompa-ing into Athen on her way from Newland to Tir (wrong turn), she finds herself in the middle of an organizational meeting for yet another clan attack on 2H0? Planned for 20 minutes later?

She thought about griding to Omni Trade and making an announcement -- but that'd mean selling out her own side. So ultimately, she decided to keep her mouth shut, go home to Tir and take a nap, and read about it in the papers tomorrow.

Right decision? Was there a better one she could have made?

(And don't tell me she should have told them not to. Nobody listens to a 17th level girl. That's why she wants a bigger bot in the worst way. People will listen to IT.)

[______________Scorus]

Brad,

What you need to do in situations like that is inform the Council of Truth of their plans.

OOC: This is the biggest hole in the storyline: such action is not possible. I could run to every guard and tell them to alert someone on the council and nothing would happen. I could yell at the top of my lungs at the entrance to Council hq in Tir and nothing would happen. We have no way to interact with the NPCs that we have to be able to interact with unless Funcom decides it is time for a planned event. And even then they ignore our tells.

IMPLEMENT THE STORY IN A WAY THAT PLAYERS CAN PARTICIPATE!

Scorus

[_____________Taldrin]

This may come as a big shock to you snarf but all roleplaying games aren't just kill, kill, kill.. If you wanna go shooting people all day go play a fps.

[_______________Snarf]

> This may come as a big shock to you snarf but all roleplaying games aren't just kill, kill, kill..

Of course not. But if you're going to be a hardcore RPer in Rubi-Ka, there are a few facts that you've got to keep in mind:
- Everyone is immortal (sort of a MINOR alteration to your roleplay thinking required here, hmm?)
- All NPCs are completely dumb. They are as good as not there. I don't even consider guards to be a part of the game. Why would I? I go up to one, swear at it and it chats about amnesty. Then I kill a guard. Five seconds later his pal comes and offers me amnesty. Uh.
- People CAN NOT for the mostpart change the storyline in any major way through actions (assasination a notable exception, although that's not new. i made an assasination attempt on the ot cyborg engineer). There's no territory to take, the stupid gas disallows most combat, etc.
- We've got dinky little 5 person level 20 factions having the same influence as 200 person level 100+ factions. The people who effect the storyline are those who make the most press releases, NOT who act in game (sad. but true).

Anyway.

Snarf

[Laeni]

Some people don't believe in scanning. My mother was one. That's why when she died she stayed dead. And not everyone can afford scanning. People don't remain under level 5 forever. They grow up. So if they can't afford scanning ok maybe they can get one basic scan and then return to that level of life every time they're killed. Which can get pretty damn depressing.

Most people just want to live their lives and wish that the politicians and leaders and extremists would just go to some arena somewhere and take out their differences on each other and leave the rest of us alone.


OOC: Snarf you just gotta work around the discrepancies. Because in every RPG you are "immortal".

[_______________Snarf]

> Because in every RPG you are "immortal".

My AD&D GM of 10 years ago sure had no problem killing my characters off!


Snarf

[______________Scorus]

Snarf is correct that at this time there is no way for players to affect the storyline outside of carefully planned and monitored GM events. And even the effects of those seem to be ignored in planning. For instance, we have gotten no official Omni reaction to the assassination attempt.

He is also correct that the NPCs might as well not be there at the moment. I remember a couple of months ago when my friends and I made the discovery of the Omni bases in Avalon. We spent a few hours finding and mapping them. Afterward one of them asked why they weren't more excited about it and the answer was obvious: because they were just part of the terrain. The bases and the 'people' in them were as static as that hill over there and, judging from the way that Funcom dodges our questions concerning NPC interaction, they probably will be for a very long while.

Funcom has gotta breathe some life in this game soon. They need to either make the Omni and clan powers that be responsive to and responsible to their constituents or abandon the concept altogether and make it a free for all.

Scorus

[___________Chagidiel]

Snarf

OOC

Ok, since my point obviously didnt get through, Ill make a clear one (I gotta learn to remember that irony doenst work well over seas =) )

Its a RG, and you have to use your imagination, as in ALL RG, even the old dungeons & dragons (which I hardly consider a real RG, since its mostly "Hack n slash", but thats besied the point)

Because you were imortal there as well. Yes, your characters could die, but really, its not like that mattered so much. You still threw yourself at that damn dragon everytime you got the chans...Need I remind you that you proberbly would not have done that in real life...at least not for something as trivial as the treasure he is suposed to have...

So the difference between AO and dungeons arent that big, even if you char. died in Dungeons, you were back on track an hour later, with a new one...And thats the same here, though youll be back with the same char, and that doesnt really matter.

[______________Scorus]

Originally posted by Chagidiel
So the difference between AO and dungeons arent that big, even if you char. died in Dungeons, you were back on track an hour later, with a new one...And thats the same here, though youll be back with the same char, and that doesnt really matter.

Before when my character did something, the NPCs reacted to it. Here the only thing that a character can do is attack. We have been given no other tools to affect the story. OOC, what Snarf is saying makes sense. IC, not so much.

At this point we are playing quake, when Funcom decides to make it a role-playing game then perhaps we can role-play.

Scorus

[________________cson]

Am I the only one that's killed Elmer Rudd 20 times? That poor ole guy lives in a tent, and yet he can affort to scan because he just keeps coming back to life.

Anarchy Online is a war-oriented MMORPG. If you want to pick berries, Funcom's coming out with Midguard which will allow you to do that. AO is based on conflict and should be played that way.

[______________Scorus]

Originally posted by cson
Anarchy Online is a war-oriented MMORPG. If you want to pick berries, Funcom's coming out with Midguard which will allow you to do that. AO is based on conflict and should be played that way.

Then why is Funcom pushing peace? Even when people scream for war, the NPCs they control say 'peace'.

Scorus