Solution to camping and lack of boss mob

[_____________Trigger]

The long and forever plauge of MMRPG is camping. I am not going to say here that camping is wrong because in most cases it is motivated by the fact that it it the only way you can get said item.

Here is the scenerio. You get a group of friends togather that are board and are trying to think of something exciting to do. Hey lets go and try dungon such and such! Great idea. So you get all geared up and go to the dungon. You get to the first room and all the mobs are there no sign of anyone else yoohoo. You fight kicking and screming losing a couple team mates here and there to the uber mobs. You get down to where the boss is and oops there is 15 others sitting there doing nothing but perhaps watching late night on TV while waiting for the boss to respawn. Well I cant tell you how bad this sucks. A waste of time, and certainly not my idea of a good time.

I want to be clear here, this is not the fault of the people sitting there waiting. Not by a long shot. This IS a game design flaw! It seriously decreses the fun level of the game and makes the dungons useless to a majority of the playerbase. FC spends a ton of time on these dungons and they are really nice only to be ruined in the end by lack of a boss monster. And this does not happen just once, but every single time. Thats right FC I chalenge you to find a boss mob in any one of your dungons at any time of the day. YOU CANNOT DO IT. If a boss shows up he is dead within minutes of appearing PERIOD. Well I and many others would rather not have to sit for hours for the CHANCE that we might be in the group that kills the boss. Same goes with the static missions, along the same topic. Whens the last time you walked into the Rising Sun FC and saw Dodga standing there, NEVER. Within 30sec he is gone any time day or night.

But im not going to pitch a ***** without giving a solution. There is a way around this mess and you FC could be the 1st game in the history of mankind to solve the camping problem with this simple and effective solution.

PUT A KEY DESPENSER AT THE START OF THE STATIC DUNGON!!!

Thats right at the begining of the dungon have a key despenser. Now each single key would represent a complete dungon full as it was intended. So I go to the key despenser grab a key, get my group or entire guild or whoever a copy and wham we got a gaurenteed quest to go on that will have a reward at the end! There you have it now everyone can enjoy the mission and get something out of it. You want to do it 16 times? So do it who cares, most of the items you get are no drop anyway and if you want 15 copies go to town. And what is the damage of having lots of people being able to enjoy the rare items as long as they had to work to get them?


Now your going to say well thats all fine but what about the 25% mission in camalot? I got a solution for that too. Make the spawn rate on the boss mob reasonable say 30min to and hour real time. Then turn the area of the boss into 0%. Thats right 0%. The static dungon with 25% is aimed at players over lev 100 anyway so there is no problem with PVP level restricitions. You want to kill that boss and get the goodie? Then you better get a group togather and have a tatical plan. Now if you want the boss you got to defend the spawn area to get a shot at him. Sounds good to me and even though I'm not big on PVP at the moment, I can live with one of the dungons being this way. This would give the PVP people something to do, at least until they all have had a shot at the boss anyway.

Another HUGE bummer is the current static quest. I got a solution to that too. So you don't want people to exploit it and it should be difficult right? Why not have a timer that is relivent to the individual instead of the actual NPC. Instead of having dodga disappear just make it impossible for me to turn in my card until a set timer is expired. I turn in my brain and dodga says oooh I got to look at this for a while, gives me a card. I try to give him the card and he says no I am not done with the analisys yet. If your afraid people will exploit then increase the time. I dont care make it a week real time. At least I will know when I can complete the quest and will not have to wait and hope not only that I catch him but actually get a turn when there is 10 people allready there waiting.

Make these changes and you will see an entire gaming community praise you to high heaven. You will more than likly even get a bunch of the old players back and some new ones with this revolutionary change. This type of solution would be notworthy in a press release to a major game mag as something that no other MMRPG has been able to acomplish. Think about it real hard FC, what are you trying to provide me with? How about a rewarding game experience that everyone can enjoy and at the end of a good harty effort a reward that makes it all worthwhile. A fun, enjoyable and rewarding game experience is what we all want and are paying for. Help us out FC. At least consider this and possibly make a comment here about this idea?? I know its asking a lot but could someone from FC at least take a look at this and tell the playerbase why it can't happen or what the problem is?? I really hope this gets read at least, bump it if you like it.

My 2 cents

[Bionitrous]

anything is better than the garbage the game designers have dumped on us with Neleb, The Lab Director, and Dodga. I can almost smell the stench of this game design from here halfway around the planet.

If they are too lazy to spawn a seperate dungeon for each team that enters (I remember when Steps used to multi-spawn) why not simply the last room(s) where Neleb, T.I.M., the Lab Director, etc. are located. Simply the last room(s) that's really all anyone is complaining about for the most part. They have the code. They used to use it.

It's sickening to fight through a dungeon to get to the end and see 20 people sitting around talking about what they are watching on T.V. Then when the boss 'pops' they fight each other to get the prize. I've been in groups where they suggest one of our members go and train some mobs over to where the other group is and then /terminate.

I don't consider Camelot a 'dungeon' so to speak because from what I hear it's really more like an outdoor playfield only underground. With the PvP rules it's simply an extension of Mort or EFP.

The Foreman's Office or Steps of Madness however should be able to be enjoyed by groups looking for a good dungeon crawl. That opportunity has been taken away from them by the game designers.

As for Dodga or Alvin, there is no sane reason why these NPC's _ever_ disappear. I have _never_ been to a mission at The Rising Sun and not checked out the little hut and not seem some idiot sitting there waiting for Dodga. FOUR HOURS of paid game time to NOT PLAY. Sit on your ass like a jerk because FunCom has determined this is good game design. NOT!

[_____________Trigger]

Bion, i agree with you. I still think it would be better though if the entire dungon respawned for a new team/group, that way would would HAVE to fight your way to a boss. Also you would be able to really enjoy the dungon. just think of it, you can kill every mob and not have to try to RUSH to the boss to get there before someone shows up (which by the way is moot because every time it looks like no one is there there allways is anyway). It would be great you could take your time and really enjoy the dungon, the nice rooms and stuff that are in there. Man what a wonderful dream that would be. I just hope that FC reads this and we can get a response and hopfully a change to the way it currently is.

People as you read this if you agree that something needs to be done, or if you have an idea of your own, or if you think of a way that might be better than mine POST IT. I personally am going to try to bump this to the top almost daily till is see some response. I could use your help if you agree. Please supprt this if you think it would increase your enjoyment of the game.

[assassimon]

So if a whole guild want an item they should just be able to run in and kill the boss mob over and over and get a new dungeon with a new boss mob all the time?

[Downsizr]

Originally posted by Azzazzimon
So if a whole guild want an item they should just be able to run in and kill the boss mob over and over and get a new dungeon with a new boss mob all the time?

That's exactly what's happening right now. But as it is now, this farming will prevent other players to get a shot at the desired item.

Welcome to AOquest !

[____________Greystar]

Originally posted by Azzazzimon
So if a whole guild want an item they should just be able to run in and kill the boss mob over and over and get a new dungeon with a new boss mob all the time?

That's what is happening already, only that powerful guilds have to camp things like Tarasque or Prof van Horn for months instead of a week, so no one else has a shot at it.

[______________Leumas]

How you manage to control the rarity of uber items?

[Bionitrous]

You manage the rarity of items by the difficulty to get them. NOT by making the game UNFun to play. NOBODY has an ounce of respect for anybody who has 'The Black Shirt of Kudzawa' for example. These people are either thought of as campers, twinks, or kill-stealers. It should not be this way. Having a rare item should mean you spent some effort to obtain the item. You should be proud to display the item. Not ashamed of the anti-social behavior that is now needed to get these things.

As an example, if there were some new item that went in an NCU slot that increased the duration of NanoFormulas by 50% they could simply put it on a MOB with a 24hr respawn time. This is frigging garbage design that a half-assed child would think of.

Instead, they could be intelligent and allow access to the item to anyone who is willing to spend some time PLAYING the game.

1. Talk to NPC Computer Merchant. He mentions an 'associate' who has told him of rumors of a shipment of prototype computer hardware. He asks if you would go talk to him in person. You get a mission token. He does NOT despawn after talking to you.

2. The person he is referring to can be any one of 15 different NPC's in various location. Tons of people will not be camping the same exact 2nd NPC. Your first task is to go search out his buddy in one of 5 or 6 locations. This spreads out the player base a bit and helps foster the (re)discovery of areas like Freedom, Bliss, Hope, etc. Depending on the quest level, the trip to get there can be difficult and you may need an escort to get there. Maybe it's a Nanofreek in Avalon or The Longest Road.

3. You manage to locate the person and talk to him about 'unauthorized' 'shipment' 'computer' 'hardware'. He asks who sent you and you give the name.

4. He acknowledges that he's got some unmaked receptacles called 'Prototype NCU Components' but he can't manage to break them open. He offers to sell you one on an 'as-is' basis. You agree and pay a hefty fee. This NPC doesn NOT despawn after giving you the item. This means you have to have spent some time earning money (or just as reasonably have some friends to help you). You now have a sealed receptacle and don't know what is inside.

5. The receptacle requires an amount of Breaking and Entering between 250-550 depending on what's inside. You need to have or find a player with the appropriate skills to break it open. This fosters interaction between players.

6. Once opened you are revealed maybe one of 2 or 3 different items of various quality levels. You happen to get a 'Precharged Bio-enhanced NCU-Bloodstream Interface' of qlvl 108. This is the item we'll focus on for this discussion. There might be two or so other items that may appear. The info for the item says:

"When combined with 'enriched' blood plasma of the appropriate level this item can greatly improve the interface between a players NCU and his biological systems. The duration of nanoformulas run in the NCU will be increased. Unfortunately as it is still in prototype stage, removing the item will destroy it.'"

This triggers the next step.

7. You now need to find someone who can make you the appropriate quality blood plasma. This means killing monsters of the appropriate level and interacting with other players. You will notice that when you kill some monsters now (that you are at this step in the quest) you will get 'enriched' monster parts as loot. These can be refined to 'enriched blood plasma' with appropriate Pharma Tech.

8. You combine the appropriate number of 'enriched blood plasma' units with the item and it becomes a NODROP 'Readied Bio-enhanced NCU-Bloodstream Interface' of qlvl 108. This item goes in Deck Slot 5 or 6.

9. As noted before, if you remove the item from your NCU it is destroyed and you will have to do the quest again.

Tell me this is EASY? Tell me it would not be FUN? If you want to add steps 10-50 then fine. If it takes 18 in-game hours to complete, isn't this preferable to sitting on your ass at some 'camp-spot' from the time you wake up in the morning until the wee hours of the next day?

If every player in the entire game wants to complete this quest and get the item, then fine. It'll be a bunch more happy players than we have now.

What we have now are players who are all smug because they sat on their retarded asses for 18 hours waiting for Kudzawa and now have a shirt that adds 22 to their pet skills. Or they joined a guild full of lvl 130+ players who camped Kudzawa with them at lvl 60 to 'get' the shirt for them to the exclusion of the two buddies from Spokane who now have to wait ANOTHER 18 hours only to be excluded by this same guild who are 'getting' another shirt for the next lvl67 metaphysicist who just joined the guild.

Rather than the current abhorent exclusionary systems we have now, unique items should foster PLAYING the game and interacting with other players. The playing field is open to EVERYONE who is willing to spend the playtime working towards the conclusion of this quest. It allows a fair amount of twinking to keep guilds happy but doesn't flood the game with the special item.

[Darkbane]

Another solution would be to have these NPCs spawn much more frequently, but in a random location (each NPC would have a list of locations and would respawn at one of them chosen at random). On completion of the first step of the mission, the player could go to a pre-set interior location to which the mission acted as a key, and there complete the quest. Some sort of flag should be set against the player to indicate they have done that quest and a cannot be given it again.

There are things that can be done about this, FC just need to be creative and ignore what EQ and the like have done before.

[_____________Trigger]

First up is my response to the rare items question. Who is to say that the boss at the end of a dungon HAS to drop the same rare item every time he is killed? In addition to that who is to say that the boss at the end of a dungon HAS to drop a rare item every single time?

I want to also comment on the guilds getting items for the lower level members in dungons they are too high for. Well with my system and the above idea added, if they want to run through a dungon 5 or 6 times with no challenge to get an item for there guild member more power to them. Like I mentioned a majority of these items are no drop anyway so you better bring your friend along. And with the above changes be ready to do it more than once to get the exact item you are looking for. This would greatly benifit the people that are doing the right dungons for there level as more than likley there will be a group at least if not more than one, so if the mob boss drops a prof or breed specific item there is a good chance that someone that came with you will have use for it. This will also discurage the guild power players because this significantly decreses the possibility that the run that they go on will drop the specific item that they are trying to get for there member, and it being no drop means that they cannot go without him to get it. I am not going to suggest a level cap on the dungons as I feel that if you want to waste your time doing dungons too easy for you then you should have that right. You should be able to enjoy the game as I should be able to. If that is your idea of fun to run an easy dungon while helping someone lower than you out, then great you should have that right. As it stands now there are very few that have the right to enjoy the dungons in this game due to the camping. And as I stated in my original post CAMPING IS NOT THE PROBLEM IT IS A RESULT OF POOR GAME DESIGN!

Bion, great constructive post about a possible alternitive to the dodga quest. Well written and a perfect example of how a quest can be done without making everone go insane in the process!! Bion's idea is just one example of the 1000 ways to properly impliment a static quest without causing the playerbase grief.

Lets face the facts here. There are and allways will be uber, twinked, power leveling, got 24hours a day to play, have every item in the game players. ALWAYS. To make 90% of the playerbase that is trying to enjoy the game suffer to stop these people from being ultra-uber item grabbers is just insane. I want to play the game like everyone else. I should never be guarnteed a rare item in anything that I do, however I should have an equal and fair oppertunity to get one as anyone else. My plan deals with this. I might have to do a dungon 10 times to get that one item I really want, but dam it at least I have an oppertunity to get it, and I can have a great time with my friends grouping to try to get it.

I am sorry but this is a far cry from rocket science. This issue is the #1 problem with all MMRPG games currently on the market. The first visionary game company to deal with it instead of taking the easy way and saying "well thats the way we all do it, it sucks but its the only way" is going to be rewarded with an incresed and happy customer base.

I saw in the patch notes for 14.0 that there will be a boss at the end of a team mission that has the possibility of dropping a rare item. YES YES there you go you see how easy that is? Hello!! Take a second to fix the rest of the areas with camping problem.

Thanks for all the feedback, keep it coming and lets make this the #1 posting on this board. And pray that FC sees it and does something about it.

[skybert]

Originally posted by Darkbane
Another solution would be to have these NPCs spawn much more frequently, but in a random location (each NPC would have a list of locations and would respawn at one of them chosen at random). On completion of the first step of the mission, the player could go to a pre-set interior location to which the mission acted as a key, and there complete the quest. Some sort of flag should be set against the player to indicate they have done that quest and a cannot be given it again.

There are things that can be done about this, FC just need to be creative and ignore what EQ and the like have done before.

actually, i think this would be a good idea. But if someone knew that boss mob xx would spawn one out of five spots, they'd put lookouts on each spot. But mobs spawning faster than the boss mob, and thus requiring the camping group to be somewhat gathered to avoid losses.

Well, it might be a better way t do things....

[______________Sarmis]

See subject =)

[_____________Trigger]

Just FYI i sent this idea in to FC via the support team. I was told by them today that this idea has been forwarded to the development team for review/consideration. I also posted a link to this thread in with the general idea. Please if you have a comment or opinion on this idea post it here. I have a high hope that someone relavent will see it and pershaps consider a way to fix this problem.

[_______Revolutionary]

I have discussed this extensively with many friends, and we all feel that the Dungeon Key Dispensor is a great idea. If anyone from FC ever reads this, they need to listen and impliment this with the next patch!!!

[kish]

I'm so glad i didn't have to write the exact same words myself!
Nice message Trigger, and for you people at funcom; Seriously, do something about it. All players will apreachiate it.

-svulst

[_____________Flyhard]

*bump*

Dungeon key dispensers NOW !!! PLEASE FC !!!

[_________Daemondread]

Great ideas here. Don't make us suffer the design of EQ all over again. I would love doing the quests the way it was mentioned above but there is no way in hell I am going to camp a npc that only spawns once every two hours when every single player in the game wants the items. Please take these ideas into consideration Funcom.

[_______________Qinky]

Bionitrous, great post, i love the way you explained your ideas about the game. Gaming = Fun.

Make it fun and interesting.

[_____________Trigger]

bump

[_____________Trigger]

No one likes this idea? Thanks to those of you that posted, hope more of you will join in.