Discuss: 13.8 Token changes

[______Biffstatsnugly]

Sorry i really like the idea. I have 154 tokens on my engie...which i think he has the most of my other characters by atelast 50 or so tokens. I dont care to go back an reroll another engie just to get tokens either but with standard methods it would take me forever at my lvl to gain the remaining 846 tokens. That would be roughly a hour a mission, add in all the missions that would be to short, or for some odd reason i would not get a token, and i would be up to atleast 1000 play hours. Maybe 3 hours a day average now days im ingame. So that would be like 333 days of just mission running....hmmm.... na no thanks.

[______________Obitus]

Originally posted by Vrach
That said, the idea is sound... but it still REALLY pisses me off that I've worked my ass off for my pitiful 170 tokens, and the last month of work seems somewhat pointless now that I can do the same thing in a week... FC *really* needs to compensate those of us who honestly put in the time and effort, only to be shafted in the end by a sudden rules change that DOES devalue what we have done (in the same manner that saying that every dollar you make as you age is worth more and more... you punish the people who are already older and have a smalelr savings, whereas their younger compatriots will be comparatively RICH by that age)... I know that my grandpa would come kick your asses.

As people get older, they do more complicated jobs that carry more responsibility. Hence, they get paid more.

Compensate you? Oh please.. You only have 170 tokens. perhaps the other 930 won't be quite such a chore. I think that is compensation enough.

The fact of the matter is that if you don't have a 1k board, this will benifit you! It will benefit everyone in the game. This is a board that is usable at lvl 100 after all, it should be widely used and not quite the chore that it is now.

For those of you against the idea, you can just delete any extra tokens you get for missions or for killing sided mobs. Any volunteers? I didn't think so.

[M@hdi]

What are the mods on a 1K token board?

[Myga]

Originally posted by Mahdi
What are the mods on a 1K token board?

+700 hp
+700 nano
+210 run speed
+210 comp lit
+210 nano prog
+140 concealment
+7 xp
+7 atk
+7 to all damage types

[____________Nutbar03]

I got my 400 token board tonight.
No token farming or /terminating. Just 37 days, 12 hours (900 hours) of missions. Under the proposed rules I'd have had 1000 a while ago.
The new rules absolutely devalue the tokens earned under the old system. I think it's a change for the better but mission junkies got the short end of the stick. I need to do 10-15 50% hard missions per level. If I'm getting 4 or 5 tokens per level I'll have 1000 very shortly. Will there be a 2000 or 3000 board now?

[TaintStain]

How this could devaluing the current 1k token oarbs and their wearers?
Will FC lower the stats on these boards, so they dont give the same as they currently do? I mean, in all respects, I do not want to play in a static world, I want to see some progress, its nice that the different factions finally realized that service to the cause should actually be rewarded based on on service rendered. IE, one must assume that a mission that is hard to complete benefits your faction more then one that takes 5 minutes, especially if you a do variation of the same mission a thousand times.

This is called progress, it is not devauling you former efforts, its upping the value on your future ones, especially if there is a higher title board implemented. The former token politics were not good, I think everyone has wondered why you couldnt be rewarded accordinlgy for a mission the size of Rome, this is a step in the rigth direction, a bit surprised though that it took so long..

I am sorry, I say again, were is the bad thing in this, no one looses, we all benefit. Dont we all scream for progress in this world we have come to love and hate, well here it is, evolution my friends, dont stop it pls?

Your friend
Fury

[M@hdi]

Originally posted by MSag


+700 hp
+700 nano
+210 run speed
+210 comp lit
+210 nano prog
+140 concealment
+7 xp
+7 atk
+7 to all damage types

w0w, thx for the info and deffinately worth going for imo!

I like the changes as they are going to be made, but only from my own perspective. I play a doc toon and as such it's an enormous stretch to get tokens by myself (a 50% mission takes me 2 to 4 hours sometimes to complete at 5 to 15 minutes per kill on a yellow). I was very proud to have solo-ed my 60 token board by level 44 and didn't plan on going for 120 at all until I read this, I'm awaiting what changes are made but I think they will give me a chance

For all the people who already have gotten insane amount of tokens, I feel for you and the work you have done for your (far more impressive then mine) token boards. I do think there should be some sort of compensation for you people (mibby for everyone who has a 250 board or higher) maybe in the form of another "pioneer backpack" kind of item. For me, the changes represent a chance for a 120 and maybe even higher board, so I like them. Hope you can see it from my perspective, I can deffinately see it from yours

GreetingZz

-Mah

PS: FunCom states that there are 3 ways to do combat in AO (fixer article)

• [1] Doing damage (with guns or melee)
  [2] (ab)using pets
  [3] Healing

How on earth am I going to kill a mob by healing him/her/it?? I still have to do damage with my guns to kill them people. Plz. don't try to make docs happy by making them believe they are actually a fighting class of which every single nano is a potential weapon

[______________hobbes]

No one loses, are you crazy, I lose big time. Take the time to read the prior posts and the have a broader and more insightful perspective.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with the token system. Different game play styles generate different token returns. The single player has only the token as a benefit. All you others get all the benefits. I have already explained this.

Don't judge the change for how you will benefit, but what is fair. Please review my posts here.

The single greatest fallacy is that everyone should get the 1000 token board. No, this is only for the elite and/or insane mission runners. Again, more title levels between 400 and 1000 is a more logical solution.

How it is not obvious that increased tokens per mission will devalue the tokens earned by those getting 1 per mission, max.

Please think of all players, not just yourself. If the change takes place, I want all the extra tokens I SHOULD have earned!

[______________Obitus]

Sheesh hobbes, should everybody get the tokens they "should" have earned?? He|| no! As somebody said, this is progress and it does affect everybody in the game. As I have already said, the only people this doesn't effect are the people that already have 1k boards. This is a chance for everyone to be greater than they are. We all should have been earning more tokens all along. This oversight will now be corrected. Maybe the one with the narrow view is you.

[GammelMann]

Originally posted by hobbes
Please think of all players, not just yourself. If the change takes place, I want all the extra tokens I SHOULD have earned!

ROFL

[assassimon]

Originally posted by hobbes
No one loses, are you crazy, I lose big time. Take the time to read the prior posts and the have a broader and more insightful perspective.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with the token system. Different game play styles generate different token returns. The single player has only the token as a benefit. All you others get all the benefits. I have already explained this.

Don't judge the change for how you will benefit, but what is fair. Please review my posts here.

The single greatest fallacy is that everyone should get the 1000 token board. No, this is only for the elite and/or insane mission runners. Again, more title levels between 400 and 1000 is a more logical solution.

How it is not obvious that increased tokens per mission will devalue the tokens earned by those getting 1 per mission, max.

Please think of all players, not just yourself. If the change takes place, I want all the extra tokens I SHOULD have earned!

I stopped token farming at 60 tokens, was just too boring.

I have done missions, in group, from lvl 100-170 and got 180 tokens now, so I have 120 tokens after lvl 100.
With the new changes I would get 500+ tokens instead of those 120.

Do I think the changes are unfair for me and want the tokens I "should" have?
NO, it's a change all for the better, all MMORPG changes, I havn't lost any ip or anything, only time and even if it will be hard for me to get a 1k board now, it would have been impossible for me to get it without the changes, so I like them alot.

[Ashuras]

I agree with Hobbes.

I do NOT want to see everybody walking around with the 1k token board.

It is unfair for those who earn it legitimately.

Neither do I want to see those who are lazier walk around with 500 tokens....

When I spent so much time and effort gathering the 468 that I have right now.

Token boards are meant to be special. Why make them meaningless ?

If u are unhappy about those exploiters who got 1k, forget them.. punishing them should not mean punishing those who worked hard for their tokens. There are other ways to punish them.

If u're unhappy about token farmers, it's your own decision not to token farm. Those who did it, managed it with great patience and waste a lot of their playing time doing bornig repetitive tasks. That itself is not a small accomplishment. If u can't swallow that, I've also proposed suggestions to counter token farming too.

From what I see, those who supported this change are mostly people who want the same reward with while not willing to spend the same amount of effort. It is not fair at all.

Or those who did not want to do missions for tokens while "young" and start to regret at high levels and found gathering tokens a lot tougher.

Is it fair to those who spend time gathering tokens and sacrificed leveling up ?

People like me would have been level 150 or higher if I did not spend so much time soloing missions. (I'm only level 118 now, had been playing diligently since launch).

[____________RedSonja]

Full agreement with the last post.
I'd like to say:

"Please post how many tokens you currently have and then say if you are For or Against this change".

We will see a pattern very, very quickly.
Those that have worked hard for tokens, who have done missions more than anything in the game and currently have somewhere in the region of 300+ will say no.
Those that decided they wanted to play the game levelling as quickly as possible will say yes.

All this change brings is:

The ability for everyone to get the 1000 Token Board with relative ease, I sat relative ease because agreed it wont be simple, however 4 tokens per mission means you only have to do 250 compared to the 1000 you had to do.

Those that decided to take the "Doing Missions" path are being royally screwed, personally I am now Level 96 and last night I uploaded my 400th Token, can't of course upgrade the board yet.
However, under the propsed new changes that should quite possibly have been the 1000th token being uploaded.

Everybody who has said yes they want these changes to be made are thinking of themselves only - they want one part of the game which is still difficult to be made a whole lot easier.
At this current rate of burn, within one year of release, some 50%+ of players who started on Day 1 will be Level 200 and nearly every character, and I mean character not player, will have the 1000 token board.

[assassimon]

Originally posted by RedSonja
Full agreement with the last post.
I'd like to say:

"Please post how many tokens you currently have and then say if you are For or Against this change".

We will see a pattern very, very quickly.
Those that have worked hard for tokens, who have done missions more than anything in the game and currently have somewhere in the region of 300+ will say no.
Those that decided they wanted to play the game levelling as quickly as possible will say yes.

All this change brings is:

The ability for everyone to get the 1000 Token Board with relative ease, I sat relative ease because agreed it wont be simple, however 4 tokens per mission means you only have to do 250 compared to the 1000 you had to do.

Those that decided to take the "Doing Missions" path are being royally screwed, personally I am now Level 96 and last night I uploaded my 400th Token, can't of course upgrade the board yet.
However, under the propsed new changes that should quite possibly have been the 1000th token being uploaded.

Everybody who has said yes they want these changes to be made are thinking of themselves only - they want one part of the game which is still difficult to be made a whole lot easier.
At this current rate of burn, within one year of release, some 50%+ of players who started on Day 1 will be Level 200 and nearly every character, and I mean character not player, will have the 1000 token board.

and all that have done missions for 70 lvl that didn't get a token because only the one that picked the mission got one, now they finally have the chance to get some extra tokens to catch up the thousends of mission we have done without getting a token cuz team missions didn't work.

[______________Krneki]

I got 270 tokens on my eng, 150 tokens on my enfircer and 160 tokens on my crat. I think the change is great. The 1k board isn't all that uber for the effort it would take to get it with the older rules. 120 token board was pretty much the most worth it for the time spent getting it.

[Nanogater]

I got almost 400 tokens and I am very much in favour of this change. I do not want to spend the next 3.5 yrs doing solo missions. Now give us team missions as well.

[Myga]

Originally posted by Azzazzimon


and all that have done missions for 70 lvl that didn't get a token because only the one that picked the mission got one, now they finally have the chance to get some extra tokens to catch up the thousends of mission we have done without getting a token cuz team missions didn't work.

Yeah but you also got 4x the xp since you were teaming. Tokens was THE advantage of soloing. I got my 1000board at 147, with the same time invested in teams I would probably be around lvl 180-200. I would very much like a 2000token board or something if this change hits live, doesnt have to be much better +1000hp/nano +10 to dmg/atk, either +210 to some new useful skill (in addition to the ones in the 1000board) or maybe some profession based board giving some reasonable bonus to profession relevant skills etc.

[______________hobbes]

Thank you Red Sonja and Ashuras for reiterating points I have made on this thread.

Here is my perspective:

At one point Gummisluv was level 57 and I was 56. Two weeks later he was 25 levels above me doing team missions. Doing team missions he could select tough ones to get more cash, high ql loot (armor, weapons). He could use his IP more efficiently as he has team members heal him, do implants, etc. and he could concentrate on his Enforcer nanos. I was earning tokens.

So now he is lvl 100 (stopped playing about 2 weeks ago) and I am 88. So with token changes, he gets the money, weapons, levels, better nps, higher implants AND now he gets the extra tokens as well.

As a solo player, can you feel my pain. Can a brother get a shout out? Amen!

I will be instituitionalized before reaching 1000 tokens. The canyon between 400-1000 is too vast. Putting some rungs along the way would make this appear more approachable. The 1000 token board should be for about 1% of the players, not a mundane finding. If you think missions are boring, then don't do them. You won't get tokens, but you will get everything else. Not a bad exchange.

As the single player (this was sold as single player viable) I would like to at least have something to shoot for and take pride in.



Sorry this post is not very polished, I had a longer better one, but it got eaten by the posting system.

[___________Zeroshift]

Adding more token levels would be a bad idea... It would just repeat the same cycle of people whining that it's impossible to get the 2000 board before level 200 so they make tokens even easier to get and the process starts over again.

[______________hobbes]

I mean token boards btw. 400 and 1000. That is a very long gap. New rewards at 500, 600, 700, 800, 900 to make the journey more bearable and create a separation between the players as to token board status. In the current state, 100 tokens takes awhile, even for dedication mission runners.

People will always whine, some justified, most not. The token board is for mission runners and the tradeoffs I described earlier. As a single player I have 340 tokens at level 88. I would easily reach 1000 before 200 at my pace, without token farming.

Funcom made this very hard, but possible. I really see no problem with the current system. Why remove the only edge the gimped solo player has? And it ain't much. Seems that people want to level up fast, but want their tokens too. You need to pick one or the other to some degree.

Can someone please explain why my scenario is unfair? Look at the posts by Red Sonja, Ashuras and Msag as well as mine to get the solo missioner perspective and why we are not in favor of this.

There are already enough post saying, "I like it 'cause I get more tokens" or "I don't want to spend the time, make it quicker". Think about game balance as a whole, not yourself. People seem to feel entitled to receive this level. Why? Its hard, but possible so earn it or ignore it. You don't need to have it to have fun or be successful. Really, its edge is largely psychological.