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Another RED CHECK I would agree with, I have kicked players from my org for exploiting, or border line grey area cheats imo. Simply because I did not want that type of player being associated with my org...or by further extention me.Quote:
Originally Posted by Traderjill
I have to say this is one of your better essays Jill. I also agree 99%, only the clan pvp thing I don't care about lol.
So i came back after really long brake and it feels like i was here yday...Same old story "fixing bugs, working on stuff, soon"
Will this ever change ?
It used to be that just about any item in the game had a use. Even 'trash' guns could be good in certain situations (against certain armors, for instance, or swapping). Almost all the 'trash' in the game is or once was part of a tradeskill process.Quote:
Originally Posted by Genele
Since you're going to be changing a bunch of stuff at the same time how about adding back some degree of modifiability. So we can hack and mod guns, add some elements but risk blowing the gun up or reducing some other feature.
Agree with others that obviously colored loot - or the radioactive dog turd looting system that turned me off from AoC - is best left out of this game.
Multiboxing is not automation - passing a keystroke to multiple windows or computers can be done using a mechanical setup involving wooden dowels operating on multiple mice.
Automation is when people are afk and still achieving some activity in the game - if that is the case then I can assure you those fellas selling COFFEE for 1m a bag are the real culprits lol...
The team aspect is moot because I have more choice on who I want to team with...as do most players who own more than 1 account.
I can count the number of competent multiboxers on all hours of AO on the fingers of one hand - just because it is something you are too lazy to do does not mean you are entitled to condemn it as something that plagues the game. In fact more people have probably benefitted from Shadowlevels on my team than you have in Shadowlevels on all your toons combined, so go find another scapegoat.
In the meantime continue to spend your attention staring at parsed combat logs!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quisty
i dont care if people do multiboxing when they do pvm , it doesent effect other players when u do it in pvm
the problem is in pvp when u get 18 special attacks on u in 0.1 seconds time from a cheating idiot
Betting a full set of ql300 CSS that the new engine won't go live untill the end of next year, at best.
A new monthly update that doesn't adress ANY of the real issues this game has. Instead, we're gonna have color codes on items to help new players distinguish between crap loot and good loot. Yes, asking your orgmates or on OOC/vecinity sure was hard. The agony!
Glad I didn't resub. Thanks again, FC!
They really cant win can they, lol..
For years people have been complaining that new players need more help whilst getting into the game. Its well known that AO for new players is very confusing and hard to grasp.
So what do FC do? try and think of ways to help out the said new players and give them a bit more of an idea of the game... and now they have a bunch of old vets moaning and being all negative
You just cant please everyone!
The problem with newbs isn't that they don't see the value of an item, therefore needing a color code. It's the absurd number of useless junk in the shops paired with the incredibly huge cost of those said items.
This color coding won't change that problem one bit.
What FC needs to do, in order to please everyone(mostly), is to actually read and implement suggestions proposed by players for many many years. If you open up the game suggestions forum and read it all, if you know the game a little, you can actually choose alot of those suggestions that would actually make this game great again. Newbs don't need a color code on a sword they can't afford and they don't need a color code on armor and implants they can't afford. To help the newbs, make them able to afford those items.
-delete 80% of the items in the shops. Atm, their single purpose is to confuse new players.
-reduce the prices in the shops. If you're just coming out of noob island and you see a shop, you wanna know what's in there that could boost your toon's performance, right? Well, untill you see that doing all those missions on noob island and farming all those dynas over and over for 2h straight only enables you to buy 1 nano and 2 implants. Then what does any casual player do? He will quit. FC needs to realize that nobody starts a game with grinding in their minds, but with "having fun". Well, there is no 'fun" when you can't afford even the simplest things. And don't sell me that "you can download clicksaver, right, and you can make GAJILIIONS selling concrete cushions" story, please. When you download a game with the ideea of fun in mind and then you notice that you need 3 other outside programs to make money, grinding for hours, you move to another game that provides the element that's missing in this one.
-remake lowbie quests so they actually reward players for their efforts. No, doing a mission for 5k credits isn't rewarding. Make a profession specific line of quests that provides the newbie with:
a)a decent weapon that levels with you for a while and doesn't require ammo.
b)a backpack containing useful nanos for your profession.
c)a set of basic implants that can grow in ql(upon right-clicking) as long as you don't add clusters to them. Then, the newb can choose if he wears ql10 imps or waits till he can wear ql30. This quest would also teach newbs the "ways" of tradeskilling implants.
d)a set of profession based armor that levels with you for a while.
my 3 cents
I like the amount of comprehension failure this update produces. Looking forward to my invite :-)
Hopefully not, because that'd mean development was halted.Quote:
Originally Posted by MyGift
Also @Contra - l2p the game of understanding player behaviour and system design instead of posting such raging posts of nonsense.
Wich part of my post does not reflect my understanding of player behavior?Quote:
Originally Posted by Mastablasta
It's a known fact that newbs have a problem with credits when they start the game, isn't it?
It's also a known fact that the need to use clicksaver and farm 50.000 missions so you can afford basic equippment isn't a solution to the problem and only drives newbs away, right? Then, what part of my post was "raging" and "nonsense"?
I'd just like to throw in my 2 cents for what it's worth...
I started playing in like 2004 and I've been a long-time casual player and ex-froob. I still don't understand about 90% of the game mechanics, haven't gotten past lvl 50 on any of my toons, and have yet to really experience the "best" part of AO -- the intensely loyal and social fan-base. This is probably due mostly to my "casual" playing style.... a couple days every few months.
I think the reason I play so little is that there is such a huge learning curve. There's not nearly enough hand-holding in the beginning and even less so as the game goes on. With 200+ levels, it's really easy to get lost by level 30. And while I'm sure the hardcore players would be more than happy to show me around, I can't help but feel intimidated by all these lvl 150+ players hanging around the starting areas right after seeing nothing but 10- players in the NPE.
I'm really excited about the new NPE which, from what I understand, will allow higher level players to mix in with the noobs at the very beginning (unless I totally missed that part). Though I have to say that I'm still fond of the old generic backyards where I was free to start my own story (not "Oh, I crash landed from the space station ((which you don't even get to go to anymore)) and now my story starts exactly like everyone else.)
I'm so glad to hear about all the "dumbing down" like the rarity and such (even though I miss the reclaim terminals, as annoying as they were.) If anything, I'd love to see it dumbed WAY down to match some newer games... at least in the beginning. I'd love to have an NPC explain to me how to use a Nano. Full disclosure, though, the only other MMORPG I've really played was Star Wars, which I really liked... but it lacked the openness and charm of AO. I liked all the voice acting, though and really miss being greeted at the space station with "Hello, friend!"
So, I guess what I'm trying to say is that as much as hardcore players want AO to stay complicated, I'd like to see it simplified so I'm not so scared to level past 25. I want to see it match some of the more modern standards set my newer games. Including the new engine which I've been patiently waiting for, for what seems like decades.
That is all.
Benabus, interesting post.
Here's a little well known bit of info that most people don't admit... Twinking.. even 'pro twinking' is easy and anyone with a calculator and access to an items database (auno, xyphos, aoitems) can figure out how to put on almost anything. The complication of AO has always been in obtaining the items you need to turn the theory into reality. The same goes with almost everything else. The complication in the game isn't raiding.. AO has some of the easiest raids of any game I've played in the last 10 years. The complication comes from the loot system. I could go on and on in this manner in regards to what makes AO 'hard'. That whole "Don't dumb down the game" thing is silly. What's dumber than the existing process where people sit afk at 2mt then kite hill then leech in inferno and end up not knowing jack about their profession at 220? What's dumber than people throwing RL cash at the items shop to buy lootrights to stuff in game and not even knowing how to do the raids or where to obtain items? The game can't get any more dumbed down than it already is if you ask me.
What makes AO 'hard' is an outdated starter system that doesn't cater to players that were born in the past 2 decades. Does the starter experience bother me.. or did it when I started? No. But yeah, I'm part of the generation that was used to DOS prompts and can remember when the web was text based. Believe it or not, that describes a rather large part of our playerbase (people that are 30-40yrs old). We come from the generation of "figure it out" and that's why most of us weren't bothered by this game and thrived in it. But times have changed and to suggest that people used to modern standards are 'dumb' is really short-sighted. When I want milk, I go to the store and get some, not go outside and milk a cow like my mom had to do on the farm. Thank goodness they 'dumbed' that down because I like my modern conveniences. This is a video game.. I think sometimes people really forget that.
So anyway what you're saying is correct. People, for years, have been asking Funcom to make the starting experience more user friendly.. because once you get the basics of how the game works, the reality is that anyone can play it and most people will love it. The problem with new players was always getting them past those first couple weeks of playing to see the true gem that is AO. I couldn't care less how many colors they put in, signs they throw up or tutorials are out there to cater to new players. If it keeps some people interested and helps them get further along.. it doesn't hurt me... in fact it'll be a help because one of the 'hard' things about leveling and raiding is finding people to play with these last few years.
Now in defense of the people annoyed with this color coded rarity thing.. its par for the course with the AO population. It was 2 months ago that the beta signup was announced. As usual, every individual sets in their mind when something is going to happen. It's been x years (I've honestly lost count and can't be bothered to go look) since they announced the engine. At this point, anything that gives even the mildest appearance of taking time/resources away from things is going to get criticized by a certain portion of the population. I'm guessing most people missed the part where it was stated that additional resources wouldn't be used to make this rarity color adjustment.. some people just read/skimmed the idea and then went off about it. Personally, I think the rarity announcement without the announcement that the database is going to be reviewed and scrubbed makes it feel pointless to me as well.. but as I mentioned earlier.. 'whatever'. It won't hurt me and if it helps a few people and doesn't take more resources from NPE then I couldn't care less.
It always surprises me that most people don't seem to know the difference between designer types who can use tools to modify the database, edit monster behavior, script quests, etc. and coders who can actually change the game's mechanics. If you've ever messed with a level editor (like the ones that come with Blizzard RTS games), you have some idea what one job is like. Knowing that stuff doesn't mean you can start poking around under the hood of the engine. Or if you need an analogy, think of the difference between someone who is a wiz at Excel, and the people who actually develop Excel at Microsoft. Different jobs, different set of skills.Quote:
Originally Posted by Traderjill
As they've stressed before, all work on the engine is in the hands of the coders, and nothing the designers or artists do or don't do is speeding up or slowing down engine development.
What development? :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Mastablasta
I don't want to be mean but its always working/fixing bugs on something that doesn't even exist ( game engine, rebalance etc )
Listening to that for 5+ years without any actual result is ridiculous even for amateurs, not to mention professionals like Funcom.
Fact is that AO didn't get any major update ( except lots of promises ) ever since LE ( 2006 ), if that can be called major update...
Just my opinion, cheers ^^
Actually that is not true at all. You see these models that have too many bones have to be re-rigged and animated again. I know that the 3D artist will be using 3DS Max or Maya or similar program to be doing this work. It is exactly the work that the artist are there for. And yes the animations have to be reworked for the new bone structure. Depending on how big a difference in bone count their was this can be simple adjustment to complete re-working of each animation attached to that model.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trypha
In a long PM to FC I asked the question why this bone issue exploded in their face so late in the development. My guess is that someone did not see the value in having the artist do risk assessment of all the models over two years ago (maybe 3 by now) when they hit the first snag with the player character models not looking proper. I believe it was Means that wrote about that if you want to go look it up. Something about the limbs flattening out when they moved a certain way in the new engine. And so they where going to fix the character models so they looked proper.
You see that would have been a red flag to me. And instead of having all the artist make new items for what ever it was they were working on, I would have had one or two doing a complete risk assessment of all the models. You know, texture types all present and sizes correct. Normals calculated correctly? Properly rigged? <-- Should have caught the bone issue right here. Run through all the animations in the models and test them in the rendering tool that again Means talked about them having a good bit ago.
Since Vhab spoke up about the old engine using software skinning versus hardware skinning I really don't understand why a list of capabilities and limits of the old engine was not compared to the new engine as part of much earlier risk assessment. Oh look the old engine allows for 200 bones in a model but DX9 says 128 bones is the limit. OK add a task to check all models for less than equal 128 bones. Better yet lets do a full risk assessment of all models for all parameters.
As I have stated it comes down to the artist would have had at least 2 years to assess all the models and fix them from the first publicly announced point of knowing the models where not going to be plug and play. The way it is wrote up makes me think they just tried them all and the ones that blew up are getting looked at. That scares me because if the others have not been fully assessed what time bombs are waiting for us when this goes beta and then live.
Vhab ,Marcosun and the other coders have done incredible stuff in the code I am sure. But this engine upgrade is not all code. Anyone that used any game engine for a fun project knows that the models and textures have to conform to the engines requirements. The new engine is DX9 and that means there exist a clear set of hard requirements for models and textures. At a minimum those should have been checked for a very long time ago.
So understand every time they say the upgrade is all on the coders I just cringe. At best it is arrogance in the belief that all the assets (models, textures etc) are just going to be plug and play. At worse it is complete incompetence at the project management level.
The Program Managers Professional qualification has a great point about risk management. Failure to do proper risk management is guaranteeing your project to fail, fall behind schedule, overrun cost or all the above. It is sighted as one the leading causes of project failure, right behind under estimating the scope and improper staffing. I would say this engine upgrade may very well have covered all the big reasons listed.
This ^
Its like building a house for 5 years and then when you're about to move in, you realize u forgot to make foundations.
All this indicate that engine was just a bone for a dog and now we got new one, its called beta testing.
What bothers me most is financial part of this project. As a Game producer ( project manager ) in mobile game industry we have strict deadlines and consequence if we brake them. Also every delay cost company money. If one of the projects took 10% more time then planed it would be a huge deal and id have one serious talk with director and maybe even got fired.
How come that AO engine got delayed million times for years and years now and nothing happens, FC still financing this project and everything is all right? Its just unbelievable unless order from the top was "make something up and keep them playing as much as u can".
DX9 was the latest version when the engine was first announced. Then came DX10 with AoC. Now we are on DX11. By the time this engine hits live we will be on DX12 and the fun part about that is that AO will once again go through a 7 year project of upgrading from DX9 to DX10 (or 11) to be able to run on modern hardware! But when that update happens we will be on DX15 and that kids is called the circle of strife.
I despise quests. They are the opposite of a good sandbox game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Contra
IDC for what you despise. Quests add variety to a game and variety is good.Quote:
Originally Posted by If6Was9