Re: blah blah blah.........
Quote:
Originally posted by Dudicas
Look, my guilds average level is ~90. I am 160. We put up a 75 and a 100 tower. That is the two closest we can get to our average level. The whole point of the argument is that I shouldn't have to watch the towers that me and my guild put up be destroyed and not be able to do anything. We can't defend a level 150 any better than we could defend a level 100 if the only people allowed to defend it were those in the pvp range of it.
Get off your theoretical high-horse and look at it from the real perspective.
If your guild's average level is 60, your not going to put up a level 100 tower just because you've got 3 or 4 people over 100. Your gonna put up a 50ish, and if those 3 or 4 people can't help defend that QL50 tower, then they WILL be left out. Do you alienate and punish them because they are too high level? Do they kick out the low levels and recruit higher?
If they can't do anything that will allow people outside pvp range to be involved, then just leave it alone! The only reason that my guild would not be able to defend those 75 and 100 towers would be if the attackers brought in/got buffed/were twinked by high level characters. THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO WAY funcom can prevent any and all of that from happening. One way or another the attackers will find a loophole to take the advantage. I don't want to sit backand watch my guild get slaughtered by some twinks, when I could easily help them out and I'm even part of the reason the average level is as high as it is.
If you can't see the point we are trying to make and only want to bash our guilds "ability to plan" and make personal attacks on people like Jynne who is spending her own time and effort to voice the opinions of a great majority of the playerbase then I'm not going to be bothered with responding anymore, I'll respond when Cz gives us another set of questions or an update on how the developers have adjusted the proposal.
Dude just calm the frell down will you, not once have I made a personal attack on anyone, it seem to me that you are the only one getting hot under the collar.
IT IS ALL ABOUT THE TOWERS! Its the land control that makes these fights happen, the point is to destroy the towers and gain control of the land, how much team PvP happened before now!? Very little because other than titles there was no point.
Your point is you dont want to get left out if you're the wrong level- fine, my point I dont want my defence/offence scapped because a high level turned up and used outside buffs and there wasnt a damn thing I could do about it - if thats the case I'll have my money back now thank you very much, because it wont be fun, it wouldnt be _fair_ and it wont be worth the effort. If this doesnt change all fights will degenerate into high level buff-fests only a few location will change hands because it will all depends on how many higher/lower players are availble.
You can join in if your the wrong level, but your limited to fighting others of the wrong level who show up - a much better situation than knowling its not even worth showing up because you are bound to lose because you dont have any high levels (as in my guilds case)
Yes you are fighting the org - not the individual, but not the whole damn org (otherwise why have PvP restrictions at all) this is an exploit in my book pure and simple. If I were given the Kamikazi bot in its curent state (i.e. instakill) you would all cry nerf, despite the fact that it would be the only way I would ever manage to kill anything, what we have now is just as unbalancing
This is not theoretical its real I stood there and watched it happen last night and we couldnt even kill a single person due to the outside buffing. At this point I dont see any point so unless it changes I wont bother to build attack or defend as there simply isnt any point - it wont take long for the 'non-hardcore' to come to the same conclusions and you will be back to the situation where its only the same people attacking and defending - elitism will be the only victor in the end
Whats next, high level MOBs turning up in mission to buff low level MOBs with complete heals and uber buffs? This situation is no different yet its easy to see how stupid it is
Its a game, everyone pays the same therfore it must be fair - and to hell with how unrealistic it is.
I'm glad your done with me, I'm certainly through with you
Jynne
Under the proposed system the attacker wont have a choice of what level players to bring, and it wont matter what level ranges the defenders have availble (beyond the number of those able to defend)
If the only the defenders get 'outside help' you end up with the attackers running out of ammo/nano/health long before the defenders break a sweat. This will ruin the game for the attackers and in the end they will stop attacking you (after they have tried a few option) or contract an uberguild to do the job for them - <sarcasm> which is worth buying the booster for any day of the week </sarcasm>
This has nothing to do with being weak - If my guild build a level 60 base, bring on the attacks BUT only from people I can actually engage, dont be exploiting info from the guild lists (definately NOT realistic for those of you quoting _realism_) to see I have no high level characters to assist. Bring on your attack teams and the crowd control and outside buff restrictions will do the rest, all I am asking for is a fair chance to attack defend
Re: Re: blah blah blah.........
Quote:
Originally posted by Warlock
Jynne
Under the proposed system the attacker wont have a choice of what level players to bring, and it wont matter what level ranges the defenders have availble (beyond the number of those able to defend)
If the only the defenders get 'outside help' you end up with the attackers running out of ammo/nano/health long before the defenders break a sweat. This will ruin the game for the attackers and in the end they will stop attacking you (after they have tried a few option) or contract an uberguild to do the job for them - <sarcasm> which is worth buying the booster for any day of the week </sarcasm>
This has nothing to do with being weak - If my guild build a level 60 base, bring on the attacks BUT only from people I can actually engage, dont be exploiting info from the guild lists (definately NOT realistic for those of you quoting _realism_) to see I have no high level characters to assist. Bring on your attack teams and the crowd control and outside buff restrictions will do the rest, all I am asking for is a fair chance to attack defend
Under the proposed system, the attackers get to bring as many high level characters as they want to buff them.
These high level characters can sit with the low-level assault teams at the border of the LC area. They can lay on the biggest buffs that the assault team's NCU can hold, just 1 meter away from the border of your suppression gas field. If someone from the assault team gets hurt or debuffed, they can run back into the 75% zone where these high level characters will be able to heal them up and give them new buffs.
I don't see how your org is any less screwed in this scenario; in fact your org is more screwed, because if you can get some high level friends from other orgs to come... those high level friends can't help you.
Do you really think your org would have a chance when defending against an assault force running 200-point healing HoTs, 30% reflects, or 91-point damage shields? An assault force that's already had 5-10 minutes of freebie shots on your towers? That's probably already checked your roster and maybe even checked how many of you were online?
Get it yet? Attackers can - and will - get high level buffs and support from high levels in the 75% zone. Defenders can't get high level buffs and support from within the 25/5% zone - ie, from within their own base!
That's how Cz's proposal will work. You consider it an exploit... I call it "good planning." :p
Re: Re: Re: blah blah blah.........
Quote:
Originally posted by Jynne
These high level characters can sit with the low-level assault teams at the border of the LC area. They can lay on the biggest buffs that the assault team's NCU can hold, just 1 meter away from the border of your suppression gas field. If someone from the assault team gets hurt or debuffed, they can run back into the 75% zone where these high level characters will be able to heal them up and give them new buffs.
Assuming of course that the crowd control lets them......
Re: Re: Re: Re: blah blah blah.........
Quote:
Originally posted by Warlock
Assuming of course that the crowd control lets them......
The crowd control applies to the land control area. Aka the 25% gas zone they won't be entering. So the crowd control won't ever take effect for them. And it's not as if 1 or 2 level 200s passing out good buffs is going to trigger crowd control anyway.
And even if they do enter the 25% zone, crowd control only takes effect IF the number of people in the area starts getting over 50 on either side (not very likely that a 'true newbie' guild will have 50 people in one place).
If you propose that high level people be warped away from low-level bases automatically, first I'll laugh at the huge travel nerf that would be, and second I'll laugh because they'll just buff their lower-level comrades 40 meters from your base instead of 1 meter. Or they'll buff them up in a city and load them into the fixer grid so they can pop out near your controller with their buffs. It's never exactly gonna be rocket science to figure out ways to avoid the crowd limitations.
You put way too much faith in limitations, and way too little faith in the ability of gamers to find workarounds for them. You also seem to think that high level people wouldn't be willing to help you - but guess what, they'd love to. We're all in here basically arguing that we should be allowed to help... YOU!
Edit: We're going over ground this thread has already covered, again. As long as players are allowed to buff each other without restrictions as regard levels, in any way and at any location, low-level attack forces will be able to load up on high-level buffs before they go off to assault another low-level force's base.
If you nerf buffing, at very least, inside LC areas, all you do is deny the defenders the opportunity to reasonably acquire the same buffs that the attackers have already gotten before starting the attack.
Edit 2: The crowd control's intention is to fight lag, Warlock, not force people to fight fairly with equal numbers of people or equal levels. It's just to fight lag.