A trimmer question that has not been covered before.

[Sorrel]

I dont believe this has been covered - Where does the bots aggro/defence slider start before any trimmers have been applied? I saw one poster suggest 50/50 but I wondered if someone could confirm that?

My thinking is that the centre of the bar (1/1 att/def) is actualy around 87% (from memory). I wondered if it is certain the bar dosen't start there?

How long is the bar? I read a QL100 aggro will add +100 and a similar defence will subtract the same amount. Can I be sure a QL100 will give full agro or full defence whatever the setting? i.e. is the bar is only 100 'units' long. Edit: if this is the case what is the point of QL200 trimmers?

Finally when I was looking at this subject late last night I seem to recall reading about aplying a trimmer several times to incrementaly move the bar. Sorry this one probably has been covered but could someone confirm or deny this?

Thanks

[Uaintseenme]

its at 50/50

[Luuv]

At least that is what would make sense, since the only Trimmers you CAN'T buy are the ones setting aggrobar in the middle position. ^^

[Sorrel]

Ahh OK thanks.

So how 'long' is the bar? if it is 100 'notches' hwy would you ever need Ql > 100?

And the pressing thing for a newb (me) can I keep reaply say a QL10 five times to move the bar to full agro? Put another way does it trim from the current position of the centre 50/50 position?

Cheers for the quick response

[Uaintseenme]

the effects of a single trimmer do not stack.

[Cenelia]

How long is the bar? I read a QL100 aggro will add +100 and a similar defence will subtract the same amount. Can I be sure a QL100 will give full agro or full defence whatever the setting? i.e. is the bar is only 100 'units' long. Edit: if this is the case what is the point of QL200 trimmers?

because the trimmers taht are ql 200 dont affect agg-def bar

[Sorrel]

Ahh of course!

What you are saying suggests that I could use for an example a QL10 and a different QL15 for an overall shift of 25 pips.....or have I got it wrong again :-)

[Luuv]

The aggression trimmers don't add or substract from the aggro bar. They simply set it. And they only come in the ql range 1-100. So the max you can set is 100% offensive or 100% defensive. I don't know what would happen if you would feed your Bot some coffee, as this ADDS to the aggrobar. Perhaps it goes over 100%. (And thus make the bot faster, especially the SL slayers could need that) Don't know. But this is nothing you can achieve with trimmers. Perhaps a crat can answer this, since they can trim their bot and then use nanos like Mudslinger.

[Silverado-]

At least that is what would make sense, since the only Trimmers you CAN'T buy are the ones setting aggrobar in the middle position. ^^

http://auno.org/ao/db.php?id=88384&ql=50

[Luuv]

http://auno.org/ao/db.php?id=88384&ql=50

No, this one sets aggro to 50% aggressive. 50% of the range between the middle position (0% positive aggressive/0%negative aggressive) of the aggrobar and the "full aggro" position. So like putting the aggrobar at 75%. When we talk about the aggrobar, we say 0% and mean the aggrobar pulled full left. That is the equivalent of the 100% negative trimmer. Going full aggro is the equivalent of a 100% positive trimmer.
Am quite sure about this, but correct me if I am wrong. If you wanted to set the aggrobar of the bot to the middle position, you'd need a 0% trimmer of either kind, but no trimmers of ql0 are sold.

[Silverado-]

Target Set Agg/Def 50

Agg/Def meaning aggro bar

[TheGovernment]

Any speculation regarding agg/def bar (particularly whether it can go above 100 or below 0) must also be related to bot inits, which we also know nothing about. As a sidenote, the mp nanos set the agg/def bar of their attack pets to 180. Where's that if the bar only slides between 0 and 100?

[Silverado-]

Well there's also some advy buffs and those RK shrines that can buff your aggdef way above 100 and shoot with an OT 12 at full speed with froobie inits

[Luuv]

Target Set Agg/Def 50

Agg/Def meaning aggro bar

Yes, but the internal setting seems to work in the -100..+100 range. -100 being full def and +100 being full aggro. But when we talk about aggrobar and we say 0% we mean full def, which seems to be the same as the internal setting Agg/Def -100. Otherwise the Trimmer - Negative Aggressive-Defensive would not make sense. Or do you claim that a ql50 trimmer of that kind sets aggrobar to the middle position just like a Trimmer - Positive Aggressive-Defensive?

[Silverado-]

Or do you claim that a ql50 trimmer of that kind sets aggrobar to the middle position just like a Trimmer - Positive Aggressive-Defensive?

Yes

Edit: i could be wrong tho, i could throw some tests and see what the hits per minute look like with both trimmers both on chicken and 200 slayer

[Guojia]

agg / deff trimmers come in 2 flavor positive and negative,

roughly it's a 2ql per 1 point past the center ratio

So for example:

Positive QL 2 Trimmer would move my slider from the default 50% to 51%

Negative QL 2 trimmer would move my slider from the default 50% to 49%

So a QL 100 trimmer is the max QL, using my assumption at that quality level it would add/subtract 50% from the default agg/def bar.


This is just the way i have always assumed it worked.

I could be wrong though

[Drahkarr]

Just restating the above in a simpler way.

The bot starts with his aggro bar smack dab in the middle. We'll call this the zero spot. The ends of the bar are -100 on the left, and +100 on the right.

Aggro bar trimmers only come up to QL 100. There are two flavors....positive aggressive, and negative aggressive.

Positive aggresive moves the bot's bar to the right to a fixed value. It doesn't add or subract, it just moves it to its QL toward the right side. Thus, a QL 50 positive aggressive trimmer will set the bar at +50.

-100|---------0----X----|+100

Negative aggressive moves the bot's bar to the left to a fixed value. It doesn't add or subtract, it just moves it to its QL toward the left side. Thus, a QL 70 negative aggressive trimmer will set the bar at -70.

-100|--X------0---------|+100

The bot's bar acts just like ours. Neutral is at 87.5%, just like ours, so at that setting, the bot's attacks SHOULD be at 1/1. Of course, other factors apply, so this may not be the case. I believe that SL bots have a slightly slower attack time, so they may need more aggressive settings to be at 1/1.

[Spleenman]

You are wrong silverado. <3

[Silverado-]

/\

[Misterbear]

i suppose the closest thing to a trimmer that would set the agg/def bar to the center would be one really low ql either positive or negative trimmer. Since the trimmer sets the agg/def bar, if you used a ql1 trimmer, it would basically reset it to the neutral starting point.

Oh, and nice diagrams, Drahkarr.