Another thing:
As a trader in a team, my skill divest/plunders nanos create the buffer I use for single/team wrangles. The skill buffs I receive from a divest, I TRADE to my team members so they can hit more consistantly with higher damage, use nanoformulas normally not on their level, and summon pets they can't normally use.
Any attacks to the trader debuffs will also have a negative affect on wrangles and their uses in a team situation.
There's a flaw in your statement.Originally posted by Kuroshio
Another thing:
As a trader in a team, my skill divest/plunders nanos create the buffer I use for single/team wrangles. The skill buffs I receive from a divest, I TRADE to my team members so they can hit more consistantly with higher damage, use nanoformulas normally not on their level, and summon pets they can't normally use.
Any attacks to the trader debuffs will also have a negative affect on wrangles and their uses in a team situation.
Lets assume your in a group with people who are mainly weapon users. Their assault rifle skill is 300 base. Lets just say that.. so they are roughly around level, 60. Now according to Gaute, if they over equip past 20% then their weapon is reduced 1/4th damage. That means .20 of 300 is, 60. That is, they can't go higher than 360.
These people probably have assault rifle expertise running, which is a +20 to their assault rifle. Ok, so from 300 base we have an adjusted skill of 320. Now lets assume they are running assault rifle mastery, thats a +60 to their skill. Oops, now they have a 380 to their assault rifle mastery. Their weapon is now working at 1/4th the effectiveness. But that is all self buffs...that's not even counting a trader wrangle.
Lets just pretend that they dont even have these buffs running. Ok, so they are now, just 300. At the very most, a trader can wrangle +60 without making the other team members less effective. Why would anyone take a trader who can at most do a +60 or less, when they could just self buff and do a assault rifle mastery or a simple expertise ? Even if the trader did a few points above expertise, the extra points arent worth it. Why take a trader who can add +10 more points when you can just add on another soldier?
This OE patch is really, not though out through enough. People don't seem to understand that with a simple fix like stun nanos, FC, was getting that wrong and had to patch that up quickly. How could they miss the obvious exploit ? 4 sec recharge and 4 sec attack. Im not saying OE patch will allow exploit to happen, I am just saying that Funcom with their current track record has manage to foul up alot of simple things. So is it logical to trust them with something as important as OE?
Furthermore, Funcom doesn't understand why people are OE in the first place. If the mobs didn't have such ungodly hp and ac in the first place, then there would be no point in having to OE to kill that many mobs. I.e how many times have you been ganged up on by a few greys and then had to zone out to kill them ? Of course some of you will probably say people will OE anyhow so they can kill faster. get more exp faster.
I guess that is a valid argument.
But on the same note, people who can OE will OE and those who can't or don't know how to OE or even how to do simple calculations will undoubtedly say that OE is a kind of exploit. And yes to the human mind it does look like a kind of exploit. But then, so on the same note you can make an argument about doctors being an exploit too. Let's look at it this way.
People who complain about OE being an exploit say that is a way to gain an unnaturual amount of exp in a ridiculously short amount of time. Well on the same note, so is having a doctor. Having a doctor on your team lets you gain an unnaturual amount of exp in a ridiculously short amount of time simply because you have less down time and you can just keep pulling pulling mobs.
On the same note you can say, level 70 agent running around with a ql 200 stigma is an obvious exploit. Or a level 60 enforcer running around with a ql 200 beam is an exploit. Sure to us that might seem unfair and impossible, How else does such a low level get on such a high level weapon ? Easy. They either have alot of money from a higher level character or they have good friends. Or, they just know how to use implants well and have done the necessary calculations
BUT THAT IS UNFAIR.
Well ok if your going to make that argument you also have to say people who reach level 200 are exploiting too. Or anyone else below you can say you are exploiting as well. Because you took the time and patience and skill to get to that particular level, with help of your friends, implants and money. Oh no but that is an exploit right ?
Let's look at it this way. Everyone can OE if they wanted to. Why don't they ? They're not going to admit that they can't do it. They won't even admit that they don't know how. They will just inevitably argue that its just not about game mechanics. Yah ok, So that means then you can't fight mobs that are above you because if you win that is an exploit somehow. And don't say that last sentence doesn't make sense. Think it through smart guy. The whole purpose of this game is being challenged. If people can take the challenge and beat the odds, and stack up that cool weapon, then let them. I know for sure most of you who argue OE is bad would do the same thing if you could. But the mere fact you can't makes you upset and thus flame all the others that can OE.
And another thing this is kinda off topic.
And to all the hypocrit guilds that are saying the OE patch will be a godsend thats such a bunch of crock. First Order always use to do the treatment exploit by taking their members into the store surgery clinics and exploiting. So who know show many of people have ql 150+ imps, or what not. Its baffling to hear them say that this is going to be a good thing when they all know they've got imps and gear on that are way past their 20% level.
Originally posted by Rayfield
lol....posts like these are just hilarious. perhaps, creator....think for a moment. (re: hypocrite)
comp lit related items. belts, ncus, are not being OE fixed in this upcoming OE patch. so, your problem would ONLY be regarding buffing your friend's newly made twink with lots of NCUs and pre-lv20. From the formula they've given us, the premium wrangles, etc... will still be just as useful to those who are about the same lv range as the trader who can cast it with only trader's self buffs.
so a lv...what, 75? trader with mochams+his own deprive->ransack->divest(deleting deprive)->plunder(deleting ransack)->wrangle someone will be of less use to a lv75 of another class who wanted to OE beyond 20%.
(numbers+nanos might be slightly off cuz i'm only familiar with low lv trader nanos)
OMG! you can't earn what, 200k per buff anymore? (at least that's what idiots have been trying to sell wrangles in RK2 for)
my friend's trader helps me in a very strange manner. here's 1 example of something fun we do (when i was 'camping' TK's lowbie bots for parts). when TK or his Lackeys respawns, he wrangles me and i calm for a higher chance of success, so we don't die. if the first calm don't work, we run away. my wrangle still on for another 30 seconds or so....i use a higher lv root than what i have. i root the bugger and head back to TK's area to kill ore of those little techscavengers. TK 'warps' back to his spawn...if he agros me, we do the same thing again. his wrangles definitely gives me an advantage to a more successful root/calm.
i think that's fun. and ther's more other stuff. Traders will be king of PVP after the patch too. when they turn those who are just below the 20% OE line with a divest+plunder to a 40%+, taking away 50% of someone's weapon's effectiveness. that's scary.
i think you're just a little too negative "creator" .....
--- Dont believe so. Your calling people Idiots who payed traders for buffs? Why? I payed traders 200k for buffs because from the buffs I receieved I managed to make realy nice bots. Slayer Guardians. I think that the buffs are worth way more and have payed more aswell because with a bot like the Guardian I can easily get 400k a mission or much more. You are referring to not paying traders for their buffs? Man, u a Trader Hater or something?
Secondly, Me Negative? Dont think so. Wait until FunCom screws up the Traders Divest+Plunder and see who will be the negative part of us! Doh!
This is a touchy subject.
After reading some of the responses here and else where I can understand that some people are not happy with the current system of implants and equipment Overquiping.
I my self think that Newbie characters shouldnt have all to high QL equipment or implants, Witch was very possible early on in this game, ( I know of instances where lvl 10 chars have ql 60+ equipment and implants on them ), No doubt given to them by a guild member much higher them themselves or someone else that gave them the stuff.
This is something that FC unfortunatly new about, Because they built the system and tested it, Im sure for many months before Implamenting it into a game.
I would like to ask FC what They Did with all the information from the BETA-Test period, Because if they would have done it proffesionally then they would have all the information they would need for the basis of a good IMPLANT/EQUIPMENT and NANO System ???
Have they even admitted to having a faulty system or is this just something they want to implament because it is becomming to easy to play there game?
They Certainly still have alot of bugs and problems in game many of witch have been fixed but still many linger on, and The latest patches havent reflected much upon that?
They seem to be more concerned about the game beeing to easy to play or Manipulate, And of cousre the cries from some people stating that to many are over equiping and/or cheating are ofcourse right up FC's alley, Then they can say ohh well it's what the majority wanted, Hehe...
I know a good BSer when I see one ( read one ).
I think something needs to be done but not a major change or nerf, FC has made the bed now the have to sleep in it..
They can calmly reevaluate the system and ask for our opinions witch they have, and I think also is the correct thing to do.
I give them my hat of for that.
Hope they can sort through the masses and come to some understanding that will suit everyone expectations to some point.
You cant make everyone happy but you can atleast try...
Thx Concerned palyer.
Originally posted by Merkaba715
What level are you Nihilie? How long have you been playing your trader? We are the ones that will least be affected by this. Go read our forums and find out.
lvl 115 Trader
the least affected ??? lol
are u part of the people who think traders will wrangle a team every 3min for little adds on damages ?? get real, this is never going to happen with me, im not a wrangling machine !
for all people outhere who never tried a trader, remember this : when we wrangle our skills go way down ! So no way, im not going to wrangle during missions, only before missions to help summon a better pet, but after the 3min wrangle, im not gonna do it again !
i didnt play a trader to stay behind like a doc, i have a shotgun and want to use it at 100% of its capacities..
and also, 50% of the time a team invite me because of my good and fast heals (docs are rare), well let me tell u, with wrangles >>> no more heals, "oh really i feel sorry u lost 2Mill xp because of that mob but u wanted a wrangle...."
and btw i enjoy healing cos it doesnt affect my shotgun speed, i still do as much damages (my nano init is real high)....
to resume what i just said, im not mad because i wont get anymore money from wrangle (have a lot of creds already... so i dont care about it...), im mad because naive people think traders will become their wrangle pets in missions.... well to these people i have to say.... WAKE UP this is not gonna happen !
Last edited by Mintfloss; Mar 14th, 2002 at 21:53:01.
You're not making any sense here. How would my giving the team +60 (actually it's +62 for a team skill wrangle, costing 29 NCU) penalize the rest of the team?Originally posted by MrBunny
There's a flaw in your statement.
Lets assume your in a group with people who are mainly weapon users. Their assault rifle skill is 300 base. Lets just say that.. so they are roughly around level, 60. Now according to Gaute, if they over equip past 20% then their weapon is reduced 1/4th damage. That means .20 of 300 is, 60. That is, they can't go higher than 360.
These people probably have assault rifle expertise running, which is a +20 to their assault rifle. Ok, so from 300 base we have an adjusted skill of 320. Now lets assume they are running assault rifle mastery, thats a +60 to their skill. Oops, now they have a 380 to their assault rifle mastery. Their weapon is now working at 1/4th the effectiveness. But that is all self buffs...that's not even counting a trader wrangle.
Lets just pretend that they dont even have these buffs running. Ok, so they are now, just 300. At the very most, a trader can wrangle +60 without making the other team members less effective. Why would anyone take a trader who can at most do a +60 or less, when they could just self buff and do a assault rifle mastery or a simple expertise ? Even if the trader did a few points above expertise, the extra points arent worth it. Why take a trader who can add +10 more points when you can just add on another soldier?
This OE patch is really, not though out through enough. People don't seem to understand that with a simple fix like stun nanos, FC, was getting that wrong and had to patch that up quickly. How could they miss the obvious exploit ? 4 sec recharge and 4 sec attack. Im not saying OE patch will allow exploit to happen, I am just saying that Funcom with their current track record has manage to foul up alot of simple things. So is it logical to trust them with something as important as OE?
The thing you are either forgetting or didnt know is that the mob HP/AC only became so ridiculously high BECAUSE of people massively overequipping. No one should HAVE to overequip to complete a 50% mission, and yet that is what we have now. The fix stops/limits the MASSIVE overequipping that caused the spiralling MOB HP's in the first place since their is now an upper limit to what OE can accomplish. It was originally planned to lower MOB HP along with the OE fix, and I'm hoping that's still part of the plan (And I really wish that followup article touches on this)Originally posted by MrBunny
Furthermore, Funcom doesn't understand why people are OE in the first place. If the mobs didn't have such ungodly hp and ac in the first place, then there would be no point in having to OE to kill that many mobs. I.e how many times have you been ganged up on by a few greys and then had to zone out to kill them ? Of course some of you will probably say people will OE anyhow so they can kill faster. get more exp faster.
ChibiKawai - The KAYOOTEST Level 40 NT ever.
"IWANNASTUFFEDTEDDY AND I WANT ONE NOW!!"
Look on the bright side. Now ransac and deprave will not only lower bonus damage from skill but also lower effective QL of oponents weapons.Originally posted by Merkaba715
What level are you Nihilie? How long have you been playing your trader? We are the ones that will least be affected by this. Go read our forums and find out.
Anyway, with the skill buffs traders have they look more like what I thought engies was for... Making stuff, and selling it.
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