Re-evaluate this problematic turn-by-turn class fixing!

[Inocybe]

Ecological Alert - Impending Species Extinction on Planet Rubi-Ka

* The Fixer

* The Martial Artist

* The Adventurer

The above are dying breeds.

Many have left the planet to transgress other planes of sentient existence.
(Note for FC: this means your customers have left/are planning to leave.)

Of those who are left, they are barely surviving on pure gut, hope and not much else. And even that glimmer of hope is fast diminishing - with the revelation that other species, sentient and non-sentient (note for FC: PC and NPC), will have their abilities adjusted and strengthened despite the fact that they have already received improvements over the past several months.

I note with grave concern that the combat-oriented species and pet-summoners have continually been bestowed with improvements. However, the same cannot be said for the 3 dying breeds mentioned aforemost. They have been left so far far far behind on the ecological ladder, it is pitiful.

If life on planet Rubi-Ka is to continue to be challenging, then ALL species must receive equal care and treatment. Otherwise, the ecology on this planet will suffer - in fact it is already suffering in massive doses.

Realizing that even the deities (FC) have limited resources (team of programmers and designers) - I suggest a change in the way species/class improvements are being handled. Conduct PARTIAL improvements for all species/classes ... so that NO species/class is left SO far behind the rest.

It is painfully obvious to Rubi-Kans on their daily lives, that continual focussed improvements on a few species/classes have left a terribly unbalanced ecology - there is, without doubt, an enormous gap between the Haves and the Have-Nots.

In short, this class-by-class turn is not a happy solution. The result: the ecology has been upset. It is in a terrible state of imbalance. Surely this cannot continue? Hearts are bleeding for lack of care!

For life to truly flourish on Rubi-Ka, there must a healthy diversity of species. Only then will life on this planet bloom in all its richness and diversity. If there is no life left, this planet is all gloom and doom.

If the deities (FC) care at all, they will not allow hearts to bleed.

Have you ever heard hearts bleeding? It is neither pleasant nor comforting. It is the most soul sadenning thing to hear ... and I've been hearing it every day of my Rubi-Kan life.

Dum vita est spes est
While there's life, there's hope

I await at the oracle for a response from the deities.


Ino
crouching tiger, hidden dragon


((Ooc - The use of the terms breeds/species interchangeably with profession/class is intentional. It was used to fit the unbalanced ecological analogy. FYI, my Rubi-Kan life began in Beta4))

[mrpres1dent]

It has been said before and will be said again until every class gets attention. At least we got them to admit they will be working on MA's and Advents soon. Though I disagree with bumping Agents in between the MA and Advent patch (what's wrong with Agents that makes them more important than Adventurers? I don't think being able to AimedShot for 10,000 points of damage is really a problem .

<sigh>

The aforementioned latin quote is everything -- all those classes who are "unplayable" without taking major risks (dumping IP into dark blue and light blue weapons skills to wield weapons otherwise reserved for "other" classes) have cried to Funcom. It has taken this long for us to even get attention. Who knows how long it will be until we see a patch.

Fixers, however. Hmm.. I'm not entirely sure I agree. I *USED* to agree.. but that was just because I figured Fixers were stuck with the Mausser. They have many other guns available to them if they wish (Suppressor's, for one -- I have seen Fixers Full Auto with one of those for 10,000 points..). The other two classes (Adventurers, MA's) don't have that sort of option without gimping themselves IP-wise, like so many MA's have done using 2HB and Adventurers using Riders.

We shouldn't be forced to sacrifice one thing for another just to be able to play this game -- translation: we shouldn't have to forego nanos for a good weapon, or vice versa, simply because our class' weapon-of-choice(tm) (MA: fists, Adv: Pistols, Fixer: Mausser) was nerfed.

Like said before..

Playing a Fixer, MA or Adventurer should not be AO on the hardest difficulty setting.

(flojojojo|level 154 adventurer|rk2)

[Paffy]

http://antiguardians.org/stats.php

ALL CHARACTERS (guilded omni/clan on RK1 and RK2)

adventurer 2777 7.67 %
agent 3578 9.89 %
bureaucrat 1216 3.36 %
doctor 3174 8.77 %
enforcer 4098 11.32 %
engineer 2826 7.81 %
fixer 2224 6.15 %
martial artist 4579 12.65 %
meta-physicist 2727 7.54 %
nano-technician 3142 8.68 %
soldier 4374 12.09 %
trader 1476 4.08 %
total 36191 100 %

or since you are on RK2

adventurer 598 7.13 %
agent 726 8.66 %
bureaucrat 274 3.27 %
doctor 674 8.04 %
enforcer 1003 11.97 %
engineer 712 8.49 %
fixer 513 6.12 %
martial artist 1207 14.4 %
meta-physicist 667 7.96 %
nano-technician 713 8.51 %
soldier 936 11.17 %
trader 359 4.28 %
total 8382 100 %

Wanna re-evaluate your thinking with RK2 having MOST MA's than any other profession

Anyways check the link. There you can also put level range to equation.

Zarch and bunch of other chars between 5-140

PS. This is why "I feel like" shouldnt be thought as fact,

[Ashuras]

Those stats are hopeless.

Anybody can play an MA or ADV to level 30 easily.

How many will continue beyond that ?

U try to do a Sum-of-level / number-of-character to see the average level of each profession. This should give u a more accurate picture of the viability of each profession.

[_______________Intra]

Originally posted by Zarch
http://antiguardians.org/stats.php

ALL CHARACTERS (guilded omni/clan on RK1 and RK2)

hahaha all characters in bold, and then guilded in normal type in parenthasis.
sorry, not all characters guilded. infact, none of mine are and I know many others in the same way.
you cant do stats on all characters without including all characters.

oh, and fix the fixers
I agree with the initial post

[Paffy]

As I said play with the settings there. For your convenience I have taken same list with lvl 100. This means that it only displays people of level 100+

All characters over level 100 (rk1/rk2 and guilded)

adventurer 102 4.5 %
agent 249 10.98 %
bureaucrat 39 1.72 %
doctor 239 10.54 %
enforcer 229 10.1 %
engineer 165 7.28 %
fixer 87 3.84 %
martial artist 263 11.6 %
meta-physicist 222 9.79 %
nano-technician 278 12.26 %
soldier 314 13.84 %
trader 81 3.57 %
total 2268 100 %

Over level 100 players MA is still one of the most common professions. Do you now want over lvl 150 stats? Ma is HIGHEST % of players over lvl 150.

Go play with that database thingie. Its fun.

To Trimus:

Yes not all players are guilded I agree. But at this point I think its safe to say that most are. Atleast on RK1 when I take a "T" of people I see around me most are guilded and its kind of revelation to find one that is not.

Zarch and bunch of other chars between 5-140

[mrpres1dent]

Zarch, what are you trying to prove with the stats?

That Funcom should base who gets a patch, and when, based on what profession is used the most? Majority rules? Is that what you're trying to say?

I sure hope not. Maybe there's a reason why some of those professions are a minority -- BECAUSE THEY ARE BROKEN.

Looks to me like the top 4 are MA, Enforcer, Soldier and Agent.

I don't really see anything wrong with Enforcers, Soldiers OR Agents that would warrant them moving Adventurers down a notch, especially after Funcom is fixing MA's before them.

Funcom previously stated that we would be NEXT after the MA's, view-able here:

http://forums.anarchy-online.com/sho...?threadid=7141

QUOTE: "Adventurers are also up for a change, right after the Martial Artists."

I, for one, do not like being lied to.

Statistics are weak. Priorities per profession should be assigned based on playability, not on amount of players.

(flojojojo|level 154 adventurer|rk2|sartan.epoch)

[Inocybe]

Those figures include both active and inactive characters. They are derived from FC database, no?

I recently went to look up some characters - characters played and characters started/abandoned by people I know quit AO 4-5 months ago. Guess what? Their characters are still in the FC database. I also know many people who create lowbies as mules or part-time RP characters. These are also included in the character database.

Statistics and figures can either be used to illuminate or blind the situation depending on how they are presented. Any debater/orator worth his/her salt knows this

Let's look past database figures. Let's look at the real daily situation ...

- Stand in 20K, Pleasant Meadows. Observe the LFG and LFM spam.
- Teams tend to centre around a core consisting of Engy/Meta/Doc. The rest of the slots will quickly be filled with Sol/Enf/Agent/NTs/Crats/Trader. Any crumb slots left will then filled by the odd MA/Advy/Fixer still active and trying to level up.

- Of course, this doesn't happen when - you have guildmates/friends/hunting buddies who will take you on whatever your profession. But where does that leave the casual or the non-guilded gamer? How is this acceptable in a paying game? 12 professions are clearly listed and made available for character creation.

Players who continue to develop their MAs, Advys and Fixers do so with sheer determination and a great of frustration and with great risk of 'gimping' certain skills. And yet many others I know have started new characters (most noticebly, engineers and metas) until their 'beloved' profession gets a proper 'love and fix'. To trivialise the frustration felt by the MA/Advy/Fixer professions is simply not nice.

Yes, this game keeps changing. Yes, all classes need improvements etc etc etc ... but surely not in a manner that leaves huge gaps in the viability of 12 professions. We should not have to pay and play with a 'beta phase' mentality. Beta was the time when they had the luxury of looking into classes by the turn. Now is not.

12 professions were presented/promised as a product feature. If they do not have the resources to pay attention to all 12, then at least make step-up fixes - hence my suggestion of partial improvements as opposed to what they're doing now.

That is the crux of my 1st post. And I believe these other players here understood that perfectly.

We all rise together or not at all - because this MMORPG will be the poorer if it turns into a combat-heavy-class-oriented online game with tradeskills as pretty ornaments. Let's face it, we're still here because we believe in the potential of of Anarchy Online.

[Paffy]

<start quote>

Ecological Alert - Impending Species Extinction on Planet Rubi-Ka

* The Fixer

* The Martial Artist

* The Adventurer

The above are dying breeds.

<end quote>

I just pointed out he was wrong. MA by now means is even close to extinction being one of the most common professions of all and yes, I see active MA's every day of every lvl.

Zarch and bunch of characters between 5 and 140 and I play them all... at turns (now its Trader)

[mrpres1dent]

He used "extinction", from what I can pull out of context, as a figure of speech. Simply trying to convey the fact that the above three professions are professions where 99% of the people who play them quit because they are so bug-laden and "unfinished".

People play RPGs as an escape from the problems of the real world. When I log onto an RPG, I don't expect my character to have problems worse than my own (figuratively speaking). Funcom needs to understand this. Instead of spending all that time developing a new dungeon, they should devoted those resources to finishing off the classes. This game, as far as I am concerned, is still highly in beta, and they have a lot of nerve charging for it at the moment.

It doesn't seem fair that some people have to get the short end of the stick just because they fell into the "minority" when they picked their profession the first time they loaded up AO.

And yes, I do agree, MA's are all over the place. But every single one of them is unhappy with the damage their fists do. I am a high level Adventurer, I am unhappy with my class, but I don't have time to re-roll, make new friends, etc.

Why should I have to forfeit all the time invested in my character just because the company to whom I pay money every month is not capable of fixing the issues that exist in their own game?

I shouldn't. I haven't. The day I quit is the day FC announces there will be no Adventurer patch, or, if the Adventurer patch turns out to be junk.

At that point I will cancel, say goodbye to my friends, and leave Rubi-Ka. No other profession really interests me.

(flojojojo|level 154 adventurer|rk2|sartan.epoch)

[Inocybe]

Originally posted by Zarch
I just pointed out he was wrong.

Inocybe Matusz is a female solitus.
But wait ... how is it possible you made such a gender mistake? You have supposedly displayed your prowess at fishing out figures from a database. And yet you lack the inability to do a single character search? Oh my, what a great display of database search skill

And no, you still have not proven or countered anything. My entire first post was an ecological analogy with a slight metaphorical tone - so for you to pull out a phrase or two out of context only shows you want to nickpick to show how smarty pants you are, not that you are interested in the plight of others. And since you clearly lack the ability to see the woods for trees - in your case, please substitute the phrase 'dying breeds' with the phrase 'suffering breeds'.

[mrpres1dent]

Originally posted by Inocybe


And since you clearly lack the ability to see the woods for trees - in your case, please substitute the phrase 'dying breeds' with the phrase 'suffering breeds'.

ROFL!

Nice one It is rather clear that he has nothing productive to contribute to this thread.

(flojojojo|level 154 adventurer|rk2|sartan.epoch)

[__________Kaisersoze]

Zarch. MA's can do 100ish damage at lvl 150ish. Find other stats.

[Paffy]

MA is not disappearing anywhere. Sure it would be "nice" to do more damage but even if they did ONE (1) point of damage per hit they would be still wanted

At this moment crit buff is THE most wanted buff in game over any other buff unless you are having pet only party. I could quote my high lvl doc friend who said:

"As long as you give us UVC you can idle in front room and leech exp for all I care".

Ofcourse you could turn this to "see, we are only wanted for our one buff, see how bad we are". Well, that one buff happens to be _essential_ buff for high level gaming and its so good that there are others like this doc friend of mine who really dont give a **** what you do as long as you supply our team with that buff.

This I could add that I have been very pleased of almost every MA I have had privilege having in our groups. Some of them have dropped the silly notion of being Bruce Lee's and doing crazy damage and have instead adapted and evolved to be very good crit buffers and secondary healers and have saved our asses many times when doc's winbloze decides to add element of surprise to our gaming experience

Another example.

My lvl 112 MA friend, who up to that level, tried to be "damage making" MA like Monks from our old MUD has now realized that what he should be doing is kind of "Paladin" of this game. Maxed evade healer with nice buffs that everyone wants.

Is this "right" then? I dont claim it to be. Many dont want to play that kind of character but would instead prefer to play this "monk" type character of fantasy games or archetypical Bruce Lee or whatever. I dont say they are even wrong wanting to...

What I do try to say, is that you are what you make yourself to be and that people who cant evolve in changing world with changing rules are destined the way of dinosaurs.

This is NOT to say that you should give up on your hopes of improvement or to meakly accept you fate, no. But to give it out like you did conveyed to me the feeling that "unless you fix us now, there wont be any of us left" which is not right. There are new MA's done every day...

To the end I would like to add that I have every profession with exception of Doctor, Martial Artist and Adventurer (yes, I have Fixer thank god or you would say I only think this because it dont affect me). Why I dont have those professions? I have never liked to be "healer" profession and responsible for other peoples exp/time/fate/frustration.

Having every profession except those kinda gives me more perspective on things or thats what I like to think.

I hope this isnt turning to "personal insults" or flame war and that you see now my view on things.

Zarch and bunch of other chars between 5 and 140

[______________Nianna]

As the statistics show, there are many martial artists at all levels, even level 150+. They are very desirable in groups and not restricted to only fist damage. Granted they can't solo too well 100+, but who really can? Solo really isn't even much of an option at high levels except for running missions, which they can do better than most because they have green evades and run speed. In a group MAs are absolutely fantastic. Having a crit buff alone can increase group damage by 50% or more.

Why do so many people play MA even to level 150+ if they are so gimpy?

If we want to compare apples to apples then you should be comparing the power curve of MA to doctor, trader, and adventurer -- the other healing classes.

Martial Artist - lvl 50+ 13.29%, lvl150+ 14.85%
Doctor - lvl 50+ 10.18%, lvl 150+ 9.41%
Trader - lvl 50+ 3.05%, lvl 150+ 2.97%
Adventurer - lvl 50+ 6.75%, lvl 150+ 6.44%

Martial artist is the only healing class that actually has a higher percentage of the level 150+ population pool than it has at level 50+. Every other healing class has more difficulty reaching high level due to boredom factor, powerlessness, or what have you. There are nearly five times as many high level martial artists as Traders, over two times as many as adventurers, one and a half times as many as doctors. They make up about 1/7th of the total population level 150+ but there are a lot more than 7 classes.