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Thread: Anti Blitsing

  1. #1

    Question Anti Blitsing

    Greetings,
    *gets ready to dodge all the flame's

    I was lisening to the gridstream readio the other night, And they were talking about the economy in the game. Ya it sucks, and they do need cash sinks. They said they tryed it with Yalm paint, and the new yalms.

    But thoes new yalms I hear are just about impossable to equip even after you spend millions, imp to heck, and ect. Only a few classes can rilly get into them, making them useless so people wont bother sinking the credits into them to help fix the economy.

    And they were saying the majority for the mass amounts of cash is blitsing making the prices so high. One person even said Make the reward like the token. 50% to complete the mish to receive the reward.

    I like this idea. Make them work for there reward, Afterall FunCom did make us start to work for our tokens.

    ---

    Drawbacks-
    1) The classes that blits won't like this idea for they won't have no more easy cash revenue.

    2) The items that are out there already, the prices might go up on, for they would be more rare, and full sets just about not seen.

    ---

    Pros-
    1) Other classes that can't blits will start to see cash for selling there single piece of armor for someone whos making a set.

    2)The economy MIGHT get fixed.

    ---

    I ask you all think of a few more pros and cons. After all Do you remember when you got a token every time, People who farmed them ended up with awsome bonuses FC fixed that, Why not this, Just seems like it sould have been this way from the start.

    *Runs like the wind!!

  2. #2
    I see Glower stepping outside his apartment one fine Rubi-Ka day and seeing a field of ticked off smurfs four about a half second...followed by the obliteration of the apartment complex behind him from the synchronized opening burst

    Fear the smurfs, man! They're not those same cute blue dudes from the 80s!

    But solution wise, that's far better than FC breaking Clicksaver again. Not that I use it. But the decibels coming off the forums when it happens can shatter eardrums
    History admires the wise, but it elevates the brave. - Edmund Morris

    The first faults are theirs that commit them, the second theirs that permit them. - Unknown

    Did you ever get the feeling that the world had an abundance of idiots? And that God had arranged for you to meet every single one of them before you died? - Kuroshio

  3. #3
    Funny that you would say fixer, Hmm from what i'v been reading here, not many like them unless they have one, What better way to get back at them >:P

    I'm shure many when they first made it so you needed a % for the token chance many were mad, Look at it today, It's openly acepted and the way of the game.

  4. #4
    *gives this thread a quite doubtful stare*

    First off, this is not a good idea. Even though the economy is quite messed up, removing the possibility to blitz would not solve half as many problems as it would cause.

    You said, by doing this people there would all of a sudden be a market for items such as single armor pieces? Sure, but at what cost? Do players really wanna sit around watching the trade channel all day just in order to get those 7 pieces of armor in the right ql-range? I think not. And most people much prefere a full set than a patchwork armor. And not everyone fancy cloaks.

    Also, this would only strike at those professions with the ability to blitz (or sneak) missions, as in, mostly Fixers and Agents, and need I remind you that many of the smurfs you see running around today are twinks, which means they already got tons of cash to spend from one of their alts, where as those without rich alts, try their best to gather what money they have. Apart from blitzing, Fixers do have very few ways of making a decent income (unless I'm totally off), it's not like we got any IPs for tradeskills pre-150, and did you ever hear anyone say "Tipping for run-buff" or "Tipping for NCU-buff" ? Don't think so...

    But sure, if you want to spend all day staring at the trade channel hoping that someone will sell that last armor piece (which they most likely wont, unless you're really lucky), go ahead. It wont fix the economy as the cash and the items are already there, it just changes owner. People with too much cash just trade expensive items and cash between eachother, it's a cycle, and it will stay that way until they get some more efficient moneysink.

    And before anyone can say "oddlove is just whining because she's an übertwinked GA-Fixer a** yadda yadda" let me just say, I'm not twinked, I don't have GA, I don't have much cash either, and thus I only blitz when I need to upgrade weapons or armor.

    Hopefully I've managed to make a point here, otherwise, I'll be back...

    BTW, if you're griefing just because you think you cant blitz? Ask a fixer for runbuffs, they probably wont even ask you to tip, I know I won't
    Last edited by Poachie; Jan 16th, 2003 at 08:01:44.

  5. #5
    Originally posted by Oddlove

    ...
    Also, this would only strike at those professions with the ability to blitz (or sneak) missions, as in, mostly Fixers and Agents, and need I remind you that many of the smurfs you see running around today are twinks, which means they already got tons of cash to spend from one of their alts, where as those without rich alts, try their best to gather what money they have. Apart from blitzing, Fixers do have very few ways of making a decent income (unless I'm totally off), it's not like we got any IPs for tradeskills pre-150, and did you ever hear anyone say "Tipping for run-buff" or "Tipping for NCU-buff" ? Don't think so...

    ...
    Just a note: the minute you start finding implants above QL 125, you have a very stable income through stripping implants and sell the blanks to players
    History admires the wise, but it elevates the brave. - Edmund Morris

    The first faults are theirs that commit them, the second theirs that permit them. - Unknown

    Did you ever get the feeling that the world had an abundance of idiots? And that God had arranged for you to meet every single one of them before you died? - Kuroshio

  6. #6
    The solution is NOT to make credits harder to get. As a semi-newbie in my early 50s, I found it a major pain to try to make any money. I sneak mission after mission for pittance of money only to look at people wanting a bazillion credits for whatever they're selling. My roommate has resorted to buying credits online and I'm thinking about doing the same. I can spend an hours wages on credits or spend a couple weeks (at my level sneaking missions for creds but no exp) just to get a few million credits so I can buy decent equipment so I can go out and actually play for fun. Ugh.

    The solution is to find money sinks for those with millions of credits. Why not make a progressive tax that takes 0% - 30% of your credits once a week, depending upon how many you have (i.e. you pay no tax unless you have, say, 5 million or more credits). This would encourage people to spend money and it would discourage them from massing mad amounts of credits.
    Guide to Teaming With Docs! is the funniest post ever. | "Engie Got Bot" song spoof
    AO chat log of Titanic sinking is the second funniest post ever

    No matter how many levels I gain, the Lag Monster is always red to me.

    Currently playing The Secret World.

  7. #7

    If mission is completed, then mission is completed!

    You don't get tokens for blitzing, because you didn't kill anyone, and those are after all BRAVery tokens.

    But the mission you picked clearly specified an objective, for example finding The Pink Panties, and so if you fulfilled the mission requirements and did find the item, why wouldn't you get a reward?

    The notion that fixers are rich, because they blitz, and others are not, because they can't, is a total fallacy. The fixers can do it better and faster (because they have fgrid, grid evac and don't have to beg for hot n run buffs), but as an advie I have no problem blitzing myself to a very comfortable standard of living, which I personally consider to have about 3 mill available.

    Granted, as an adv I too have run buffs (albeit somewhat bumpy ones, and I freely admit that I too prefer GF for that smoother and richer ride), but then again I have never had a Fixer refuse me a hot n run either. They may have been afk, or possibly just ignoring me (I doubt this), but in the vast majority of cases I get one with no fuss whatsoever. Once you have a decent Run Speed, and possibly (well, preferably really) HoT, absolutely ANYONE can blitz to their hearts delight.

    Tax? Cooky idea, I'm not totally against it, but it raises 2 very important questions: Who collects the taxes, and for what?

    I play Clan Rimor, and so there exists no central authority worthy of the name, and anyone trying to become the central authority better not start it off by taxing Clanners! Omnis do have sorta kinda a central authority, but on the other hand it's not as if the corporation DOES anything for them, except produce some rather inferior armor.

    Taxes for what? Because I totally refuse to be taxed just to get rid of money in the game, and so the taxes have to go to SOMETHING that we can see, even if it is all in the end a digital illusion, be it money, taxes OR infrastructure.

    Maybe a whompa/grid tax to fund more whompas and grid points? I know Tir could use 1, possibly 2 more grid terms, and so could probably Omni Ent and NLC too. The outback is very poor in infrastructure too, lacking not just in transportation, but also save terms, reclaim terms and banks.
    Reverend Revelator Ramagano, Proud Something of Alpha Omega

    Alpha Omega: Fighting For Your Future, Today

    No, I'm not back.

    How embarrassing, after all these years it turns out I CAN'T spell **ncom with an F and a U, talk about egg on my face eh?

  8. #8

    any change to blitzing had better deal with the entire economy (including item drops)

    I'm an NT and I am working my ass off blitzing missions (as best an NT without Fixer buffs can) to make 40-50M credits to buy Nullity Sphere MK1. All because the disc is EXTREMELY rare and the places it drops are constantly camped by other professions, who while not necessarily seeking NS are more then happy to keep it when it drops.

    Before FC goes messing with the only way anyone can make enough credits to buy essential items they had better think about the consequences and deal with them BEFOREHAND.

    Wooti

  9. #9
    Runners and dodgers, sneakers and calmers would all be DIRECTLY hit by this. So that's: Agents, Crats, Fixers, NTs, Adventurers.

    Add to this anyone who gets a runbuff/HoT from a fixer. (and any low-levels with a decent layer shield on)

    GA fixers are the fastest and probably the safest.
    Non-GA fixers are equally as fast but more risky.
    Evasion classes (MAs) with runbuffs can get close to a non-GA fixer.
    Calmers are medium speed and quite safe (if not reaching too high above their level).
    Sneakers are slowest.

    Without spending an couple of hours in a mission (if your suggestion was followed) just to have a chance of getting a single item even the non-blitzers would suffer. Engineers would not be able to upgrade their bot, MPs would not have a chance of getting good pets/infuses/mochams, Traders would not get their higher level wrangles, Docs would never see their SFA nano.

    NO ONE would be able to equip anything more than a few QLs above their level with the reduced availability of mochams, wrangles and SFA. Which would make FIGHTING through a high-level mission to hit the magical "50% required for reward" IMPOSSIBLE.

    I'm a level 81 non-GA fixer who only blitzes items I need or low-level (i.e. mission slider below 50%) armour sets for my friends who are just starting AO and occasionally something to sell so I can buy implants/items outside my range -- I do not have untold millions of credits, my dearest purchases off of players have been 700k for a belt and 350k for a nano, the most money I have ever sold any item to a player for was 500k.

    And don't forget that the time I've spent blitzing, I have NOT been levelling. I spend my time the way I need to in order to get the reward (xp/item/cash) that I want.
    Last edited by SBExp; Jan 16th, 2003 at 12:00:53.
    Turchin - Fat Crat member of Illuminati.

  10. #10
    Hmm...

    Well, I must say I agree with Revelator here... apart from GA using Fixers, the Fixers aren't the best blitzers in the game, they simply have all the necessary tools "by default"

    If I had to risk it, I'd say the best blitzers in the game are Enforcers. Why? Not only can they ask a Fixer for GSF and HoT's, they have tons of hp, mongo, and on top of that, they have rage.

    (GA changes everything tho, but remember, blitzing is 80% about runspeed. It's quite possible to blitz a level 200+ mission totally "naked" once you reach the likes of 1300+ runspeed)
    Basher Tarr, Engineer, and damn proud of it!

    (really)

  11. #11
    Personally, I like the idea of making a mission item reward similar to a token reward, ie dependant on %age mission completion. I do feel that the economy in RK1 / Atlantean is pretty fubar, and it needs to be addressed.

  12. #12
    The end of blitzing won't change a dang thing. Or rather, it'l make matters even worse. Think about it. You have players with millions upon millions of credits. They will still trade items among themselves for loads of money. Then you have the lowlevel startups, who don't have any money, can't blitz gear for themselves, can't blitz gear to sell.

    I like the tax idea, make it like an income tax, whenever money is transferred between players, say 5% of it disappears. That should slowly bring down the circulating money mass.
    Basher Tarr, Engineer, and damn proud of it!

    (really)

  13. #13
    Originally posted by WilloTheFist
    Personally, I like the idea of making a mission item reward similar to a token reward, ie dependant on %age mission completion. I do feel that the economy in RK1 / Atlantean is pretty fubar, and it needs to be addressed.
    Missing out on a token at 98% complete because a mob died in an acid pool is annoying.

    Being denied the nano/item you spent 2 hours trying to get would piss off ANY player.
    Turchin - Fat Crat member of Illuminati.

  14. #14
    if they had done this from day one, no problem, but seeing how people allready have made 100 of millions blitzing, cutting off the chance for the later players to do the same would be just cruel and would creat a huge gap betwene the poor and the rich in the game, begging would for sure get really a big thing and thosewith money would probably get non-stop tells... also you might say that those people with that kind of cash will burn them away eventually. that is unfortunatley in most cases not correct, unless they are saving up for a GA, dragon or some other luxury equipment.. cause they have allready what they need.

    currenly the game is made so that anyone can get loads of credits if they really invest time into it, much like in real life. the pace you get the money is however perhaps a bit quick.. I wouldnt mind them perhaps tuning down on the cash reward and such. but removing it unless 50% or more completed would hurt the weak professions the most.
    Operation impending doom 2 seems to have started with patch 15.6.5
    12.6 first contact, 14.6 second attempt, 16.6 Invasion of the gabber bots ?
    Old and bitter player, currently playing: Justincase GA4 wearing phix0r
    Originally posted by Cz
    I already saw this thread, but refrained from answering due to the pleasant show of confidence from Lumin.
    Sing a song for FunCom

  15. #15
    Im an MA.

    When I need something I blitz it.

    Take this away and il be soloing crappy missions all day and I wont be happy.

    *glares around the room*
    I am Kong.

    Strong and passionate, I tend to be misunderstood, sometimes even feared. I don't want to fight, I don't want to cause trouble, all I ask is a little love, and a little peace. If I don't get what I want, I get angry, and throw barrels and flaming oil at whatever's stopping me.

  16. #16
    Originally posted by Slicerx
    I like the tax idea, make it like an income tax, whenever money is transferred between players, say 5% of it disappears. That should slowly bring down the circulating money mass.
    Make giving those alts a large amount of startup cash a bit painful Maybe not too bad a thing.

    Open up a few exclusive nightclubs (Eden?) and have an entrance fee (could be done like some of the ferry "ticket machines").

    And the REALLY easy ones for Funcom to change:-

    Make the new vehicles USABLE by more players (but keep the costs up) = more players putting cash into the shop terms.

    Sell QL200 treatment/nano kits in the shops (with a suitably high price).

    Sell empty QL200 implants in shops at about 50-100% higher cost than they currently sell for player-to-player (still useful to blitz and sell, but if you want the convenience and have the credits....)
    Turchin - Fat Crat member of Illuminati.

  17. #17
    Originally posted by SBExp


    Sell QL200 treatment/nano kits in the shops (with a suitably high price).

    Sell empty QL200 implants in shops at about 50-100% higher cost than they currently sell for player-to-player (still useful to blitz and sell, but if you want the convenience and have the credits....)
    Now these are GOOD ideas! If you want money to go away, then make available things that people WANT to buy, and which they then WILL deplete, for so to happily go buy MORE of the same.

    I know prices are different for Omni and Clan, but for me a ql 125 basic imp cost around 60k. Make the price of a ql 200 basic imp 200-300k and I have absolutely NO objections. Nor do I think anyone else would object much, even if the price went above that too.

    Chargers and kits are even better, because every single player who reaches TL5 would want one, and would probably not complain about too high prices on these items either. I do know that I have stopped putting IP into First Aid and TS (as an Adv I have NO TS req nanos), because I can't get higher kits to justify it. Or more to the point, I CAN get thm, but it's really MUCH too much work.
    Reverend Revelator Ramagano, Proud Something of Alpha Omega

    Alpha Omega: Fighting For Your Future, Today

    No, I'm not back.

    How embarrassing, after all these years it turns out I CAN'T spell **ncom with an F and a U, talk about egg on my face eh?

  18. #18
    This is a really really bad idea.

    1) Plenty of prof’s blitz missions, in fact ALL can blitz MAX missions if they go get a few buffs. It just means spending some ip’s on run skill and evades. Fixers just happen to be better at it than other profs. This is after all how they were designed.
    2) If cash becomes harder to get and likewise items become fewer and further between. Then no one will benefit. Prices will remain artificially high and only the rich will EVER be able to afford them.
    3) Fewer items will be available on the market forcing their prices higher still. The crappy bits of armor that some people mission for still won’t sell to anyone other than a shop.
    4) Many, many more players will be unhappy as they won’t be able to get the stuff they want/need for their characters.
    5) Those that already have the stuff will be whole magnitudes more powerful than the up coming characters that cannot get or afford the stuff.
    6) Fixers and agents will feel much less inclined to mission items for other players and will instead concentrate on getting stuff for themselves and possibly their guild.
    7) Tax is bad as any cash limit will just encourage players to make alts to hold on to the creds or alternatively the guild bank might actually become a proper bank and be used for holding players spare cash.
    8) It would be easy to duck any cash transfer limit to avoid paying tax, it merely means making more transfers to stay below any set limit
    9) Those that don’t try to avoid taxation will be more harshly penalised than those that do. Casual players as usual will be the hardest hit which is very unfortunate as it is these players that seem to be the ones complaining and in need of assistance.

    The only reason there are large amounts of creds circulating is as a result of the cred duping exploits. FC didn’t take these sums away from the people/orgs it suspected of duping them they just dished out a bunch of week long bans. So It will take a long time for this money to peculate through the player base.

    NT’s and Crats can Mez and open every chest in a mission without having to kill a single mob, how would this be handled? The suggestion merely takes the cash earning potential of agents and fixers (or for that matter anyone who gets a run buff) and shifts it to Mezers for which no one can bet buffs.

    It would appear that this problem is worst on RK1. RK2 is just fine, any messing with the economy there is completely unnecessary. The results of exploiters really shouldn’t be to punish the entire AO population. FC should have been much more harsh and taken ALL suspected exploited creds away from players and orgs that made them, rather than just handing out a few temp bans.

    Tiggy

  19. #19

    Re: Anti Blitsing

    Originally posted by Glower
    And they were saying the majority for the mass amounts of cash is blitsing making the prices so high.
    1. They're wrong.
    2. This wouldn't stop calmers from making money, would it?
    3. Fixing stuff is what fixers do (well, some of us anyway).

    The only professions that I know of that have a hard time blitzing, calming or sneaking self-buffed, if that is what they want to do with their char, are MPs and Engies.

    Think again.

    /G13
    pirates. with lasers.
    Are you having an argument on the internet, again?

    Gene13 - on a space odyssey since 2001
    XXX - N

    Some day your ship will come in, but you will be at the airport.

  20. #20
    things are high priced because people are WILLING to pay that. And the economy here isn't messed up because of blitzing, it's because of org bank exploits and duped credits still being around. You know, the ones that were there apparently 1.5 years after launch and they finally found them.

    Things will always be high priced if it's rare.

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