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Thread: BUMP for new complete IPR

  1. #161

    Re: yes but we differ upon the why

    Originally posted by Blackwing
    *edit: gamma is i think not prof locked, neither is the custom reet so i am still unsure about the correct time frame they popped up*
    I am 99.999% positive that the gamma is fixer only, if it wasn't everyone would be using one at around level 41 and I do have 2 of them sat in my bank, so I have seen them

    Hugs

    lilnymph
    Lilnymph - Clan Fixer - RK1
    lilnymph wrote on November 21st, 2003 08:01:01:
    You may take our postcount threads, but you will never take our FREEDOM!!!!!
    Originally posted by Cz
    The post count is mine! All mine! Mwahahahah!

    40.476190476190474% of me is a huge nerd! How about you?
    Style over Substance

  2. #162

    he ... true does not really matter...

    my fixer never got one because i had horrors about this dungeon from the time i camped for my crat suit.

    its just that a clan mate was using it on his ... hmm forgot.

    it is a nice gun for a while but it is not necessarily worth the trouble unless you stop leveling.

    http://auno.org/ao/db.php?cmd=view&id=156770&t=ag
    sept 03 - the day ao was keeled by sl.

    gone now. byebye.

  3. #163

    Re: yes but we differ upon the why

    Originally posted by Blackwing
    my basic argument is that ipr and class specific items are in no way related.

    again we are at a deadlock. you cannot prove me wrong, neither can i prove you wrong.
    My point is that if you put a great Piercing weapon in the game, it will get used by players in one of two ways:

    No IPRs: enforcers can spend a few levels maxing green piercing skill and add it to their repertoire.

    With IPRs: everyone can reset their skills and use it.

    Therefore, if FunCom wants to put a great Piercing weapon in the game, but doesn't want everyone to use it, they would make it Enforcer-only.

    I think that is one reason (maybe not the only reason) that we are seeing more and more profession-specific weapons.

  4. #164
    Hmm....don't remember if I bump'ed this post b4...if so it's done again :P
    Traumatizer of Ragnarok.

    The second coming.

  5. #165

    Re: Re: yes but we differ upon the why

    Originally posted by Curmudgeon


    My point is that if you put a great Piercing weapon in the game, it will get used by players in one of two ways:

    No IPRs: enforcers can spend a few levels maxing green piercing skill and add it to their repertoire.

    With IPRs: everyone can reset their skills and use it.

    Therefore, if FunCom wants to put a great Piercing weapon in the game, but doesn't want everyone to use it, they would make it Enforcer-only.

    I think that is one reason (maybe not the only reason) that we are seeing more and more profession-specific weapons.
    It's also the reason why a weapon like the Edge of Tarasque is guaranteed to be used by every enforcer once the buffs are there for them to reach the skill levels. Regardless of their ip investment.

    There's no way for them to reward someone that's invested heavily in any weapon type throughout their character's development because everyone can switch to that weapon easily. There can never be a group of top pistol users. Or a group of top assault rifle users.

    Nobody should have an objection to a small group of people that sacrifice in other areas to have a superior weapon or nanoskill. Those that implant in the weaponskill despite nanoskill conflicts and vice versa. Those that raised a skill to the maximum every level from the start.
    History admires the wise, but it elevates the brave. - Edmund Morris

    The first faults are theirs that commit them, the second theirs that permit them. - Unknown

    Did you ever get the feeling that the world had an abundance of idiots? And that God had arranged for you to meet every single one of them before you died? - Kuroshio

  6. #166

    Re: Re: but if you look at a weapon

    Originally posted by Curmudgeon


    Blackwing, here's my counter-counter argument:

    People seem to feel that "weapon switches" are a gawd-given right in this game. I disagree. If you are an enforcer and you go 2hb for most of your career, but then decide to go to 2he at 161st, you are quite capable of raising 2he over the next few levels to max it. IPRs were not introduced to this game so that people could switch weapon styles at will. Although it's inevitable that people will use them for exactly that.

    Yes, the static skill system has already been FUBARed by IPRs. They are starting to put in more and more profession-specific and level-specific items, to cover the mess they made. If your static skill system is starting to dissolve, you have to prop it up with gear restrictions.
    No you should play the same old char for the rest of your boring missery life shouldnt you? We can't let people have variety. That would be to fun! and Fun we can't have.. We must have responsibility and whatnot!.

    Christ.
    RK1 - Hajk - Solitus - Lvl 217/DR 16 - Nanotech - Apocalypse
    ---
    Explorer 60% / Socializer 53% / Killer 46% / Achiever 40%

  7. #167
    Originally posted by Bima
    Dude, who in the world is this directed to?

    I know several of the people here arguing against IPR are among the people who spend an awful lot of time and energy trying hard to help other players in many, many ways, from advice on how to make more powerful characters to explaining game mechanics to helping acquire items to putting them in touch with others who can provide services they cannot and so on. Maybe you should do some research into that before throwing about accusations of self-centeredness and greed.
    How would give anyone more ipr's or a full ipr in any way break the game? make it worse? I see lots of comments, and i still cant figure out why anyone else should choose the lifeway of another onces charater.

    Still all i can see its self centered and greed to not let anyone else have fun. Because yet again not do i go around in Rubi-ka telling you what you could do or not do do i? Maybe you shoud go and do some research to quote yourself.
    RK1 - Hajk - Solitus - Lvl 217/DR 16 - Nanotech - Apocalypse
    ---
    Explorer 60% / Socializer 53% / Killer 46% / Achiever 40%

  8. #168
    Originally posted by Kuroshio
    You call other people jealous? You've got that backwards. They've got what you can't earn and it's eating you up inside. So you want it given to you. How can they be jealous of you? They've got what you want. Hell, I've got more than that. I've got that, plus every reset point I've earned so far. What should I be jealous of? You needing help to do what others can do by themselves?

    Tell ya what. I'll support regular resets and additional IPR...in exchange for something:
    So why the freaking what do you care what others want to do if your not jealous or dont care? Because of the simple reason that you DO care.

    And wth is a IPR if not a IPR? Yes i know the thread was about full IPR and still support it because people have been gone under that time when they were and missed it. If you dont like it.. Dont use it. As simple as that. and hey i got nothing against trading for something but by your remark you seem to be totally against IPR.
    RK1 - Hajk - Solitus - Lvl 217/DR 16 - Nanotech - Apocalypse
    ---
    Explorer 60% / Socializer 53% / Killer 46% / Achiever 40%

  9. #169
    Originally posted by lilnymph

    Hajkster, I am failing to see your problem. Funcom gave you 15 Ipr's over the lifetime of your character to use AS YOU WISHED. Now I say the most sensible use for them, and the one funcom gave them for originally was to keep them for when funcom nerfs something major on your character. however you chose not to, and used them for other things and have had an advantage in the short term from doing so. Thats fine, hope you enjoyed being uber. Now you have to live with the consequences of your actions. I am sorry, but thats the way it is.

    Hugs

    lilnymph
    To Correct you i used IPR's to come away from a weapon that has been nerfed that totally gimped the proffesion i am in both turns of AR and Speed. It wasn't any weapon. So i Switched just to find out that the gun i switched to never could wreck the expected outcome because the AR on that gun in return need to be enourmess. Then FC decided to release a new series of guns in the first area i had HAD skills in. So if your gona see it that way its not my fault but FC's. I have never Been uber, i will never be uber, but i have always thought about being about normal. And it lacks to me why anyone else would freaking care what the heck i do with my charater? It's my charater damnit. Go work on your own instead. ;P
    RK1 - Hajk - Solitus - Lvl 217/DR 16 - Nanotech - Apocalypse
    ---
    Explorer 60% / Socializer 53% / Killer 46% / Achiever 40%

  10. #170
    Originally posted by Hajkster


    To Correct you i used IPR's to come away from a weapon that has been nerfed that totally gimped the proffesion i am in both turns of AR and Speed. It wasn't any weapon. So i Switched just to find out that the gun i switched to never could wreck the expected outcome because the AR on that gun in return need to be enourmess. Then FC decided to release a new series of guns in the first area i had HAD skills in. So if your gona see it that way its not my fault but FC's. I have never Been uber, i will never be uber, but i have always thought about being about normal. And it lacks to me why anyone else would freaking care what the heck i do with my charater? It's my charater damnit. Go work on your own instead. ;P
    "It's not my fault"
    "It's not my fault"
    "It's not my fault"
    "It's not my fault"

    What weapon did they nerf, what weapon did you change to, and what weapon are you lusting over now? Cause I suspect somewhere in the information you're not giving we'll find:

    It is your fault
    History admires the wise, but it elevates the brave. - Edmund Morris

    The first faults are theirs that commit them, the second theirs that permit them. - Unknown

    Did you ever get the feeling that the world had an abundance of idiots? And that God had arranged for you to meet every single one of them before you died? - Kuroshio

  11. #171
    Originally posted by Hajkster

    It's my charater damnit. Go work on your own instead. ;P
    well go work on your char then instead of crying to funcom to work on him for you.
    I am Dnastyone Official Broom pusher for The Professionals
    Painmage my newest funnest guy
    PHEAR ME RK1 Yazule IMMMM BACK

    I would have to say that this is an typicall example of how an flame should not look like. You need to think things through and calm down before you try to write an flame... Im sorry but I would rate this flame with an 1. Aggression is to high, grammar and cursing isnt to well planned... Maybe he has an point somewhere in there but I dont even want to find it. - Centurion3

    ROFLOL

  12. #172
    Originally posted by Yazule


    well go work on your char then instead of crying to funcom to work on him for you.
    It's not me crying that i dont want anymore IPR's... cryer.
    RK1 - Hajk - Solitus - Lvl 217/DR 16 - Nanotech - Apocalypse
    ---
    Explorer 60% / Socializer 53% / Killer 46% / Achiever 40%

  13. #173

  14. #174
    Originally posted by Kuroshio


    "It's not my fault"
    "It's not my fault"
    "It's not my fault"
    "It's not my fault"

    What weapon did they nerf, what weapon did you change to, and what weapon are you lusting over now? Cause I suspect somewhere in the information you're not giving we'll find:

    It is your fault
    Did i say It's not my fault four times?. Arent we abit childish now huh? Oh i forgot. We can't have fun. Sorry. And YET FREAKING AGAIN. What do you have to do with my charater? Because its you who arent answearing the question. i can keep making the same comments i have made in the hole thread, it wouldnt mind what i even said because you have made up your mind that none should get a new ipr because you think so, whatever the reasons may be. It's all about you. as i said before. Go play a FPS then.
    RK1 - Hajk - Solitus - Lvl 217/DR 16 - Nanotech - Apocalypse
    ---
    Explorer 60% / Socializer 53% / Killer 46% / Achiever 40%

  15. #175
    Originally posted by Hajkster


    Did i say It's not my fault four times?. Arent we abit childish now huh?
    I was wondering if you'd get it. That's exactly what you sounded like. A kid blaming everyone else for your own choices.

    Originally posted by Hajkster
    Oh i forgot. We can't have fun. Sorry. And YET FREAKING AGAIN. What do you have to do with my charater? Because its you who arent answearing the question. i can keep making the same comments i have made in the hole thread, it wouldnt mind what i even said because you have made up your mind that none should get a new ipr because you think so, whatever the reasons may be. It's all about you. as i said before. Go play a FPS then.
    What do I have to do with your character?

    Well when Funcom nerfs an item I'm using because there are too many people like you uberizing too easily, my character gets affected.

    When Funcom puts an item on a mob that's a royal pain in the ass to kill for me and 20 of my buddies just for a slim chance at getting one item in order to keep it out of the hands of people like you, my character gets affected.

    When Funcom doesn't reward the people that have the best skills in order to keep items/abilities away from people like you, my character gets affected.

    When I have to hear you exaggerate how you've screwed up your character beyond repair when really you're just out of IPR and can't change to the new flavor of the week, it affects my future plans to have children. Cause if they act like you all the time, I'll choose to buy a dog.

    And no, you can't have fun at the expense of others. The fun you want means constant nerfs, slow to no item implementation, more camping of mobs, more super mobs to fight for marginally better items, more profession clones in the game (almost all high level atrox enforcers looking the same), and less sense of accomplishment at doing anything other than getting a quick jolly every time your gun goes off.

    AO is a RPG. In a RPG, the skills you develop should be more important than the items. You want to play a dungeon crawl. In a dungeon crawl the items you obtain are more important than anything else. So I recommend you go play Icewind Dale and leave the MMORPG genre. Nobody that calls their game a RPG will satisfy you.
    History admires the wise, but it elevates the brave. - Edmund Morris

    The first faults are theirs that commit them, the second theirs that permit them. - Unknown

    Did you ever get the feeling that the world had an abundance of idiots? And that God had arranged for you to meet every single one of them before you died? - Kuroshio

  16. #176
    Originally posted by Kuroshio


    >I was wondering if you'd get it. That's exactly what you
    >sounded like. A kid blaming everyone else for your own choices.

    Did you ever read what i first said or were you just fast to flame away?

    >What do I have to do with your character?

    exactly! nothing!

    >Well when Funcom nerfs an item I'm using because there are
    >too many people like you uberizing too easily, my character gets
    >affected.

    No it doesnt. Just counterwise it with get something better. You seem to be an expert on skills so that should be easily done.

    >When Funcom puts an item on a mob that's a royal pain in the
    >ass to kill for me and 20 of my buddies just for a slim chance at
    >getting one item in order to keep it out of the hands of people
    >like you, my character gets affected.

    When you are selfish and get jealous of others i can see how you dont get any help with the mobs. Be nice instead and maybe it change. Think of others instead of just yourself.

    >When Funcom doesn't reward the people that have the best
    >skills in order to keep items/abilities away from people like you,
    >my character gets affected.

    No it doesnt. How would changing my skills affect your charater? I still need the equipment, the experience and the luck with me.

    >When I have to hear you exaggerate how you've screwed up
    >your character beyond repair when really you're just out of IPR
    >and can't change to the new flavor of the week, it affects my
    >future plans to have children. Cause if they act like you all the >
    >time, I'll choose to buy a dog.

    What the ever heck you do on your freetime doesnt affect me. This is a game... Remember?

    >And no, you can't have fun at the expense of others. The fun
    >you want means constant nerfs, slow to no item
    >implementation, more camping of mobs, more super mobs to
    >fight for marginally better items, more profession clones in the
    >game (almost all high level atrox enforcers looking the same),
    >and less sense of accomplishment at doing anything other than
    >getting a quick jolly every time your gun goes off.

    Your the one that is for nerfing. No more Full IPR's. You just said it yourself. How is GETTING a full ipr nerfing?

    I do like camping of mobs myself but thats merely my opinion. Am i not alowed to do that either? So what if i want a gun with a NT to look like a soldier. Ill never get the attack rating of a soldier anyway.

    >AO is a RPG. In a RPG, the skills you develop should be more
    >important than the items. You want to play a dungeon crawl. In
    >a dungeon crawl the items you obtain are more important than
    >anything else. So I recommend you go play Icewind Dale and
    >leave the MMORPG genre. Nobody that calls their game a RPG
    >will satisfy you.
    '

    AO is not a rpg. its a MMORPG. Icewind dale is more of a RPG. A MMORPG should be satisfying everyone to a degree.

    No your the one that want to play dungeon crawl. Get that item with the skills i have just collected aca Diablo II and then reroll to play another char to get new skills. Fine, You got play icewind dale.

    Im the one that wants to work on my charater, make him a part of me. Give him a roll in a massive multi online "Role" playing game.
    RK1 - Hajk - Solitus - Lvl 217/DR 16 - Nanotech - Apocalypse
    ---
    Explorer 60% / Socializer 53% / Killer 46% / Achiever 40%

  17. #177
    Originally posted by Bima
    Dude, who in the world is this directed to?

    I know several of the people here arguing against IPR are among the people who spend an awful lot of time and energy trying hard to help other players in many, many ways, from advice on how to make more powerful characters to explaining game mechanics to helping acquire items to putting them in touch with others who can provide services they cannot and so on. Maybe you should do some research into that before throwing about accusations of self-centeredness and greed.
    Sorry, I take it back.

    But when someone comes up telling me what to do, taking away my freedom i sometimes get pissed.
    RK1 - Hajk - Solitus - Lvl 217/DR 16 - Nanotech - Apocalypse
    ---
    Explorer 60% / Socializer 53% / Killer 46% / Achiever 40%

  18. #178
    Originally posted by Hajkster


    Sorry, I take it back.

    But when someone comes up telling me what to do, taking away my freedom i sometimes get pissed.
    Ok. I understand.

    Please realize that mostly this hasn't been about taking away any freedoms with existing IPR, it has been arguments against giving a new complete IPR, a freedom which doesn't currently exist.
    Bima, Golly, Whatsamatta, Laslingis and an army of sub-100 alts

  19. #179
    Originally posted by Hajkster

    >Well when Funcom nerfs an item I'm using because there are
    >too many people like you uberizing too easily, my character gets
    >affected.

    No it doesnt. Just counterwise it with get something better. You seem to be an expert on skills so that should be easily done.
    No. You cannot tell me I have to go switch weapons and skills because an item/ability got nerfed. I chose bow for my trader. I chose smg for my crat. I chose 2 handed edge for my NT. I picked up bow later in my trader's career, but the weapon skills my crat and NT use I picked out before I even created the character.

    Why should I get punished when too many people like you, that want to be among the best but don't want to put in the work to do it, overbalance one of the abilities I have?

    Originally posted by Hajkster
    When you are selfish and get jealous of others i can see how you dont get any help with the mobs. Be nice instead and maybe it change. Think of others instead of just yourself.
    Hajkster you want what I can and do earn without reset points. How am I jealous? Selfish? Maybe, though if you earn the right to be as good as (or better than) me I won't complain. Right now though, with reset points, anyone with a credit card and access to Ebay can duplicate the efforts of the best players. Just gets down to who's credit limit is higher.

    Originally posted by Hajkster
    >When Funcom doesn't reward the people that have the best
    >skills in order to keep items/abilities away from people like you,
    >my character gets affected.

    No it doesnt. How would changing my skills affect your charater? I still need the equipment, the experience and the luck with me.
    Unless an item says no drop, you can simply buy it if you have enough credits. And credits are easy to earn. Hell, The Mockers will go get it for you if the item is missionable. Most good organizations will gladly help their members get a specific item.

    Originally posted by Hajkster
    Your the one that is for nerfing. No more Full IPR's. You just said it yourself. How is GETTING a full ipr nerfing?

    I do like camping of mobs myself but thats merely my opinion. Am i not alowed to do that either? So what if i want a gun with a NT to look like a soldier. Ill never get the attack rating of a soldier anyway.
    A complete IPR will almost definately mess up the balance in the game. Everybody that thinks just like you will rush to whatever is the latest fad in weapons. I'd bet that if a complete reset was offered tomorrow, within a week the number of people using Manex Catastrophes would at least triple. And I'd bet that the Manex gets nerfed shortly thereafter.

    Originally posted by Hajkster
    AO is not a rpg. its a MMORPG. Icewind dale is more of a RPG. A MMORPG should be satisfying everyone to a degree.

    No your the one that want to play dungeon crawl. Get that item with the skills i have just collected aca Diablo II and then reroll to play another char to get new skills. Fine, You got play icewind dale.

    Im the one that wants to work on my charater, make him a part of me. Give him a roll in a massive multi online "Role" playing game.
    Black Isle will tell you straight to your face that Icewind Dale is a dungeon crawl. If you want their RPG, you'll have to pick up Baldur's Gate.

    In a dungeon crawl, skill is not as important as:
    [list=1][*]Killing everything in the game[*]Getting as many of the best items as possible[/list=1]

    AO is a RPG. The "MMO" part just means you get to play with a lot more people because its online. IPR negates the character development part of the game. Complete Reset do so even more. For what you advocate, why bother having skills? The devs could just eliminate the skill categories and say "You can use any of these items when you reach XXX experience points".
    History admires the wise, but it elevates the brave. - Edmund Morris

    The first faults are theirs that commit them, the second theirs that permit them. - Unknown

    Did you ever get the feeling that the world had an abundance of idiots? And that God had arranged for you to meet every single one of them before you died? - Kuroshio

  20. #180
    Originally posted by Kuroshio
    No. You cannot tell me I have to go switch weapons and skills because an item/ability got nerfed. I chose bow for my trader. I chose smg for my crat. I chose 2 handed edge for my NT. I picked up bow later in my trader's career, but the weapon skills my crat and NT use I picked out before I even created the character.

    Exactly And you cannot tell me that i shouldnt get a Full IPR.. Getting to see the connection now?

    Originally posted by Kuroshio
    Why should I get punished when too many people like you, that want to be among the best but don't want to put in the work to do it, overbalance one of the abilities I have?

    The hard part is leveling. I have reached 200. That is the end of the line m8. How hard is it putting points in to skills? I really dont seem to get this one. Are you telling me i havent worked on my char?

    Originally posted by Kuroshio
    Hajkster you want what I can and do earn without reset points. How am I jealous? Selfish? Maybe, though if you earn the right to be as good as (or better than) me I won't complain. Right now though, with reset points, anyone with a credit card and access to Ebay can duplicate the efforts of the best players. Just gets down to who's credit limit is higher.

    Jealous = When you envy someone and would like to have the same. In this case you cant so you deny anyone to get the chance to get it. Simple. You have brought up Ebay since start. It's their money. They are just taking over someone else that put the work in to the char. But now when you mention selfish i have to agree with that to.

    Originally posted by Kuroshio
    Unless an item says no drop, you can simply buy it if you have enough credits. And credits are easy to earn. Hell, The Mockers will go get it for you if the item is missionable. Most good organizations will gladly help their members get a specific item.

    You were talking about Items from mobs that takes 20 buds to take down or what ever you now said.

    Originally posted by Kuroshio
    A complete IPR will almost definately mess up the balance in the game. Everybody that thinks just like you will rush to whatever is the latest fad in weapons. I'd bet that if a complete reset was offered tomorrow, within a week the number of people using Manex Catastrophes would at least triple. And I'd bet that the Manex gets nerfed shortly thereafter.

    So how do i think? Explain to me how i think. How will Manex get nerfed? Its a hard hitting slow weapon. Its the type it is. A weapon simply just not get nerfed because many people use it. But if it is to strong etc it will get nerfed.

    Originally posted by Kuroshio
    Black Isle will tell you straight to your face that Icewind Dale is a dungeon crawl. If you want their RPG, you'll have to pick up Baldur's Gate.

    In a dungeon crawl, skill is not as important as:
    [list=1][*]Killing everything in the game[*]Getting as many of the best items as possible[/list=1]

    AO is a RPG. The "MMO" part just means you get to play with a lot more people because its online. IPR negates the character development part of the game. Complete Reset do so even more. For what you advocate, why bother having skills? The devs could just eliminate the skill categories and say "You can use any of these items when you reach XXX experience points".
    I didnt say Icewind dale wasnt a dungeon crawl. I just that the type of game you were after is dungeon crawl. Yea why bother having skills?.. You just want chars to reroll if they choosed wrong anyway.
    RK1 - Hajk - Solitus - Lvl 217/DR 16 - Nanotech - Apocalypse
    ---
    Explorer 60% / Socializer 53% / Killer 46% / Achiever 40%

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