Rimor Wars

**Dyna18** · Jan 2nd, 2003, 22:31:21

Originally posted by Isoldei
...

Damn you isoldei... you may not write often, but you sure write long essays

gonna read now what you wrote

**Dyna18** · Jan 2nd, 2003, 22:46:10

About your comment Isoldei:
Allthough some forget it because they are in-game 14 hours a day, AO is still a game....

Meaning people play AO to have fun, and for many losing is not something they like. So if they keep on losing time after time, a large group of them will be tempted to join the winning side.

I hate how things are going for omni right now. I don't mean the fact that we lose constantly, but what I hate, is that there hardly is any incentive to turn this around. For 2 months we haven't been able to get more then 10 people to tara. And also for towers I noticed a lot of battles where towers were under clan attack and there was no combined action at all to save those towers (except from a hand full of org members who owned the towers).

We do have a small number of organised raids lately, but a global movement to stop the clan invasion needs a lot more work.
Right now, there is noone standing up trying to lead the masses, since tara broke down 3 months ago, noone has been willing to put down the effort it takes to change this.

So like I said, I hate how things are right now. So for now I'll keep on waiting till there is a leader willing to organise us against the clans.

**_____________Isoldei** · Jan 2nd, 2003, 22:56:28

yep totally agree, no fun why login? as I said some brief period of organization so that later you can log in and jump in on something happening. It is just a game and not all can play that much but point is its gonna be boring and losing battle if somehow Omni doesnt change things...really don't ask me have no idea why anyone would bother at this point...just rating really.

**__________Little Rot** · Jan 2nd, 2003, 23:25:36

For every OT that wants to switch to Clan, I will buy you all a Clan application and deliver it. The less OT I have to fight is the more XP I get. I've been seeing a lot, and I mean a lot, of OT switching to Clan lately and it sorta takes the fun out of it.

**_____________Losobal** · Jan 2nd, 2003, 23:50:53

Hmm. Heh maybe they should invert the bonus xp formula. Then you have to choose (as a side) which is more important the buffs available from holding a tower or the bonus xp. Yes yes, I know it is logical that the side holding most towers should get more bonuses, but especially on RK2, its compounding matters, not only does clan hold more land and have more bonuses for its fighters when it comes time to beat on (yet again) Omni, but they gain xp faster, increasing their ability to beat on Omni types. Add the sheer advantage that clans have in raw numbers, no wonder Omni keeps losing ground.

Course..that would end up giving neutrals the best xp bonus of all, ....so nevermind! Screw the neutrals!

**p00finger** · Jan 3rd, 2003, 01:00:42

Originally posted by Rotamus
For every OT that wants to switch to Clan, I will buy you all a Clan application and deliver it. The less OT I have to fight is the more XP I get. I've been seeing a lot, and I mean a lot, of OT switching to Clan lately and it sorta takes the fun out of it.

The rumor mill is churning out the possiblity that all Omni is considering blowing up their bases and converting to clan. Clan wins! The Notum Wars are over! We all get good XP!

Omni doesn't need to change things...FC does. If you don't know what I'm talking about, you're not paying attention.

**Aesma** · Jan 3rd, 2003, 02:33:14

Ok. I have read everyone's comments, and am going to weigh in with my lil comments.. so bear with me.

Isoldei is right. What is killing omni right now is apathy. Not everyone wants to constantly PvP. Not everyone wants to fight for every ounce of territory. With the clan's greater numbers, they will of course have more people who want that. They will also have more people who RP, and therefore more people who want to fight, and want to kill omni. Personally, I play AO to get away from things, and to relax a bit. Im not a PvPer... I am only interested in making myself "uber", and killing MOBs. I dont care about some silly title. My actions should speak for themselves. I dont need a title to feel good about myself. Heck, all a title really does is make yourself a target.

Also, with the extra 3% xp the clans are getting, and th extra bonuses they get with more towers, they will naturally be more powerful than us. It is a natural progression, and one that takes ALOT of force to turn. Force which omni lacks, mostly because so many are defecting to clan. Most of the people that I know have left omni for one of two reasons... they are either tired of all of omni being so selfish, and want to go to a side that helps each other, or they want to get all the uber loot, and switch to clan just to get more looting rights. The first side is very valid, and the second side is the *cause* of the first. I think FC is partially to blame for this, as not everyone is on AO to PvP, no matter what they think. I found a poll the other day asking people whether they preferred PvP or PvM... 61% voted PvM. 17% (i think) voted both, and the rest voted PvP.... maybe FC should listen to that poll. PvP will always have a niche, and most people will PvP now and then. but its not everyone's obsession.

Speaking of that.... after i got ganked 7 times trying to help out a fellow OT org (twice after asking to be allowed thru to a nearby mission)... I am not going to attack any clanners. only defend OT. I have also since hit 150, so until i get some more levels under my belt, I know im prime ganking material.. and therefore, wont participate. I just put up towers to better myself. Most days, I just dont want to PvP at all. Its not my cup'o'tea. simple as that. Hopefully, FC will not only understand that, but also make concessions to that feeling.

**__________Armaklaesy** · Jan 3rd, 2003, 03:25:33

Sorry, I just have to laugh at all the people that blame FC for things. Everything from crowd control to 'laggg' to way FC makes loot hard to get and everything in between.

Damn last night I lost my baseball game and you know whose fault it was? Stupid Rawlings made my catchers mit wrong it should have 2 finger holes not just one. And why doesn't Louiville Slugger Co. made baseball bats with spikes like ENForcer mobs have in AO. Should be spikes on bats!! Also, the diamond is wrong. Whose idea was it to run the bases counterclockwise? Damn how did that guy get a job making baseball rules? Doesn't it make more sence to run the bases clockwise? And you have to touch a guy with your ball to make him out? That's pretty stupid, why can't you just wing the wall off his head? And how come they don't.........

......well you get my point. We are all playing the 'same' game with the 'same' equipment, so give it up already. It's not FC's fault OT gets its ass kicked day in and day out.

I think FC is partially to blame for this, as not everyone is on AO to PvP, no matter what they think. I found a poll the other day asking people whether they preferred PvP or PvM... 61% voted PvM. 17% (i think) voted both, and the rest voted PvP.... maybe FC should listen to that poll. PvP will always have a niche, and most people will PvP now and then. but its not everyone's obsession.

Well that's great. With your reduced XP bonus you'll get to PvM 3% more than Clan get to. This should make you happy! OT is obviously the right faction for you.

**Aesma** · Jan 3rd, 2003, 04:06:08

ok, maybe that was a lil more whiney than i intended it to be. I think the best way to put my point across is that I feel that FC should encourage more PvM, and less PvP. it seems as if seemingly everything is designed towards PvP, and very little towards PvM. I, for one, would love to get more static dungeons. But thats just me.

**Revelator** · Jan 3rd, 2003, 12:05:20

I feel like I'm witnessing the break-up of the good ol' Soviet Union all over again here. Man, you Omnis are just about ready to throw in the towel aren't you? Telling ya all, that 15% XP bonus is gonna be sweet!

But seriously guys, the lvl of achievement we clans are getting from steam rollering your bases is getting to be more and more like the BS lvling grind, only without the lvling of course.

Taking all your bases is gonna become a chore just like BS, it's something thats quite boring, but it will need to be done (if nothing else, getting through the actual BS grind is going to be faster with a 15% XP bonus), and if it has to be done, we will actually do it like we do BS, and that is FAST!

Assemble about 40-50 people of correct lvl, assign 2-3 teams to each tower, make sure that you have some good PvPers across the range to defend against defenders, and it should take very little time indeed.

The only problem I see right now on Rimor is that there might not be enough Clan orgs with enough skilled people to put up the correct controllers, but a temporary solution there might be to bring in some Neutrals.

Omnis, I know you are outnumbered and outgunned, but why not see it as a challenge?! For Clan this is going to be a bore and a chore like BS, but if you could actually stand up to the onslaught that WILL come and sucessfully defend your bases, wouldn't that give you a real sense of accomplishment? Wouldn't that be something to tell your little Omni grandspawns?

**Revelator** · Jan 3rd, 2003, 12:34:16

Another thing is that FC will spank you all with the nerfbat for utterly destroying their beautiful and poignant storyline! Going to be hard for FC to salvage anything if Omni just quit and the whole LC map is Clan Red!

**Tzorcelan** · Jan 3rd, 2003, 14:40:47

Very good thread this and It brings up a important point. The Clan vs. Omni conflict on Rimor is very uneven at the moment.

Personally I envy the omni, they are the underdogs. For them to have any kind of success in notum wars they need to get together, work out a strategy and execute it as best as they can. And it's is a huge challenge for them. But in return any victory they get must taste just that much sweeter.

Being a clanner now in notum war is getting to easy. And there is no fun in that. How fun is it to fight if you know it's 90% certain you're gonna win? "Yeah I killed 3 omnis today.. and we outnumbered them 5 to 1." That will get you chicks alright...

I don't know how to fix this, especially since i don't know how the omni's are as a group. But if the game gets too boring I'll switch side and start some fights..

**Revelator** · Jan 3rd, 2003, 15:01:18

Originally posted by Tzor
Very good thread this and It brings up a important point. The Clan vs. Omni conflict on Rimor is very uneven at the moment.

Personally I envy the omni, they are the underdogs. For them to have any kind of success in notum wars they need to get together, work out a strategy and execute it as best as they can. And it's is a huge challenge for them. But in return any victory they get must taste just that much sweeter.

Being a clanner now in notum war is getting to easy. And there is no fun in that. How fun is it to fight if you know it's 90% certain you're gonna win? "Yeah I killed 3 omnis today.. and we outnumbered them 5 to 1." That will get you chicks alright...

I don't know how to fix this, especially since i don't know how the omni's are as a group. But if the game gets too boring I'll switch side and start some fights..

Ohhh thats CRUEL Tzor! Offering the Omnis Clan help in NW must be sooo humiliating for them!

Almost as if the Americans fighting the Iraqis in the first Gulf War (the sequel coming soon to a TV near you!) had gone:

"WTF!? Dudes! You really can't fight at all?! Man you guys are gimpy!And whiny too! Look, here's what we'll do: We'll give you some Marines, and planes and stuff, and then we'll try again, maybe that way it will go better?! Cheer up, if you Iraqis can't defend yourself from us, then we will be more than happy to even up the odds a bit."

I nominate Tzors post for the 'Most Nasty But Hard To Really Attack Flame Of The Year' Award.

And yeah, I know it's early January, but I'm confident it will still win, shouts of n00b and STFU!!!!! doesn't really have much bite once get outta 6th grade, but Tzor's has the kind of barb and kick that will really get under the skin of the Rimor Omnis reading it.

**Hibernation** · Jan 3rd, 2003, 15:17:03

Problem is that when you are at a winning side, more people will come to join the victors so clan will have more and more people showing up every day. Omni on the other is the loosing side so the numbers will dwindle day by day.

Take into account that alot of people arent interested in pvp but they will be if their side is winning and they wont be if their side is loosing.

Something honestly needs to be done, for the future of the game if nothing else. I posted this suggestion in another thread as a solution not affecting bonuses.

Make the side with more land controlled open for attacks longer periods of the day and vice versa. That wouldnt make you get less bonuses only that you need to work harder to keep them.

I dont know really, could work perhaps.

**Tzorcelan** · Jan 3rd, 2003, 15:37:42

Mwahaha

phear my cruel under the skin tactics. All a part of drawing the evil omni-corp machinery to the frontline. Only thing they can do is to prove me wrong.. they can't flame..

cya in the trenches!

**odian102** · Jan 3rd, 2003, 16:15:05

Omni is suppose to have the best weapons and armor.

Clan is suppose to have an xp advantage.

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Right now. Clan has both!! There is not a clear cut weapon or armor advantage for omni.

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A smaller force that is better equiped can go against larger forces.
But if both sides are equally equiped. its a numbers game. that is the major problem.

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Eventually, omni will get tired of dieing every fight by 1 to 4 odds. Most major battles end up with 1 omni being attacked by 3 to 4 clanners. I for one am getting tired of reclaiming(which takes forever) and then flying out the the battle to be attacked again by 3 clanners and the whole cycle repeats itself. Like I said with both sides being equiped the same. Its a numbers game.

Your right its a game, but with that said, I for one dont enjoy every battle being 1 agains 3 odds, but if omni was better equiped then it lessons the numbers game.

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Whats funny is clan is a bunch of rebels that desided to fight against the company (omni). Omni is a universe wide company with huge factories, advanced labs, tons of money to invest in research and we dont have better equipment. That makes no sense. A bunch of rebels have the same resourses as a huge company.

I can understand clan having an xp bonus, they are fighting for a cause they believe in.

=============================================
But lets look at the big picture:

Why some one would go clan vs omni. In NW.

1) Same equipment. (or equal equipment as omni)
2) A natural XP bonus
3) More people to group with and establish friendships.
4) Clan already controls the game. So, If i join clan. I get all the benefits.
5) A decreased chance of getting ganked in mass pvp. An increase chance of ganking.
6) With more people comes more security. If im not really intrested in PvP but want the bonuses that the towers give me in pvm. Then, Clan offers the most protection from my towers being blown up.
7) If I only want to do PvM, then having the highest xp % is nice and being on a side with the most people make it easier to find groups.

Why some one would go omni vs. clan. In NW

1) Beta player. started omni, so im omni.
2) I have a friend that is omni.
3) I love a change, so why not. Reclaiming doesnt bother me, I love it! I love going against 3 clanners at a time. that is the true test of pvp tactics and skill.-----Im uber.

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The only way to balance it right now is equip the fewer omni with better weapons and equipment.

-my 2 cents.

**Hibernation** · Jan 3rd, 2003, 16:32:41

Originally posted by Odian102

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The only way to balance it right now is equip the fewer omni with better weapons and equipment.

-my 2 cents.

The problem with that is that there are 3 servers and the only server that has this big gap is Rimor. The servers need to be exact lookalikes. They cant make changes that only affects one server.

Thats why solutions needs to be balanced on all three servers. Storywise i agree with you but in terms of the game that wont work, FC can in no way balance my better gear compared to a clanners slightly higher attackrating if something like that was implemented.

**Dyna18** · Jan 3rd, 2003, 17:16:15

Originally posted by Whites

The servers need to be exact lookalikes. They cant make changes that only affects one server.

I don't agree. The servers aren't exact lookalikes now.
Check the XP bonus on RK1. It's way bigger then what we get on RK2

**_____________Isoldei** · Jan 3rd, 2003, 17:59:01

I tried to put it this way when talking to a fellow omni couple days ago...we just set that slider on the log in screen to "very difficult" when we stay omni. Geez not really my style as a gamer since usually "very easy" offers me a challenge

I could likely return to clan, there are good people there as well; in fact I fear most friends I have who don't leave the game entirely will be those I knew as clan. Question is will it really be any more FUN? I doubt it. No fun just winning because you are outnumbering your opponant and getting loot is really cool but I just don't care to camp any NPC that much. So to me those who do go clan are simply taking an easy way to profit which I don't really respect.I totally understand clan especially high level players would not wish to switch...they have friends there and it is their "home" as it were.

Really what it comes down to is that I play video games to kill stuff. I am not really always that good at it but I like to do it. Killing the NPC's for loot doesnt really thrill me much and neither do BS missions. I actually often run around killing stuff doent really give me much xp or any. I don't need a title and I don't mind dying but in a previous post one thing that is a problem for Omni in NW is that it is damned frustrating to fly halfway across RK to die to 6 or more people then rez and fly back. That isn't a challenge or a thrill at all. Plenty of times sure I die because I screw up but sorry most times I see what is there and figure I may as well throw myself in maybe slow someone down a bit. Dying in 2 seconds really isn't fun at all against a ton of opponants, its just silly. It's like pulling a ql 200 mission to solo at lvl 50.

So actually I do get tired of clan claiming in any way to be superior, if they are it is solely because they have better stuff and their more experienced players aren't leaving the game. Get off your high horse because you are no better than Omni you simply hold the upper hand. Take a look in any situation in game or out...life isnt fair, and just because someone or something is successful doesn't always mean they or it is any better in reality.

**p00finger** · Jan 3rd, 2003, 18:21:27

Originally posted by Isoldei
So actually I do get tired of clan claiming in any way to be superior, if they are it is solely because they have better stuff and their more experienced players aren't leaving the game. Get off your high horse because you are no better than Omni you simply hold the upper hand. Take a look in any situation in game or out...life isnt fair, and just because someone or something is successful doesn't always mean they or it is any better in reality.

Precisely! This whole dilema has nothing to do with the people that play Clan or the people that play Omni. The problem seems to be with the engineering of the game dynamic between the two sides. It's really the dynamic between the three sides of Rubi-Ka. I'm not neutral, but they seem to be left in the dark, at least on Rimor.

The problem begins with the character creation and what is "told" to the newbie. It is then compounded with the ability to change sides. Not that the ability to flip sides should be removed, but the number of one side vs. another should be balanced from the outset. "Clan is not recruiting just yet, so you'll have to be Omni or Neutral...you can defect at a later time". Just a simple example, but you get the idea.

Furthermore, where is the clear advantage of being an employee of a galactic-wide corporation. Where is the finely-tuned armor and weapons. Where is the extra perk in your token board. Clan is supposed to be the underdog by default, yet there is nothing "pro-Omni" which makes this so.

Now you can take the easy way out and label this a whine and that the sides should be balanced. Um...no! Omni should have a clear advantage over the Clans. Omni-Tek is the enormous private industry with unlimited resources and technologies while the Clans are a bunch of pilfering grab-asses (hehe) trying to topple the evil giant.

How about this suggestion, comment please: Simply make the Omni-Med Suit, Omni only. This would translate into only Omni having the highest level implants. Would that be fair?

Thread: Rimor Wars

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Mighty Challenger To Clan It Isn't

Oooohh! FC is gonna be sooo mad!

No fun to be the bully...

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