We want a one time IP reset!!

[__________griemdaall]

Originally posted by Iroido
griemdaall...after reading all your posts, ive come to the conclusion that you have no clue what your talking about. An ip reset would be the best thing for AO right now as in it would make over 80% of the players extraordinarly happy immediatly and the remaining 20% would be happy after they reset their chars and realized how bad they actually were. And its not just Adv's that have been screwed, think of the dual weilding pillow freaks that spent countless IP in the skills to do that, just to name one more.

Thats just my opinion, i may be wrong

I can't argue if I do/don't know what I'm talking about, but I can say that I did offer a perfectly fine non-ip reset solution to the pillow folks. Why not just implement an item that uses that skill, but gives something other than +60 to nano skills? That seems reasonable to me, and wouldn't require an IP reset. That is my solution to all item related IP problems. If they nerf something, they are doing it for a reason. It sucks to have skill points in something you can't use at all, but doesn't suck nearly as bad to have something that's useful in a way that doesn't make the game unbalanced. For instance, how about an offhand item that adds to evades, or adds to body dev, or adds to some other skill that is NOT another +30 to nano skills? Then multi melee people are happy, and the game is no worse for the wear.

Better yet, how about a whole series of items that can be offhanded that give bonuses to different skills. Like the Leet doll, but better bonuses at higher QLs.

How is that a worse solution than IP reset?

This is not a flame.

Edited to add something I forgot:

MP summoned weapons were a late addition to the game. I think you would be hard pressed to find an MP that complains about having spent points in Multimelee for pillows, since that skill is useful now for the summoned weapons. Right?

[__________griemdaall]

Originally posted by Dealingdeath


I disagree ....there are many high level nanos that I would be able to cast if I could recover the wasted IP.

...I have NCUs that I could equip with more IP into Comp Lit.

...I have implants I could use with more IP in Treatment.

I could further add to the list but thats not important whats important is that these things will greatly enhance the enjoyment of the game for me and those I group with. I can't tell you how many times I hear "you can't cast this or that yet...well you should for your level". I'm always saying 'I'm gimped - wasted IP"

To say that rerolling is the quickest fix for this is a joke....I'm L128 and it took me 6 months to get that high and you say reroll....LOL...I said I'm a casual gamer. I don't think an IP reset will make me higher level but being forced to reroll will certainly make me 128 levels lower.

You state that one time IP reset will "skew the game even MORE towards powergamers". I would love to hear your rationale behind this statement. Just because you say it with fervor doesn't make it so

Ok, at level 128, reroll isn't the fastest solution, agreed.

Having other people that are your level who are able to do things you can't do is not always a bad thing. If everyone who was your level could do everything you could do, then we would be playing EQ. The whole purpose of having a skill based system like this one is divergence, people all go in different directions. I know some enforcers who have hardly any NCU because they lack the comp lit. That is part of what they are, and it's what makes them different. They are the ones who chose to make thier character that way, they weren't forced. I know a few MPs who don't have the ability to use some of thier nanos, but those MPs all have a lot more HPs than I do because they focused on body dev. It makes us different, not necessarily gimped. To me, gimped means you have no purpose, you are not only less useful than the best, you are not useful at all. There are many things that others do better than most of my characters, but I still have a good time.

My goal is not to stand toe to toe with the best MA and be better than him 1 on 1, but if that were my goal and I had gimped myself in the process of leveling, don't you agree that would be my problem, and not his? Making everyone reset thier IP makes everyone suddenly perfect, template. Doesn't that nullify the work and care that people put into making sure that they are perfect? Believe me, there are people out there who started a character, made mistakes, learned from mistakes, then restarted and made a character who is uber powerful by NOT making mistakes. It invalidates the work they did both rerolling and planning if everyone suddenly has an opportunity to be just like them. Especially if everyone else gets it handed to them on a silver platter.

As to how would an IP reset skew the game more towards powergamers? That's quite simple, I'll try to explain. Feel free to tell me if I'm wrong, I'm enjoying this flame free conversation.

Powergamers, in general, are higher level than anyone else. They were higher level than anyone else before anyone else got higher level. That means that they have more IP to reclaim when the IP reset comes, which will allow them to become tougher than they were when they were pioneering being high level, which isn't easy all by itself. Suddenly the top 10% of the game is, say, 30% stronger than it was before, while noobs are the same.

The powergamers then get to max level, they are guild leaders, social players now, they hang out and chat, and group with friends to collect items. After a while, the noobs catch up and get to max level, but they don't get an IP reset at level 150, they got one at level 10 (or not at all) so they didn't reclaim as much lost IP, so they are gimped in the same way the original folks were.

The noobs just became 30% weaker than everyone else, with no chance to ever obtain the strength that the powergamers had.

Unfortunately, the higher level mobs were made 30% stronger because the powergamers were bored.

Now noobs are 30% weaker against higher level mobs than people used to be, thus the game is broken. Hilarity ensues. Monsters are adjusted to be weaker, powergamers slaughter pit lizards solo and kid around ae killing medusas with thier uberness, while the noob group is struggling just to get by. Mobs are adjusted again, etc...etc...etc..

If you have people in the game that come from 2 different levels of difficulty, it makes the game impossible to balance.

I hope I got that all out right and it makes sense.

This is not a flame.

[honestomar]

nicely put griemdaall.

[_______________Cordi]

What I said Griem, only you put it better

IMHO FC have not made enough mistakes/corrections in the skills to require an IP reset.

Players on the other hand have.


Cordi
WHo desperatly would like her wasted IP's back, but is not willing to but other folks happiness at risk because of it.

[Miriandel]

1° It reflects reality: you learn things, you forget things, that's life.

2° In a game like this, you often want to play with things. "Look, this weapons looks fun, let's try it !". You can't in AO. IP's spent are gone forever, even if you used them 2 seconds.

3° Rules change, it's a dynamic world. Characters change too, for the same reason.

4° Players make mistakes. Because they don't know how things work, or because they dont yet know how they work.


Static IPs are neither fun nor realistic, and I can't understand why some players post repeatedly to deny others the right to an IP-wipe.
It's going to happen you know, no need to argue, it will happen, Gaute said it.

[_______________Cordi]

Yes Miriandel

I agree with all of your points bar 1.

1° It reflects reality: you learn things, you forget things, that's life.

Not sure which reality you live in, but mine for sure doesn't bear any resemblance to AO

I'm trying very hard here to match even one thing up between reality and AO, umm, here you go....you cannot choose to forget something in RL, and you cannot in AO.

I really wish some of it did reflect reality, I'd love to just be able to change professions, to forget something I learned back in college that I don't use anymore so I can learn something new.

And as for the IP reset being a dead cert? people have been known to change their minds. Especially devs.

Cordi.

[______________Iroido]

i think Miriandel said it best, why even post, its gonna happen and if YOU dont like it DONT do it, they said it would be optional for your char and for just a limited time frame, so why should you even care??

[_____________Paldorr]

IP reset = good.

Players will love it (except exploiters). ALL will benefit equally.

Downsides? None.

So do it already!

[_______________Cordi]

If you want to contribute to a discussion, at least read the other posts.

IP reset = good.

Players will love it (except exploiters). ALL will benefit equally.

Downsides? None.

So do it already!

I do believe all of these things have been covered by other folks during this thread. Especially the ALL will benefit equally bit, if you can't read and understand why that is blatantly untrue, then I will not waste my breath trying to explain it to you.

I think this discussion has run it's course, to sumarise tho, not all people who think this is a bad idea are explioters. Not everyone will benefit equally, if they would, they wouldn't be arguing.

Cordi

[___________Damion666]

Im no exploiter and i dont want the ipreset.... i have spent ip into skills that i NEVER use now.... but i enjoy this as it gives characters character.... if there is a reset people will simply get out their calculators and put ip into certain skills only... kinda takes the flavour out of your whole life on rk...... if you hate your ip distrubation so much just make a new dam character... its not like its hard to lvl in ao.... and then your new char can just have all your curret stuff making it easy to lvl him/her up..... ive done it many times and have now found a great char that i love to play (he rox too).... fc hasnt changed that much in the game and deffinatly not enough to constuite an ip reset..... plus... what happens in another 6 months when the game changes some more... ANOTHER IP RESET... hell lets just make it so we can reset our ip anytime we want!!.... wee... wouldnt that be fun.... NOT!

[Miriandel]

you cannot choose to forget something in RL, and you cannot in AO.

Good Lord, you can't figure how much I'd like you were right !
Unfortunately, you are wrong.

I'm a 40 old engineer (irl you see, and I don't have bots at work, while it would be fun ).
I used to be musician.
I played in several orchestras, even as soloist.
I spent years of my life learning music, but my job required I put music aside.

Sad but true, I can't play anymore.
I still can read a score, but can't make my instrument sound any close to what I could.
Those hard work years are gone with the wind

On an AO scale, I had something like 800 skill, now I have a mere 150.

[__________Turbulence]

Joeblow that spent 2000ip to get his vehicle ground up to 100 to use that sweet new Kodiank is not going to suddenly be super uber because he no longer has to waste that 2000ip becuase he can get it back from the ip reset.

You do realise that at level 100 which is very easy to obtain in a few weeks time that you get 40,000 ip per level. IP spent on vehicle ground and the likes are not an issue the real issue is maxed skills that have been changed for many characters be it Pistols, Pillows, Rifles, Aimed Shot, Mulit Melee whatever it be there are so many viable options that Funcom has decided should not be viable options and removed/nerfed leaving the players who maxed these certain skills out to dry with a ton of wasted ip. The only proper thing to do is to refund the ip.
The ony way to do this is IP reset.

Bring it on it's been too long...many folks are tired of waiting.

[_________________Zuh]

You do mistake and ask for IP reset ? Shame on you.


A player who know better than other what to do have advantages on the new arrival.

If some of your skills became useless because rules changed, then FC have to make new stuffs that need your skills. Don't ask for IP reset to get your vehicule ground IP back again....

And maybe (surely?) a skill like vehicule ground will have a real use later. Like a vehicule with unique properties or so (to compensate the unability to fly).


Grimandel said already why an IP reset would be bad for AO and I agree with him. Please read all the thread before posting here : ).

[________________Sent]

Player with gimped toon = unhappy customer = cancelled account.

Player with gimped toon with the abiliity to fix it = happy customer = active paying account.

There isn't too much to think about there.

[_________________Zuh]

Originally posted by Dr. Sent
Player with gimped toon = unhappy customer = cancelled account.

Player with gimped toon with the abiliity to fix it = happy customer = active paying account.

There isn't too much to think about there.

For my part I would give a try to AO after an "IP reset" and see how it turns out.


And probably cancel my account.

[__________WGMelchior]

"If some of your skills became useless because rules changed, then FC have to make new stuffs that need your skills. Don't ask for IP reset to get your vehicule ground IP back again...."


What do you mean, IF? It's already happening. And they haven't made many skills more useful. Sure, there is chemistry and pharmatech, but they are quite the opposite.

We are talking about the instances where Funcom intently changes a skill for the worse. Since it has taken them ages to fix concealment, for example, and it still won't work, I have little hope for them to fix all the skills there are.

[________________Neon]

all these online games are like this when dev's balance. People in other games just reroll as sitution changes. Should be the same here. It easy 1-100 in this game especially after you learn how to play with your gimp. So rather than holding your breath and having no fun just let go and start a new 'toon

[_________RandomTrend]

I want a one time....credit card reset!

If FuncoN could do this...i could reallocate those precious $150 dollars into something that does'nt have the stability of doggy-doo in a heavy rain...maybe a pooper-scooper.....

Best of luck to all that deserve it...

RT

[______________Iroido]

why is this even a discussion anymore??? The people that do not want their IP reset and to keep the waisted IP on their char can leave it, its optional... dont do it, for the people that want all their IP back from dual weilding pillows such as myself, and the adv's that got screwed, and the agents that got hosed, WE will do it and it will make us happy, if this somehow offends you to the point of cancelling your account when the reset was not done on your char you are the biggest idiot in the game and i would be happy to see you go and not be in RK or on these boards any longer.

The point here is if you wanna RP and keep your char gimped for the sake of not being able to forget in RL...do that, me, ill reset my IP being this is a game and i can do that.

[___________Rastus-SD]

Ramble ramble...

Everyone else is doing it so I think I'll rephrase stuff that's already been said a few times with my own angle...

Random points from what I've picked up skimming this thread:

Those who want an IP reset should be allowed to have one and those that don't aren't forced to --- Anyone thinking that -obviously- didn't read or heed the posts about how it would allow powergamers to further increase their powergaming and further shyte all over the numerous casual/RP players who really don't -want- to create Joe the uber-<insertyourcareerhere>.

The bouncing back and forth abour RL comparisons and wether you forget stuff. Sure, you forget over time and your proficiency decreases, but you don't suddenly magically become more proficient in another field. IP represents the time and practise your character puts into the stuff he's doing, you simply can't use 'forgetting it over time' as justification for an IP reset because you do -NOT- get your lifetime back to 'respend' whenever the world around you changes.

Who wants an IP reset? - Powergamers.
Who benefits from an IP reset? - Powergamers.
Who will be hurt by any IP resets? - Non-powergamers.

That argument about unhappy players being nerfed closing their accounts works both ways. If there are IP resets and the powergamers get to further their cause then casual gamers -will- close their accounts because the game will become less playable for the casual gamer.

I'm not saying this is a pointless discussion nor am I saying my view is right, but I think the bigger issue is what does AO plan to become, a powergame or an RPG? A change either way will lead to the exteme supporters of the other closing their accounts and looking for their fun elsewhere. Powergaming never has and never will appeal to me. I find it tedious, bland and unrewarding, but that's just me. Already, AO doesn't have what it takes for me to become a hardcore player, but is holding my attention as a casual distraction from other games. *shrug*

While it's not what I'd like to hear, I think the answer has already been given in the polls. In at least two polls the support for PvP, missions, solo hunting and group hunting has been significantly more than the support for social activities, events and RP. It's a sad but true fact that we RPers are the minority and the commercial eye-candy MMORPG market will not support us. Until a MMORPG comes forward to -truely- support the roleplaying community I'll remain a true supporter of online text based games.

I'm not sure if I can do this, but if anyone wants to play an RP enforced cyberpunk genre MOO (MUD, Object Oriented). Email me - rastus@sindome.org or tag me on ICQ, 5541347.