The new raids - can we have some ethics?

[Noer]

Originally posted by Jamespond
Some guilds doesnt have any respect at all....

Some of my guildies was out killing Ljotur, and then a few clanners from A.I.R. ADLN, I think that was the name, arrived and started breaking the calms... The last thing u want to say at the reclaim is "I was killed by a leet"

fun fun... they did the same at The Pest.

[Coldstrike]

I agree with you on this one Noer. With the new mobs, spawning them can be more than half the job, so "winning a damage war" might give you looting rights according to the game mechanics, but it's not really ethical to do.

But at the same time, I don't like it when people start verbally attacking people just for trying to help out in good faith. So please, if one or two people comes along and tries to help you and you don't want their help, then tell them so, don't start calling them KSers.

[georg]

This thread deserves a bump...

-Loot messages in vicinity.
-Loose the nodrop tags unless it really -is- needed.

Fortunately most guilds have enough courtesy/ethics already, the big problem are the few people (you probably know who) and a few guilds not having them at all. Lowering themselves to either the omni/clan scum ****, or , the unique mob nugget arguement.

[________________Psic]

Originally posted by Loveyou
Another solution is that the one with the loot rights can do a /loot right <insertname> and pass the loot rights to someone else (if you want to keep the nodrop tag on items). This will easily prevent the ninja loot stuff.

A /loot <name> command to give loot priviledges to people would be so nice!

Bumpity bump

[Noer]

Originally posted by Psic


A /loot <name> command to give loot priviledges to people would be so nice!

Bumpity bump

Yeah, so far the best solution I see on the problem aswell.

[aaronb]

bump, and...

- don't kill drain pets (typically grey/green mobs nearby)... this is more than just an inconvenience
- don't invite all of your friends to watch... too many people in the area frequently results in people disconnecting

[Nano0]

Here is how I see the problem fixed.

The team that does most dmg, the guild KT, gets loot 100%.

so I suggest the following.

Remember the Stiletto?
well u use some kind of device on the "to be nodrop" loot, to be able to equip it. and when u "activate" it, it becomes a nodrop, and therefor a usable item.

What this means is the looter can loot all the ph4tz on the body, and in his own time, give the loot to whomever the officers of that particalur guild who is raiding want the loot to go to. Or if its an interguild coop. then hand over the loot to the other guild.

That would work best imo. Maybe with a combination of making all loot messages to both team and vicinity.

Yours truely
Nano0

Unit Commander of clan Storm

[Animoy]

Great idea Nano0

[Razzitazz]

Originally posted by Loveyou


When the loot is not nodrop it cannot be ninjaed by a random person and therefor cannot be sold by a random person cause you dont have to release the corpse and let someone else loot.

Your taking my two paragraphs as one single paragraph.

What I mean is that any non-NODROP loot kind of sucks because a ninja could take it, even if you know him, throw it to an alt and sell it -- I've seen in many times.

And I also meant that NODROP loot is fine with me, except when people ninja it.

Probably didn't say it right.

Either way, hope this thread is read from Noer's sig by everyone, so there isn't many more problems like this in the future.

[Julka_Pomy]

Originally posted by Noer
I'm not here to rant, not here to point fingers. I'm here to suggest something. Since 14.5 we have gotten some nice raid mobs that give highlevels something to do in this game. I'm talking about mobs like Ian Warr, Notum Soldier, Special Agent Lamb - yeah even The One and The Pest.

After we made our guild a few weeks ago to mainly focus on these raids we have stumbled into a problem which is getting worse every day. And since Funcom doesn't seem to care about this I think we have to do something ourselves until Funcom wakes up.

Let me explain. Doing Peter Lee, Notum Soldier, The Pest or any of those mobs can't be compared to Daria, Nugget, Van Horn and that type of uniques. Thoe old uniques are pushovers that die in a few seconds. The new mobs are minded for multi-groups and different types of tactics and take a lot of coordination and planning to take down. And most important, they don't have a fixed spawntime for 18 hours. So if you want to do the mob, you just go there when the others leaves or do another unique (yes you need to kill some placeholders of course).

What I am comming to is that it pisses me off that certain guilds thinks its okay to come try and outdamage a guild when the guild spend all night getting e.g. the Mercenaries (Ian Warr and friends) spawned and pulled alone. Its a process that takes time and a lot of dedication from a guild. And the mobs aint easy. So its plain rude and lame to go to the mob and hit Q and try to outdamage them. If you want to have a go on the mobs yourself, gather your friends 2 hours later since the camp automatically despawns, and you have the chance yourself. Not to mention the ninjas trying to ninja the loot and jacking the 20-30 people that just spend most of their evening trying to get these mobs. I can't believe Funcom hasn't done anything about this yet. It has been a huge problem for so long in Camelot, and now its getting a problem at the raid mobs aswell.

At least most guilds has the decency to respect the work of other guilds at a raid when they are there and move on to another mob. (Storm, Renaissance, Synergy Factor etc. seems to understand and respect that), but there are also rotten eggs out there saying stuff like "people outdamage all the time at Daria" and so on. Guys, this aint Daria or Nugget. You can't do these with 1-2 people. Please have that in mind next time you see guilds or groups at raids. Are you really wanting to be a total jackass and ruining a night of 20-30 people in this way? This isn't an OT <> Clan thing, these mobs are in 75% zones - its not like you can kill the ones trying to killsteal if you want to. A lot of you might remember all the fuss about Obedience Enforcer and Tortureyou/Caol. I just wanna prevent issues like that happening again. And it can be prevented with a little decency and respect for the guilds at raids.

I have some suggestions you can think about in the future.

- If you are interested in watching a guild take down one of these mobs do it at distance. People tend to get nervous about ninjas when strangers stand too close and it also makes it harder targeting stuff for the people at the raid.

- If you hover around in a Yalmaha above the body people are getting nervous about ninjas. Move too a good distance. This also prevents you from fiddling with their aggro, as aggro on some of these mobs are quite random. :P

- Don't start attacking these mobs before clearing it with the raiding people. Even if it is with good intentions its not certain that the guild want you to. It can ruin aggro and thereby destroy the raid. It may also be that they say "go ahead". But at least ask them.

- When the mob drops be sure to be out of loot-range. It secures you from ninja-accusations, and makes the guild less nervous.

- Make screenshots of people who try to ninja.

- If you got ninja'ed stay calmed. Check your screenshot and don't accuse anyone of being a ninja before you can be sure he/she did.

- When you found out that someone ninja'ed inform their guildleader. I can't speak for other guilds but in my one things like that normally result in /org kick.

- Make lootmessages spam in 'Vincinity'. If you have a ninjaproblem, you know who did it and it would lower the amount of ninja-incidents dramaticaly, because a ninjalooter will think twice before he makes his move. Everybody will know and his rep will be ruined ... Better imo, instead of petitioning and asking a GM to solve it or at least try to solve it ...

Just some suggestions which can make these raids less a headache with people trying to jack (or doing without they know) the events for the guilds raiding these mobs.

And I still hope Funcom are going to make an anti-ninja-policy and handle the problems about nodrop loot at multigroup-mobs.

Thanks for reading, and have fun on the raids.

Lots of good points in your post Noer.

But i suggest you clear them up with your guild before bringing it up here.

Here is whats happend less then two weeks ago.

We with apocs decided to go to camp OE. He wasnt up so we started to kill OI. WE had two teams and me doctor and another adventurer healing. We do fine becasue we did OE with same setup before.

After 1 hour and 30 minuites we killed 3 OI and OE spawned. We screwed up on pull and 2 of us died not a biggy they were otw back.
Now while we waitng for them here comes 2+ legion teams and starting to get ready.
I asked spyderv if he gonna try to kse from us, i got answer saying we came here to kill this mob. After i explained him that we just killed 3 OI to spawn OE, i got no answer. In vicintiy someone from you said "why bother you cant kill him with just one doc" (heck and we didnt do that before)

So ok we got ready and pulled OE ah yes we also had to make damge team..
So here we started shooting at OE and all legion teams joined in without any explantion. Luckely we got loot rights.

Ah yes we still havent got any explaniton of what your intentions were there. And so far i see it as Kseing.

I hope its not going happen again.

[Julka_Pomy]

.

[eaze]

Originally posted by Noer
Another problem that needs to be adressed from Funcom is the way to handle nodrops dropping from multi-group mobs. It aint working well as it is now.

Now, that one is easy. Remove nodrop from all items, except Tokens, MA attacks and the likes. Armor, weapons etc does not naturally fit the NODROP flag.

[______________Thromp]

How about a new command /team loot rights %t

It would allow the specified person to loot any corpses with loot rights currently held by the team.

[stromm]

hmm, it all looks good but im just wondering what happens if a mob say, agent lamb is undisturbed for a while and then two guilds show up at the same time? What is the deciding factor as to who gets the mob? And what about guilds who might put an alt away from a spawning area with a second account to camp it?

[______________Orchid]

Perhaps first to target it?

Also, seems all my posts are being deleted around here...

[stromm]

no way to distinguish that though..

[_____________Nalissa]

Originally posted by eaze


Now, that one is easy. Remove nodrop from all items, except Tokens, MA attacks and the likes. Armor, weapons etc does not naturally fit the NODROP flag.

It's not quite that easy. If an item isn't nodrop, then it will be farmed. What that means is that your chance of getting that item becomes nil unless you have 200M+ credits lying around or 6 high level soldier/enf friends.

The suggestion of /loot <name> would work, as would the 'activation' suggestion of Nano0's.

[Fatcrusher]

I really love [NODROP] , i just wish they could fix the problems surounding it . NODROP items are what makes ur character individual like when kink got harassed every day when he used EOT , and it also stops little Punks buying the ph4tz off Ebay

[Mowatx]

Remove the nodrop tag people are not going to
farm this stuff it's too hard to get in the first place.
NODROP just makes it more difficult to hand out!

[georg]

Originally posted by Psic


A /loot <name> command to give loot priviledges to people would be so nice!

Bumpity bump