5% needs to be done away with *now*.

**_____________Meurgen** · Dec 8th, 2002, 02:56:37

Ten minutes ago I went to help some Dork Guild friends defending from an attack by MoK and Legion. The base was almost over run, and was well into it's 5% period. I landed, and got shot to around 25% hp by the base towers. I ran outside of their range and healed up. In the confusion I went and tried to help a friend in a fight, but got alphad by two people down to around 5%... I turn around and run back out of their range and died. Killed by a FRIENDLY Solar Turret.

Until Alliances are formally introduced, the 5% simply does not work. It does not make things 'more interesting'. That's the reply of people who haven't yet been killed by towers they're trying to defend. In any serious fight, this simply tips the balance completely towards the attacking side. If they can have 5 guilds grouped together attacking, then why can't the defenders have five guilds grouped together defending?

Groups are not easy to find, especially with the surrounding chaos of a full scale battle, so this is in no way a solution.

Didn't Gaute mention that bases were supposed to be extremely difficult to attack? I don't see the extreme difficulty involved in chasing the defenders back into their own turrets to get cut to pieces. There is no advantage to the defenders, only a disadvantage.

I'll say it again, in bold and underline this time:

Until Guild Alliances are formally and technically introduced, there is no proper place in Notum Wars for a 5% period for *any* base. Remove the 5% period.

I'll keep this bumped 'til it's introduced. :P

**aaronb** · Dec 8th, 2002, 04:53:00

Hmm, and I was just about to post asking for 5% all the time.

**Wildwal** · Dec 8th, 2002, 05:06:13

i made this post in the beta forums .. :/

**Warboc** · Dec 8th, 2002, 09:21:08

No way around this. Official alliances, done with functions within the game, are needed. Period.

In the meantime, I see no way to justify for 5%. It only gives the upper hand to attackers, especially when it concerns a guild of 300 vs a guild of 50.

**Mercatura** · Dec 8th, 2002, 09:24:29

i made this post in the beta forums .. :/

Yeah and IIRC didn't it get ignored there too?

**Razzitazz** · Dec 8th, 2002, 10:49:38

Well its in there for those clanners that want to take on other clanners bases. While I would never see the reason in this I'm sure there are other guilds that would.

**______________Insida** · Dec 8th, 2002, 14:14:12

Lets say that Storm for example is controlling all the land in the lv200+ area and some people wants to build a tower there and they are clan, well thats why theres 5% suppression for 1hour. Soon, when alot of ppl will own NW, they are going to want a peice of land, when all the good location are taken, you will see that the 5% suppression gaz ain't that silly.

**_____________Meurgen** · Dec 8th, 2002, 21:59:16

I know what 5% is there for, and yeah I agree that it's a good idea, but read the whole post (and maybe the replies) please. Without alliances to keep the towers from aggroing friendly defenders, 5% doesn't work, pure and simple. 'Til it does, the 5% period *has* to be removed. It makes defense nearly impossible in any large battle.

Nerf Asmoran.

**Sheffy** · Dec 9th, 2002, 01:32:44

Shh, Insida's attempting to sound smart.

**Kuro** · Dec 9th, 2002, 03:53:45

Originally posted by Sheffy
Shh, Insida's attempting to sound smart.

Does change the fact that he's right. Imagine if there were no 5% gas zone and, obviously, alliances don't exist. Now if I wanted a piece of land from someone i'd have to go find some smelly clanner to come clear the base for me. And we all know that same smelly clanner would simply plop his own tower down when he finished.

Alliances are a necessity. But let's not shoot ourselves in the foot till Funcom implements it.

P.S. Mercurata:
As long as you've been hanging around here, you should know by now that Funcom doesn't respond to a lot of things. But it also doesn't mean they don't listen. One of the things that we all did complain about during the NW beta was the gas line camping. And I don't remember anyone commenting on that subject either. But then where'd you think the Disgrace Period came from? (Whether or not it works as well in application as it does on paper we're just going to have to ignore for a bit

)

**_____________Meurgen** · Dec 9th, 2002, 04:03:40

Originally posted by Kuroshio

Does change the fact that he's right. Imagine if there were no 5% gas zone and, obviously, alliances don't exist. Now if I wanted a piece of land from someone i'd have to go find some smelly clanner to come clear the base for me. And we all know that same smelly clanner would simply plop his own tower down when he finished.

Alliances are a necessity. But let's not shoot ourselves in the foot till Funcom implements it.

P.S. Mercurata:
As long as you've been hanging around here, you should know by now that Funcom doesn't respond to a lot of things. But it also doesn't mean they don't listen. One of the things that we all did complain about during the NW beta was the gas line camping. And I don't remember anyone commenting on that subject either. But then where'd you think the Disgrace Period came from? (Whether or not it works as well in application as it does on paper we're just going to have to ignore for a bit )

A necessity, meaning the other 'necessity' shouldn't exist until both *can*. 5% has no place right now... it's simply ruining the defense effort of those trying to help out. Create an alliance system, and reinstate the 5% gas period... it's not that difficult.

**Kuro** · Dec 9th, 2002, 04:14:01

Originally posted by Meurgen

A necessity, meaning the other 'necessity' shouldn't exist until both *can*. 5% has no place right now... it's simply ruining the defense effort of those trying to help out. Create an alliance system, and reinstate the 5% gas period... it's not that difficult.

Then tell me, what are we supposed to do when we want to (or need to) take down a base that's the same faction as our own while we wait on an alliance system? Cause Funcom isn't going to turn off the Notum Wars functionality while they solve the 5% gas problem.

**Sheffy** · Dec 9th, 2002, 05:18:32

So essentially, you're saying its ok to let a terribly stupid aspect of the game ruin hundreds of tower fights because of the occasional need to destroy a base of your own faction.

I'm sorry, but that doesn't quite hold water for me.

I'm sure when your base gets attacked by the opposing faction during 5% gas, you don't want people of your own faction to get slaughtered by your towers when they're there to help you. I just don't believe you would say that's how it should be. If it were possible to join a team during a fight, then maybe it wouldn't be *as* bad, but obviously, it doesn't work that way and would exploited, so you can't.

It puts the attackers at a *** HUGE *** advantage because they're already in teams such that the 5% gas won't affect them much at all -- if at all. The defenders (read: reinforcements of the same allignment) are now at a tremendous disadvantage because they can't organize teams properly through the chaos to evade the 5% rules which we should be able to do already with org alliances.

How about making sure towers don't attack people of the same faction during the 5% period UNLESS someone in that faction attacks a tower (or someone) in the guild who owns the base? Perhaps make AE nukes/debuffs/etc not hit towers of the same faction until a true attack (single-nuke, or any other attack) is initiated specifically on a tower?

I'm just throwing out ideas here. I'm sure it would take Funcom some work to implement something like that, but they've done much more complicated things before.

**____________Rodstaff** · Dec 9th, 2002, 05:25:13

I think its funny when we chase you silly clanners back into your own towers just to get blow up by your allies.....lol thats the funniest thing ive read on this board today..hurray for 5%!

**Kuro** · Dec 9th, 2002, 05:53:03

Originally posted by Sheffy
So essentially, you're saying its ok to let a terribly stupid aspect of the game ruin hundreds of tower fights because of the occasional need to destroy a base of your own faction.

I'm saying like it or not, until there is a viable solution ready to be implemented (which we won't hear about until it's done), we might have to live with the current system. In fact, I'd prefer to live with the current system than have the 5% gas yanked.

The current system provides for pressure on the Funcom programmers and developers to change it. Yanking the 5% suppresion would solve the problem but it removes that pressure. I do it all the time at work: unless my boss specifically tells me to do something the hard (but often correct) way, I will opt for the quickest way possible. It's not because I'm a bad employee. It's because in a 24 hour day my schedule is allocated for about 26 hours of work,, only 8 of which I'm actually working. Same goes for Funcom.

Big or small, all developers in software are faced with more bugs and more good ideas than they have the programmers to deal with. Leave them the quickest out and quite sensibly they will take that way out. Because they don't have enough time to do everything. I can wait for an alliance system and suffer the attacks from 'friendly' towers. To me, an alliance system is worth more than no alliance system and not being able to attack the towers of people in my faction if/when needed.

**______________Dr.Log** · Dec 9th, 2002, 09:29:02

Originally posted by Meurgen
Ten minutes ago I went to help some Dork Guild friends defending from an attack by MoK and Legion. The base was almost over run, and was well into it's 5% period. I landed, and got shot to around 25% hp by the base towers. I ran outside of their range and healed up. In the confusion I went and tried to help a friend in a fight, but got alphad by two people down to around 5%... I turn around and run back out of their range and died. Killed by a FRIENDLY Solar Turret.

Until Alliances are formally introduced, the 5% simply does not work. It does not make things 'more interesting'. That's the reply of people who haven't yet been killed by towers they're trying to defend. In any serious fight, this simply tips the balance completely towards the attacking side. If they can have 5 guilds grouped together attacking, then why can't the defenders have five guilds grouped together defending?

Groups are not easy to find, especially with the surrounding chaos of a full scale battle, so this is in no way a solution.

Didn't Gaute mention that bases were supposed to be extremely difficult to attack? I don't see the extreme difficulty involved in chasing the defenders back into their own turrets to get cut to pieces. There is no advantage to the defenders, only a disadvantage.

I'll say it again, in bold and underline this time:

Until Guild Alliances are formally and technically introduced, there is no proper place in Notum Wars for a 5% period for *any* base. Remove the 5% period.

I'll keep this bumped 'til it's introduced. :P

Why do people like you assume that because something bad happened to you the whole game should be changed and everyone should agee with you ?

**Dhurdahl** · Dec 9th, 2002, 09:50:33

Okie... lets say that we remove the 5%...

How in the world are there going to be ANY battle at all at the sub QL100 towers? esp those in the QL10-50 range?
All those areas are totaly unaccessable by the opposing factor! aka the only ones that can attack them are the same factor and thus in the 5%..

??

**_____________Meurgen** · Dec 9th, 2002, 10:28:59

Originally posted by Dr.Log

Why do people like you assume that because something bad happened to you the whole game should be changed and everyone should agee with you ?

This bad thing happens to defenders every single day, and is often making the defense of bases an unplayable, and unenjoyable mess. Because it *hasn't* happened to you doesn't mean it shouldn't be changed. If you repeatedly were killed by friendly towers you would be here 'whining' too.

Kuro: Your 'leaving 5%' argument could be said for pet pathing too. They've kept it around for quite a while and no, it's not fixed. I don't see alliances coming any time soon, but right now there is a valid and serious problem that tilts the scales strongly in favor of attackers. As a person who often gets called to the defense of other guild's, this sucks... bad. You're telling me I'm just supposed to 'put up with it'? No, I want it changed.

Dhurdahl, good point. But, infighting being fine and all, do we really want the entire emphasis of low level tower holding to be entirely clan versus clan or omni versus omni? I don't see any story in that... or much fun. It looks like you touched on another problem that needs to be adressed.

**______________Serath** · Dec 9th, 2002, 11:00:32

5% is real good for both side... if u are attacking... thats wy its only 1 hour...

FC... please dont nerf away 5% its perfect as it is...

Tho one thing that should be added is that u can join fighting teams...

**Snuble** · Dec 9th, 2002, 11:01:53

Let there be global notum explosions once every 14 days, that effectivly wipe all towers from the face of Rubi Ka. No more need for 5% and a huge money sink

Thread: 5% needs to be done away with now.

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