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Thread: Testing crowd limiting

  1. #41
    Someone explained a situation where she had arrived as one of the first to defend the towers of a guild in their alliance. As more people gathered, she was warped away by the new CC system.
    This needs a revision.

    The people already there, should be able to stay in the zone untill they die (maybe have a delta of 2 - 4 when area has reached max cap, just to make sure people are not holding other people out on purpose). The way it should work (imo) is that the last to come has the fewest rights - compared to the ones that arrived early. The important thing is to balance the cap so it reduces lag, and still is fair and good fun.

    And of course, you will hopefully revise where you have placed your warp stations (where ppl warp to when displaced by the CC system). Having people warped into nowhere is basis for frustration and deflating the fun of NW. IMO the warp stations should be placed NEAR to the pvp action, but on the other side of the zone border. That way, people who have been warped away can que up outside the pvp area, waiting for someone to die, and fill their place RAPIDLY. This would also mean having to use tactics when assigning people to enter the area, as you would want key personel to be able to get back in.

    Alternately making tower controlled areas their own SMALL zones (or protected by invis walls, as mentioned by Cz), making servers concentrate on those areas in particular. (I.E. Broken Shores and outside of TIR are example of areas not good for crowds, as the servers have to focus on a larger area.

    I know you didnt ask for suggestions, but thats what I give you. Sorry
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  2. #42
    What this could end up turning into is...

    Attackers (clan/omni) will attack tower with 50+, thus locking out the deffenders (clan/omni). Towers fall to whoever can get the area filled first, like Tara.

    Already last night, one of Storm's towers was being attacked by dozens of omni. We couldn't grid in, and the few that did, zoned so slowly they were killed before they knew what hit them. The server eventually crashed, throwing out all the omni hard work because at the current rate, there were going to take the tower down.

    I know you dont want suggestions, but alot of the lag seems to deal greatly on client side as well. Turning off all graphical effects and turning draw distance down helps. What I've seen is fighting at a tower out in a place like Mort/PW etc... with nothing but dessert is alot less lag'y than fighting in EFP/DAV populated is dozens upon dozens of textures (trees, rocks, mobs, vegetation) that causes us clients to lag when we're trying to load 50+ players ontop of this.

    Perhaps the crowd control can limit the equal number of attacker and deffenders to prevent unbalance, and places deemed for towers be removed to other locations, or skim downed on all the extra garabage textures thats laying around to lag us down.

  3. #43
    I hear a lot of ppl about the balance. The ballance is there.
    40 attackers - 40 defenders ( as said in the main post from Cz )

    The defenders coming in second and crashing is cause the player systems can't handle it. Not cause the servers doesn't want you in.

    Make something that you can put all the vicinity rocks, trees and birds out, around a base.
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  4. #44
    80 people is still way too high. I too was at the tower in BS, just south west of the grid. Though I didn't get warped, I saw several others suddenly disappear, only to recieve tells about being warped. There were not even 80 people there, there werent even 50 people there, and the lag was still pretty bad. Towers should not be running on the same servers that host Broken Shores, period. Broken Shores is already broken enough without having to handle 40+ people battling it out.

  5. #45
    After taking part in defending a tower for the first time last night, all i can say to this is *wow*......and in a bad sense

    I enjoyed the experience, dont get me wrong.

    But lag was bad with 40-50 people there, and from what you've said so far Cz, this control system sounds like it'd add more traffic to and from the server.

    At the moment, when an attacking force comes in, the chat handle is flooded, and (even turning off the "other hit other") lag ensues because there are so many people buffing, healing, fighting and such, not to mention the new fighting from the towers to mobs.

    Now this crowd control would add more information to it, having to work out whoose what level, whoose on a team, who is with an org, who is where, who is crowded in what space and who is dignified as an attacker or passer by?

    It sounds like a heap load of information to me, and i could only suggest that if you wanted this crowd control to work, you'd have to seriously limit the number below 80.

    From thinking of all the information going to and from server, i imagine this crowd control thing to add more lag, not take it away.

    (and i do agree with the others on the debacle of Rimour, why on earth would anybody initiate a whole server into this scheme, then when its meant ot have been turned off, the figures are all wrong and it carries on. This surely means they would've been wrong the moment you put it out. It kinda wreaks of a farce)

    But anyway, my contribution is simple. This thing would on the outlook of my experience already, seem to probably make things worse, unless you halve the amount of the crowd. And i dont think people want that.
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  6. #46
    Mort has crashed twice since server start already.

    I'd say that's good feedback on your system.

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  7. #47


    The NW concept has been fun for the first day, but as more and more people started attacking and defending, the lag was horrible. Problems included getting stuck while sitting. Also broken nanos,,I a trader, no drains ever seemed to work. PRetty much camelot in a wider scale.

    Also in Rimor, I got stuck outside the player limit thingy,,,and somehow got warped inside it,,,I was stuck inside the base with 30 clanners and couldnt get out because of whatever reason..Basically I had 60 seconds to get out, but was stuck inside because of the stupid limiter.

  8. #48


    Certainly, the client could auto-turn-off some of the excess caht messages on entry into a LCA and turn them back to their original state on exit. That would reduce the strain on the player's bandwidth a bit. Reduce the frequency of game state replication would also help, things might become a bit jerky, but it would be better than no motion...
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  9. #49
    With all the money gained from the booster pack, why dont you buy more servers for the server farm !
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  10. #50

    I was waiting at reclaim booth at south gate of Tir when I was deported. I was relived that I didnt lose any items and no roller rats killed me. But was very inconvenient.

    Second problem everyone had in NLD on Dec 3rd at around 8:30pm PST is the crowd control feature would cause EVERYONE to crash and then when you reconnected you realized that you had been deported to somewhere. One minute there is a big battle then the next minute after I relog after crashign there is no one there. Kinda like the twilightzone meets ao.

  11. #51
    Must say that Gronta was right in a previous post.
    My bud was transported all over the map in Newland Desert Tue 3/12 at the battle over the clan land control tower.
    So the crowd control seems to be implemented in NLD also.

    Had to tell him coordinates since the poor guy was completely lost out there.
    As it happened we both were in the level range to make a difference in that battle = 30-40.
    If anyone are to be transported away - it should be
    1: The organisation who have most members on the location.
    2: Those who are of a to high or low level to make a difference in that location.
    But yes, I understand that it might be complicated to do yet I hope the dev's will at least consider the possibility.

    As it happens, we were the only 2 neutrals there, yet one of use were trown out so far he used most of the gametime to travel back.
    Teams broke up so one got the 'Damage wiped since team broke up in midfight' happened over and over - if this was due to people warped out of the zone or not - i cant say.
    But it certainly did affect the outcome of the battle.

  12. #52


    Crowd limiting has now been turned off completely on Rimor.

    On Atlantean we have turned it off in Mort and Perpetual Wasteland. Instead we have turned it on in
    - Deep Artery Valley
    - Easter Fould Plains
    - Southern Foul Hills

    Also, we now have a cap of 50 and a delta of 5. Please let us know your experience with battles conducted in these playfields.

  13. #53


    well that all sounds great CZ exept it ISNT TRUE!!!!! its NOT just on RK1 and its NOT only in those play fields,,, and it SUCKS btw
    We on RK2 had it working very well in belia forest ,,, defenders just put enough ppl in thier base to make us getting kicked out and we were like hmmmmm can FC really be that stupid??? geee bad question
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  14. #54
    Sounds good CZ. Also keep in mind the trees and debris around the towers in these PF's. My bet is that there'll still be blood red lag. Is there a chance of removing environment objects within 100m of tower?

  15. #55
    Limiting by guild is stupid.

    A straight limit by faction is all that's needed.

    The reality of NWs is that it isn't a guild vs guild battle. It is generally a Clan vs Omni battle.

    If you implement this guild limit, then you will see only large guilds surviving.

    You will see the hoardes of Clan and Omni having fun charging around attacking and defending regardless of guild have their fun sucked out.

    You will have your guild vs guild. The five or so that are large enough to attract every greedy lootwhore in this game.

    It is a HORRIBLE change.

    Limit by faction. Not by guild.

  16. #56
    Originally posted by Zylina
    Limiting by guild is stupid.

    A straight limit by faction is all that's needed.

    The reality of NWs is that it isn't a guild vs guild battle. It is generally a Clan vs Omni battle.

    If you implement this guild limit, then you will see only large guilds surviving.

    You will see the hoardes of Clan and Omni having fun charging around attacking and defending regardless of guild have their fun sucked out.

    You will have your guild vs guild. The five or so that are large enough to attract every greedy lootwhore in this game.

    It is a HORRIBLE change.

    Limit by faction. Not by guild.
    Agreed entirely with Zylina's post. Faction not guild.
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  17. #57

    What about Docs?

    So, as far as I understand, non active defenders will be warped out, and non active being defined by the amount of damage they are doing.

    Thus a healer will get warped out because they are not doing damage?

    It would suck leet gonads to lose your doc during combat because someone else came on the playing field.

    PLEASE, give use a simple YES or no answer as to whether or not the CoH chests can be opened

  18. #58
    I can give you first hand experience from how it works. Our towers in SFH was taken several hours ago.

    Here's exactly how it happend - Apoc gathered a force of about 15-20 or so peeps near SD, and then streamed down to the base. With their numbers added to our own limited numbers - we're talking in the 20's for all peeps involved + the control tower and hmm, 9 I think support towers, the playfield was so incredibly lagged as to be unplayable.

    I was rooted without knowing it, and lagged hard ie. frozen. Everything came streaming in at once after about 2 mins., with another long delay before the reclaim process started. When I tried to grid back - crashed.

    So as for the crowed control procedures - who cares? The servers can't even handle 30 people in close combat, much less 50 or more.

    I have a P4, 512ddr, cable modem, blah blah blah, so it's not on my end.

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  19. #59
    I actually think it should be guild by guild imo.
    Nothing like having 1 guild vs 7. Otherwise, whats the point of having a powerful guild? Unless everyone from one faction is in said guild..

    Thus said, I am sick of workaround solutions. Fix the problem FC - Your servers.
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  20. #60
    Agree with Kink, make the servers more robust, but if that can't happen here's another idea.

    Drop all gas levels of the entire zones of PW, Mort, DAV, Belail, EFP, SFH, Mort, SAV and CAV and any place that can hold a q150 (or q200) controller or better down to 25%, 5% or 0%.

    Limit the crowds around the bases in some basic sense and then let everyone else fight around the outskirts.

    Keep periodic 100% gas around the bases so there are safe havens, maybe keep 75% around the uniques.
    MP's should be FEARED.

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