traders are overpowered - justify already !!

**Mercatura** · Nov 27th, 2002, 03:33:02

I'd settle for traders deleted if we get to keep our levels n' tokens and reroll, because it would set a precedent.

The pvp whining would drop considerably besides the hardcore forum trolls who spend 10 times as many hours on forums than ingame, most people would realize that everything even remotely fun in the game would be gone in a matter of weeks. And they would finally shut up.

Losing the trader profession for that would be worth it.

FC would love to, you all really have no idea how much not having wrangles in the game would let them continue The Vision™ so they can perfectly tweak which profession can use what where and when.

When an enemy invades your land with a collum of tanks, the first thing you do is blow the bridges in front of them. (or when they start crossing if you can)

**Razzitazz** · Nov 27th, 2002, 10:50:33

Originally posted by Cudus
Piercing, this is from character creation:

The Trader is the ultimate businessman, getting more for less in every single transaction. Like others, they create and trade material goods. But in combat situations, they use unique nanotechnology which enables them to drain opponents of skills, energy and health, transferring those benefiths to themselves or their allies. This frequently causes the most formidable opponents to wither to a cracked shell of their former self...

Now please stfu!

Yeah, that is the description that is in the charecter creation, obviously after the 1 year+ Funcom can accurately display it in the last patch.

Trouble is that is not the description of the trader that has been in the manual, strat guide or website for the past year. They took out the "weak in offense" or "bad in battle" part.

You dumb bastard.

**binaural** · Nov 27th, 2002, 11:07:15

Originally posted by Piercingevil

Yeah, that is the description that is in the charecter creation, obviously after the 1 year+ Funcom can accurately display it in the last patch.

Trouble is that is not the description of the trader that has been in the manual, strat guide or website for the past year. They took out the "weak in offense" or "bad in battle" part.

You dumb bastard.

Rofl Peicingevil>Cudus

yeah, it used to say on the strat guide and stuff that a traders weak feild is all combat.

Thus regardless of your occasional losses to enfs or whatnot.. your absolute ownage of the pvp side of AO seems kinda silly. I know that Cz plays a trader and he even said (tho kind of jokingly) that he doesn't want them nerfed... don't worry. the 50% of all threads on the forums being nerf trader threads won't worry funcom.

**Razzitazz** · Nov 27th, 2002, 15:56:43

Seems everyone wants to act now that traders were envisioned to be the masters of both trade skills and combat. Hell they have the best evade buff in game, second best calms.

You guys even complained when your heals got taken away. lol.

**_______________nehte** · Nov 27th, 2002, 16:05:45

Best evade buff? You don't know what ur talking abaut.
Quantum Uncertainty is 110 evades and takes 43 NCU.
Reduce inertia is 120 evades and 42 NCU.
Then u got fixer runbuff wich doesn't add that much evades but i prefer 30less evades and 700 more runspeed.

**binaural** · Nov 27th, 2002, 19:16:33

Originally posted by nehte
Best evade buff? You don't know what ur talking abaut.
Quantum Uncertainty is 110 evades and takes 43 NCU.
Reduce inertia is 120 evades and 42 NCU.
Then u got fixer runbuff wich doesn't add that much evades but i prefer 30less evades and 700 more runspeed.

oh noes!!! only 10 less then a MARTIAL ARTIST my god you must be upset!

they really should give you guys a decent nuke that is close to a NT nuke and then you would have it all : P

**Razzitazz** · Nov 27th, 2002, 19:35:46

Originally posted by nehte
Best evade buff? You don't know what ur talking abaut.
Quantum Uncertainty is 110 evades and takes 43 NCU.
Reduce inertia is 120 evades and 42 NCU.
Then u got fixer runbuff wich doesn't add that much evades but i prefer 30less evades and 700 more runspeed.

wtf ever, you get my drift.

**Mercatura** · Nov 27th, 2002, 21:04:57

<--- annoys MAs with QU for fun. At least until they finally wake up and MoP me

**__________Beautyfarm** · Nov 27th, 2002, 21:52:33

gimme AoE nukes and you can have the plunder line.

deal ?

**_______________Cudus** · Nov 27th, 2002, 23:48:03

Originally posted by Piercingevil
You dumb bastard.

Run out of your sorry excuses for arguments eh?
This is -Anarchy Online: Forum Wars™-

**MrBunny** · Nov 28th, 2002, 00:21:52

Originally posted by Nothinman

oh noes!!! only 10 less then a MARTIAL ARTIST

The point is piercing evil got her facts wrong as she usually does. MA"s evade buffs ARE superior to a trader's evade buffs. NCU wise, and Buff wise.

Countless times I've seen morons like nothinham, piercingevil, zylina, coldstrike, calvara, bring up the same reason over and over again as to how it is traders are Uber. They use the same scenario they use the same numbers, and they even use the same anecdote from a long time ago. Funny considering how many people have brought evidence to the contrary.

They don't seem to realize that in reality soldiers and NT's are the ones that are exremely overpowered.

Let's compare
What do traders have?
-no ac buffs
-no hp buffs
-no evade buffs
-only the ability to tempoarily buff and debuff their opponents
-gimpy heals after trader nerf

What do soldiers have?
-AC buffs
-HP buffs
-A HEALING NANO
-Reflect buffs
-Init buffs
-TMS which makes them unkillable for 1.5 minutes, and after 30 seconds they can re-cast it.
-Weapons that do radiation

What do NT's have?
-Exploit that lets them nuke their target without getting agro
-NS which makes them unkillable like a soldier.
-Area Nukes that let them do 3k damage
-Nanos that let them debuff AC so they can do even more damage than 3k

It's always the case for anyone whos ever gone to tarrasque raids, to see a group of NT's wiping out omni or clan forces as they try to take box room. It's always the case that a group of soldiers will run in and alpha anything that moves, leaving alot of dead bodies behind, and not even being scratched once they throw up their Mk shields. What of them even getting a scratch? Just heal it up and alpha some more.

Everyone keeps talking about balancing pVp. Well if you really want a balance in PvP then you should all be rooting for the nerf of soldiers and NTs. Group of Nt's wiping out half the opposing force trying to take box room? No other profession in the game can do that with the exception of soldiers, and even they are just as good as Nt's.

NERF SOLDIERS AND NT's!

**MrBunny** · Nov 28th, 2002, 00:29:34

Originally posted by Piercingevil
Yeah, that is the description that is in the charecter creation, obviously after the 1 year+ Funcom can accurately display it in the last patch.

They should have also added to the NT description:

If you wanna be able to kill everyone in mass battles without even getting scratched, or to debuff someone's armor to the point of worthlessness so you can nuke them as if they were naked, then this is the class for you. NT, the number 1 pvp profession in AO.

The nerfing for NT's is long overdue.

**MrBunny** · Nov 28th, 2002, 00:39:58

Originally posted by Piercingevil
. Hell they have the best evade buff in game, second best calms.

What are you complaining about? Nt's have the second best calms, the Best Nukes, the Best roots, HE for their nano pool, and if you just run a hot, you cant possibly die. And if that was not enough you even get a godly nano that lets you not take any damage. omg what more do NT's want? Nano program called, "Everyone sux0r but Me" ?

which would drop your evades to 0, gives you a 10k damage shield, and also agros everything to you?

"Oh no but traders have the best evade buff" Wrong. "They got second best Calms" Wrong. Crats have the best calms. Traders come in third. You just about got everything wrong, which is not surprising, cause from what I have read, you seem to do that alot in your posts.

NT's have far more superior nano skills than a trader would ever have.

If anything needs to be nerfed it has to be NS. I mean, that's just impossibly uber. No damage at all, while you stay still. Haha. Very funny, It's almost like the pseduo nano I made up in the begining of this post, only it has no damage shield.

**________tavumebottes** · Nov 28th, 2002, 10:53:31

Is mr bunny trying to get nerf on us
So much BS in a few post is dangerous, plz do not listen to this guy who don t know game mechanics, other profs and his own prof.

**Razzitazz** · Nov 28th, 2002, 13:20:16

Originally posted by MrBunny
Nt's have the second best calms

Nt's have the worst calms in game.

1 = crat
2 = trader
3 = NT

The Best Nukes

This is pretty debatable. Rule of One is on part with our bast nukes, dmg overall. Mind Quake while doing less, but close damage, also lowers nano skills.

What we DO have is the most nukes throughout the levels, MP and crats have long drought times with no nukes.

the Best roots

Wrong again.

1. Fixer
2. Crat
3. Agent
4. Trader
5. NT

HE for their nano pool

Good one, at least you got one thing we have.

and if you just run a hot, you cant possibly die.

lol, You really are a smart one aren't you. You sure you play this game?

And if that was not enough you even get a godly nano that lets you not take any damage

Boy, take by itself you would think every NT had a easy-to-get nano that didn't have any drawback eh?

"Oh no but traders have the best evade buff" Wrong.

Yeah I was wrong, second best, by 10 points. Whoops.

"They got second best Calms" Wrong. Crats have the best calms. Traders come in third.

Try again chief. Traders are second only to crats in their calming abilities.

NT's have far more superior nano skills than a trader would ever have.

Not sure what you mean by this. If you mean their accessability to NFs, then it would be a matter of opinion I guess. But if you mean the actual SKILL LEVEL, you once again show you know nothing about this game.

If anything needs to be nerfed it has to be NS. I mean, that's just impossibly uber. No damage at all, while you stay still. Haha. Very funny, It's almost like the pseduo nano I made up in the begining of this post, only it has no damage shield.

If you nerf it, very few would complain because few have it. Also, there are a few drawbacks which you seem to miss.

1. Duration. It lasts 19s for MKII, 14s for MKI. With MKI you have a 6 second recharge which means you will get one good nuke off before it drops. 3-4 with II.

2. Rooted. Yup, you are rooted in place when you cast NS. So you just back off a sec, then we are dead when you come back. You did know that didn't you?

3. NCU. Takes 46 NCU to hold MKII. You fill mine up, like people tend to do, I cant cast it without fumbling through my NCU trey.

4. Damage shields. Damage shields rip right through it, so don't act like I can sit and AE everything. I do that I'm dead.

5. Debuffs. Yup go right through, so I cast NS, you debuff me, I'm just standing there.

**Razzitazz** · Nov 28th, 2002, 13:21:18

Originally posted by Cudus
Run out of your sorry excuses for arguments eh?
This is -Anarchy Online: Forum Wars™-

Um, my arguement was right above this statement, which Nothinman added to.

Try posting my entire reply.

**Razzitazz** · Nov 28th, 2002, 13:22:19

Originally posted by tallistro
gimme AoE nukes and you can have the plunder line.

deal ?

Hell yeah, you can have VE and Kels if I can have plunder.

**________tavumebottes** · Nov 28th, 2002, 14:51:07

i think i would accept if it was doable

**Mercatura** · Nov 28th, 2002, 15:46:49

What do traders have?
-no ac buffs

Ummmmm...sorry but yes we do. Theyre the"best" in the game, though they take tons of ncu and only last for 3 minutes. Which makes only the debuffs ever worth using, the "AC wrangles" are better used as vendor fodder than uploading.

Nerf..I mean..Delete Traders!

**pudds4tw** · Nov 28th, 2002, 18:02:21

Okay, I'll bite..

Originally posted by MrBunny

The point is piercing evil got her facts wrong as she usually does. MA"s evade buffs ARE superior to a trader's evade buffs. NCU wise, and Buff wise.

Countless times I've seen morons like nothinham, piercingevil, zylina, coldstrike, calvara, bring up the same reason over and over again as to how it is traders are Uber. They use the same scenario they use the same numbers, and they even use the same anecdote from a long time ago. Funny considering how many people have brought evidence to the contrary.

They don't seem to realize that in reality soldiers and NT's are the ones that are exremely overpowered.

Let's compare
What do traders have?
-no ac buffs
-no hp buffs
-no evade buffs
-only the ability to tempoarily buff and debuff their opponents
-gimpy heals after trader nerf

What do soldiers have?
-AC buffs

Which are so low and pitful, plus uses nanoskills which no soldier in their right mind would make a priority that no soldiers under 160 would ever use them, and even if they do the small boost compared to the level they're used at makes them little more than a novelty.

Originally posted by MrBunny

-HP buffs

See AC buffs...

Originally posted by MrBunny

-A HEALING NANO

A...the key word is "A". We got ONE healing nano, which most soldiers, unless they want to sacrifice key areas, are able to cast at 150+. It's an allright nano when you're able to instacast it, granted, but that means investing a shovelful of IP into our dark blue nano init and even then you're normally far better off just blasting away instead of trying to heal.

Originally posted by MrBunny

-Reflect buffs

I'll give you that one. Reflect buffs are a very nice nanoline for the soldier and useful in combat.

Originally posted by MrBunny

-Init buffs

Yes...2...one is so low the benefit is next to 0 and the other one requires so much nanoskill that only soldiers above 190 can cast it unless they're kitted out with various hard to get nanoboosting items.

Originally posted by MrBunny

-TMS which makes them unkillable for 1.5 minutes, and after 30 seconds they can re-cast it.

That's 1 min and 20 seconds and we can recast it 40 seconds after that. Also it has the quite quite significant drawback of removing our active reflect shield, which makes us totally vulnerable when TMS drops. It also renders us impossible to cast our heal nano, making it even less useful in pitched battles.

Originally posted by MrBunny
-Weapons that do radiation
[/B]

I assume you're referring to the Augmented and Boosted Hellspinners. It's true that these weapons are quite deadly, however they are no more, in fact probably less, deadly than the manex and the queen blade.
Also, obtaining the upgrade for the Hellspinner is extremely difficult, requiring the effort of several teams and the level req of 175 for the low version of the upgraded Hellspinners mean that..well...a significant part of all soldiers cant use it.

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