14.7.1 : Nano changes

[_____Real Kinky Ityn]

Hmm the root level check is a fine idea but I think funcom is loosing sight of some of it's original class vision. Crats have the best roots in the game. We have 2 in particular that are very good but they come at mid level. The first is a ql99 root greater restrict movement, it has a 50% resist rate. The second is a ql129 area root, greater mass illus paralisis, and this has a 65% resist.

The 2 class defining abilities of crats are charms and the best roots in the game.

I think it's essential you rework the crats high end root nanos to continue this line up to 185. No need to change existing roots, just add 2 more of each root and area root.

Greater Restrict movement II at ql 145
Greater Restrict movement III at ql 180

GMIP (greater mass Illus paral) II ql 150
GIMP III QL 185.

And that should do it. I think it was Funcom's original intention to make crats the one class that could actually root a raging enforcer, this will no longer be the case in the coming patch. I know Gaute has a lot of things on his head, thinking we had an 11% crit buff and all, so I just wanted to bring the small world of crats to your attention here and let you know that you may have strayed a bit from your design intentions.

[mercutio4910]

make root/snare need more nano , and they can use it every 3 min only !!!!!

[anarc]

Cz please ask dev´s to add some higher ql snares and roots to agents and other professions, our snare and ae snare stop at about ql 100

[Skymarshal]

First off,

Talk about the "Items" that remove roots/snares all you want. The things that I have found out from looking at the 14.7 item DB, is that they dont just magicaly break roots/snares, they only remove time from them, this would imply that you can use them all you want, but your still rooted.

Secondly,

I dont think we should be making it harder for roots/snares to be broken. As it stands on live today, some of the most powerfull pvp classes are the ones that can root. These days with the extended lenght of PvP battles, Roots are the only way to keep a person from running.

Might I be bitter because I am a soldier, maybe, but I think that my point here is more of a balance point in general, in repsects to all the non-Rooting classes.

Roots are ALREADY powerfull in PvP, this change just makes them rediculus.

I already am fearing stepping into PvP zones alone, now after this change it won't be a fear, I jsut won't do it. It is not logical, my class, has no way to handle being chain rooted/deprived/etc.

That is a topic of much discusion, in another forum though.


Furthermore, please, I beg of everyone not to just randomly 'think' they know what they are talking about, when they truley dont. I don't know everything, I never claimed to, but I'm also not insane enough to come here saying things like roots are underpowered. Anyone who cant root, and anyone who takes a moment to play a class that doesn't have roots, will soon relize how good they really are.

~sky

[mercutio4910]

as mlee advy , i agree sky !

[________________Gold]

hehehe...this can be fun...

last time I duelled an enf (u know, one of those professions with high nano res) I snared him....it took him 40s or so to get it off him, and start moving again (he didn't have a runbuff going, so he was at -500 runspeed or sumthing)...by that time I had halfed his hp and once he broke it, I started chainrooting him instead. He didn't counter 1 root, and he died while screaming "CHEAP!!"....hehe...

can't wait to go to 2h0, put a -1500 snare or a long root on someone and then just leave...hehe...come back 10 mins later and kill them. HAHAHA

oh, and moving tir grid? hey great...not...how about increasing bandwith and cpu power to the city instead? You see, cz, zoning in this game your company makes is a 50/50 chance of crashing/reaching other side. Well, depends on which zones...training grounds zoning are always 2-3 attempts.

Lol, more nails in the coffin. Release nw and get the suffering over with, hehe...when does swg come out?

[Snuble]

There is 1 item you can use to get rid of a root. The free movement stim. It took 5 QL125 stims to get rid of a 3 minute NT root. The other "root" breaker only works on snares (its in the description).The virus scanner stims can only be used while sitting. (from now on I'll only sit and attack!).

The free movement stim have a 2s attack and a 5 second recharge. Thats 45 seconds to break a 3minute root. In that time the NT would be out of range and out of aggro. Guess he could chain root me at that spot for as long as its fun for him.

Roots are in fact getting stronger (harder to break when you are attacked, don't break when you are debuffed), and they are getting harder to resist (the level thing put into the equation called for a 10% reduction to resist).

To put it this way, even with a 50% chance to resist, you would be glued to the spot 9/10 in 3 retries.

Big love for the rooters out there, but it comes at the expense of melee users. And those left with only the Free Movement Stims will get it the most. At least soldiers still got their range

[Mercatura]

I can also confirm firsthand the "root/snare removing tools" really suck.

[Waffen]

Originally posted by Achmed20
im talking about shields not TMS. radiation deflection shied, fire defelction shield or whatever.

about the restoration kist! teh guy is also unable to use any treament kits or nano rechrager. hes still in fight to he cant use em. only item hey can use r stims too.

restoration kits may need take 40 secs, but they add NP and HP. using both as stims would take 60 secs.

The shields you mention are from items, and would require one to raise the parry skill, which for a soldier is another ip sink.

And the rooter could recharge. All they have to do is zone, heal and recharge, and zone back. Plenty of time to do this with upper level roots.

[_______________kratt]

There is a HUGE gap between calm nano programs, how are they going to deal with that? If I'm still using a calm from 50 levels ago, and cannot use the calm 50 levels above me, how can I expect to calm mobs?

[Achmed20]

Originally posted by Waffen


The shields you mention are from items, and would require one to raise the parry skill, which for a soldier is another ip sink.

And the rooter could recharge. All they have to do is zone, heal and recharge, and zone back. Plenty of time to do this with upper level roots.

i give up .... ok soldiers suck and im going to shot every1 :P

[Achmed20]

Originally posted by kratt
There is a HUGE gap between calm nano programs, how are they going to deal with that? If I'm still using a calm from 50 levels ago, and cannot use the calm 50 levels above me, how can I expect to calm mobs?

how do u expect using a lvl 50 gun on a lvl 100 mob and still hoping ull survive?

[_______________Vydas]

Originally posted by Achmed20

how do u expect using a lvl 50 gun on a lvl 100 mob and still hoping ull survive?

The point here is that it is possible to upgrade your gun. The same is not true for nano formulae, if none are available for your prof in that spread.

[Blackwing]

totally dodged test life?

sorry for the strong words but are you nuts?

what should a crat or nt do to get into a team now in the 80-160 range? bellydance maybe?

if the change to calm resistance is anything like the charm crat line which is totally useless between 80-160 - and you give no reason for it being not so - then you effectively killed crowd control.

crats are not able to cast their higher mezzes due to the steps in between neither are nts (plus nt calms have a high resistance per se).

may i ask who had this bright idea?

(as for the root crap sorry i dont pvp so i could care less. i am however amazed that i now have to stand around a couple of minutes until the root breaker stim takes hold. yay! makes missions so much more exiting.)

[_____Real Kinky Ityn]

I think what the mezz level cap will do is force people to take easier missions which may be nice for crats in a "fun" sense.

Think of it this way, how many crats complain about not being able to charm any of the mobs in missions from level 80-160? They say charms are useless because of the psy checks, therefore all they are good for is calming in this level range. If no class can mezz say 160 missions and level 80-100 teams are pulling them, then those teams will just die. Even the pathetically gimpy pets' mobs have will be a threat. This will force teams to pull lower missions, and this will also make people level slower. If that is the case, you will be able to get a lot more use out of your charms and this will make your game play more dynamic.

See, Blackwing, I'm level 191 and I really don't care about mezzes and PVM. I hardly use them anyway, and the only think this is going to mean is no more area calming EFP boss mob lackies.

I do care about roots though, and regardless of how they have been adusted, and regardless of if they will be as quickly nurfed as they were adjusted, it makes NO SENSE AT ALL that our higher QL roots are INFERIOR to our lower QL roots. Does that seem to be a valid argument? Should our higher QL roots not have a lower or equal resist as our mid level roots? Since funcom doesn't like changing existing things, a simple suggestion to contiune the line was made, and hope it will be considered.

Hey, IDEA, try using your 50% roots in those 160 missions, if you get past the level check chances are the mob won't resist. Those 65% area roots are pretty useful in missions.

[Coldstrike]

Originally posted by calvara



ooohhh thats right, lets use a LOW LEVEL TMS to "fool" him. yuck yuck! ya that will really help when we are still nanoshutdown for 2 minutes

At least we soldiers will be getting the last laugh. Our opponent might have killed us, but at least we got to fool him into thinking we had TMS Mk X up.

[Zaubermaus]

What's the problem with soldiers and roots?

Soldiers are (or at least, should be ) using ranged weapons, so a root won't have such a big effect on them since they are still able to shoot back ...

... except their opponent has a better range, but hey, range has to be good for something at all

[____________Fenestra]

Originally posted by Waffen
My hovercraft is full of eels

OMG! That must be really frustrating!

Hey guys, you're generalising this so much, you all look like... that N-word with two staring eyes. FC speaks of roots now having a level-check. Now, they also say some professions' roots will be harder to break than others. Roots had their defensive skill decreased by 10% (!). And, snares till be very hard to break.

So far, everyone has been complaining about either "everyone can now break my roots and snares" or "now why doesn't my profession have an anti-root nano...grmbl".

It is NOT this simple, and was never intended to be simple. If you have decent nano-resist, while fighting on full def - you will be very hard to root. On the other hand, if you use a high-level snare, you can almost be sure that it doesn't get resisted. And as with all calculations, there is a piece of randomization. This promises to be fun!!!

Now, the question is - these new nano-programs, how efficient are they? Do they break every root and snare you have running? Do you have to keep casting it again if it fails, is it even possible? And what other new root-breaking items are available in the upcoming patch. Have we gotten any informaiton about them at all? Maybe I missed it then - but it's not in the patch notes. The patch notes are so vague it could mean anything.
Has anyone seriously tried them on the test-server? Seriously as inside the bar in Hope with your best friend?

I get the feeling people just collect new stuff all the time, even on the test server. They never do any testing there. I'd love having Seinfeld talking about the testing they don't do on the test server, but heck, he was busy over the weekend. Anyway, stop complaining when you don't know ****.

[Blackwing]

Originally posted by Ityn
I think what the mezz level cap will do is force people to take easier missions which may be nice for crats in a "fun" sense.

Think of it this way, how many crats complain about not being able to charm any of the mobs in missions from level 80-160? They say charms are useless because of the psy checks, therefore all they are good for is calming in this level range. If no class can mezz say 160 missions and level 80-100 teams are pulling them, then those teams will just die. Even the pathetically gimpy pets' mobs have will be a threat. This will force teams to pull lower missions, and this will also make people level slower. If that is the case, you will be able to get a lot more use out of your charms and this will make your game play more dynamic.

See, Blackwing, I'm level 191 and I really don't care about mezzes and PVM. I hardly use them anyway, and the only think this is going to mean is no more area calming EFP boss mob lackies.

I do care about roots though, and regardless of how they have been adusted, and regardless of if they will be as quickly nurfed as they were adjusted, it makes NO SENSE AT ALL that our higher QL roots are INFERIOR to our lower QL roots. Does that seem to be a valid argument? Should our higher QL roots not have a lower or equal resist as our mid level roots? Since funcom doesn't like changing existing things, a simple suggestion to contiune the line was made, and hope it will be considered.

Hey, IDEA, try using your 50% roots in those 160 missions, if you get past the level check chances are the mob won't resist. Those 65% area roots are pretty useful in missions.

i try to think outside of my characters sandbox.

i could put my bureaucrat into the level cap where he can use ql 160ish calms and charms give or take.

that is however not my point.

i have friends who play nts and crats at a level significantly below my own.

can you please explain to me how they are supposed to find a team now their primary reason for existance in said teams has been nerfed to hell and back?

that is the point. i am well aware that after passing 170 you do not need calms nor even a full doctor to succeed but that has nothing to do with the power of calms or even heals it is just because the reward system is fubared.

people would do higher ql missions in a heartbeat if the rewards were worth it and the inflation of crowd control / heals at higher levels would cease to exist.

fact is that the last patches have killed crowd control.

mobs summon you or are flat out resistant to anything you can do anyway so why take a gimp crat or nt into your team now?

for my speeches and xp buffs or the nt for his humidity and nukes?

i severly doubt this will happen.

time to level my trader since she will be the most effective crowd controller now.

[Blackwing]

Originally posted by Fenestra


I get the feeling people just collect new stuff all the time, even on the test server. They never do any testing there. I'd love having Seinfeld talking about the testing they don't do on the test server, but heck, he was busy over the weekend. Anyway, stop complaining when you don't know ****.

has this patch not completely bypassed the test server?

is it not so that only a select handfull of nw beta testers have a slight clue about what will happen?

i could be wrong maybe 14.7 has been patched to test life this week but it sure was not on monday.

this change is radical and quite drastic and it sure as hell could have used some weeks on test life so we gather some info.

the way i and i reckon most players learned about it was when the patch notes were dropped from a great height upon us about 48 hours before this patch went life.

wtf is that?