What's the primary method to overequip?

[________________LRRH]

Not asking cos I want to, asking cos I'm thinking about balances. ;)

In the shift-left click description for the Stamina attribute, it says it's lowered by the addition of implants.

If the usual method is by nano-buffing, then.. I dunno what to do. ;)

If it's implants, the best way would be to simply enable this implant-lowers-stamina thing. Or, better yet, lowers-stamina-and-body-development..

Maybe have this dependant on your level. If you're using an implant N quality levels over your character level - like, 200 implants in a 150 level character - it lowers your stats by some clever mathematical agolrithm, which I could never come up with because math sucks rocks. ;)

Thoughts? Good? Lame? ;p

[_____________Barakon]

I'd say implants is part of the problem, but mainly the fact that you can stack buffs as well as some buffs being quite potent.


eg*

first, get implants in above your lvl by getting your str/agi/sense/int/psy/sta buffed by the various professions as well as using general buffs, and treatment buffed by general nano/doc/implant machine.

second, get mastery buffs for your weapon of choice, then stack that set of buffs with the best wrangle you can get. The skill increase from the implants as well as the masteries and wrangle allow you to over-equip your weapon by quite a bit.

third, get your str/sta/agi/sense/int/psy buffed up with profession buffs as well as general buffs. The primary stat increase from the implants as well as the buffs allows you to over-equip your armor by a fair amount, of course armor wont help you much when someone crits you for a few thousand damage *cough* Vektor *cough*

This is when the 'Twink' will go to PvP zones and spoil for a fight, before his/her equipment starts to go a bit 'stale' from gaining a few lvls. I've also heard of some 'Twinks' who don't lvl their 'uber' char so that the equipment stays at 'premium' potency, and just PvP with it.

[Meetshield]

The biggest culprit in the overequipping world is wrangles.

For 2 or 3 minutes you get your weapon stats boosted greatly. If there is one thing that would solve the over-equiping situation in one shot, it would be to get rid of wrangling (sorry traders but its true).

[XoTech]

Wrangles dont help a trader in any way at all. You should apologize to every other profession. Wrangles HURT our skills for 3 min and help who we cast on for 3 mins. I wouldn't care at all if they removed wrangles except for the fact that other traders couldn't wrangle my trader.

[______________Wahoo.]

Wrangles are the biggest problem!With the new over-equiping rules those will more than kill the wrangles for the use of over-equiping. Humm but we'll see.

[Meetshield]

I meant "Sorry traders cause I know thats you big money maker"

[______________Nelida]

buy into the NONSENSE that the so-called 'overequipping' is "bad".

I'm actually quite amazed that anyone who actually likes diversity would want to nerf all the means that provide a RANGE of character ability. Sure, punish those that go out of their way to be the best they can. Let's all try to strive to the LOWEST common denominator...that's a rich and rewarding goal. If anyone actually SUCCEEDS in this game let's knock them back down into the ranks of those that plod along frittering away their time and money. Oh...hehe...silly me...this is EXACTLY what Funcom wants. They WANT us to struggle endlessly while we pay them. After this little 'balancing' act some class will again figure out how to get ahead and Funcom will come back out to knock us down again.

Don't ANY of you see the pattern here? There will ALWAYS be people who want to make the most of themselves. Unfortunately there are ALSO many people that think 'getting ahead' means holding others back. In this case it is to Funcom's advantage financially to listen to the later group.

Originally posted by Tomasin
The biggest culprit in the overequipping world is wrangles.

For 2 or 3 minutes you get your weapon stats boosted greatly. If there is one thing that would solve the over-equiping situation in one shot, it would be to get rid of wrangling (sorry traders but its true).

[Meetshield]

I think you are drawing false conclusions here. If you cant see that overequipping has caused some game balance issues, then you arent paying attention.

The situation is this:

Im only going to use these two classes as an example to try and spell this out for people who think that overequipping changes are being requested by people who just want to hold back the people who try the hardest to excel. I use these two classes cause they are the two classes I play as co-mains if you will.

My Agent is capable of self equipping into some pretty nice higher QL weapons. This is by design, they are supposed to be able to buff rifle and aimed shot to equip them at a higher level than other classes can. They can maintain it. BUT they are also able to equip way beyond their means by wrangling into a weapon beyond what they can buff into. This upsets the current balance in the game as an overequipped agent is pretty deadly and can rocket through levels.

The result is Funcom tuned mobs to compensate for this by making mobs tougher with higher ac and more hp. A knee-jerk reaction for sure, but thats the current state of the game. This would be all fine and good if everyone could wrangle into a higher level weapon.

My Martial Artist cant wrangle into higher QL fists. My MA can self buff its MA higher than any other class can as they should, its by design. At level 82 my MA skill is capped. I have 18 levels where I cant add any more points to MA. It basically stays where it is and mobs become tougher and tougher. MA weapons are completely broken right now and are more trouble to use than they are worth, so wrangling into them isnt an option since we have to continuously un-equip them and zone and re-equip them just to get them to work correctly any time our MA skill changes for any reason (buff, debuff, etc...)

Now while my MA is unable to increase its MA skill for 18 levels, other classes are able to wrangle into higher and higher QL weapons making them more effective as they go on, even if their weapon skill caps also. They become more effective and progress with the ever toughening game, while MAs stay exactly where they are for 18 levels. Then once thier MA skill goes up again, they are no 18 levels behind everyone else.

So while it is beneficial and fun for the agent to over-equip and I admit, its hard to survive as one without doing that, it is a nightmare as a result for MAs who are stuck with fists that cap out, and they have no ability to increase it.

You could make this comparison with other classes too, I just know these two so thats why I chose them.

The problem has really spiralled out of control. It has gone on for so long now that it has become a game play feature and of course people arent going to want it changed after the time and effort they put into equipping that uber weapon they spent a ton of credits on. I totally see where they are coming from. Is nerfing overequipping the answer? Most likely not, but something needs to be done to compensate for that for the MAs who cant overequip their fists.

One way to do that would be to add items like MA gloves that increase the MA skill by so many pts and have a skill requirement based on brawl or something. Add brawl to the skill wrangles and voila, MAs can overequip, thus evening the playing field. That would be better then upsetting the balance that the majority of the classes have come to depend on.

I support the discussion on this going further. I right now support the over-equipping changes cause I want to see something, anything done. I want to play my MA again, but under current conditions its an exercize in futility, and I would rather play a class that can compete. Its a double edged sword really. I want something done for my Minimum Damage Artist, but not at the expense of my Agent, but I guess thats like having your cake and eating it too.

[________________LRRH]

See, I don't think wrangles and buffs and the like were originally meant for over-equipping.

When you buff a skill that your weapon uses - if you're an Agent, and you buff Rifle, for instance - your Attack Rating goes up. Buff aimed shot, and it'll be more accurate and do more damage. Buff your attributes, and they'll add a few points to the relevant skills (Agility Boost usually adds a few points to Rifle and Aimed Shot, for instance). I'm thinking that over-equipping is a by-product, and not necessarily intended from the get-go.

Has there been anything from Funcom to contradict this line of reasoning?

Mind you, a little bit of over-equipping is fine, and certainly necessary in the current environment. It's the rampant stuff that's the problem; level 100s using QL 200 armours, weapons, and implants.

[________Transcendent]

What did the designers think when they made the wrangle nanos ?

[TemplarRed]

Of course wranglers were intended to allow characters to use weapons, nanos, & pets that would otherwise be beyond the ability of the character (i.e., 'over-equipping'). The same can be said of tutoring (once it's fixed) & implants.

To assume otherwise is completely absurd.

There is nothing unfair about this. Any profession can, & should, 'over-equip'. Perhaps not every profession gleans the same amount of benefit from equipping high ql weapons; i.e., MA's... but MA's rock without weapons. If you're an MA & you want to optomize, then you need to look at your armor & implants.

Every other profession besides MA's can benefit from a strong weapon. Even if you are an NT or Doc, & you choose to carry an Important pillow instead of a Vector ND (for example). You can gain an advantage by saving your IP, instead of spending it on 1H blunt... then have a Trader wrangle your 1H blunt skill in order to equip your pillow.

Some people argue that the current system is unfair to 'nano-using professions'. EVERY profession is a nano-using profession. Every profession depends on using nano formulas in combat... not just Docs & NT's.

If anyone out there isn't optomizing their character, then that is your choice... and a poor choice, at that. You are choosing not to use the tools that you are provided with, end of story.

-Templar Red

[_______________Garzu]

Some ppl claim it is a skill to overequip.... LOL, thats BS, all it takes is creds, so mostly ppl with high lvl chars, got the best twinks, just like me.

[Meetshield]

If you think MAs rock without overequipping, you obviously dont play one, arent over 85 and never group with them.

MAs are damn hard once their MA skill caps (for 18 levels). There is not much that can be done about that. This is a huge problem for the MA that doesnt really effect the weapon users.