Small Guilds - I MEAN SMALL

[Argulace]

What is up with the 1-5 person guilds? I'm sorry but it is my humble opinion that a guild should consist of a command structure, leadership and membership body.

How is a 1-5 person guild useful to any cause. They can't take down unique mobs, they don't have the abillity to even make a full team. So, whats the point other than being in the top stats groups for 3rd party sites?

They will gain bonus for this after the booster pack. I think FC needs to address this problem before booster pack release.

Lots of guilds out there ranging from level 1-200, and ranging in membership from 20-260 are working hard to prepare for the booster pack and other guild bonus' which will be available to those who work hard.

Tell me why someone with all their alts in 1 guild constitutes a leader?

Also tell me why someone with clan characters can be in Omni Leader chat. Also tell me why someone with Omni characters can be in Clan leader chat?!?!

These problems are serious.

You should not be able to create an org if your account has an opposite side character on it.

You should not be able to create an org with less than 10 people IMHO and further your org should automatically disband when the membership is below 10 for more than 7 days.

Tell me why i'm wrong. I'm sick of the 2 year olds making guilds just to disrupt leader chat and feel important.

Arg

[uburoi]

Nothing wrong with making a small guild with some friends.

The Leader chat spamming is a different issue.

[Boci]

i am against the spam leader channel gets at times...but argu...saying small orgs shouldnt exist..is moronic. Not everyone is MoK, not everyone WANTS to camp uniques, not everyone WANTS to be in the top. Some people, like those in Albion for example, formed just to have a private chat channel, so they can hang out together, easier. who cares if 5 lvl 200s decide to make an org for themselves...or if 5 lvl 1s do...we all started out somewhere, mebbe you remember?

Bugger off argu, this game is about socializing..in the end, and we all know that...tellin people a small org shouldnt be allowed..thats just silly

[Greybear]

Small org is one of three things.


1)...Player with alts using the bank to allow for easy twinking of self. EXPLOIT
2)...A small but simple group of friends. This is plausable.
3)...A small guild with alot of trouble. Plausable since to make a guild is easy, to make it mean anything is hard.



Personally I believe that you should be able to transfer things to yourself alot easier than it is right now.

A small org of friends is not likely to rule the world but is likely to be enjoyable.

I agree with the fact that if enrollment in an Org drops below a set limit it should be disbanded. Any org should have a set number of peeps to keep it established, then it should also have a set number of peeps per week logging in to verify its membership. Any org that is Omni shouldnt be allowed to have a Clan member and visa versa. Only Nuetral orgs should have all three.

Not sure what Leader chat is, since Im in no Org.

[Argulace]

Originally posted by Boci
i am against the spam leader channel gets at times...but argu...saying small orgs shouldnt exist..is moronic. Not everyone is MoK, not everyone WANTS to camp uniques, not everyone WANTS to be in the top. Some people, like those in Albion for example, formed just to have a private chat channel, so they can hang out together, easier. who cares if 5 lvl 200s decide to make an org for themselves...or if 5 lvl 1s do...we all started out somewhere, mebbe you remember?

Bugger off argu, this game is about socializing..in the end, and we all know that...tellin people a small org shouldnt be allowed..thats just silly

I wont resort to telling you to buggar off, however I shall take a slightly different tone with you from now on.

Apparently your short sidedness does not allow you to see the future problem of this "open guild creating" policy.

Read about the expantion Boci, then tell me how acceptable it is for the clan to make an alt so they can listen to our strategy and know what we are doing before we do it.

Want to make a small chat group? Get a bot.

Arg

[Thorlicious]

well if you don't like the 2 year old simply use /ignore ...if you want to discuss something for ur upcoming moves, open a chatgroup with some others.

I'm in a small guild ya, we're a small group of friends and we invite ppl if we find them beeing rewarding as a person to our org..we help each other for 100%.


I'm normally not a big fan to point out stuff of the real life, but ther are big and small citys...you choose the way you want to life (well ok sometimes you don't have a choice) but in this game you have a free choice

oh and i think the main difference is that I'm playing this game and not really "working" in it.

this ain't a flame to you arg i just wanted to point out that ppl use different ways of playing the game, and they/we are free to do so...

[______________Jerrak]

i can understand what arg is saying about clanners and omnis listening in on stratedgies (dunno how to spell it) and i agree with him.

But saying that small guilds shouldnt exist because they cant do anything is just not right. and saying that they ant get any unique loot is just flat out BS, Arg you know its whichever team does the most damage gets loot rights, so a team of 6 lvl 200s all in the same guild have the same chances at getting the loot, such as tara, but if your talking about un camped mobs, then true, it is alot harder.

If your afraid that small guilds are gonna be able to beat big guilds in notum wars, i dont relaly know what to say about that, but saying small guilds shouldnt exist is wrong.

sorry if i misunderstood your point, but thats what i got out of this thread.

[Boci]

Im not against the whole, pick a side yer stuck with it...but its impractical. Better tellin a shark to be a vegitarian. So long as this remains a game, we have to have the choice for every character.

[__________Lucid Flow]

Originally posted by Argulace_MoK
How is a 1-5 person guild useful to any cause. They can't take down unique mobs, they don't have the abillity to even make a full team. So, whats the point other than being in the top stats groups for 3rd party sites?

They have fun, a concept long lost in this game.

[_______________Karrd]

How is a 1-5 person guild useful to any cause. They can't take down unique mobs, they don't have the abillity to even make a full team. So, whats the point other than being in the top stats groups for 3rd party sites?
They will gain bonus for this after the booster pack.

Some people, like those in Albion for example, formed just to have a private chat channel, so they can hang out together, easier

both points are valid Arg

on the one hand you could have a small group a friends
on the other, you have a small group of high levels getting a bonus
Now they can't just disband all guilds under 15members. But that doesn't get rid of the bonus issue.
catch22, something needs to be reworked

Want to make a small chat group? Get a bot

you make it sound so easy.

[Argulace]

Originally posted by Jerra
i can understand what arg is saying about clanners and omnis listening in on stratedgies (dunno how to spell it) and i agree with him.

But saying that small guilds shouldnt exist because they cant do anything is just not right. and saying that they ant get any unique loot is just flat out BS, Arg you know its whichever team does the most damage gets loot rights, so a team of 6 lvl 200s all in the same guild have the same chances at getting the loot, such as tara, but if your talking about un camped mobs, then true, it is alot harder.

If your afraid that small guilds are gonna be able to beat big guilds in notum wars, i dont relaly know what to say about that, but saying small guilds shouldnt exist is wrong.

sorry if i misunderstood your point, but thats what i got out of this thread.

A team of 6 killing tara who are not participating in the loot system for tara, whatever that may be from which ever side your from are considered one of two things.

a) Ninja's.
b) Leeches.

The point is, that guild of 6 couldn't take tara on their own. Which really amounts to a team of 6, which is a different story all together.

I agree that teams of people who like eachother should be common inside guilds.

Take for example a few guilds I could mention who fit the criteria I'm concerned about. As follows:

http://www.ymera.com/1/A_Neutral.html
http://www.ymera.com/1/Tiffany_n_Co.html
http://www.ymera.com/1/Servants_of_Twilight.html
http://www.ymera.com/1/The_One.html
http://www.ymera.com/1/Star.html
http://www.ymera.com/1/Vandelmar_Consortium.html
http://www.ymera.com/1/Nerfcom_you_n...y_nerf_it.html
http://www.ymera.com/2/The_Sacred_Six.html
http://www.ymera.com/2/PornStarZ.html
http://www.ymera.com/2/The_Cult_of_Vashtar.html
http://www.ymera.com/2/Students_of_OTESL.html

Someone tell me why a single one of these should exist.

Maybe 5 was an arbitrary number. Maybe not.

It used to take 5 people or so to make a guild, whats the point in making one if you dont intend to do something with it?

I think the pressure I'm trying to put on here is more directed at people who log in to AO, make a guild not knowing a darn thing about the game then spam leader chat with things like:

1. Loan me money to buy a yalm.
2. Anyone have "this item or that?" (If i wanna trade, i'll listen to trade channels, not leader chat)
3. !#$@ @#! !@ #!@#$!@# !#@! my !#$!ing (whatever) fell off, how can i get it back on?
4. Can I get a wrangle from someone?
5. Anyone have 80+ treatment?
6. How do i make money? (If you dont know how, you certainly have no business making a guild)
7. etc, etc, etc.

About a year ago, there was a meeting. A meeting on plot related items and as usual it drew the finest people. Azazzel was there to wreck the meeting, I was there to yell and scream about amnesty, Boci was there i believe, others were there to talk about the growing Cyborg problem... Then there were others there who had 3-5 people in their orgs, they were level 20ish and all they wanted to do was yabber about stuff not related to leading ANYONE for ANY reason.

I happen to know one of those persons, who didnt talk much was a member of a very high level Clan organization.

I'm hearing a lot of positive things about an alliance that has formed. At first I wasn't interested, nor was our membership because it seems like every time someone trys to organize something, another person works their rear off to dissasemble it.

I am NOT participating in any plot related activity till someone tells me there are no persons in guild leader chat who have clan characters. You wanna spy? Do it the hard way.

Everything upon everything being implemented in this game is pushing people to come together in guilds. Large and small it makes absolutely no difference. I don't say, "those guys suck" because they have 20 members. I definately have no delusion that MoK is better than anyone else because we have 180. What I do think, is that LEADER CHAT, is LEADER CHAT. And if you want a social channel you should push for one.

Maybe FC could put a social channel application in the game. You apply for and are automatically approved for a "sub group" chat system, which allows the client to automatically create a connection to your favorate channels when you log on.

How hard is that?

Whatever happens, this friends using guild leader chat thing has to go before the booster pack or there will be serious issues concerning guilds working together.

People say, if you wanna talk strategy make a channel? ARE YOU KIDDING ME? Whats the name of the leader channel? Why do they call it that? So you can tell me to go make a leader channel?

Whatever your smokin, keep it away from me.

Edit: Last comment not intended to insult the person who posted the above quote. It was however intended to insult those who think its ok for me to have to make a side channel to discuss things with leaders while they use leader chat to socialize and spy with their opposite side alt.

Arg

[Mercatura]

People could just use 2 accounts to spy. Limiting chars on 1 account in any way would be pointless, and piss a bunch of people off.

Hmm, all guilds under 500 members should be disbanded! j/k

[Hildegaard]

Whoa, Argulace

I can respect your vision of the game, but that's not everybody's vision. Nor do you have any right to shove your vision down anybody else's throat.

You have something of a reputation for arrogance, and threads like this clearly demonstrate why you have that rep.

What gives you the right to say that somebody else's guild should be disbanded?

Who died and made you lord king of the universe?

[____________Dominata]

Originally posted by Argulace_MoK


A team of 6 killing tara who are not participating in the loot system for tara, whatever that may be from which ever side your from are considered one of two things.

a) Ninja's.
b) Leeches.

Nonono... The loot system for Tara is something put in system by players and not Funcom. Tara is essentially a free for all, just because you are in on the loot system does not mean that you are the only ones with loot rights. I bet that those who do not want to participate in the loot system regards those who are pompous prats who think they have some sort of authority in Camelot.
I can understand people not wanting to participate on the clan side of it, they seem to be arrogant and stupid beyond belief so for them it is their only way to have a go at the loot. Omni's new bot seems to be much more friendly, however.
I see the need for the loot system but at the same time you have to realise it is a competition for the loot, and if you want to have a go at the loot without being part of the bot you should be able to do that without being frowned upon. Anything else is...arrogance.

As for the leaders chat... It is one of the most OOC colored chats already and it mostly used for chitchat, even by leaders for the bigger factions. Ideally the chat should be used as a means to coordinate our forces and share valuable information, which happens occasionally, but mainly it is social and it is not only because of the small factions. If you want the leaders chat to only deal with "leadership" issues then you will have to make an effort I'm afraid, but have no illusions about how it is the small factions who ruins "our" chat.
But it is amusing when a faction leader asks for the direction to Harry's, hehe.

At the same time I agree with Arg that there should be a limit on how few people there can be in a faction. The limit for forming a faction is six people and if it ever falls below that for a certain amount of time it should be disbanded. Otherwise FC might as well skip the rule on a full team required for starting a faction in the first place.

[misterretro]

Originally posted by Dominata
Nonono... The loot system for Tara is something put in system by players and not Funcom. Tara is essentially a free for all, just because you are in on the loot system does not mean that you are the only ones with loot rights. I bet that those who do not want to participate in the loot system regards those who are pompous prats who think they have some sort of authority in Camelot.
I

Any player at T who does not participate in the system for either clan or omni is bieng entirely nonproductive and does nothing to help their faction. At the same time they are also doing a disservice to themselves by effectively lowering the chances of getting any loot at all.

As per guilds less than six players, that is entirely rediculous, and they should have been removed from the game long ago, and the same goes for guilds of less than six ACCOUNTS. (Where accounts are used to measure the # of people)

The problem with leader chat has been that way for a long time, I understand. Since it is so easily infiltrated by people that haven't ever heard of the words "Role-Playing". For any sense of security, a bot is far more appropriate to use as a leader chat, because access could be restricted to people who are loyal to their faction, and people who intend on using it for the intended purpose of "Leader" Chat: to lead people. On the other hand, Leader Chat as it has been is more of a joke than anything in my understanding, and will probably remain to be that way.

[_______________Hypos]

Weren't orgs changed a while back so that to create them, you first form a team and then the org is created from the team? Given that constraint, it doesn't sound like it would be possible to limit orgs to having large numbers only, or new orgs could never be created.

[________Garzu-perman]

Originally posted by Warsprite


Any player at T who does not participate in the system for either clan or omni is bieng entirely nonproductive and does nothing to help their faction. At the same time they are also doing a disservice to themselves by effectively lowering the chances of getting any loot at all.

As per guilds less than six players, that is entirely rediculous, and they should have been removed from the game long ago, and the same goes for guilds of less than six ACCOUNTS. (Where accounts are used to measure the # of people)

The problem with leader chat has been that way for a long time, I understand. Since it is so easily infiltrated by people that haven't ever heard of the words "Role-Playing". For any sense of security, a bot is far more appropriate to use as a leader chat, because access could be restricted to people who are loyal to their faction, and people who intend on using it for the intended purpose of "Leader" Chat: to lead people. On the other hand, Leader Chat as it has been is more of a joke than anything in my understanding, and will probably remain to be that way.

I just noticed your sig: "Omni to the end", well, good luck then, the end is near.

[Streaz18]

Arg,

My guild used to consist of around 10-12 members back when the highest person in our guild was around lvl 100. However, many quit and we are now down to four main members. Three of us are 181, 180, and 179 respectively. The other is in the high 120s and plays on and off. We have enjoyed chatting together and we help each other in as many ways as we can. We like having a guild and it gives us pleasure in having a small group of friends we can talk to about ingame and real life stuff. We don't take on camped mobs or go to Tara. I am the only one in my guild that even goes into 25% zones unless I ask my guildies to come and help me fight the clanner cause. I think that saying that we don't have a right to exist is entirely wrong and I strongly disagree with your opinion. If you want an OT leaders channel that is used to do what you have on your agenda... MAKE A BOT! You can then just keep the people you want in it, and include some of your MoK generals too. Due to the booster, my guild recently made the decision to disband this week because we want to join a larger guild which will allow us to participate in the new features more. However, this SMALL guild that i have been apart of (and I MEAN SMALL) has been great fun for me and a source of some of my best moments ingame. Are you saying, I shouldn't have had the pleasure of associating with this small group of people in a guild setting? If you are, I have two words to say to that: **** THAT! If you were not implying that, I misunderstood you and I apologize.

-Streaz

[misterretro]

Originally posted by Hypos
Weren't orgs changed a while back so that to create them, you first form a team and then the org is created from the team? Given that constraint, it doesn't sound like it would be possible to limit orgs to having large numbers only, or new orgs could never be created.

I think you misunderstand what I am saying...I can't speak for Arg, but I'm talking about guild that are less than six people. An organization constitutes more than one or two people. I understand if they're trying to have fun, but it undermines the functionality of the faction they belong to. If people don't care about their faction they should have been a neut.

[____________Dominata]

Originally posted by Warsprite


Any player at T who does not participate in the system for either clan or omni is bieng entirely nonproductive and does nothing to help their faction. At the same time they are also doing a disservice to themselves by effectively lowering the chances of getting any loot at all.

I'm not saying anything about their chances or if they are being productive or not. All I'm saying is that no group of players have the right to tell others to participate in the bot or not. Personally I think that the bot is a good thing and needed, but it is up to each player if they want to participate or not and nobody has the right to frown on it.
When the Omni bot first started and I went to the hosting orgs site to read about how the system worked, I almost started laughing at the pompous tone used (don't recall the name right now...). Basically, you had to brown nose to be in and that made me swear off Camelot until I was "bigger" or another bot came about. So I understand if people do not want to be part of any bot, no matter how convenient it may be.