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Thread: The road ahead: Post 18.7 Changes and Vinkera's thoughts on how to fix NT's.

  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by DigitalBath View Post
    @Vinkera: A lot of what you're up against seems to come from the weird twisted things NT's have been and become over the years. I agree with you so far and like the idea of a clear path for a newly made NT to follow. Branching off into alternative paths (e.g. the weird pistol+candycane builds that were around) should be possible and encouraged for more veteran NT's to enjoy too, but with a much lesser priority.
    Yea, it seems to me that previous dev's took the.. Slap another layer of crap on top of this layer of crap, approach. Little tweaks here and there are really all that's needed in my eyes, but hey, I'm not a dev. :P

    Quote Originally Posted by DigitalBath View Post
    Obtaining nukes more easily would be nice too, though some of the more prevalent SL weapons are also somewhat hard to acquire outside of the GMI and Org hand-me-downs so I'm not sure how much support that'll get.
    E.g. - "Why should NT's get their shiny new nuke on the Jobe shop while I have to farm and craft my Perennium Sniper/Blaster/Beamer?"
    Just playing devil's advocate here.
    Fair enough.

    Some should be store-buyable, but others possibly rather common drops in level-appropriate instances or just random from mobs in SL, maybe rollable in RK even. That would encourage either teaming, or soloing to learn your tools and such while not being an easy give-away.
    Vinkera - Soli NT - 426k DPM - Setup
    Robbey - Soli Crat

    Lone anarchists - Tower of Babil

    Celez - Soli Doc
    Loaloa - Soli Enf
    Wondershot - Nano Soldier
    Robzor - Soli Engi
    Proserpexa - Opi Agent

    Trying out civilization - Storm

  2. #42
    Here's what I would suggest for a level 5 SL nuke. One thing you may notice is extremely low NR check, but it is even with Ice Flechette, which is plausible to still use at level 5. I'm not including the pointless damage modifiers for the AI DoT's, because it's very unlikely anyone would ever see the benefit from that using this nuke anyway.

    Spark Shower - Combat - 13 NCU

    Strikes the target with a ray of energy, inflicting 50-75 points of damage.

    Stats:
    NanoPoints 10
    Duration 0s
    Range 35m
    Stacking 13

    Speed:
    Attack 2.00s (2.00s)
    Recharge 1.00s

    Attack:
    Matter Crea 100%

    Defense:
    Nano Resist 50%

    Criteria to Use:
    User Profession == Nano-Technician and
    User Level >= 5 and
    User Matter creation >= 55 and
    User Expansion sets & Shadowlands and
    User Cyberdeck & Basic

    Perform on Use:
    Target Damage for 50-75, mitigated by Energy AC.
    Vinkera - Soli NT - 426k DPM - Setup
    Robbey - Soli Crat

    Lone anarchists - Tower of Babil

    Celez - Soli Doc
    Loaloa - Soli Enf
    Wondershot - Nano Soldier
    Robzor - Soli Engi
    Proserpexa - Opi Agent

    Trying out civilization - Storm

  3. #43
    wouldn't mind seeing nukes scale with MC like GIVA does. MP pets are doing that now to cut down on how many nanos you have to buy/look for.
    Former Assistant Director of Pack of Noobs

    Fake Friday with Means, and it worked!

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Vinkera View Post
    because it's very unlikely anyone would ever see the benefit from that using this nuke anyway.
    ...
    User Cyberdeck & Basic
    Especially when the Cyberdeck turns it into a level 50 nano
    No further significant work is expected to be done on this project going forward.

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Bendaar View Post
    Especially when the Cyberdeck turns it into a level 50 nano
    Not when you consider that the Worn Cyberdeck will Set flag NanoFocusLevel &BasicCyberDeck.

  6. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by Auct View Post
    Not when you consider that the Worn Cyberdeck will Set flag NanoFocusLevel &BasicCyberDeck.
    Thanks for the clarification.

    The worn Cyberdeck does set a "Nano Focus Level". I intentionally want low level SL nukes to not be usable with weapons other than the Cyberdecks just like higher level ones. The only limit would be Specializations, which I removed from the proposed level 5 nuke.
    Vinkera - Soli NT - 426k DPM - Setup
    Robbey - Soli Crat

    Lone anarchists - Tower of Babil

    Celez - Soli Doc
    Loaloa - Soli Enf
    Wondershot - Nano Soldier
    Robzor - Soli Engi
    Proserpexa - Opi Agent

    Trying out civilization - Storm

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Auct View Post
    Not when you consider that the Worn Cyberdeck will Set flag NanoFocusLevel &BasicCyberDeck.
    Oh nice, didn't see that in 18.7. Now, I could use one of those for my low level NT, but Dedlock tells me to visit the IPS guy and IPS guy only sells four decks, starting with the old basic deck.
    I also checked the (clan) basic weapon and nano shop - no luck. Is it somewhere in ICC or do I have to reroll ?!
    No further significant work is expected to be done on this project going forward.

  8. #48
    You will only receive the worn Cyberdeck when you create a new NT, yea.

    I don't think it can be bought anywhere, but we should see if Michi can add it to the IPS vendor, also.
    Vinkera - Soli NT - 426k DPM - Setup
    Robbey - Soli Crat

    Lone anarchists - Tower of Babil

    Celez - Soli Doc
    Loaloa - Soli Enf
    Wondershot - Nano Soldier
    Robzor - Soli Engi
    Proserpexa - Opi Agent

    Trying out civilization - Storm

  9. #49
    Continuing with a level 10 nuke. Here's what I've got:

    Chilled Touch - Combat - 14 NCU

    Strikes the target with a ray of fire, inflicting 85-120 points of damage.

    Stats:
    NanoPoints 22
    Duration 0s
    Range 35m
    Stacking 14

    Speed:
    Attack 2.00s (2.00s)
    Recharge 1.00s

    Attack:
    Matter Crea 100%

    Defense:
    Nano Resist 55%

    Criteria to Use:
    User Profession == Nano-Technician and
    User Level >= 10 and
    User Matter creation >= 80 and
    User Expansion sets & Shadowlands and
    User Cyberdeck & Basic

    Perform on Use:
    Target Damage for 85-120, mitigated by Fire AC.


    Nano Resist goes up, as it starts to become less of an issue at lower levels. Based on a toon I ran though Arete, I don't think that would be usable right away without getting a few points through implants or Composite Nano buff, either. That is also by design. There should be some intensive to gear properly to use these, since every time they hit, they're going to make a dent.
    Vinkera - Soli NT - 426k DPM - Setup
    Robbey - Soli Crat

    Lone anarchists - Tower of Babil

    Celez - Soli Doc
    Loaloa - Soli Enf
    Wondershot - Nano Soldier
    Robzor - Soli Engi
    Proserpexa - Opi Agent

    Trying out civilization - Storm

  10. #50
    While you're paving the road forward for NT's in general, I just wanted to beg for some help for froob NTs. Froob MP's seem to be able to nuke almost has hard as I can now and top that off with the fact that their NR check for Metaing's Improved Glacial Lance is lower than Resonance Blast. And they have a pet on top of that.

    I think the suggestions for revamping the RK nukes are great and I hope it will get updated soon.

    Thanks,
    Froobalicious General of Barador Arin.

    -- Playing AO for six years, still a nuub gimp, and proud of it!

  11. #51
    I actually have a 165ish froob NT, so I know as well as anyone how bad they have it.

    Number 1 on the punch list is GIVA style nukes, but I want 2 of them to be usable by froobs. RK nukes do need work, but unfortunately SL nukes take priority over them for obvious reasons.

    If we get the GIVA style nukes as I've outlined, I think froobs will be a lot happier, though.
    Vinkera - Soli NT - 426k DPM - Setup
    Robbey - Soli Crat

    Lone anarchists - Tower of Babil

    Celez - Soli Doc
    Loaloa - Soli Enf
    Wondershot - Nano Soldier
    Robzor - Soli Engi
    Proserpexa - Opi Agent

    Trying out civilization - Storm

  12. #52
    so much for that dual wield thing getting fixed :/
    Former Assistant Director of Pack of Noobs

    Fake Friday with Means, and it worked!

  13. #53
    Well, it got the Aimed Shot nerf I wanted.

    I expected it would still be dual wieldable, so it's good that was added, minimum.
    Vinkera - Soli NT - 426k DPM - Setup
    Robbey - Soli Crat

    Lone anarchists - Tower of Babil

    Celez - Soli Doc
    Loaloa - Soli Enf
    Wondershot - Nano Soldier
    Robzor - Soli Engi
    Proserpexa - Opi Agent

    Trying out civilization - Storm

  14. #54
    well, if this is the direction that were headed, can we at least get burst/fling on our symbs, maybe multi range as well seeing as all of our weapon skills and evades are dark blue with the exception of pistol being just blue.
    Former Assistant Director of Pack of Noobs

    Fake Friday with Means, and it worked!

  15. #55
    I don't see pistol even making sense next to the Cyberdeck.

    We have very little support for weapons by design. That goes for builds and buffs. Symbiants and some of OFAB help a bit, but it's hardly viable as an alternative for us as a damage profession. I'm OK with that, however. If someone wants to make a pistol NT, they're already aware of it being more difficult to pull off.

    Basically, I have no intentions to ask for weapon buffs to anything we have at this time. Pistol NT's should still be a difficult and interesting project, not a standard build.
    Vinkera - Soli NT - 426k DPM - Setup
    Robbey - Soli Crat

    Lone anarchists - Tower of Babil

    Celez - Soli Doc
    Loaloa - Soli Enf
    Wondershot - Nano Soldier
    Robzor - Soli Engi
    Proserpexa - Opi Agent

    Trying out civilization - Storm

  16. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Vinkera View Post
    Basically, I have no intentions to ask for weapon buffs to anything we have at this time. Pistol NT's should still be a difficult and interesting project, not a standard build.
    Unless you're a froob.
    Froobalicious General of Barador Arin.

    -- Playing AO for six years, still a nuub gimp, and proud of it!

  17. #57
    I'd still like to see froobs have a cyberdeck of their own. One that doesn't set any flags, "Nano Focus Level" wise, but something that actually makes a decent weapon at 200. I thought if it added 45 to all nanoskills and 2% Nano damage at 200, it would make it a little bit easier to cast the top RK nukes.

    I'd also like to see some lower end versions of Nanobot Sheler, Izgimmer's Wealth, Notum Overflow Injector, and possibly others, that can be used by froobs. They would be rather inefficent versions compared to paid, but would make froob NT life a bit easier standing toe to toe with mobs. I know that tends to come down to praying the mob dies first, and the NT surviving with a sliver of HP left, if any.
    Vinkera - Soli NT - 426k DPM - Setup
    Robbey - Soli Crat

    Lone anarchists - Tower of Babil

    Celez - Soli Doc
    Loaloa - Soli Enf
    Wondershot - Nano Soldier
    Robzor - Soli Engi
    Proserpexa - Opi Agent

    Trying out civilization - Storm

  18. #58
    Those damage numbers look good, but I think it's going the wrong way to have a new SL nuke every 5 levels. They should be scaled like MP pets, and maybe all switched to rad damage to be consistent with our endgame nukes.

    Not really NT specific, but: perhaps also do something about the accessibility of SL nukes. Locking them behind the garden key quests becomes increasingly troublesome as you progress through the Shadowlands, to the point where you have start asking other people to buy your nukes for you if you want to stay up-to-date. This is particularly true with Inferno, which has its garden key locked behind what is possibly the most needlessly obnoxious quest in the entire game.
    I am wiser than any god or scientist, for I have squared the circle and cubed Earth's sphere, thus I have created 4 simultaneous separate 24 hour days within a 4-corner (as in a 4-corner classroom) rotation of Earth. See for yourself the absolute proof.

  19. #59
    The trouble with scaling too far, is I can't think of a way that nano costs can also scale, but still be able to lower the cost.

    What I mean is, I figure another tier of a nano could do "Hit user current nano X". That great and all, but I don't think that value can be changed by a cost reducer. So, either a nuke ends up at way too high or way too low of a nano cost at some point if it scales really far.

    My plan was just to redistribute the existing nukes across the level ranges and give them proper values. It seemed to make sense that a low level toon's nano pool and skill grows pretty quick, so they should have a shorter interval to their next nuke. Once you pass 25 or so, scaling would be more of a goal, then new nuke every 10th level. Maybe deleting half of them and scaling a bit further would make sense. At least it would be smoother for a longer trip to hecklers and such, where it's reasonable to cover 20-30 levels in a 3-4 hours.
    Vinkera - Soli NT - 426k DPM - Setup
    Robbey - Soli Crat

    Lone anarchists - Tower of Babil

    Celez - Soli Doc
    Loaloa - Soli Enf
    Wondershot - Nano Soldier
    Robzor - Soli Engi
    Proserpexa - Opi Agent

    Trying out civilization - Storm

  20. #60
    Doh. Never even thought about nano costs. Although, with all the nano regen we have between HE/perks/etc, it probably wouldn't make a huge difference if costs grew in chunks.

    Also I just want to say that I had been following AO for a while before I resubbed and I think you're doing a good job as professional. Keep up the good work, we definitely need it.
    I am wiser than any god or scientist, for I have squared the circle and cubed Earth's sphere, thus I have created 4 simultaneous separate 24 hour days within a 4-corner (as in a 4-corner classroom) rotation of Earth. See for yourself the absolute proof.

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