New clan raid bot appetite?

[nat3s]

Hello all,

I recently posted a thread regarding raid activity here:

http://forums.anarchy-online.com/sho...iding-nowadays

Unfortunately, having resubbed, I've noticed that the 2 prominent clan raid bots (Iraid and Noraid) appear to have died. The former is suffering from a lack of auto-invite functionality and few remaining raid leaders where the latter seems to be offline.

Being a keen programmer I thought I would take it upon myself to put together a new raid bot based on the Bot# library. What I would like to know is whether people are keen for a new bot.

I've been throwing a few ideas around with friends and was hoping to build a bot based on the following system:

• Points are earned within raids, very similar to Iraid / Noraid.
• Auction style could be set to either closed (Iraid) or open (Noraid).
• Alts can be linked to an account and share points (again similar to Iraid / Noraid).
• I would like to create a new system for raid leading which doesn't require authorised leaders. Ideally where anyone can raid leader if they are voted for by the attendees. It would require a simple UI for boss loot linking. May not be possible but the lack of raid leaders has already killed 1 bot and it appears to be a problem that needs solving.

So, any interest?

[Baby]

Noraid hasn't actually died from my point of view. Haven't been on this weekend, but the previous two weekends raids were happening there as usual. Iraid on the contrary is indeed lacking either leaders or willingness of leaders to raid. Demand from players is high, since the recent aipfs/pande on Iraid I attended were completely full.

Starting a third bot means people have to start farming points on a third bot from scratch, which is semi effective I'd say. But it is clear to see that you do have ambitions to get people back to raiding (which I think is great), so have you thought about jumping on board with Iraid? As a programmer you could help Kites get the bot back up to working as intended, if he wants. And maybe even sign up as leader if you feel like doing it.
And who knows, maybe it'll bring some old leaders back to business.

[nat3s]

My motivation is definitely to help get raids going again, I worry the pop will drop if people cannot access raid content. Sounds like Noraid being offline may be temporary which would be great news but as it's invite-only it may not solve the problem for all.

I used to speak to Kite a fair amount when he was first working on Iraid pre-merge and once emailled him offering to help out but he didn't reply. I got a sense that there was an element of protecting his baby and he possibly didnt want to share it with another programmer (which I totally get). I'll drop him another line and see if he may have changed his mind. He might be willing to share the points database at the very least as getting people to embrace a new bot starting from 0 points would be a tough sell/ask.

Thanks

[Baby]

Sounds like a plan to me. You should definitely keep us posted about it!
In the end, if I had to choose between (let's say) 500 points I can't spend, and a bot that let's me farm new ones that I actually can spend, I knew what I would do. And I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one.

[nat3s]

To keep you posted, I sent an email over to Joul to see what could be done re migrating the db data over or possible dev access.

Fingers crossed!

[Baby]

Thank you! I was just about to bump this haha. I'm in mucho need for a new raidbot. I recently noticed that neither Kites nor raidleaders join the group anymore, so I guess this ship has sailed.

[Esssch]

Iraid on the contrary is indeed lacking either leaders or willingness of leaders to raid. Demand from players is high, since the recent aipfs/pande on Iraid I attended were completely full.

Why not just, I don't know, volunteer to be a raid leader, instead of creating an entirely new bot.

[Baby]

Why not just, I don't know, volunteer to be a raid leader, instead of creating an entirely new bot.

Why not just, uh I don't know, consider that not everyone wants to be a leader?

[Esssch]

Don't have much room to complain, then, do you?

[Baby]

Oh, I'm sorry. I didn't know you're that incapable of reading. I wasn't complaining, I was saying how the current situation is. I was also suggesting that Nates jumps on the Iraid train rather than starting a new bot. Just so you know what I wrote in the post you apparently didn't understand the first time you read it.

[Esssch]

Iraid on the contrary is indeed lacking either leaders or willingness of leaders to raid. Demand from players is high, since the recent aipfs/pande on Iraid I attended were completely full.

I recently noticed that neither Kites nor raidleaders join the group anymore, so I guess this ship has sailed.

Seems like I know how to read just fine, perhaps you should pay more attention to what you post. If all you do is complain about a lack of leaders, but you aren't willing to lead yourself, then your complaints really hold no weight, and then going on to say you're all for a 3rd bot is really just counterproductive. If there's no leaders for the current open raid bot, why would there possibly be leaders for a new one? You act like Iraid is completely broken. I can join the channel, I can lead a raid perfectly fine right now. The problem isn't the bot, it's that, for me personally leading raids, I don't have the patience to herd cats at the moment.

[Lazy]

The problem isn't the bot, it's that, for me personally leading raids, I don't have the patience to herd cats at the moment.

i almost miss herding cats on iraid

[Baby]

When I state that Iraid is lacking leaders, it's a complaint? That's nonsense. It's just me saying that Iraid has no actual active raidleader at the moment. Neither have I been all for a third bot at that time. But yes, people change their minds.
Maybe you don't understand the hierarchy in a raidbot. Admins promote people to raidleaders in trainee. Trained raidleaders teach trainees how to raid. So if you now read my post again, you will understand why I said "this ship has sailed". That doesn't mean no one is willing to become a leader, they simply can't. Also the bot seems to not be working correctly when raiding, if I understood Falc right the other day. That is why I suggested that Nates joins the iraid team, instead of starting a new bot. If you add up to all this that the iraid.io site has been down for I-don't-even-know-how-long, well.
You can argue as much as you want, but fact is that raidleaders don't start raids anymore. For whatever reason, that's really not important. And no I'm not complaining as in I expect them to do raids whenever I want, but I also am free to join any raidbot or team to get my raids done. I don't have to sit around and wait for a raidleader to stand up and do a raid on Iraid.

[Esssch]

I am personally friends with an Iraid Admin. I'd be happy to pass along the names of any people who wish to become leaders.

[nat3s]

Oh dear, bit of a derailment.

I've not heard back from Joul/Kite so I don't think I'll be able to source the Iraid db data/schema. I've started work putting a raid bot together in C#.

As noted above the intention is to avoid needing to promote raid leaders, I'd like raids to be self sufficient providing I can dream up the mechanics that will enable this to happen without it being exploitable.

[mcnurja]

I miss the day when i took dustfront to albtraum and used the raidbot to earn myself billions in one day, raid lasted like 8hours.

[nat3s]

I think the only way to allow anyone to start a raid would be to ensure points can only be earned when a particular number of people have joined, say 20 people level 205+ for Pande or 15 for alien sectors. This would be to deter multi botters abusing the system. Once a raid had been created, and before auctions could be started or points earned, an auction poster would need to be agreed. This should be ratified by the attendees via raid vote.

Something like this:

<Nates> !raid_start Pande
<RaidBot>
<RaidBot> |A Pande raid has been started|
<RaidBot>
<PlayerX> !join
<RaidBot> |PlayerX has joined the raid|
<PlayerY> !join
<RaidBot> |PlayerY has joined the raid|
.
.
.
<RaidBot> |20 players have joined the raid, the raid can now be confirmed|
<PlayerX> !raid_confirm
<RaidBot> |The raid can only be confirmed by the person that started it|
<Nates> !raid_confirm
<RaidBot> |Raid confirmed. Join requests have been disabled. Please vote for an auction controller|
<Nates> !auction_vote Nates
<RaidBot> |Do you wish Nates to be the auction controller?|
<PlayerX> !yes
<PlayerY> !yes
.
.
.
<RaidBot> |The vote has been passed. Nates has been set as the auction controller|
.
.
.
<Nates> !auction_open

A UI window would allow for loot selections for each boss in the DB.

<Nates> !auction_start


Abandoning a raid, changing the leader or auction controller would all be available as options for voting on.

Likely to be many holes in the above which will require further thought. Feel free to pick it to pieces.

[Baby]

I generally think that a bot in which everyone can lead is difficult to handle, because it requires a lot of maturity and well, not something you find often ingame.

However, I think whoever starts a raid should automatically be auction leader as well. Too much of a hassle and botspam if you have a full raid for example. Also the auction window needs to be kept real simple, so everyone will understand how it works, when there's no such thing as "training" for a leader. A required amount of people of a specific level is not too bad of an idea, but it would be sort of a bummer if you (for example) can't find person #15 and have to cancel a sector, because 14 won't be accepted by the bot, but would be okay as well. There should be some latitude for a leader.
Also make sure you have always a minimum of 2 leaders, in case one goes ld, gets rl aggro or whatever. Quasi backup.

That's what came to my mind for now.

[wyldebeast]

I am personally friends with an Iraid Admin. I'd be happy to pass along the names of any people who wish to become leaders.

Over the years Iraid have been active I've tried signing up to become raid leader about 5 times. Through whatever system the bot told me to use on the given day. I've never once had anyone from Iraid get back to me. A public raid bot that apparently requires you to personally know the admins to get promoted doesn't sound all that public to me and I welcome any alternatives.

[Esssch]

Over the years Iraid have been active I've tried signing up to become raid leader about 5 times. Through whatever system the bot told me to use on the given day. I've never once had anyone from Iraid get back to me. A public raid bot that apparently requires you to personally know the admins to get promoted doesn't sound all that public to me and I welcome any alternatives.

I became a leader without consulting my friend first, so sounds like user error. I literally joined the channel, checked the online list for admins/leaders and said "hey, I want to be a leader" and one of them set it up.