MP DPM capability and "best" setups

[McKnuckleSamwich]

Can a/some seasoned MP's please provide some insight as to "best" DPM builds they've used?

Some specifics I'm interested in are:

Tigress vs pistols (assume peh'wer/Troa'ler)

add damage vs crit (specifically add dmg in pistol setup vs crit with bow)

nano dmg % adding setups with a nuke/proc heavy setup (no idea if this is even a thing) paired with whatever weapon



Basically what I'm looking for is an idea of what setup is needed to make people go "holy sh*t, I didn't know MP's could do that!"

Thanks in advance

[Ghostforce]

Usually my mp is right behind Evy-Soldier, Crats, Engi and Shade in 12m "DD" list. Setup is not
super expensive but i chose bow since i miss alot hits with lust's and while AR is a tad higher with guns,
damage with crits are weaker and you have less defence. Bow setup is far more versatile then guns.

Anyway here is setup: http://auno.org/ao/equip.php?saveid=198139
I'm sure i changed Hud1 with something else then nm absorb in raids but cant remember with what,
else is it ssc left shoulder and some varois ncu. I'm sure theres better setups out there but this works for me
atleast :-) I change most stuff for better defence if there is no propper tank in team or when doing bs

[JustinSane4]

This is something I'd be quite curious about as well. There isn't much data available from endgame-setup MPs. The best I can find is Esssch's 240,333 DPM against an inf heck with a pistol setup. http://auno.org/ao/equip.php?saveid=150427 is his base set-up last I knew, but I'm not sure what gear he used for the test. I got 226,020 DPM on an inf heck with a fairly under-geared 2hb setup (mix of alphas and betas, mostly DB armor, Jathos helm, Powerful Mind/IS pads, mix of alphas and betas, no ACDC, elctrophoridae gloves) using the Aggressive Staff of Julian Redfire. And I also tested a full def (though still undergeared) SoZ setup and got 167,160 DPM on an inf heck.

In raids, I usually fall slightly ahead of soldiers and behind non-afk engies, crats and shades.

I'm sure a full-out DD setup could do significantly better (something like http://auno.org/ao/equip.php?saveid=61220), but I've never seen one tested. I'd also be curious about a well equipped MA MP, but haven't seen that tested either.

I'm guessing players who are going to put that much effort into a DD pet class character pick a profession with two attack pets rather than one (quite logically).

Edit: Nanodamage setups are no good. At most we're throwing 30 nukes a minute for ~35-40k damage against high AC mobs, so even a whole lot of nanodamage modifier doesn't help much when it improves such a low base. Add damage (generally add all damage) is, to my knowledge, the best for MPs because it helps nukes, perks, procs and weapon damage.

[Psikie]

I think dual Asp will best DD for MP. This is just using 2k skill for both. Which we all know Asp will have greater AR, also better chance to land perks. This also does NOT include poison proc from Asp. AND the additional attack pet buffs that you must wield creation weapons for.

I am 2hb on my MP but I plan to switch 1hb once 18.7 goes live. Pistol and 1hb creation will be top DD setups for MP hands down, I think 1hb edges it out but I have not fully tested it....yet.

Lust of the Xan
Your critical hit will be 2700 points.
Your normal hits will vary between 1350 and 1350 points.
Over 10 seconds you would do about 10029 points of damage.
You would score 4.74 normal, and 0.2 critical hits.
The damage done by normal attacks would be 6937 points and 3092 points would be special attacks.

Asp of Titaniush
Your critical hit will be 3600 points.
Your normal hits will vary between 1800 and 1800 points.
Over 10 seconds you would do about 9360 points of damage.
You would score 4.8 normal, and 0.2 critical hits.
The damage done by normal attacks would be 9360 points and 0 points would be special attacks.

[JustinSane4]

Asp/Abandonment may be better. Main hand weapon determines AR, so you'd have the AR from Asp and damage/specials from abandoment. I remember some MP posting about this setup a while back, but I don't believe they gave DPS stats for it.

[Teeko]

In that setup you couldn't use 1hb perks with asp in main hand, so your suffering there. Why not dual abandonments? that would seem like the prime setup for DD, seen it work tremendously well. Granted kur'ush more damage but not selfable if you want to throw on your shield at a moments notice

[Psikie]

The max AR is the goal when you use Asp, the 1hb perks are 50/50 at best on landing with lower AR from Aban. You also would not be able to use main Pet attack buffs which would be a HUGE drop in dps.

This is something along lines I would suggest http://auno.org/ao/equip.php?saveid=198142

[Esssch]

This is something I'd be quite curious about as well. There isn't much data available from endgame-setup MPs. The best I can find is Esssch's 240,333 DPM against an inf heck with a pistol setup. http://auno.org/ao/equip.php?saveid=150427 is his base set-up last I knew, but I'm not sure what gear he used for the test.

I don't swap gear, it's too much of a hassle for me.

I used to be dual Asp. I don't have the numbers to back it up, but I definitely feel like I started doing more damage after switching to pistols. MA could likely be decent as well, though it works better for actual MAs and traders due to SL+LE procs.

Most of these setups won't have numbers to back them up, I don't know if anyone else has noticed that there's a lack of endgame MPs. If anyone is willing to volunteer their time and gain some headaches to gear different weapon setups on Test, I'd be interested in seeing how well my setup taken to it's limit actually performs to other weapon types. I'm betting a Peh'wer/Big Burger combo with a considerable amount of +dmg gear will be either our best or 2nd best DD option.

[Psikie]

Ill try to see if I can get on test since new patch. If I am able to ill do a 1min test vs both dummies using dual Asp. Again that is IF I am able to log onto test.

[JustinSane4]

I'm betting a Peh'wer/Big Burger combo with a considerable amount of +dmg gear will be either our best or 2nd best DD option.

Agreed. I can't prove it, but I'd bet on it, were I the betting kind. But that's basically an engie setup, only they're better at it (better mainhand gun, EOE, pistol buff, 2 attack pets, etc).

[nanoforcer]

If michi is reading this please enable mp to train 10 perks in 1hb, and also take a look at the problem with not being able to perk (with 1hb perks) with creation in the "wrong" hand.

[McKnuckleSamwich]

Thanks for the feedback guys.

I'm surprised that nobody is suggesting a crit setup with a chaos. It seems that a crit setup could do fairly well. The setup posted by ghostforce is missing about 20% crit which is substantial on just a big critting weapon.

I guess one thing that I'm totally clueless about, is how much nano adding armour is *actually* needed at endgame?

If you're fully buffed do you need any nanoskill adding armour?

Here is a baseline proj dmg adding setup with 300 FA Rarm imp, berserker LA, and appropriate gear for boosting AR/proj dmg.

http://auno.org/ao/equip.php?saveid=198147

The obvious question I have is this: if you're using mind wail/whatever the endgame damage proc is, and you're chain nuking... is it better to put in DB bracers? Obviously if you're soloing you probably want the DB bracers for survival, but in a team setting when you're less worried about catching aggro, then lets go all out.

But will this setup be better than duel Asps? I calced that the proc dmg from Asp procs is about 2370 dmg which relies on the mob staying alive for the entire 24s duration of the dot. With duel asp procs /minute is around 11 times/minute which basically looks like the proc will be up full time, which is good, but the damage on it is pretty low overall - basically continuously ticking 395 dmg every 4 seconds.

If the damage boost on pets is significant, it might outweigh this, but it seems to me a more pragmatic approach is to go balls out crit with chaos, or balls out proj dmg+pistols.

edit... nerf I just say that the recharge on MIMQ is only 1.92s which is an extra 30 hits per minute!!! that's a lot, so it seems it might be useful to be using both DB bracers to tack an extra 150 damage on each nuke (30*150=4500 dmg/minute), but it results in a loss of dmg/minute on pistols.... can't calc without knowing approx. recharge on burst/fling/FA though.

[lainbr]

It is totally guess and memories from some years, but I know MP can do almost Crat like damage with pistols. I myself was on top 5 dd in org raids with bow setup. I dont have raw and metodical values because I could never test my damage on Inf Hecks w/o losing damage trying to survive then

...elctrophoridae gloves...

Completely offtopic but... you just know I "farmed" this gloves for 2 years, right? :v

[McKnuckleSamwich]

it seems with MIMQ being energy dmg that a better setup would include an energy damage weapon.

the Dreadlock rapier is energy... but as always theres lack of support for RE.

There aren't that many energy pistols. thrasher has fling/burst, so ideally there'd be an energy damage pistol with FA that you could stick on offhand to make use of the energy damage modifiers.

http://auno.org/ao/db.php?id=123891

This one is pistol/RE has FA, and is energy damage.. but obviously pretty long FA recharge would significantly offset the value.

http://auno.org/ao/db.php?id=123854

Aha this one!

Freedom super arms 90.

FA cycle = 4800
att 1.12
rech 1.22

2-84 (105) - Energy AC

Pretty decent damage range.

You could pair a http://auno.org/ao/db.php?id=267128 dreadloch rapier with it, load up on energy damage, have all the specials and as long as you had enough AR to hit with both weaps, you'd get some pretty serious damage going.

I'm going to build a setup in auno.. see how much add energy damage you can get. and also check what RE support is available.

[McKnuckleSamwich]

http://auno.org/ao/equip.php?saveid=198972

945 energy add dmg.

1145 with 12m buff - that's pretty decent. I reckon you could do some pretty mean damage with this setup.


MP doesn't have power up perkline which is kinda sad given the value of energy damage and the propensity for using energy weapons to make use of that damage type.


ego strike +super ego strike are both cold dmg as well.... retarded.

[McKnuckleSamwich]

AR modifier formula is: [[(AR-1000)*Class AR Multiplier]/400+3.5]

Freedom arms (Max AR=2004) 2-84 (105)
Rapier (Max AR=2600) 230-350 (250)

Assuming 2060k AR with rapier (basically assuming you can JUST keep it out of OE Plus 458AAO)
And capped AR on pistol.

Base damage on each weap is:
[[(2060-1000)*0.3]/400+3.5] = 4.295*230 = 988 rapier
[[(2004-1000)*0.3]/400+3.5] = 4.253*2 = 8 pistol

Assuming awakening and pred buff of course, so 200 energy damage +setup = 1145 energy damage

Making base damage on rapier 988+1145= 2133, and superqueen = 1153 dmg

Regular hits = 18 rapier+18 super queen = 18*2133+18*1153=59145/miin
fling = 10*2133=21330/min
burst = 60/8s*3*2133=48000/min
full auto = 60/35s*19 bullets = ~ 24000/min (seems you can get quite close to the damage cap, but not all the way estimating 12k FA's)

[show-hide]Full auto formula used for assessing recharge:
((Wep recharge x 4000) + FullAutoCycle - 1000)/4
((1.22 x 4000) + 4800 - 1000)/4 = 2170 to cap, but I assume about 1500 skill

From rulz's weapon specials calculator, it looks like FA is probably around 30-35 seconds which is about double as long as I thought it would be unfortunately.[/show-hide]

MIMQ:
60s/1.92s*(1095base+1145add energy) = 70000/min

Procs:
Ego boost 602base +519 add cold dmg
super Ego strike 1500base+519 cold dmg

Procs can fire off regulars+fling hits, so 36+10=46 chances/min

46*5%*(602+519)=2579/min
46*5%*(1500+519)=4643/min

So, with JUST regulars, spamming all specials, and spamming nukes and using procs I'm estimating:
59145/min (normal)
21330/min (fling)
48000/min (burst)
24000/min (FA)
70000/min (MIMQ)
2579/min (ego strike)
4643/min (super ego strike)
= 229697/min

and you haven't even hit /pet attack, or hit 1 perk yet - notably too, this is assuming high AC's. i.e. every bullet/nuke hitting for min.

[JustinSane4]

That is an extremely cool idea. I've never seen that combination proposed or tried. I'm not sure in practice you'd do quite that well, because it can be a bit tricky to perfectly time the nukes and keep the weapons 1/1, but that's still excellent damage. Would love to see someone put it together and see how it goes.

[Cratertina]

I dreamt yesterday of someone doing this on forums... Only recently I started leveling my 150 MP, 1hb/1hb, 1hb/shield... Damage is resonably good, 80-120k damage even in TL5.

So here we see an awesome McKnuckleCalc, woudln't though 1hb be better? Like you guys suggested, creation with poison proc + abandonment of xan. In theory atleast add damage setup with fullauto pistols, etc work best, but for actual gameplay I find that quite lame. Even when done on fixer with good add damage and fullauto support.

What could one hope with 1hb + top pet + top notch gear?

Could we see 250, 280? Maybe even 300? Depending on content...

What about nukes? How can those be buffed? Kinda lame to see same nuke from 120-220.

[Ghostforce]

All these damage setups are looking cool, cant wait until someone is thesting them out. What i would like to point out are that
these are most suicide setups in terms of solo play or if/when your getting aggro. I tried 2hb, 1hb, pistol, piercing (!) and bow.
Bow was the setup i could get the most out of when i use mp for more then posting dd logs, its only few swaps for a more defensive
build or shield :-)

I dont think full auto setup would work, i noticed i missed alot hits vs xan bosses and burst often hit only with 1 bullet

[BangleTiger]

All these damage setups are looking cool, cant wait until someone is thesting them out...I dont think full auto setup would work, i noticed i missed alot hits vs xan bosses and burst often hit only with 1 bullet

Just as a point of reference. FA and Burst calculations contribute a solid one third of the setup's damage. I'm curious as well to see the results.