They did copy the fast leveling process to endgame from WoW. They forgot to add variety to the leveling process and decent leveling loot though.
They changed the game to become more like a WoW clone but without the gameplay.
New Instance
Monthly Boss Events
Pathfinding
New Shadowlands Mission
Towerwars changes
They did copy the fast leveling process to endgame from WoW. They forgot to add variety to the leveling process and decent leveling loot though.
They changed the game to become more like a WoW clone but without the gameplay.
I'm so over the coinage of the label "WoW Clones".
It's a buzz term used by the ignorant who have no idea how complex the system really is, and therefor connect to this term because they can't see past it.
Just like every other buzz term people use to give a label to something they don't entirely grasp.
Last edited by Towerblock; Apr 15th, 2014 at 18:56:07.
Towerblock, 220/30/70 Engineer
President of Steadfast
And way too many alts...
"X-clone" is a negatively loaded term.
Thor Mastablasta Hammersmith - Level 220, AI 30, LE 70 Clan Atrox Nano Technician - Setup
The Red Brotherhood
I'm a Nano-Technician, don't ever expect me to fight unbuffed, alone or fair.
Means: about f'ing time :P
Satenia: heresy <3
Znore: Mastablasta <3
Kinkstaah: I have agro from many mobs ;(
Madarab: we are aoe class, we are supose to use pistols
Marxgorm: the NT toolset does not fit into my raiding tactics
Ya, I preferred the Everquest-clone version!Originally Posted by Gimpynoob
None of those, rebalance, then engine or maybe sort out the economy, get the game populated, but one thing you beat around is notum wars get this multiboxing sorted a lot of players are trying to tell you its become a problem and why, I don't PvP since LE changes destroyed it with the easy mode items, and poor balancing. Hope that was some insight, also if you anarchy online developers read this, check out some social network sites, some video host sites, and fan/org player sites and do some research and read what people have wanted for the past 6 years, there has been plenty of suggestions here on these forums to.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Qualinas
You're kinda slow, aren't you, Mr. Nov09?
Well, its not everyday when I google for funcom or access funcom.com.
Oh noes j00 want me to bring my "Join date: 2004" main to pwn yo? lols @ forum pvp
it's not even "tower wars" changes that we're looking for... I think the 4-5 whatever "ban multiboxing in PVP" threads have provided a pretty gruesome look at why multiboxing has utterly destroyed PVP in AO.
I won't go into detail, but based on past experience, I'd say coding deterents to MB in towerwars will be significantly more difficult to accomplish, inclusive of implementation, than say, just adjusting the stance:
MB in PVM = ok
MB in PVP = not ok
and let the player police themselves with the backup of GM ban hammers. I mean, how hard could it be to just say "utilisation of 3rd party software which impacts other players experience directly is disallowed"?
I think an initiative to adjust towerwars mechanics is a significant undertaking, and not a bad one and one that is probably 4-5 years late - but based on the rate of change .... I just don't see how anything will make it to live in time to salvage the few remaining players who will consider coming back.
This I like except I worry that the flood of petitions from people who are just bad at pvp and are unable to save their towers even when MB is not used and blame it on MB would overwhelm the small ao staff. That's what happens when we police ourselves unfortunately. But a good suggestion.
I have more buzz terms for your ad hominem and strawman arguments if you want.
But since you seem to be unable to understand my argument, considering that you didn't use any arguments in favour or against it, I will try to explain it in very simple terms. Just for you.
A clone is a copy.
In games, just like in many other activities where intellectual property is involved, an exact copy of an original product is unlikely.
Before WoW was published other MMORPG games existed already. Those games already had certain features and characteristics.
It is a logical conclusion that these features that already existed in previous games of the same genre are either generic or were copied into WoW, making it a clone of game A, B or C.
However there are other features implemented originally in WoW that can be considered clones when they were implemented in later games.
One such feature that is considered by many as original to WoW, and to which I made reference to, is the fast leveling process to endgame "where the game really starts".
AO, until some years ago, was very different. The leveling process was much slower from the beginning and reaching endgame was in itself an achievement. Leveling fast to endgame and spending most playtime farming after reaching max level was introduced more recently and in my opinion is a copy of the WoW leveling process.
I made no comment about the quality of the WoW's leveling process. It certainly has advantages and disadvantages, like any other leveling system. What is good in WoW is that the leveling process chosen for the game is supported by the game. Fast leveling with many optional routes supplying good leveling gear and with optional but accessible PvP and dungeon crawl content.
AO devs copied the fast leveling process by increasing the xp of some mobs hugely creating a nuclear powered railroad to endgame. Everything else was essentially kept the same with the consequences we see now. Cloning WoW's leveling process was one of the worst decisions ever made by AO's game undevelopers.
But please tell me how wrong I am. You can point to my defective use of the english language or to nitpick some definition or another if you like. Go ahead, you know you want to.
Yes, the pre-daily grind was so superior to everything on the market, that's why AO was completely swarmed with so many new players, they had to merge the servers to handle them all.
Pre-daily mission, people still accelerated the endgame grind as much as they could - heck teams, inf spirit kiting, those came long before the new, and frankly improved levelling experience.
The problem is the aging population - many of us are completely sick of levelling new toons to 220, or twinks to whatever level. We are going to do it as quickly as possible for purpose built toons. Nothing will change that.
What dailies did is offer an alternative to the sh!t grind that we had before.
Every single major MMO out there offers a comparable system.
To deny that the addition was an improvement is completely batty in my opinion - and if your objection is lack of levelling teams, I see a lot more people seeking teams for Elite daily missions than I have for any other levelling content in most of the last decade.
Regarding the other issues, i.e. levelling gear etc., yes that needs to be improved. But the transition from singularly repetitive /afk grinds to at least partially active grinds is nothing but an improvement.
-= Make the new engine look even better. Don't forget to post a screenshot! =-
MB did not destroy pvp in ao, it may have affected tower war pvp a little. But that's beside that fact that pvp in AO is already a mess and unbalanced.
No pvp, tower change will bring any new people to AO, the skill and equipment gap is way to massive to bring any new person. And not worth it to pay to for, for old players.
AO is now, just 220 lvls, of emptiness, completely repetitive grinding, long waits on lft for forced teaming quest, no ability to farm items yourself without a higher lvl alt, and then more long waits for spawns and normal teams (Which rarely exist)
AO is a Money (Creds) win game, buy creds, you are better in pvm, and somewhat better in pvp even if you dont know what you are doing.
i agree with all that other than that ao pvp is a mess. people always say it is, but it isnt half as bad as it sounds. it is actually quite good. people always think it is because they don't know what they're doing and loose to people with 10 years of experience. given ao's complexity, pvp is amazingly balanced. not optimal, far from optimal, but still. and that's where ao is actually like no other game. there are few encounters you really stand 0 chance. in most cases, tactics are crucial. and equip, you are right, does play a very important role. but afterall, its not ao pvp's fault that the economy is broken and xp is handed out by the bucket for free so people put zero effort into character development.
Ed, I don't know where you come up with this stuff but I always feel like reaching through the interwebs and slapping you in the head.
PVP in AO, as Xootch said, is 'amazingly balanced'. Considering there are 14 profs, and there are exactly 14 profs that are usable in different aspects of PVP, I'd say that's one thing AO has that's pretty much a head and shoulders above any other area of play.
Yes, low levels are dominated by agents, traders and enforcers. Yes, the Troa'ler is epically OP, yes, shades are OP, yes, engies and crats are OP, yes, doctors are OP, yes, traders and MA's are OP 1 vs 1, yes, Shield MP's own everyone and their dog without even trying, yes, agents are actually insanely versatile, and yes, keepers actually help their team and can deliver an alpha that sends shockwaves through the community, so, with all that OP, who's left? fixers and advies? well, I guess if you have to suck it up if you're not a lovechild.
But doesn't that actually mean that AO is balanced? 12/14 profs are really solid? I mean, it kinda sounds a bit like dev's wet dream to me, having 12 out of 14 profs viable to some extent in PVP.
Enough though, that's not the issue, the issue is that nobody wants a 1 vs 1 fight to actually be 1 vs 1 fixer and 5 crats/5 NT's and their 10 pets, whom, if you can survive the chain stuns/fears, and get past the overlapping auras, and get past the pet spam, and actually start hitting one of them, they will actually all disappear into the great grid unknown where they can just reset and come back when you've stopped defending.
In case you've not been paying attention, though, FC noticed, and took the first step: nerfing fixer meeps. It shouldn't be too long before something is done regarding the MB part.
It seems when half the population of AO quits and cites these things as an issue, people do actually notice.
As for the 220 levels of epic boring grind you speak of, are you sure? because I'd hazard a guess that there are more mid level players than 220/70/30's in game who are perfectly content to twink up, and be good in their chosen level and excel there, than do some dailies and infing for a few months to max out.
There is more to the game than just "grinding" 220/70/30.
You know, what I had posted had nothing to do with your argument. You can keep your opinion of it. I'm not trying to argue against it, for it, whatever.I have more buzz terms for your ad hominem and strawman arguments if you want.
But since you seem to be unable to understand my argument, considering that you didn't use any arguments in favour or against it, I will try to explain it in very simple terms. Just for you.
A clone is a copy.
In games, just like in many other activities where intellectual property is involved, an exact copy of an original product is unlikely.
Before WoW was published other MMORPG games existed already. Those games already had certain features and characteristics.
It is a logical conclusion that these features that already existed in previous games of the same genre are either generic or were copied into WoW, making it a clone of game A, B or C.
However there are other features implemented originally in WoW that can be considered clones when they were implemented in later games.
One such feature that is considered by many as original to WoW, and to which I made reference to, is the fast leveling process to endgame "where the game really starts".
AO, until some years ago, was very different. The leveling process was much slower from the beginning and reaching endgame was in itself an achievement. Leveling fast to endgame and spending most playtime farming after reaching max level was introduced more recently and in my opinion is a copy of the WoW leveling process.
I made no comment about the quality of the WoW's leveling process. It certainly has advantages and disadvantages, like any other leveling system. What is good in WoW is that the leveling process chosen for the game is supported by the game. Fast leveling with many optional routes supplying good leveling gear and with optional but accessible PvP and dungeon crawl content.
AO devs copied the fast leveling process by increasing the xp of some mobs hugely creating a nuclear powered railroad to endgame. Everything else was essentially kept the same with the consequences we see now. Cloning WoW's leveling process was one of the worst decisions ever made by AO's game undevelopers.
But please tell me how wrong I am. You can point to my defective use of the english language or to nitpick some definition or another if you like. Go ahead, you know you want to.
I simply left my print, and voiced my opinion on two words "WoW Clone."
So if you wanna take that as some sort of personal attack, fine. Go ahead. Be advised however on two things: 1. I don't care. 2. This isn't about you. Or else I would have hit 'reply', as opposed to 'post'.
But if you'd like to continue feeling personally insulted by something I said about WoW Clones, you're just gunna have to chew on that on your own.
Cheers.
Last edited by Towerblock; Apr 16th, 2014 at 05:13:52.
Towerblock, 220/30/70 Engineer
President of Steadfast
And way too many alts...
If they gonna do inf-missions they should not only focus on xp, but the gameplay too. The ai and mob-attributes is horrible. You also just run from one mob to the next while clicking damageactions.
Rk-missions used to be more fun since it had more events. The 'omg cam!', being stunned by a turret, Evac to lift or lift to next level with a back-up plan. Those missions also gave quite a bit of loot and a fair amount of credits, compared to the game back then.
Xp-reward being highest within our own levelrange might be best for the fun.
170-200
201-215
215-220
If they do towers I hope they fix tara too. The raid usually doesn't run.
pre-that they boosted xp on hecklers, cause people wouldn't play slsaid it b4; add hecklerjuice and testrobot 2 vetshop, done!
Last edited by leetlover; Apr 16th, 2014 at 05:36:48.
Disclaimer: My posts should not be read by anyone.
You don't think disallowing inspect will do the exact same thing? Yet that doesn't appear to be a problem for them. "j00 can't have equipped THAT legit, imma petition j00!!".
Read my post again! Where did I say in my post I didn't think allowing inspect all the time would not be a problem either? We beat that dead horse in another thread already, no need to drag it in here on my comment sheesh. It will also be a problem in the same way overwhelming the dev team. regardless, Mcknuckles idea still has merit.
Last edited by Gunforhire; Apr 16th, 2014 at 12:08:25.
While I understand how omni multiboxing sucks on your end saying that it destroyed pvp is just a lie. BS is the same, city pvp is the same. NW had pvp ~1% of the time, without tnet's zergwars it has pvp ~0.8% of the time which isn't a big loss to be honest. It may have "destroyed" NW but pvp is intact.
Perhaps I should have formulated that a bit differently. Lets put it this way: Don't you think if FC feels they have no probs handling all the petitions for people claiming twink X can't have gotten item Y on legitly, they also shouldn't have major problems handling petitions for the few well known pvp-boxers?
I know you don't actually mean it's actually half the population that cancelled over MB. But I still want to say that we're talking about maybe in the range of 60-70 accounts in the core group that decided that enough is enough. Then perhaps around the same for ppl who left due to their friends leaving. So around 120-130 accounts somewhere. And that in turn is probably something like 3-5% of active subs of ao. So. it's a blip on the screen really.
As to long term effects. There will be more ppl cancelling on both sides due to low activity. But still not enough to do something probably. So don't get your hopes up.
Pity you don't care. I was ready to make a long post with my opinion about the personality traits of people who make insulting posts in reply to previous posts and then hide behind lame excuses of "This isn't about you" and also about the intellectual capacity of people who think anyone would ever believe such patetic excuses. But since you don't care...
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