Discussion on Roleplaying Game Mechanics

**Towerblock** · Feb 27th, 2014, 17:55:28

Originally Posted by Shalex

This sadly i have come across in just about every game iv RPed in. People can easily get the hero complex. Its almost kind of like a single player game mentality. My character is the hero, bow down to me while i save the day. Then you get exclusive little "clicks" that form and you either RP their way or go away. Its sad, but common.

Yeah, I stopped roleplaying in GW2 after two weeks of listening to nothing but people's god complexes, and their 'my poops don't stink' tirades.

**Encyros** · Feb 27th, 2014, 18:54:19

Thanks for all the responses! They've been really informative and helpful in getting a sense in how we feel about these things. I think I should probably add my own thoughts too:

Info on sight:
Their breed and their sex.
Possibly their Faction, Profession, or a rough Level if they are wearing specialised or advanced equipment.

On scanning, a level of information appropriate to one's character's role, and the faction of the one being scanned.

Shape Vs HUD
I feel that both Agents and Fixers have a decent shot at concealment in this way.

Agents are the better skilled in actual subterfuge in the physical world - changing their face quickly, their manner, their speech to suit their False Profession et c., and I agree with Vash's view that an Agent who does all these things should be able to work a suitable disguise.

Eventually, unless the Agent uses an Agent Undercover Kit, I would expect them to be foiled by repeated scanning on a couple of encounters by a figure of authority where they are trying to infiltrate, even if their manner is perfect, since this is where I see tech being at.

Fixers are the better skilled in blocking scanning records - removing traces of their true identity from the Grid. Coupled with the bother of using the Clinique Plastique, they can remove all obvious trace of who they are, exactly. Everyone and their leet pet would know that they are a Fixer, but which Fixer, exactly? Like the various hacking groups over the years.

Eventually, they use Comms or appear in scenes, I would expect the natural personality of the Fixer to shine through, and for them to become identifiable due to their relative lack of expertise in physical subterfuge, over several scenes, even if the tech jamming is perfect, since they won't have the expertise of an Agent in acting.

Finally, Adventurers should be able to mimic the behaviour of animals to perfection. If an especially paranoid person with the necessary clearance does decide to scan them, their full human identity would eventually show up.

I don't see Slayerdroid Transference as a viable way to conceal, since the Droid is probably linked to the Engineer in question.

Comm ID
From the start seems good to me. It encourages encounters. If someone doesn't want to connect they can always shut it down.

Suppression Gas
I don't support violence in 100% as I think it's good to have areas where characters can talk instead of fight, though think it quite reasonable that, say, LTC authority figures be able to have the gas levels lowered through venting.

The process of gas venting should take time, much like the game-mechanic warnings we receive of a countdown to when characters may be attacked, or fight. I see it as reasonable that this level is monitored by implants so that characters can see the countdown.

As a universal and unintelligent gas, when levels are lowered, this should affect everyone in the scene.

Tells
Neural, giving audible voice. It seems only sensible to reconcile that we can have a conversation and speak into our comms with emotes, too.

Levels/Enlightenment
I like the idea of Security Clearance levels and recognition by one's faction, as well as Enlightenment being some sort of insight gained from the Shadowlands that's difficult to quantify and is individual to each person.

I feel that at the very low end, this should translate to combat effectiveness too. Noone wants to be RP-ganked by a bunch of level 2s.

**Kotts** · Feb 28th, 2014, 05:20:39

Info on sight: How much information is immediately known about a person that is seen (name/faction et c.)? How much should normally require a scan?

-Immediatly- availible would be whatever is obviously visible with the naked eye/implant. A general scan I consider is something just about anyone could do, skimming info of the target's NCU. I see it as the equivalent of Facebook stalking or Googling someone, by using the ingame info window (Target, and hit 'T'). This is something seen as pretty rude, too. All the data in the info window can be changed with items , mechanics, and other means like Lornavash mentioned.

Shape vs HUD: Is there any point in 29488 wearing a helmet/changing one's appearance via Face Graft/polymorph for concealment?

I must admit I'm pretty amazed at the feedback on this. While I'll admit The concept is pretty new is does bring up some pretty fresh (to me at least) ideas in the way of cloak -n- dagger RP, and really good ones too! Unfortunately game mechanics do not support Face Graft, Polymorphs, or other shape changes as a foolproof way of hiding your true identity. And like Loriah pointed out, what if the -player- can't remember what the other character looked like, or never knew? What if the player is brand new to the RP community and simply can't tell? If these nanos, and tools are going to be used for this desired effect of hiding identity; I feel it's the players responsibility to let others in the scene/area they are RPing with know -before- the RP starts flying all over the place. Communication is key here.

CommID: Under what circumstances can one start sending a character IC tells?

I don't have an issue with being able to flat out send tells to others right from the start. It is however a cold call, and IC actions have IC consequences. That said, go nuts!

Suppression Gas: What level of violence should be permitted under suppression gas?

This topic is muddy as hell, and if you all want to break this off on a topic all on it's own, I'm all for it. Suppression in the animated series is depicted as stopping attacks from doing any damage. In the following clip the energy bolt from the gun is deflected away from the agent.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qNARe...15E8E&index=10
The series also shows the creepy SOL Banking guy being able to adjust his local suppression with "A device". Since it's in Tir I assume the gas is at 75%, so CSBG maybe raised his to 100% maybe?
In the game itself, the system messages say at 100% no fighting is possible. Period.
At 75% it says wildlife may attack, however, human mobs can attack you too, as well as be attacked in return. What's the difference between Human mobs and player controlled humans?
25% gets even more confusing when you look back at 75%. The game states 25% is a political zone, and members of the opposite faction can attack you. But wait a minute, city guards were able to attack and be attackable at 75%!?
The game mechanic itself is a paradox. Many ARK-Events, Official FC storylines, and players have ignored the hell out of suppression gas for the sake of a good story. Which is more important?
How I approach this is that I just refrain from violent actions around the general community, If I'm not familiar with the player I'll send them an OOC tell and ask if it's ok to take it to that level. About a week ago while goofing off with a few other RPers in voice chat the topic came up about getting consent before attacking someone, or starting up a story arch that is a bit touchy. Encyros made some very valid points in that consent slows the momentum down, and can be harmful to immersion, which I do agree with that statement. However I feel it is imperative to ask for consent with players you are unfamiliar with, and fully respect their wishes to participate or not. On the other hand, I will however resort to some violence as it seems fit -if- I feel that the other player and I have established a good rapport with each other and can trust each other to put on a good show with no hurt feelings after. Again, Communication is key here.

Tells: Are they *normally*, as our standard, considered texts, voice messages, or videos?

I mentally default them to voice, but video, text, neural, hive-mind... whatever-capable is feasible. I roll with whatever the other person tosses out there. It is a cyber-punky setting anyway.

Levels/Enlightenment: How should these be played?

Like Tussa said, I go by security clearance. That's how she raised me in AO RP :P I use levels as a rough guide for some degree of combat prowess, -BUT- by no means is it the end all be all. For example, Cora's Omni-Pol goons, My characters will always see them as Omni-Pol guards, not as low levels that hit like a wet noodle. When the smack you with a stun baton it's going to hurt. I tend to lean more on Profession vs. Profession, or what traits or quirks a Character possess.
Enlightenment, I see is being more based on the character. maybe they found their meaning of life, had a life changing epiphany, Or just had their minds blown. It's unique event for the character that only their creator can define. As for the core shifting, have fun with them.

***

Name tag question: I keep mine off, and I'll also try to stay in first person camera as much as I can when talking to others if the geometry/clipping/ height difference allows.

***

More Suppression gas food for thought: The only thing keeping Clan territory, -clan- territory is brute force, since the Tir accord has been annulled. It's illegal for Clans to be in Omni-Tek areas, like the bars, however it is not illegal for OT personal to be in Clan areas (like bars). If Suppression in bar tempers aggressive thought behaviors, and actions what's stopping OT from just rolling in and arresting clanners as they see fit? Without the aggression in a 100% zone they would be unable to even think about fighting back, or defending their comrades. Is an arrest a violent action?

Another Suppression gas food for thought you didn't see!: To provoke some thought, and self reflection. What would you do if your character got beat up? Could you as the player accept that? How would the character react? https://myspace.com/heldbystarlight/...d-lose/1265945 That said could you solve a hostile situation -without- resorting to violence?

A Healthy Suppression gas food for thought: RP locations will become deserted if they are continuously invaded with the other faction claiming being invincible due to suppression gas, and refusing to leave. The only available avenue for the "home team" would be to go somewhere else and more private. This means going to apartments for meetings, using tells, and team chat instead of vicinity. This has happened before, and it will repeat itself if we as a community do not learn from our previous mistakes. Last thing we need is everything going underground, and less contact between factions, and those neutrals too.

**Xeenah** · Feb 28th, 2014, 14:39:25

About the /tells:

Something I do from time to time is to open with something like:

:: Caller ID: "Xeenah" — Accept (A) Refuse/Ring (R) Message box (M) ? ::

I don't expect everyone to open up like this, it's just something I do from time to time

Sometimes, I just use "Beep beep" or ":: Incoming call from "Xeenah" ::". Including options like above (A, R, M) is technically power-playing, since I shouldn't decide what their comlink options are :P I only do it as a little immersion touch

From an IC point of view, living in a universe controlled and legislated by several corporations, I'm inclined to think that privacy of the general public is not in the best interest of those corporations

So, odds are my comlink ID would be public.

From an OOC point of view, it makes interactions easier and helps keep RP flowing. That's why I don't mind if even a stranger sends me a /tell. Depending on the situation at hand, I may reply with an "automated message" of some sort:

"Mrs. Clay is unavailable at the moment, your call has been recorded. If you wish to continue your message, please do so after the tone. *beep!*"

This way, what's already been sent to me is not flat out lost, and the other character can leave a "message". It's also a courtesy I like to do to other players, who can then leave their message without having to wait. RL does happen sometimes!

**Tussa** · Feb 28th, 2014, 18:34:40

Originally Posted by Kotts

At 75% it says wildlife may attack, however, human mobs can attack you too, as well as be attacked in return. What's the difference between Human mobs and player controlled humans?

Wow, I had never even considered this before, even after all these years! What a great point! I think this quite changes things for me. After all, a human mob and a human player character are supposedly the same thing. And really... just standing in an area and tossing verbal threats at each other without being able to do something about it becomes droll and passive over time.

Originally Posted by Kotts

The game mechanic itself is a paradox. Many ARK-Events, Official FC storylines, and players have ignored the hell out of suppression gas for the sake of a good story. Which is more important?

Another good point. As roleplayers, I would think that we're always looking to create and play scenes and stories not to boost our own egos or stroke our proverbial epeens, but to create good stories for all who are involved.

Originally Posted by Kotts

Another Suppression gas food for thought you didn't see!: To provoke some thought, and self reflection. What would you do if your character got beat up? Could you as the player accept that? How would the character react? https://myspace.com/heldbystarlight/...d-lose/1265945 That said could you solve a hostile situation -without- resorting to violence?

This is such an important point! No one is 100% fearless and no one is untouchable. Our characters should all be subject to losing face or losing a fight given the right circumstances or great roleplaying. We can act as awesome as we want, but getting an asswhooping would hurt, regardless of how tough-as-nails they appear to be. A couple of my best roleplaying moments in AO have been when my characters have been at the mercy of someone else, in scenarios or stories that were driven by fabulous roleplayers who were respectful and considerate, though their characters were certainly not. I believe it's important to let go and dare to let your character "lose" every now and again. Everyone fears something, and no one is invincible.

It's the ups and downs in a character's life and their development as time goes by that shape them to what they are today, and if nothing bad ever happened to them, they'd be flat and quite uninteresting, just like they would if nothing good ever happened to them either. It's scary to let them back down or lose something. After all, no one likes losing, but I think it makes for much more interesting roleplay.

**Towerblock** · Mar 1st, 2014, 00:45:23

Heh. Speaking only on my own behalf: When I RP'd bubba full time, I always lost my @ss off when it came to public battles. I would always get inevitably flagged, and then the griefers would always take all in the end.

During the attack in Tir, I continuously got killed by lvl 300 guards, spammed and chained, over and over again. Kotts and Xeenah were present during that. And my MP was the toon I frequently went into BS and tower battles with.

I've also been captured by ARK events, where I literally broke my characters ankles trying to escape from a few of the SC's thugs purposely. A large group of people had to bail me out and heal me.

I usually take my butt whoopin's like a man. :/ Problem is, at least with PC's there are elements there I can understand and have the ability to work around and with. When a LTC shows up buffed for maximum deus ex machina, I barely even bother anymore. It's why I stopped doing massive public events after the Tir situation. I have no problems joining things where I have a chance at actually achieving something palpable. But, those events don't happen anymore. There is always the same formulaic uber looming plot boss, which ends in a massive battle where RPr's are basically drowned out by the non-RP zerg, and in the end Omni-pol gets all the credit IC. So, people have other reasons other than ego to not even bother, and that's also linked to an entirely similar yet tangental rant I have about AO RP.

So, to counter the statement "they'd be flat and quite uninteresting" I've seen plenty of loosing be flat and quite uninteresting, even anticlimactic.

**Vinele** · Mar 1st, 2014, 02:14:36

You bring up some valid points Tower. Perhaps we can compile another thread with feed back about events? Maybe suggest we have a more balance of battle and just story ones? I'm not sure on what the restrictions and such events have but, feedback is always welcome im sure.

**Towerblock** · Mar 1st, 2014, 06:02:31

I could do a huge rundown of things that I would consider to throw at Events as feedback, but one thing I have learned is that these issues are mostly my own. I have been roleplaying so long, and over so many different genre's and platforms that I have a very specific vision of how roleplay works, and does not work, both as a player and as a GM or ST.

What I have come to learn about how Events operates purely from an outside perspective, and how my own personal vision comes into play, is that there is a massive disconnect between the two. And, I don't think what these two should be too similar, as MMO roleplay seems to have far more restrictive than what I consider to be typical, for some of the reasons that have been outlined here in this thread.

The largest restriction of course being the splitting of the factions. To me, the idea of Omni-reform being the largest reason why Omni-tek players can and do have such a hard time being socialized with the rest of us, is really really unfortunate. If there was one thing I would change about the whole AO RP experience would be to completely do away with the current version of Reform. I'm not saying it would make Omni-tek look more like flowers and rainbows, but it would remove the most dehumanizing factor from the equation.

**Encyros** · Mar 1st, 2014, 18:32:15

I'm very eager to defend the blackest evil, but maybe you could create another thread for this Tower?

**Towerblock** · Mar 1st, 2014, 23:26:32

As I said before. I could, but then it wouldn't accomplish much. MMO RP is just a different thing, and Events has a pattern they follow and do not really deviate from it. Pheat's side projects would have been the best way to shore that difference up, but alas.

**Vinele** · Mar 2nd, 2014, 05:02:10

Forgive me for my ignorance Tower, but you have peaked my curiosity. What side projects?

**Towerblock** · Mar 2nd, 2014, 05:19:29

He was trying to broaden things up a bit back when he was Director, and later when he returned. The advertisement for it can be found here: http://forums.anarchyonline.com/showthread.php?t=607498

**Tussa** · Mar 2nd, 2014, 13:51:49

But ARK Events aren't the only one who can run events. For the most part, roleplaying exists between player characters, as we're the ones who interact with each other on a daily basis. Aren't we?

Though I do believe this is a discussion for another thread.

**Nanostratege** · Mar 6th, 2014, 08:29:53