for how loong does funcom think we can play without changes?

[Leetlover]

This are all endgame problems, stuff people get in trouble once they pvp at endgame... So after about 6 months of various farming to get there at all.

Most newbies quit before lvl 125, mongo rage is not a problem, or aimedshot.

Pvp is totaly retardedly balanced. Why does it takes months for a newbie to have a decent pvp toon? And why do newbies need another pvm lovechild to support it?

Problem with balance is that pvp in AO is so inaccessible.

Yep, it is quite fun 2 play when u got tools. Many know what 2 do, but have no means.

imo, players are hoarding leetness. Some view the game is if it was the veteranbot, and the devs do little about problems. F.x the lack of team-content...maybe they think it is a player-issue and not a dev-issue.

[MassDebater]

Blame retarded availability of low level AI armour.

[Valerija666]

I can play this game forever even if no changes bc its an awesome game

[Gimpynoob]

I can play this game forever even if no changes bc its an awesome game

Me too. Although I wouldn't mind playing with other players once in a while.

[Shareida]

SMB1 is better than lets say GTA IV.

There you go.

[McKnuckleSamwich]

I'm trying to say that the Troa isn't as OP as it is on Crat/Engi as it is on Doctor/Advy where it ramped up the PvP damage on two of the most defensive classes ingame. Crat/Engi already had damage from the pets, and could kill Evaders with Pets/Procs/Nukes. But Advy and Doctor -couldn't- and now they can. Which is bad because Doc/Advy were already tough against EVERYONE else.

QFT.

But it also made engi AND crat stronger. It made all professions using pistol stronger, mainly because it offers a more consistent AS than OH, doesn't cost any extra IP, has far better offhand/mainhand AR, offers usable mods, offers better PVM damage, offers far better PVP regular damage, and most importantly, streamlines setups so less peripheral adjustments are needed to take advantage of it.

[MassDebater]

QFT.

But it also made engi AND crat stronger. It made all professions using pistol stronger, mainly because it offers a more consistent AS than OH, doesn't cost any extra IP, has far better offhand/mainhand AR, offers usable mods, offers better PVM damage, offers far better PVP regular damage, and most importantly, streamlines setups so less peripheral adjustments are needed to take advantage of it.

I'm not aware of any pistol using professions running out of IP at 220. I am also not aware of any particular sacrifice in gear to use OH over Tro.

[McKnuckleSamwich]

I'm not aware of any pistol using professions running out of IP at 220. I am also not aware of any particular sacrifice in gear to use OH over Tro.

http://auno.org/ao/db.php?id=88374

http://auno.org/ao/db.php?id=205620&ql=275

thats - 80 AR, - 120ish add dmg, - 440 inits, and +9 crit (useless in PVP) depending on what the other item swapped out was.

But those are pretty significant.

[MassDebater]

How silly of me to not know that poor OH users had to use VE unlike those lucky Tro users.

[McKnuckleSamwich]

How silly of me to not know that poor OH users had to use VE unlike those lucky Tro users.

I don't know if silly is the right word.

Perhaps you're just unaware.

Realistically though, an advy certainly does not have to use TS, and theres absolutely no reason he should.

Offhand, I can't think of one situation where a TS would outperform a green hud 3 with a swap to purple hud 3.

On engi, same thing, except in duels, where you have the time to prepare your nano swaps ahead of time, but realistically i'd assume most engies would use a health hud 3 then swap to purple as soon as 1k HP had been consumed. In mass PVP, a TS could be useful, but not necessary.

On crat, evade hud 3 or purple again, but TS could be useful, but not necessary, but again, it's nice to have the option to change

On doc, I admit I'm unfamiliar. I think docs have a hard time reaching the OE level on troaler without a TS so that may be a moot point, but no doc's I know use yatamutchy.

The reality is, is that OH is poor alternative to troaler, and, anyone who can afford to use it, I'd say 95/100 does use it (there are a few who do not... but there aren't that many). The OH needs a buttload of % weap range to be in the same league as troa ler, so it stands to reason that if you need to compensate AR/HP/AR/add dmg before you even start to compare the damage/damage range, you're looking at an inferior weapon.

Are we really having this conversation? or are you just trolling?

[MassDebater]

Adv is the only pistol user who can use tro with out VE.

[wonderland]

In this thread, people explain how they think you need to use a targeting scope to get yourself out of oe, not to get aimed shot multiplier and 11s recharge.

and apparently, aimed shot always caps 30% health. Especially with a weapon that has 225 maximum damage.

I don't know if silly is the right word.

Perhaps you're just unaware.

I laughed, considering pretty much everything you said was incorrect.

The reality is, is that OH is poor alternative to troaler, and, anyone who can afford to use it, I'd say 95/100 does use it (there are a few who do not... but there aren't that many). The OH needs a buttload of % weap range to be in the same league as troa ler, so it stands to reason that if you need to compensate AR/HP/AR/add dmg before you even start to compare the damage/damage range, you're looking at an inferior weapon.

Except for people who want to use full auto. You know, that special that you claim caps your martial artist nearly 100% of the time. The one that troa'ler debuffs -2000 of. and just because a mod is there doesn't mean that it's necessary for your character's setup to PvP with. None of your logic makes any sense.

[Obtena]

In this thread, people explain how they think you need to use a targeting scope to get yourself out of oe, not to get aimed shot multiplier and 11s recharge.

and apparently, aimed shot always caps 30% health. Especially with a weapon that has 225 maximum damage.

Yeah, these mistruths have already been belaboured in a previous one of (many) McK's famous 'remove AS pistol' Threads.

[Psikie]

Yeah, these mistruths have already been belaboured in a previous one of (many) McK's famous 'remove AS pistol' Threads.

I dont agree with all that McK says, but I do agree AS pistols is just the most absurd addition to AO i've ever seen. No other single item can be put into the hands of any random 3 toons and kill anyone in pvp regardeless of any other factors.

[MassDebater]

3 Angst agents, 3 Envy soldiers, 3 Hatred enfs, 3 triple NTs.

Much more likely to kill someone than 3 lots of 2k AS, 1k bursts.

[Esssch]

For new players rebalance will mean absolutely nothing. And even if you have rebalance before the engine, what good is that to the new players if any of the following would happen the first thing the start AO:
- chat / items info windows display no text
- very annoying clipping issues
- graphics not loading up properly (toons with no heads, missing textures from armors)
- black screens because their video drivers for their brand new card can't handle AO
- gfx artifacts due to AO's rendering engine
- zone crashes because their computer doesn't like AO and will not load up the next zone properly
- poor performance with lag / stuttering

This are issues that the new rendering engine will fix by making AO run with less issues than before while still adding a bit of eye candy to the game so people won't say "what a pile of rubbish!!!".

That's not entirely true. I still notice clipping issues, graphics not loading properly, artifacts in very specific locations, and fairly poor performance (well, 50 FPS at minimum, usually 70ish, but it feels pretty choppy around 50) in AoC with a 7950.

[Wyoming]

3 Angst agents, 3 Envy soldiers, 3 Hatred enfs, 3 triple NTs.

Much more likely to kill someone than 3 lots of 2k AS, 1k bursts.

Random? I figured he meant like, any three support classes. By your logic, an army of copies of a good 220 PvP-Built gank prof would be a reason not to nerf the Tro - because a few identical clones of other builds can beat three lone guns.

[MassDebater]

And what does this randomness prove? A combination of 3 envy users is going to be more powerful than 3 random Tro users.

Guess its time to nerf that OP envy.

[Psikie]

And what does this randomness prove? A combination of 3 envy users is going to be more powerful than 3 random Tro users.

Guess its time to nerf that OP envy.

Unfortunately you kinda stuck your foot in your mouth here. Apart from the fact that not any toon can even equip an envy. 3 doc/advy/enfo/mp/crat/keep/engi/age/shade/trad all with envy probably couldnt ever hit you with FA. Unlike the ridiculous NEVER miss AS pistol that ANYONE can equip.

[wonderland]

It doesn't matter who's able to put it on, but how powerful they are or could be when they get it on in a competently-made setup.

I honestly don't understand how he "put his foot in his own mouth."