A follow up question, which profs would you absolutely never take?
for me the answer is agent.
Unfortunately I've just seen so few well played agents at endgame that they are on the bottom of my list for filling a spot.
Every other prof has some benefit in terms of dmg mitigation, healing, or above average DPS or some other modifier to the target that makes them really useful.
The only things an agent reliably brings is adds UBTing, moderate damage, and 4% crit.
edit: very very close behind agent is MA.
The only reason MA beats agent is that it takes less skill on MA to produce *just* above piss-poor damage and reliably 7% crit for team and 120 evades for tank.
MA's can produce retarded nice damage, but when I play my MA and see what most other MA's do that are "leveling" i'm usually so astounded by the vastness of difference that I resolutely decide never to bring them on another raid.
Last edited by McKnuckleSamwich; Jan 3rd, 2013 at 05:21:00.
Engineer pet procs -300 init too.
Engineer could run an AC team proc and replace 25 add dmg aura with 627 AC aura (or so) if beast isn't hitting for min damage.
Originally Posted by McKnuckleSamwich
A good time to calculate something I've been interested in since they changed notum shield.
With keeper running reflect aura, engineer could get 24+13+3+6%. 7 more with bracer depending on beast damage type. Nanomage engineer could get an extra 15 more with the perk but it drains tons of nano.
That is where our team comes in.
Its safe to say in pvm that the proc is 100% up.
So you would have 24+3+6+13=46% static. Until someone clarifies beast damage I will ignore bracer.
Notum shield drains 525 np/s every second.
My setup as NM would have 18k nano. Lend nano is 1000 so lets go with 19k. Engineer could go enhance nano for 2500 more nano.
It stops ticking if nano drops below 5k. But I will ignore this for now.
That is 38 seconds of pure notum shield alone.
Swap in alphas and you get 178+ nano delta before natural tick.
Add in 2+ general buff and you get 180 added. Base is 18.
198 nano delta a tick or 99 np/s.
Rouse outfit by trader is 74 np/s
Keeper nano field is 28.8np/s
MP has spirits perk that is 32.5np/s but it is a perk so I will go with 30np/s assuming activation time and lag/human reaction.
MP could also perk notum source for 2500 every 4 mins or 10 np/s again rounded down to factor in execution and whatnot.
Regain nano is 13np/s
So far engineer is at -525 on notum shield but 13+10+30+28.8+74+99=253 np/s added.
Engineer is now at 270 nano/s being drained.
So far that allows 20500/270. 75 seconds of nonstop notum shield.
Each team member would use ql 200 Nano stims which is 2400/40 60 np/s.
5 people is 300np/s.
That (minus team member delay on items) I would say the exact amount of nano required.
Throw in s7 nano larvae and there's no way you can run out.
Of course all of this falls apart if the reflect proc/reflect get wiped from beast and/or that spirit morph drains your nano.
But I will keep going since it will work for other bosses.
A team with MP/Keeper/Engineer/Trader can keep an NM engineer with practically 61% static reflect.
http://forums.anarchyonline.com/showthread.php?t=525914
Then there's these items depending on damage type.
So example with projectile you would sit nice and easy on 73% reflect permanent. 81% poison if you got 1500 BM. etc.
Now if you think about it, imagine what soldier can tank with 60-80% reflect with an advy healing, and that is what you'll get on engy.
This was what I was wearing. Tell me I asked for it
I didn't say doctors. I said characters, characters encompass all 14 professions. Since pande was released all characters have seen a boost in HP, defense, offense and damage. Because of this, content is much easier and can be done with a lot less people/support. Not to mention tool sets exist now that didn't in the past.
Balance is going to open the door for some professions and provide them with heals, tanking and debuffs so its not going to be "ok we need a crat then we start" "hey theres an mp lft for XX' "Oh no we got enough people we only need crat".
The question shouldn't be, what professions can do what content without the big 3 (devoted tank, healer and debuffer) but it should be what determines difficulty. When Priest Atalas was introduced he was hard. He was unperkable, hit hard and hit fast and he would switch targets. People complained so much that they made him easier.
Is it the amount of tricks and paying attention you have to do during an encounter that determines difficulty? Is it the right profession for debuffing? Do you need a bunch of DD for this content? If you look at pande its a tank and spank zone. You can do the whole area with just a tank, doc and DD. Do people still consider it difficult? What if your team isn't well equipped, does that play a factor in difficulty?
When dealing with tricks and paying attention in PvM content, what benefit is there for taking, for example, an Engineer over a Crat?
Both do damage in similar ways and amounts, a Crat provides game breakingly OP debuffs and can CC anything in game. An Engineer does damage and provides a little bit of reflects and can debuff adds as long as they don't hit anything, causing reflect damage, thus breaking their blind.
No, I am proposing the question, "What makes PvM difficult". I am not asking how pvm is difficult in AO (or not). I am asking, in general, what makes content (any content existing or not) difficult?
cool thanks, forgot both of those.
Also, nice discussion on notum shield.
my opinion is that engi can't do enough damage to hold agg (don't forget it's a pistol (?) user with nothing special... the pets don't contribute to taunt).
One thing that you bring up though that is quite interesting is the stims.
The new stims are pretty exceptional, albeit expensive.
I use a QL 230 stim on my engi that heals for 2677 hp/nano I think and over 5 people, thats a lot of heal power that I didn't take into account.
61% reflects is definitely substantial.
interesting stuff.
In teams with an adv healer and mp etc, Eng should be able to grab aggro well.
It will come down to how much hp gear must the engineer get to stay alive vs how much damage gear he needs to keep agg.
Edit: Another tactic I've not seen since froob is to put MP healpet on eng pet.
In fact I would imagine a lot of 220s don't even know thats possible.
This was what I was wearing. Tell me I asked for it
bahahaa I perk healed my engi pet in a duel a few days ago and guy thought I was sploiting.
Pretty funny stuff. I have a 110 MP and I love using bela on the meatball when I don't feel like killing all the towers.... ie. meatball hits a CT with dmg shield, takes damage, bela heals.
5 keepers
or
5 players with freak str 3 perked
or
Advy to tank using Pheonix to draw aggro
Keeper for ward
Engineer for reflects and damage
NT or trader for mez
MA or MP for debuffing
Agent would be viable as tank using enforcer-TP-doctor, with essence buffs and using CH to tank, but beast clears essences. Honestly I would rather just have 5 keepers.
I can use every profession if they are geared properly and use their toolset appropriately. They may be less effective but I have done plenty of raids without any of the core PVE professions.
5 keepers would be a stupid decision.
just sayin.
3 max.
but you'll get better coverage of weaknesses using a diversity of profs.
Why would it be a stupid decision if it works? He asked what could do it, and I said something that would. 5 Keepers could do anything with a single target or 5 seperate targets even if they divided aggro. The only damage they would take is nuke damage and shield damage, and the nuke damage would be healed with all 5 using area heal perks together.
The level of individual skill and team coordination required
I am wiser than any god or scientist, for I have squared the circle and cubed Earth's sphere, thus I have created 4 simultaneous separate 24 hour days within a 4-corner (as in a 4-corner classroom) rotation of Earth. See for yourself the absolute proof.
Not enough damage mitigation, and not enough heals to make up for lack of mitigation.
You need to lower the damage output on beast or it wouldn't work.
How do you propose a team of 5 keepers who need to evenly divide agg in order to progressively out-taunt the next keeper when he falls low on HP are going to handle 4 or 8 adds, or 2 pinks? or 3 pinks?
It's not even remotely a good strategy.
You obviously have no idea how to maximize the effectiveness of the keeper toolset in PVE content, especially against bosses, so stop trying to correct me.
Please explain.
I'm sure you have plenty of experience dealing with adds without a mezzer or debuffer, so why don't you detail your chronicles of awesome by explaining just how you and your 4 super duper keeper friends would juggle beast agg while he is getting CH'd by the 3 pinks that just spawned.
I'm not questioning you, mate. I'm just telling you you're wrong. I wouldn't want you to waste four peoples time in some fruitless quest to down a big mob with 5 keepers.
Mc, you're aware he said 5, not 6.. 1 Trader/NT could debuff Beast and calm adds.
Indeed. But we are talking about a team of 5.
Certainly you could toss a mezzer in the mix. Is 5 keepers a a trader going to cut it though? imo you need more than that.
Never have I done beast with a team of 3 and iCH was not used at least once.
Talking beast here:
- Keeper tank + ward
- MP for damage debuffs + heal pet (if only Zset MP's had a way to tank...)
- Eng for reflects
- Fill with advs
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