How to save AO from SWG and the rest.

**Sean-Roach** · Oct 20th, 2002, 20:59:44

Wingless, I admire and envy you.

From your thoughts, you are clearly an intelligent person. If I were to rely on your words alone, I'd assume otherwise, since most any intelligent person, who spoke english as a first language, would not make the number of grammarical errors you have. Thus I can only assume you learned english as a second, (or third,) language. I admire and envy you.

Your idea about branching and specializing the classes was one of the things I remember them talking about for Shadowlands, so maybe we'll see that eventually.

However, remember that lucasart isn't the one behind SW:G that FC has to worry about. It's Verant who knows how to make a MMORPG. Also, SW:G is in closed beta, so some of the people who are on this board may be comparing the two and know what they are talking about. However, as I understand it, they can't reveal what they see, so probably the people here are comparing AO, as it stands now, with SW:G's list of planned features. If you compare AO's pre-release features list with SW:G's pre-release features list, you might find the two more equal. I, however, am too lazy to look at the moment. :>

Remember, AO has housing. It's functionally broken, but it does exist. EQ's Shadows of Luclin was released with a new "bazaar" system to make player trade easier, but they only got that working in the last couple months. That's several months that that product was out, that one of its core features was Not included.

I guess I'm arguing both sides. SW:G probably will be broken at launch. There are just too many variables for Varant and LucasArts to overlook for the game to be fully working at release. However, it does have the name, and new customers are probably not going to give AO a chance due to it.

They'll either see the SW:G box, and buy it due to brand familarity, or they'll have tried SW:G, or heard someone else's complaints, and avoid AO because it's similar to SW:G and SW:G was broken, hence AO is probably broken. A --> B --> C.

By the way, I am NOT saying SW:G and AO are "similar". I am, however, saying that they will probably be perceived that way by people who have never played. Both, after all, will be Sci-Fi games.

Edit, I deleted a mistake. It didn't display the way I intended.

**______________Orchid** · Oct 20th, 2002, 22:27:29

I am beta testing SW:G.

**Gearbox** · Oct 21st, 2002, 01:42:33

Jesus Emiko, aren't you beta testing Eve as well? Leave some for the rest of us, yes??

**Gearbox** · Oct 21st, 2002, 01:55:16

Originally posted by Bhaaz
As said above, it's the social aspect... it's all about the social aspect. Definitely AO's weakest point at the moment and it's the very thing that gives mmorpgs any kind of longevity (UO anyone?).

That's very true. UO is graphically inferior to every other major MMOG... but it's still alive. You can never have too many social features, and I'm always surprised when companies ignore them.

DAoC is a great example. Apart from the fact that the game itself becomes mind numbing... there are zero social options. So once you're tired of combat... you log off and very likely type "CANCEL". And why not? There's nothing else for you at that point.

AO's social aspect is vastly better than DAoC's, but there's still lots of room for improvement.

So many people would hang on for the social aspect long after they've tired of combat, were there a deep set of social tools at their disposal. In fact, people would take a lot longer to get tired of combat in the first place. They'd be too busy goofing around.

**______________Orchid** · Oct 21st, 2002, 02:11:27

Originally posted by Blue Cat
Jesus Emiko, aren't you beta testing Eve as well? Leave some for the rest of us, yes??

lmao

**_____________Gyrmyth** · Oct 21st, 2002, 05:10:54

Originally posted by Derisor
4) Outdoor Moster Exp: Increase it. Drastically. Tir county is now totally empty and that is really sad. Give peopel incentive to go out there and hunt. Also throwing in a bit of cash wouldnt be a bad Idea. Id suggest that outdoor monsters offer good cash and good exp but no items except for trade skill drops. Missions offer items.

While I agree with the XP, not sure on the money really. I always liked the idea that missions offered better cash/equipment while hunting (especially in teams) offered better XP. Of course, right NOW team missions beat both of these hands down if you have a good team, but that's why I say up the XP on outdoor hunting.

Originally posted by Derisor
5) Increase trade skills drastically: Give us 1000 new items to manufacture. Stims of all varieties.

I'm all for this one.

Originally posted by Derisor
6) Reduce trade skill cost for items: Make it economically feasible to make medical kits or weapons that people will want to buy.

I like this one too. Making trade skill items should DEFINITELY be more profitable. I mean, if it's cheaper and easier to just go buy the completed item, what's the point?

Originally posted by Derisor
7) Make a couple new craftsman professions that are all about trade skills.

Not sure if this is necessary, they just need to refine the existing one and stop listening to people who whine about not being able to PvP with a trade skill profession. I mean, who says that traders, engies, crats, and docs should compete on par with Soldiers and Enforcers in the arena? They're support professions, not primary fighters.

Originally posted by Derisor
8) Increase nano varieties: Get on your thinking caps and put
out some more nanos.

Heck, I'd be happy with more truly UNIQUE nanos for the professions instead of trying to make essentially only a few different types of nanos and giving them different names. There's few differences in the nanos in several professions outside of the name.

Originally posted by Derisor
9) More mission tiles to make for dynamic missions. Give us some scenery here guys.

Variety is always a good thing, but they would have to constantly add new scenery. No matter how much they add all in one shot, it will get stale rather quickly.

Originally posted by Derisor
12) This one would be tough but would trump the upcomming games. Get multiperson vehicles.

Difficult? No way. In fact, they used to exist. There used to be a transoport that would transport an entire team.

Originally posted by Derisor
13) Increase the level max drastically.

Two Words for you on this one...SHADOWLANDS EXPANSION

**Warlock** · Oct 21st, 2002, 10:08:23

Just a quick note on hunting

My first character was Neutral (before I realised it was a curse not a blessing) and I almost exclusively hunted for all of his 28 levels (mostly out at the Newland oasis) because missions were boring and token irrelevant (not that I knew about tokens back then)

Hes gimped!

Why?

Because he never has enough money to buy all his nanos, nor does he ever loot any of his profession nanos (Engineer). Since he relies on his pet to level he gimps himself further by having sub standard weapons/armour/equipment to buy his much-needed new pets.

Fortunately when I switched to my Omni main I was able to fund him so hes not that bad anymore, and now he does missions (boring as hell but a much better time investment)

Dyna camps are simply team missions without the several-hours-ploughing-through-MOBs-to-get-to-the-boss (which is a good thing).

Outdoor hunting has to be worth the investment both in XP and in cash (either direct cash from the corpse, or better loot which sells for more)

**________Barry Fukuda** · Oct 22nd, 2002, 00:48:20

Lets face it , just about everyone loves Star Wars. Hell, in Australia alone, 40000 people have registered their religion as Jedi!

Someone earlier in this thread said that SWG will have a buggy start like all other MMORPG's. Well I’m not so sure, Verant has been in the MMORPG business for awhile now. This will be their second MMORPG, and I’m sure they have learned quite a bit from EQ. With Verant making SWG you can be sure of one thing, it won’t have the buggy horrible start that AO did. If anything they know that AO's crappy start nearly killed this game. They won’t make the same mistake.

I agree with everything on the original post, there are a ton of bugs still needed to be worked out of AO. Even though AO has a lot of content, to compete with SWG its going to need a whole lot more.

Then again, if SWG is just EQ in the Star Wars universe, there is no way I’m going to switch over to it. I can’t stand EQ. I think there are a lot of people out there who have grown tired of EQ and want something different. I doubt SWG will hold their interest for very long if it is some sort of EQ “clone”.

This Booster pack coming out is going to make AO much more interesting. Finally, guilds / orgs will have something to do! Owning land is what made UO great, so I think it will change the focus of this game.

Until I have tried out the Booster pack, I’m not sure what the future is for AO. I know that the way this game is as of right now... it seems a bit like a 3D futuristic Diablo 2. You go online and basically do the same things over and over again. Not that that is so much of a bad thing, but I can do that for free with Dungeon Siege or Diablo 2. So being able to own and protect something that I have invested a good amount of time into, appeals to me. As of right now I am looking forward to the Booster pack more so than SWG.

And as far as I have heard, SWG isn’t going to have anything you can "own" (besides equipment) until their first expansion pack which will allow you to buy a space craft and fly it around in space (Which sounds pretty kewl to me.)

And now I hear Funcom is going to waste more resources and time on making the Longest Journey 2. This is a game that did not sell well in the first place. (Not that the original was a bad game) I see this hurting AO in the long run.

Sony & Verant obviously has more financial backing than Funcom, so why would Funcom do this? Seems like a stupid move to me. I’d hate to see all the progress made with AO go to waste.

I am just beginning to enjoy this game; I hope AO doesn’t disappear into MMORPG history as quickly as it sounds like it will.

**______________Orchid** · Oct 22nd, 2002, 00:54:29

The booster pack is definitely not going to make AO more interesting.

It would take alot more then the ability to ripoff Warcraft ability to make towers to keep my interest.

**________Barry Fukuda** · Oct 22nd, 2002, 04:42:09

Warcraft? But archer towers are awesome =P

**Sean-Roach** · Oct 22nd, 2002, 06:01:49

Mr. Fukuda,

I'm the one who said SW:G is probably going to be rather buggy. My evidence is is as follows. When Verant's own Shadows of Luclin was released it was missing a key feature of the expansion, and it had bugs. (One of those was still there some time later. Log in in the bazaar or some other "silent" zones and you'd get stuck with the startup music...even after you zoned. MIXED with whatever sounds you were SUPPOSED to be hearing. I quit logging out in the bazaar.) SW:G is not EQ in space. As a consequence, they probably had to start over from scratch on the SW:G engine. New software is buggy.

Also, as far as fourty thousand australians declaring Jedi as their religion. Well, I knew auzzies were nuts when they passed their anti gun laws not too long ago.

**________Barry Fukuda** · Oct 22nd, 2002, 07:18:50

I see your point. But I highly doubt it will be as buggy as AO was when it first came out.

I don't think sitting here discussing SWG is going to help anything though. The real question is: what can we do to encourage Funcom to change its attitude and try to make AO into the game we all want it to be?

Unfortunately I think the answer is nothing. =(

**_________BettiePaige** · Oct 24th, 2002, 01:29:14

I just want to add that new higher level content is probably the single most important thing to keep people from getting bored and leaving the game. This is coming from someone who played AC for 2 years. Yeah sure, the XP chains and combat macroers bugged me, but the biggest reason I cancelled my account was that I was bored out of my mind. When I say higher level content, I mean new and higher QL nanos/pets, guns, armor, implants, etc. People get bored using the same QL 200 gun/nano/pet for 50 levels. Also, raise the level cap. I've already seen some of this in missions, now we can do QL 200+ missions, 200+ QL implants and armor. My point is, people really don't want some QL 300 boss mob that they have to camp for hours and hours with a team of like 30 to get some item that isn't all that useful. People want nukes that do more damage, guns that do more damage, better roots/calms, better pets, better armor, etc. I think most people cancel their accounts because they've reached say level 150, and there is not much more to strive for.

**______________Orchid** · Oct 24th, 2002, 02:32:05

I've been playing alot on AO's test server lately, and I must say, it was increible.

The new character creation and shuttle to Omni1 in 14.6 and beyoind is great. Everyone should check it out.

My views oin AO have brightened alot recently.

**_______________North** · Oct 24th, 2002, 02:59:15

they have made star war galactic battleground, yes and is only AoE with the unit of starwars lol and he are almost unplayable at 8 too laggy.

Untrue, the game is very different from AoK and AoC. It has completely different strategy aspects and unit balances.

**______________Cronos** · Oct 24th, 2002, 05:50:52

Originally posted by Emiko
I've been playing alot on AO's test server lately, and I must say, it was increible.

The new character creation and shuttle to Omni1 in 14.6 and beyoind is great. Everyone should check it out.

My views oin AO have brightened alot recently.

you feel better about AO as a game because of the new character creation? hmm...

and while i'm talkin to you how is Eve-Online? i've heard it got positive buzz from beta testers.

**______________Orchid** · Oct 24th, 2002, 06:14:31

I meant test overall.

Wont discuss Eve here at length but yea its doing real well.

**______________Cronos** · Oct 24th, 2002, 07:02:44

good, thats the MMORPG i'm waiting for

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