Nano-Technician Nano Document Discussion Thread

[Kintaii]

use the DM animation?

Different things. An effect is the big bright blue light and explosion; an animation is the character moving and doing the YMCA. =)

[Causticsoda]

Interesting...

Where is our stun? Very useful when taking down docs.. Cant kill em, but can reduce em 1/2 hp+stun and watch em die someones alpha.

I like most of em, but seems i need roll Trox-nt and delete nanomage. Seems to me that flesh has replace brains in pvp for NT's. Wtb more HP...

Kiting, imo should be reasonable us run AoE-dot/blind with nuke without waiting that 7 seconds.

Nemesis dot... not like. Original was better. U gona run dot on enf instead keeping him rooted No Gsf - no chance.

Might be i misunderstood something and cant say much, before tested tho..

[ArienSky]

I like most of em, but seems i need roll Trox-nt and delete nanomage. Seems to me that flesh has replace brains in pvp for NT's. Wtb more HP...

How will you keep up with the nanocost (nano pool) and MC requirements then?
You do get stronger layers though.

Kind Regards
-Ariensky

[Causticsoda]

How will you keep up with the nanocost (nano pool) and MC requirements then?
You do get stronger layers though.

Kind Regards
-Ariensky

Spamming layers with that nanocost... well same situation no pool anymore. And NT with all that MC-stuff on wouldnt survive anywhere long, i mean pvp/pvm both. Another thing about layers, could solve self only by making one low team layer.

I think nemesis nano should be reasonable nanodot what wouldnt break root. Dots in pvp for NT, only reason i used SI was i can cast DM (i rather use IU tho). Nothing nemesis for me if i can run 3 different dots on oppponent, more like selfdestruction-button.

One burst effect should be stunning. Few firts will stun for a moment and last like ~4 seconds. Now forexample fighting team/bs with healing class, they just outheal your damage. Would give healers somthing to thinkabout too.

I hope they will do somthing to NR-perks & checks before they push that "big red button" Nowdays 5-10 first seconds in fight goes NR-debuffing while taking beating. Those new NR-debuffs i just dont want imagine that.. Almost evry pfofession exept NT can be nanoproof somehow and use somekind of dd. I would be happy to hit some specials in first seconds of fight too, not just try stay alive and debuff my opponent.

Well cant see how this works, becouse its on paper only. Got to test and see.

Edit: Well that nanoinit debuffing-busrt might work vs healingprofessions.

[Pyroatheist]

My main issue, as with most people, is the exorbitant nanocost that is present on pretty much every nano in the document. I have a 170 pvp SL only nt, and when having an extended fight, vs say an enfo or soldier, I find it very difficult to maintain a reasonable nanopool. If I continue chainnuking as much as I can, reapplying roots and NR debuffs constantly, I'll run completely dry within several minutes, needing to then take a step back, only cast roots and nr debuffs, and sit down to use nano packs for a minute.
---With the proposed nanocosts on most of our nanos, I can forsee completely destroying my nanopool within the first 20-30 seconds of a fight, regaining it partially through the use of various usable items/perks, and then completely destroying it again in the next 10 seconds of nukes. That situation will be completely untenable if the NT is to remain a viable profession for pvp. Either much MUCH lower nanocosts will be necessary or much MUCH higher nanoregen buffs will be necessary.

Froobs should gain access to the basic cyberdeck, and the first 2 levels of nanoburst, end of story.

Decembersky mentioned something about stuns being removed from AO...if thats true, it will be very unfortunate for my shade being unable to stunlock people for 20 seconds...and also unfortunate for nts who like to use electrifying containment in tl5 pvp..which brings me to my next point...

All of the new nukes are exactly the same. This was a very cool part of being an nt, you had the option to use CoF to debuff nanoskills, or containment for the stun chance, or if you wanted to help out someone using weapons, you could use the gravity fluctuation nukes for the debuff to evasion, not to mention the different nr % checks on different nukes, so you could situationally choose which nukes to use vs which people. All of this is completely gone now. As much as I absolutely love the nano burst idea, and the new implementation of almost everything in the nanodoc, this removal of uniqueness is a damn shame.

As far as the removal of GA nukes goes....meh. Fixers have always been nt food, whether using GA or not. Using GA nukes on a GA fixer just made it slightly more satisfying when you smelled the crispy well-done fixer after a few casts.

As for NS1/2...I don't particularly mind the changes that were made, and I think it actually lends itself to more interesting uses of the 2 nanos, however...with these changes, it is absolutely necessary for NTs to have BOTH of these nanos, and currently only NS1 is readily available, by which I mean still prohibitively expensive for new players, but easily bought by older ones. However, NS2 is an extremely rare, even more extremely expensive nano that is just a general pain in the ass to get. This must be changed, NS2 MUST become at least a semi-common dyna drop, or rollable. In order to be effective with the use of the NS line, NTs must have both these nanos, and for most people, that is very very difficult to do at this time.

Overall, I'm very pleased with the changes that have been displayed in this nanodoc. However, there are several absolutely necessary changes that still need to be made, namely support for froobs on bursting, nanocost, and changes to availability of NS2. As far as uniqueness in nanos goes...while it will be missed, it is not an absolutely integral part of the nt profession, and therefor if it truly stays removed in the implementation of these changes, people will whine for 3 weeks, and then get over it.

EDIT: As far as nanocost goes, I think that it might be a decent idea to actually give all NT nanos negligible nanocost...so as long as you are in normal combat, you wont notice a thing about nano. However, to counteract that power, all nanodrain effects would be several times as powerful vs nts than with everyone else. The effect of this would be that nts have plenty of nano to do anything they want, BUT...if they want to use NS2 or if someone uses nanodrain perks, or traders start landing nanodrains, youll have to fight tooth and claw to hold on to enough nanopool to stay viable in a combat situation. This would really fit in with the glass cannon description of NTs, as if you dont give them some attention, they will really bring the pain, but if you start draining their nanopool, theyll become disabled very fast without lots of evasive action taken.

[sultryvoltron]

The only thing that made me go ??? was the weapon specials debuff. Why didn't Traders get that?

I mean, especially considering the nerfs the Trader toolset went though, why give what logically should go to another prof to ... a damage prof.

I'm not hating on the nanoburst special effects... just the weapon specials debuff struck me as odd.

[Blackcradle]

Agreed. Odd and out of place.

[Causticsoda]

The only thing that made me go ??? was the weapon specials debuff. Why didn't Traders get that?

I mean, especially considering the nerfs the Trader toolset went though, why give what logically should go to another prof to ... a damage prof.

I'm not hating on the nanoburst special effects... just the weapon specials debuff struck me as odd.

- 8 different options of debuffs/damage depending on damage type.
- You start the game with 2 bursts. You gain +1 Burst per specialization giving you 6 Bursts at 4th spec.
- The NT can build up his burst potential by using Alpha, Base, Finishing, or Special Effect Nukes.
- After using an Alpha. Base. Finishing or SFX nuke, a 20 second timer will be placed in the NT's hostile NCU window.
- The 20 second hostile NCU refreshes everytime an Alpha, Base, Finishing or SFX nuke is used.
- The Duration of the debuffs depend on burst level.
- Level 1 Debuffs Last 5 seconds.
- Level 2 Debuffs Last 10 seconds.
- Level 3-6 Debuffs Last 15 Seconds.

Doesnt look like big debuff for me, i rather use element what debuff nanoskills/inits than specials, so i can live without it too. Only situation i can see it could be used is 3 or more nt's together and ther still other better options like damage. Traders can debuff opponent weapons oe without specials debuff too so i dont undestand why they need this max 15 seconds debuff?

Traders got nerf, NT's got nerf i think all profs got nerf somehow. Will be interesting to see how this all works.

I checked doc with time again and it seems pretty good afterall. Still i m worried about how we can survive long enough to use that potential we have. To be a threat to someone need lots of nanoskills-stuff, but using all.. lose too much defence/nr.

[Puheenjohtaja]

Anyone thought these in low nt perspective?
I got 110 nt and just calced that after about 30s of nuking my nanopool would be completely empy even after using both nanoregain perks, stim, battleprepared nanokit. Hope it gets like that for other profs also in the nanodepartment

[Nanofat]

I'm not hating on the nanoburst special effects... just the weapon specials debuff struck me as odd.

Wizards are always supposed to have a bunch of odd toys. They're correct situational use makes the difference between the best and the rest.

Just for an example:
It seems to me that we're back to fearing conflicts with soldiers now since our reflect pierce has been replaced with a reflect debuff. However killing him used to be my best defence against him and since that isn't as reliable as it used to be, if i can survive an an assault by a soldier under his shields by effectly nerfing his combat abilities for a short time - thats a useful toy.

[zorxer]

Different things. An effect is the big bright blue light and explosion; an animation is the character moving and doing the YMCA. =)

what i meant was; instead of some random tracer effect, add current DM effect to the deck....although it might be a bit too much to spam the area with that all the time

[Ataraxy]

Could add the DM effect to the nanoburst nukes, and change the colors according to which damage type you're using, to reduce repetitiveness. Just a thought =P

[Molotoff]

1) Tiers
Will it work like most current perk templates and scale between the few values listed in DecemberSky/Mastablasta's summary ? Or will going from 2999 to 3000 MC dramatically boost your damage and debuffs ?

2) Burst level
2 from start +1 for each specialisation, so maximum effect is reached with 6 bursts at level 200. There should be something at the end of the road. A special Seventh burst for the last shadow level. Too bad if that makes some other NTs jealous.
If not an additional burst, maybe at least more upward scaling on debuff with some nanoskill (like the fire one) ?

3) Chemical Bursts: Armor Class
Will nukes now be affected by ACs in PvP ? If so, will it works like weapons do or like nukes do in PvM ?

4) Poison Damage Bursts: Weapon Specials Debuff
Not sure on how efficient it would be. I would rather see a short special lockout. Or something else.

5) Unable to nuke yourself any more!
Can we have an option to still do it ? Pretty please, with radiation on top ?

6) Nano Range Debuff Line
Will they really be useful ?

7) Special taunt
It might make it too easy to get aggro during an aggro contest. But could make things much easier than now to synchronise NS tanking with multiple NTs. Depending on how much NS get destroyed in the rebalancing process.

8) NS2
My beloved, what have they done to you ?

9) Blinds & evades
Optic plague effect nerfed, but higher static evades to compensate. Why not.
A better AoE blind is nice though for a 6 AAO difference, why ever use the single target blind outside duels (or sometimes PvM) ?

And please change the name of the highest evade buff. The description can state it is based on some trader's code, but the name should not be so trader like.

10) Fortification/Mockery Line
Give them their own line back and remove str/sta from it. I may like tanking, but I am NOT an enforcer.

11) Nano Resist Debuff
Ewww.

12) Absorbs : Self Only
On one hand, I'm happy, since nobody will ever ask me to play the 'healer' with chain layering anymore. On the other, I find it a bit silly to loose the option. Especially if the only reason is to be n00b friendly. If anything, there could be self/target/team/raid layers.

13) Nemesis nano
Why a dot ? It's unnatural since it breaks CC. A nuke would be a bit uncreative. There should be other options, shouldn't it ?
As for the increased effect with layer.... it's definitely not fun if our layers become self only.

14) Grid Line
I'll certainly miss my warps.

15) Izgimmer's Wealth Line (Nano Healing)
As long as we don't get a spammable nanoheal, I don't mind if it can be used on others.

16) Enfraam's Accelerated Cyberdeck
Enfraam's beat Izgimmer at something ? The world must be coming to an end. Or was it an april's fool jokes?

P.S : Thanks for the readable summary.

[Djiax]

Spamming layers with that nanocost... well same situation no pool anymore. And NT with all that MC-stuff on wouldnt survive anywhere long, i mean pvp/pvm both. Another thing about layers, could solve self only by making one low team layer.

You got it wrong, layer nanocost can go in the negative if you face different damage type, since you gonna save 45% of 2467 (1110) per damage type that would hit your pool because of shelter if you hadn't layer running. At 55% na cost reduction, a layer cost 2035 nano.

You face 2 opponents that hit with 2 different damage type and strip 4934 off your layers, you saved 185 nano.

oO

Versus a single opponent and because you might have more HP then you have nanopool, you might indeed not refresh layer.

Depends how much HP for how much nano you got.

Gonna be some weird gameplay decisions

[Gridpain]

* 10 seconds cool down on NR debuffing nuke ? realy ?
The amount debuffed is quite small now, and now it will even take 21 sec to reach the top debuff...

* Blind effect completly removed ...
Current blind is a pain because is not removable, not resistable below level 200, last long and can be spammed...
Why not reduce the duration, remove spammability, and keep the blind effect ?
Or maybe -AAO for 15 sec, and "blind effect" for the 3 first sec ?

* Nuke 1 sec cast time ...
nice, but what will be the use to UBT / Malaise a NT now ?

Edit :

* NS1/2 change
is a huge nerf to TL2 to TL/45 NTs (not sure about tL5, as I dont have one)
NS 1 protects, but ok, you can not nuke, why not... but you ll not be able to blind / NR debuff / calm / root at all ??
NS2 is pretty nice when you have a large nano pool, like at TL7... at lower level, it will go poof soooo fast
With the removal of unbreakable root, enfo will remove your whole nano pool by sneazing at a NT.

[Blackcradle]

Wizards are always supposed to have a bunch of odd toys. They're correct situational use makes the difference between the best and the rest.

Just for an example:
It seems to me that we're back to fearing conflicts with soldiers now since our reflect pierce has been replaced with a reflect debuff. However killing him used to be my best defence against him and since that isn't as reliable as it used to be, if i can survive an an assault by a soldier under his shields by effectly nerfing his combat abilities for a short time - thats a useful toy.

Your blinds already nerf their or others' combat abilities. Not that I think the special debuff is that great on its own or anything. But with the damage capabilities NTs will likely have I don't think they should be able to debuff more rather than less. Certainly not specials... this just seems totally Trader-esque.

[Gatester]

Anyone thought these in low nt perspective?
I got 110 nt and just calced that after about 30s of nuking my nanopool would be completely empy even after using both nanoregain perks, stim, battleprepared nanokit. Hope it gets like that for other profs also in the nanodepartment

Yeah, I figured in a lot of dead people by the time my nano runs out, the damage is just incredible.

The issue is that low level NT's have no real emergency defense now, because one removes offensive abilities and the other will wipe our nano pool quickly.

[sultryvoltron]

- 8 different options of debuffs/damage depending on damage type.
- You start the game with 2 bursts. You gain +1 Burst per specialization giving you 6 Bursts at 4th spec.
- The NT can build up his burst potential by using Alpha, Base, Finishing, or Special Effect Nukes.
- After using an Alpha. Base. Finishing or SFX nuke, a 20 second timer will be placed in the NT's hostile NCU window.
- The 20 second hostile NCU refreshes everytime an Alpha, Base, Finishing or SFX nuke is used.
- The Duration of the debuffs depend on burst level.
- Level 1 Debuffs Last 5 seconds.
- Level 2 Debuffs Last 10 seconds.
- Level 3-6 Debuffs Last 15 Seconds.

Doesnt look like big debuff for me, i rather use element what debuff nanoskills/inits than specials, so i can live without it too. Only situation i can see it could be used is 3 or more nt's together and ther still other better options like damage. Traders can debuff opponent weapons oe without specials debuff too so i dont undestand why they need this max 15 seconds debuff?

Traders got nerf, NT's got nerf i think all profs got nerf somehow. Will be interesting to see how this all works.

I checked doc with time again and it seems pretty good afterall. Still i m worried about how we can survive long enough to use that potential we have. To be a threat to someone need lots of nanoskills-stuff, but using all.. lose too much defence/nr.

Thanks for the lesson is something I already understand, but you've missed the point. Everything about a weapon specials debuff just screams Traders.

Wizards are always supposed to have a bunch of odd toys. They're correct situational use makes the difference between the best and the rest.

Just for an example:
It seems to me that we're back to fearing conflicts with soldiers now since our reflect pierce has been replaced with a reflect debuff. However killing him used to be my best defence against him and since that isn't as reliable as it used to be, if i can survive an an assault by a soldier under his shields by effectly nerfing his combat abilities for a short time - thats a useful toy.

Of course it's useful, but if you have to put weapon specials debuffs somewhere, why with NTs and not Traders? Again, everything about that ability seems like it should be a Trader thing.

[Shareida]

....A trader is just an NT with a shotgun and no nukes.

[DecemberSky]

NS1 -ONLY- kills your matter creation, therefore, you can still cast anything that doesn't have matter creation as a skill. Like blinds and calms. So its not all bad =)