Nerf AO

[Obtena]

I'm not sure I agree with this.

400 add dmg is like doubling what you have with EVERYTHING running, if youre a soldier, fixer, advy or keeper.


But, 400 add dmg selfed isn't OP'd? come on.

Look, you add 400 add dmg to what you get selfed on a fixer/soldier, and all of a sudden your onehander is hitting 800 dmg normals.

how is that not ?

Because every soldier, fixer, advy and keeper going into PVP aren't running in there with all the instance buffs running at the same time all the time ><. It's just Paper PVP here again. Just because you can show it can happen doesn't mean it does happen.

And no, it's not really F'ed that a onehander hit's 800 damage reg hits.... if you think that's GOOD, then you're delusional. I don't even know what you mean that 400 add damage doubles everything running. It's not doubling reg hits for anyone unless you have a min damage = 1 weapon (I don't see too many of those). That means it's not doubling fling or burst. FA and AS caps most people anyways so it don't matter. Where is this double damage?

Yes it has an effect, but it's certainly NOT doubling damage. Considering many profs are getting alot of perk damage, it's even LESS of their PVP damage that is affected. If the argument is boiling down to how it makes the onehander OPed, then it's not the instance buffs that need the nerf, it's the onehander. The add damage bit isn't what makes those instance buffs OPed.

[Arane]

How about instead of wasting time reverting a 220 back to the power of a 200 and rebalancing half the PvM game to accomadate that nerf we just ask the Dev's to add more new content aimed at max level players along with the rebalance of professions thats currently being worked on?

You're basically asking to go back to vanilla AO which I can understand, I enjoyed the hell out of it myself but the game has grown and taking it "back" to where it was isnt really the answer, at least IMHO.

I'd rather see new content added that both fun and a challenge but that doesnt require 30+ people to do it. It's hard enough to get 10 or 12 together these days.

[-yeny-]

Because every soldier, fixer, advy and keeper going into PVP aren't running in there with all the instance buffs running at the same time all the time ><. It's just Paper PVP here again. Just because you can show it can happen doesn't mean it does happen.

my org does 2-3x db1/2+12m buff-rounds per day. and all other real pvper that i know allways do same.

400 add dmg is a huge gain for any prof. also the 100 AAD + 30? evades are discussionable.

just remove em from pvp so that fights become fair without the need to do buffrounds all day...

[Chewy1]

my org does 2-3x db1/2+12m buff-rounds per day. and all other real pvper that i know allways do same.

400 add dmg is a huge gain for any prof. also the 100 AAD + 30? evades are discussionable.

just remove em from pvp so that fights become fair without the need to do buffrounds all day...

Bump for this!!!

[Arane]

my org does 2-3x db1/2+12m buff-rounds per day. and all other real pvper that i know allways do same.

400 add dmg is a huge gain for any prof. also the 100 AAD + 30? evades are discussionable.

just remove em from pvp so that fights become fair without the need to do buffrounds all day...

I hear ya and kinda agree....but I have noticed that a lot of up and coming players take advantage of these runs for gear and infusers and such and it would be ashamed to see the daily runs stop since mostly people run through there for the buffs.

It does put the average person in the BS at a disadvantage if he/she doesn't take the time to go get the buffs though so I see your point however removing them will not balance pvp, with the most serious pvp'ers out there having the best of everything not to mention the skill level acheived by pvp'ing all day the average persn in BS wil not stand a chance anyway so its really a moot point.

[Obtena]

my org does 2-3x db1/2+12m buff-rounds per day. and all other real pvper that i know allways do same.

I guess my response to that is ... bull? Your org do 2-3 of each of those raids every day? You're org is either REALLY exceptional, or you are just being sensational. If everyone was actually doing that like you say, they wouldn't have time to PVP in this game. It's not really relevant to the discussion anyways.

I'm not saying 400 add damage isn't a gain, but it's not doubling PVP damage for anyone unless you are using some exceptional setup with junk min damage weapons, you're FA/SA/AS skills are crap and you aren't using perks. It's certainly not unfair or breaking PVP in any way, so there isn't a reason to change it, whether 1 person or every person is getting those buffs. Those buffs are there to encourage people that already have their loot to do the instance again and those buffs have to appeal to PVPers. Nerfing those buffs will make it even harder for people to do those instances.

[Brofist]

I'm not saying 400 add damage isn't a gain, but it's not doubling PVP damage for anyone unless you are using some exceptional setup with junk min damage weapons, you're FA/SA/AS skills are crap and you aren't using perks. It's certainly not unfair or breaking PVP in any way, so there isn't a reason to change it, whether 1 person or every person is getting those buffs. Those buffs are there to encourage people that already have their loot to do the instance again and those buffs have to appeal to PVPers. Nerfing those buffs will make it even harder for people to do those instances.

First of all +400 add damage is a ton for AS and FA on any weapon.

Second of all people still do beast, apfs, and every other instance in game and they don't add short term buffs.

[Wrangeline]

I don't care at all about the +dd on my trader but the +aad is a godsend. When your defense hovers around 3200-3300 and people's AR hovers around that range as well, then it can make a huge difference. Trader is probably the profession that has the most to gain from 12m buff out of all professions in AO hehe.

[Anarrina]

Could people PLEASE get a grip on their language and make your points without all the obscenities. Its entirely unnecessary, and I get tired of editing the posts for them. Excessive Profanity infractions are still infractions, and I'll start handing them out as necessary.

[McKnuckleSamwich]

I guess my response to that is ... bull? Your org do 2-3 of each of those raids every day? You're org is either REALLY exceptional, or you are just being sensational. If everyone was actually doing that like you say, they wouldn't have time to PVP in this game. It's not really relevant to the discussion anyways.

I'm not saying 400 add damage isn't a gain, but it's not doubling PVP damage for anyone unless you are using some exceptional setup with junk min damage weapons, you're FA/SA/AS skills are crap and you aren't using perks. It's certainly not unfair or breaking PVP in any way, so there isn't a reason to change it, whether 1 person or every person is getting those buffs. Those buffs are there to encourage people that already have their loot to do the instance again and those buffs have to appeal to PVPers. Nerfing those buffs will make it even harder for people to do those instances.

You mis-read.

I said 400 add damage DOUBLES the amount of add dmg a toon has, and, makes normals on a onehander do 800 dmg (which is a friggin lot for a weapon that is supposedly TEH NURFEST weap in game apparently, which everyone and his dog still uses.

[Obtena]

yeah, but who cares if that has a minimal impact on most professions actual PVP damage that happens so irregularly anyways? It's a nothing fix.

[Mostadio]

I guess my response to that is ... bull? Your org do 2-3 of each of those raids every day? You're org is either REALLY exceptional, or you are just being sensational.

I know quite a few people who do this.

[Obtena]

Sorry, I just can't believe that day in and day out, people are doing all those raids multiple times a day. It's not relevant anyways. There is no reason to nerf the add damage from the buffs when it has such a marginal impact to damage. AS/FA reach caps easily in PVP and PVM, fast attack, fling, burst are calced on min damage. No one is getting anywhere near epic increases to their long term damage from +400 add damage buffs in PVM or PVP.

I'm still astounded that anyone would even try to associate a 800 reg hit from a craphander as needing a nerf. It's a crappy weapon? So is that reg hit.

[iolanda]

Well its logical you dont belive it has a huge impact since your probebly fighting on the enf mostly. But take me for example i got 12k hp on my shade and im not really affraid of AS spam as much as i am of a god damn melee advy or a enf running in and doing 1.3k-1.4k regulars on me . Not to mention other proffesions that do about the same with those god damn buffs . Your perspective of PvP is exactly papper pvp wich you keep telling people , not everyone has 30k hp take in consideration that more then half the proffesions ingame DO CARE if they get hit for a 600 dmg regular or a freaking 1300 .

[sultryvoltron]

I guess my response to that is ... bull? Your org do 2-3 of each of those raids every day? You're org is either REALLY exceptional, or you are just being sensational. If everyone was actually doing that like you say, they wouldn't have time to PVP in this game. It's not really relevant to the discussion anyways.

You're quite out of touch with reality on this one. Even my fairly small Neutral org does it an average of once a day, depdending on who's on.

yeah, but who cares if that has a minimal impact on most professions actual PVP damage that happens so irregularly anyways? It's a nothing fix.

It actually has a pretty decent impact on AS and FA damage from professions that aren't inherently strong with those specials. Or did you forget that AO is mostly about specials at TL7?

Sorry, I just can't believe that day in and day out, people are doing all those raids multiple times a day. It's not relevant anyways. There is no reason to nerf the add damage from the buffs when it has such a marginal impact to damage. AS/FA reach caps easily in PVP and PVM, fast attack, fling, burst are calced on min damage. No one is getting anywhere near epic increases to their long term damage from +400 add damage buffs in PVM or PVP.

I'm still astounded that anyone would even try to associate a 800 reg hit from a craphander as needing a nerf. It's a crappy weapon? So is that reg hit.

Again, out of touch with reality.

[Obtena]

Hey, I'm not in touch with reality? The burden of proof that Add damage is OP for PVP is on the guy making the claim. Show us how 400 add damage affects PVP damage. If it doesn't it shouldn't really be too hard. If craphander is the best or only example you can make, I think my case is made. Seriously, think about it for a second. If it's a decent impact on profs that have weak AS damage, then what are people really trying to accomplish here? Nerfing already weak PVP damage from those profs? UM HUM

According to you, it actually impacts the profs that NEED it the most. It has no impact on profs that specialize in FA and AS or rely on perk damage or don't use min damage = 1 weapons in PVP. Who's left? I mean, it's the same old thing ... what impact will removing 400 add damage from these buffs actually have for PVP as a whole. I think it's insignificant. I'm not in touch? Tell me how.

[sultryvoltron]

For some unknown reason, you think people don't get these buffs regularly.

Also, you must be brushing over the fact that AS calculates in +dmg before the multipliers.

Also, you've never seen an Engi do a 9k+ burst? Also those pets? They need a better AS?
Let's not even pretend like Doc's have a weak PvP offense.
Or Advys? They need to cap their AS more?

Jeez, Crats are the only ones left, and the rebalance spreadsheet shows a drastic increase in nuking power, doesn't it?



Ever notice how professions that don't specialize in Full Auto don't complain about gimpy Full Auto? Nope, they don't use it. Now, about those professions that don't specialize in AS? Yep, they piss and moan about being crowbarred into it, then they get 12m and DB1/2 buffs on their pistol users and go spam on 'O' every 11s in order to maximize their AS damage.

Also, I'd imagine Iolanda and any Crats would tell you they would prefer Enfos not have +400 (200 pvp) dmg since they can be killed with regular hits.

[Obtena]

Sorry, where are you telling me how 400 Add damage buffs affect PVP damage, in general. Probably because they don't. You can point all out the specific instances where this prof does that, but generally, it's not significant enough to nerf it.

BTW, my regular hits as an enfo are sitting at about 1200 ... 400 add damage to that from buffs is reducing the number of reg hits I have to make to kill someone between 10-15% I approximate, in the BEST case vs. non-evaders, and even lower against evades profs. So thanks for that example to show how minor an effect is has for enfos. 13 more profs to go.

[sultryvoltron]

You're still ignoring that +dmg is calculated into AS before multipliers.

[Obtena]

I am? NICE! That doesn't change anything I said.