An idea on how to balance advys

[Bonghigs]

First off, i know this is asking the impossible but if we could please keep the discussion on-topic that would be fantastical I don't mind if you disagree with me and explain why, but please can we be rational hehe


Adjust Biococoon so that advy can only train X perks into it. I'm not sure what that number should be, but i'm guessing between 6 and 8. This would essentially remove BioRegrowth from advy and make their coon a little less effective.

Having a 220 advy (melee for years and just recently went ranged to try it; very active in pvp) and having fought the onslaught of FotM ranged adventurers I think that this could be enough to have a large impact in real pvp without dropping a nerf-hammer on the profession.




Note, this idea is not my own. It was discussed and formulated with my favorite Nanomage Enforcer on RK2

[Bonghigs]

Wanted to refine this idea a bit without editing the original. The idea here is to find areas where they are stronger than they should be. Advy should be able to do everything, but not necessarily as well as others.

To me, i think having all 10 perks in biococoon is this kind of situation. It makes sense that we can coon, but maybe not as good as an enforcer can. (*cough* this goes for engi's too *cough*). This would nip a bit of the top of our healing ability, but would bring us back down a bit to maybe closer to where we should be.

/shrug. Interested to hear some rational comments and thoughts.

[Obtena]

I think the trend is that nanocosts are going up, especially for heals. That many have an impact. The reworking of runspeed may also have an impact to advys. I'm always finding that when fighting an advy, there usually isn't an 'IN' to beat them. I'm facing evades, heals and layers in any kind of unexpected combination and if I do find that in, they have little problems running away, if they haven't killed me yet. I actually don't find Advy offenses to be exceptionally strong so I'm hoping that whatever is done, it's kept rather status quo.

What needs to make more IN's to advy's defenses? Reductions and lockouts could be the answer. I don't think Advy's will be losing any perk access anytime soon. I don't think any particular items make them any more OP than anyone else. I'm willing to bet that any fix will be in the nanos. Another option could be something rarely used in AO ... drawbacks. Cast a nano, get 300 AAD? OK, but get -300 AAO too. That kind of thing. Having to make hard choices between which of all these nice defenses to use could be another way forward. Allow those choices to be dynamic as well, so they are on demand instead of 'setup' choices.

[vios]

I agree with Obtena, they will probably have a good punch back with balance, maybe in 2014

I though the drawbacks where the morphs. If they are done as they should the advy can be a really interesting class to play (not OPed but fun!)

[agentwolve]

remove there 80% perks - INC

remove there ability to use AS - (semi inc)

then reduce or totally remove there root resistance

[sultryvoltron]

The entire concept of Advys is that they are all around good at everything. Right now, they are far too good at everything they can do.

1) Reduce self healing, increase target healing. Advys lack in this area.
2) Reduce static evades slightly.
3) Reduce Biococoon slightly, or completely remove it in favor of ... [fill this in] because coon is totaly OOC for Advys.
4) Revamp morphs to have distinct and useful purposes. Perhaps the loss in evades could be made up for by one of the morphs, with -AAO attached to it. Another morph would have +AAO and -AAD, Dragon morph for +HP and potential tanking? Also Tree morph for healing, completely change the tree part of it, or just let the tree walk which would be weird.

[Xenotric]

Not sure why its ooc for an adventurer to have bio shielding.

They have always had some absorbs and their character story is that of a wilderness explorer, where putting up shields to absorb and reduce the hostile environments effects are important (hence the adventurer shield items).

If anything its the access to acrobat that makes less sense (beyond it being an MR/MM buff).

It wasn't until shadowlands (or slightly before it) that they actually got any sort of evade buffing nano's, and that came in the form of having AAD tacked onto their top wolf forms and the wolf aura's oh and a tiny bit on some MM/MR buffs.

Compared to the release access to (albeit slightly weak) absorb shields as part of their damage shields and AC buff lines, all of which are catered to in the bio shielding line.

My thoughts on the subject would be to either:

a) Decide on a specific toolset the adventurers should have and limit them to those rather then everything

b) Rebalance their tools, they have access to everything but non of it should be on par with the tools of the classes that focus on it, they may individually seem weak by themselves but when added together lots of small things can still be more potent than 1 large thing. Keep them with a core skill set in mind and limit their options for everything else to mediocre perk wise (for example keep bio sheilding as it fits, but limit stuff like acrobat and spatial displacement to half the maximum perks or remove them and leave the nano toolsets and such.

[mcnurja]

remove coon,limber+dof,SD or atleast 2 of these and it should work

[Chrazy]

remove coon,limber+dof,SD or atleast 2 of these and it should work

lol... Why don't you want to remove the heals, not being able to use any weapons, -2000 RS and a -2000 constant init to them while you're at it?

[mcnurja]

yea that too thanks for reminding!

[blingoutyourdead]

Cut their legs off.

[Bonghigs]

b) Rebalance their tools, they have access to everything but non of it should be on par with the tools of the classes that focus on it, they may individually seem weak by themselves but when added together lots of small things can still be more potent than 1 large thing. Keep them with a core skill set in mind and limit their options for everything else to mediocre perk wise (for example keep bio sheilding as it fits, but limit stuff like acrobat and spatial displacement to half the maximum perks or remove them and leave the nano toolsets and such.

This is where i was going with this. Advy should be able to do everything, just not as well. To me this balance is going to happen mostly in perks, as our nanos already fall in line with being "good but not best" and the nanocost increases will tone our healing down a bit.

Thus, to me the changes are going to be in perks. Spatial Displacement needs to stay a full 10-line for adventurers as not being rooted/snared falls directly into the toolkit we've had since forever (anti-root snare nanos, namely). Acrobat in its current state cannot be affected because it is only four perks and thus harder to limit. This makes Biococoon the most likely target to me and the easiest to implement, as limiting the last couple perks to exclude advy would go a long way:

• No more BioRejuvination to cut our healing a bit
• Tone down bio-regrowth a bit to lower our healing
• Tone down the absorb a bit (ie, easier to break through) to make it less OP in combination with other items

[-Klod-]

Advies are balanced, it's other profs that need adjusting.

[Xenotric]

Spatial Displacement needs to stay a full 10-line for adventurers as not being rooted/snared falls directly into the toolkit we've had since forever (anti-root snare nanos, namely). ]

Those nanos actually came in around the same time as the advy's "evade" support as well.

[Ninjaloot]

remove coon,limber+dof,SD or atleast 2 of these and it should work

/agreed

[borriss]

Advies are balanced, it's other profs that need adjusting.

/agree

[Kinkstaah]

Make Bio Cocoon lock out DOF

Done

[Togusa]

Don't touch my Advy

[Berinda]

As the owner of a 220 advy wearing mostly CSS, I'd say advies would get fairly balanced just by removing acrobat.

[Questra]

I think currently, an advy only having access to around 2-3k of biocoon would do it. They have access to more than enough healing power to keep them alive in DoF downtime, often against against multiple people, without the need to absorb 10k of each damage type.

That or reduce the amount of evades that DoF gives them to 200. A great many advies are now unperkable through Limber to even the highest AR profs.