Healing Nerf Idea

[Gatester]

This would be the only nerf involved for healing if something like this was introduced, and I would like opinions as to if this could be a viable means of adjusting healing or would cause too many problems.

This nerf would effect healing that is spammed. Everytime a heal is cast, the player (caster) would get a temporary hostile effect in their NCU. For the first time it is a 10% nerf to healing effeciency and the debuff will increase with each cast to a capped level of 50%. The debuff would include a 10 second duration, so that when the heal is cast in that time the debuff increases, but if the caster waits until after 10 seconds they can heal with the regular effeciency.

So, doctors and adventurers who are spamming heals would have them become less effective over time, and the advy instant morph heals would be included in the nerfing effect. Perk heals would be effected by the heal effeciency debuff but not cause the debuff to increase or refresh itself.

Main points and issues:

Martial Artist should be relatively unaffected by this due to their cast times.
10 seconds might be too long for doctors, perhaps a shorter time for them?
Will 50% be too much, or not enough for doctors considering their existing buffing?
Should team heals be effected?
Would this allow doctors to recieve more "static" healing fairly?
This would definately increase the need for additional healing in raids, good or bad?
Would this nerf healing too much at lower levels, what would alternatives for that be?

Should be enough I think, the only alternative I see is having heals cap on players health but that does not solve a lot of issues, especially with adventurers.

[Marinegent]

I think a 6 or 7 second duration would be best.

It's longer than the recharge time of most heals used today. It makes the professions more vulnerable, but not obnoxiously so with having to wait 10 seconds.

[MyGift]

I think a 6 or 7 second duration would be best.

It's longer than the recharge time of most heals used today. It makes the professions more vulnerable, but not obnoxiously so with having to wait 10 seconds.

Yea so u can cast ur CH w/o any problem?


6-7 sec would mean nothing since almost all heals got 5+ sec recharge ...

[Marinegent]

Yea so u can cast ur CH w/o any problem?


6-7 sec would mean nothing since almost all heals got 5+ sec recharge ...

I think it's a joke you even bring up CH. It's a pathetic tool as it is, and easily disabled at that. Agents are being hit with the same nerf as everyone else. And nanopool being one of the targets for nerfing, and agents having one of the most difficult nanopools to manage due to the cost debuffs that come with mimic, we are going to be one of the hardest hit.

Docs can currently heal over 2 times as much as agents can in a 10 second period. At least for the moment, CH does not need any nerfing seeing as it's our only working defense.

Not to mention - a lot of professions have a high enough DD that they can kill a doc pretty quickly if the doc was forced into waiting 10 seconds between heals, or only getting 50% of the healing out of each of their nanos. 10 Seconds is too long imo.

[Mekh]

...snip...
Not to mention - a lot of professions have a high enough DD that they can kill a doc pretty quickly if the doc was forced into waiting 10 seconds between heals, or only getting 50% of the healing out of each of their nanos. 10 Seconds is too long imo.

This sums up my opinion on this pretty fine...
Well... At least as long as actively casting heals is the only defense a Doc have, which even happen to nerf/disable their offense at the same time unlike how it is for every other prof out there.

[Flyingengi]

MP has a 50% heal efficiency debuff...it barely effects docs

[McKnuckleSamwich]

I like the idea.

it could easily be seen as "the nanobots efficiency is reduced by overworking"

I think 10 seconds isn't unreasonable.

I think doctors cap should be 35%

but imo, docs need a further heal reduction too, like ICH 100k--->20k

[Mekh]

MP has a 50% heal efficiency debuff...it barely effects docs

You're kidding I hope...

[Dopecat]

Could the heal change be made without affecting PVM? Im sure many pure PVMers dont like the idea that for sake of PVP balance, their PVM gets also nerffed.

So what im suggesting is making healing work in similar way as damage in PVP where its 50% efficient. Perhaps with healing it should be bit higher though, like 70%. Just an idea to play around with.

[Flyingengi]

You're kidding I hope...

50k and 100k are not very different

[Mekh]

50k and 100k are not very different

Every 20 seconds... Unless NRx perked, GTH'ed, drained, NSD'ed or e-NSD'ed in which cases no doc is casting it.

BI or more often lower quality heals is still the bread and butter for any doc out there due to cast time, considering the 20 seconds cooldown on this one. A Doc have to heal more often than every 20 seconds unless they're fighting a BY leet or equivalent.

[Mikenche]

but imo, docs need a further heal reduction too, like ICH 100k--->20k

A big fat NO to this. Improved Complete Healing can be a big lifesaver in raids.

IMO, heals should get a 50% reduction in PvP, to match the damage reduction. In PvM they're fine - if I had to point out one thing wrong about docs in PvM it would be their absurdly high offensive capability given that they're supposed to be healers.

Oh, and please spread the heals out over levels a bit more evenly. Getting no new heals for the 50 levels between 125 and 175, and then having to wait a further 30 levels for the really good stuff is not fun.

[XenonDe]

50k and 100k are not very different

But 4k and 7k perk heals are.
But 7k and 13k are.
Oh, how about stacking heal eff debuffs as they so nicely do.
Then you have a difference from 100 to 13000.

One thing you are right about though. A single heal eff debuff from a MP that doesn't use his other toolset, doesn't debuff mc and bm, doesn't run the NSD proc and does crap damage would not affect the doc in a way he would die. Unless you have a single friend.

I like the idea.

it could easily be seen as "the nanobots efficiency is reduced by overworking"

I think 10 seconds isn't unreasonable.

I think doctors cap should be 35%

but imo, docs need a further heal reduction too, like ICH 100k--->20k

So in your oppinion docs should be able to heal a single capped hit every 10 seconds or spam it until a heal won't even heal 3/4th of a capped hit? You wouldn't need to nerf ICH then because no doc would heal for 20k hp with it anyway. Not many 55k HP docs out there.

This is getting better by the minute. So going by the latest suggestions doc heals should have nanocost increased three times, nano delta be nerfed (not like we not allready run out of nano all the time in pvp), a 35% heal cap on heals, ICH removed from the game, gradually decreasing heal efficiency, their offense decreased (next to loosing AS), and apparently heal eff debuffs should be increased. Well, Good luck with that.

[Mikenche]

So in your oppinion docs should be able to heal a single capped hit every 10 seconds [...].

This is getting better by the minute. So going by the latest suggestions doc heals should have [...] a 35% heal cap on heals [...]

I believe what was meant with that was that docs would never get their healing efficiency reduced by more than 35% due to the "overworked nanobots". So they'd always be at 65% healing efficiency or above, unless other factors were reducing it further.

[Gatester]

What I was wanting is a method where someone forcing an adventurer or doctor to heal very often, because they have a high DD output, would force the doctor and advy to have less effective healing over time and eventually OD their healing ability. It would take a rather long time and would require more effort on the part of both professions rather just spamming heals.

Healing does need to be adjusted, and this method effects heal spamming. I would like to see increased HoT effeciency, maybe 600ish HoTs if something like this was introduced.

[Kazeren]

This has got to be one of the dumbest threads ive seen in a long time...

First off, DO NOT lump docs and advys into the same group. Two different profs with two very different toolsets and play styles.

Secondly, Do you really think that casting heals should hurt the doctor? Really think before you type please. That like everytime you mongo it heals less, every time you rage u get less benefits, every time you cast layers you get less, everytime someone blinds the debuff is less. It makes no sense, if you wouldn't want it to happen to your prof, don't suggest it for others.

Third, ICH is mainly a pvm heal. Its very rarely used in pvp and even when it is its a one time life saving button. Comparing the amount it heals vs our normal heals isnt even comparable.

Forth, You are wanting to nerf our only defense so we can only cast every XX amount of seconds? You are aware that our heals are our only defense. Docs dont get evades, crazy HP, coon, reflects and other defensive tools. We have heals, and that is it.

If a doctor has alot heal eff, he should get to keep it. We have to give up other things to get that amount and shouldn't be punished for it.

Most of all try reading the doc forums first.

And No to everything you suggested gate.

[XenonDe]

I believe what was meant with that was that docs would never get their healing efficiency reduced by more than 35% due to the "overworked nanobots". So they'd always be at 65% healing efficiency or above, unless other factors were reducing it further.

Hm, Yeah upon second look and taking the first post into consideration it does seem like I misread it.

Healing does need to be adjusted, and this method effects heal spamming. I would like to see increased HoT effeciency, maybe 600ish HoTs if something like this was introduced.

But there prolly are already plans for reduced heal spamming. Local recharge, quote from doc forum below. The local recharge and a big+small heal is most likely what we will get.
How about we wait out those change before we suggest more and more nerf and lockout from heal nanos.

[COLOR="Red"]Changes and concept haven't been finalized as of yet, but what they are working towards or consideing is several different heals with each their own local recharge.

Imagine something along these lines concept wise...

- A large heal with long local recharge when lots of HP is really needed fast
- Several lower heals with faster local recharge for trickle healing or filling up and such

[Grafter]

{Venachar: Sorry, but it was trolling}

How are Red Dawn~Dusk/Remedy Inhibitor/NSD/NE NSD/DRAINS/-heal efficiency perks+nanos/GTH/Chain Stuns/Crat Init Debuffs/etc etc factored into this?

[SSK]

pew

How are Red Dawn~Dusk/Remedy Inhibitor/NSD/NE NSD/DRAINS/-heal efficiency perks+nanos/GTH/Chain Stuns/Crat Init Debuffs/etc etc factored into this?

Same as blockers, reflects, OS, mochs and rest of stuff what can happen ingame obviously

[Flyingengi]

A Doc have to heal more often than every 20 seconds unless they're fighting a BY leet or equivalent.

Hi, I'm an mp. Maybe you haven't seen my damage? My perk "alpha" has a 2 minute + recharge. It also has a 30sec cast time to execute. With my pets UBT'd (with no way to remove) and the doc resisting 50% of my nukes, it takes me at least 1 minute to knock off as much HP as a doc has. So, yes, full HP every 20sec is a tad OP since they can also use normal heals during this downtime as well.


As it stands with docs currently, they can heal over 300k HP in a minute (counting ICH as 20k hp). Your top DD's in pvm hit 250k-300k DPM. Half that for pvp and you get ~150k DPM. Now just imagine that they are UBT'd. This proves that a good doc could outheal 2 shades w/o stuns being a factor. You see no problem here?